Jump to content


Photo

Worst Grand Prix car of all time


  • Please log in to reply
84 replies to this topic

#51 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 4,859 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 14:48

Michael

Was that definitely the same car? I have heard speculation that it was the same car but could it have been something new.

Allen

Advertisement

#52 fines

fines
  • Member

  • 9,647 posts
  • Joined: September 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 15:23

I can't be too sure, Allen, but David Hodges (A-Z of Formula Racing Cars) has this to say: "This [the MonteCarlo] turned out to be the Dywa from 1980, with a Mader DFV engine installed in its little-altered chassis."

#53 Barry Boor

Barry Boor
  • Member

  • 10,824 posts
  • Joined: October 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 17:31

Gentlemen, I think we may have found our winner...........

#54 Paul Hartshorne

Paul Hartshorne
  • Member

  • 132 posts
  • Joined: March 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 18:50

My favourite terrible F1 car too!

The Dywa team entered the car for the 1985 Silverstone International Trophy, the first ever F3000 race, to be driven by (I think) Peo Consonni, but they didn't arrive. It was reported that their transporter had been involved in a road accident on the way to England from Italy and the (ahem!) racing car damaged beyond immediate repair.

This didn't prevent F1 aspirant Fulvio-Maria Ballabio from buying the car's remains, rebuilding it, and christening it the Montecarlo GP001. It's only appearance was at Imola in 1986, where one observer described it as a cross between a McLaren MP4 and a farm tractor!

The only photo that I ever saw of it was in an advertisement in one of the Le Mans yearbooks (possibly the 1987 edition). The photograph was taken at the car's launch :rolleyes: in Monaco, with Honorary team patron Prince Albert of Monaco!

Cheers, Paul

#55 fines

fines
  • Member

  • 9,647 posts
  • Joined: September 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 19:22

A little quiz: Two years before his episode with the Dywa/MonteCarlo, Ballabio was trying to enter F1 with a sponsor that would allow the team to sign a retired superstar as number one. The car was actually painted in the colours of the sponsor and tested by both the star driver and Ballabio, but the deal fell through because the FIA wouldn't issue a superlicence for Fulvio (his best result in F2 the year before had been a fifth in a race with only seven finishers).

a) Who was that superstar driver?
b) Which team wanted to run a) and Ballabio?
c) Who was the sponsor?

#56 Paul Hartshorne

Paul Hartshorne
  • Member

  • 132 posts
  • Joined: March 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 19:36

Easy Peasy!

The deal was to have been with the Spirit team, with Emerson Fittipaldi as team leader.

The sponsor would have been the Disney Corporation via Ballabio's father, who owned the licences for the Disney characters in Italy (Topolino, aka Mickey Mouse, etc.). Burago toy cars were also involved.

Allegedly the deal fell through because Ballabio was refused a superlicence, and upon hearing this, his father dropped dead of a heart attack, having set his heart (excuse the pun) on his son becoming a Grand Prix driver.

Of course, this is from memory, so I may be completely wrong! :)

Cheers, Paul

#57 Felix Muelas

Felix Muelas
  • Member

  • 1,187 posts
  • Joined: November 99

Posted 04 March 2001 - 21:14

Ballabio...
Posted Image
and Emmo...
Posted Image

:)
Felix


#58 fines

fines
  • Member

  • 9,647 posts
  • Joined: September 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 22:09

I should have known better, but I hoped to get at least a couple of wrong answers... :(

Next quiz, at which time of day is the Emmo shot taken?;)

BTW, I can't see any Burago stickers...

#59 Allen Brown

Allen Brown
  • Member

  • 4,859 posts
  • Joined: December 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 22:19

More updates due for OldRacingCars.com.

Sounds like I need to add a DNA (did not arrive) for a F3000 Dywa at the 1985 Int Trophy and a DNQ for a 'Monte Carlo 001' at Imola in June 1986.

Thanks for helping me with those two omissions.

Allen

Advertisement

#60 Paul Hartshorne

Paul Hartshorne
  • Member

  • 132 posts
  • Joined: March 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 22:25

Errr... they're on the underside of the front suspension rocker arms!;)

Burago did sponsor Ballabio's F3000 Lola at Donington Park in 1985, so that's probably what I was thinking of.

BTW, didn't Fulvio later become a successful powerboat racer, along with his fellow F2 / F3000 journeymen Lambert Leoni and Aldo Bertuzzi?

Cheers, Paul

#61 Blind Terry

Blind Terry
  • New Member

  • 2 posts
  • Joined: March 01

Posted 04 March 2001 - 22:27

In terms of cars which actually started a GP, what about the Shannon which appeared at the 1966 British GP but didn't last long. About 1 lap.

#62 Barry Boor

Barry Boor
  • Member

  • 10,824 posts
  • Joined: October 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 22:32

fines - half past Thursday....

#63 fines

fines
  • Member

  • 9,647 posts
  • Joined: September 00

Posted 04 March 2001 - 23:44

"silly plates" at work...

And damn, I missed it again! I had post #200,002 and now #300,078! :mad:

#64 Racer.Demon

Racer.Demon
  • Member

  • 1,705 posts
  • Joined: November 99

Posted 05 March 2001 - 21:49

Originally posted by Megatron
The Life was actually a devolpement of the 1989 car that NEVER turned a lap at all.

The car was basically built to "highlight" the W12 engine.


Megatron: it's even worse. The car was basically *bought* to highlight the engine!

The '89 car you are talking about was not a Life as such but in fact was the stillborn First car. This was the car that was to lift Lamberto Leoni's First F3000 team into F1 (it was tested by First regular Tarquini) but of course this never happened. It was designed for the Judd engine, so Life in fact reverted to the original engine for the car in the course of 1990!

Patrick: the French W12 engine you mention was the MGN which was tested in the back of an AGS hack around the same time as the Life. More on that in Rainer's excellent article Engine Failures on 8W.

GP cars and engines so bad that they never even raced could be another interesting part of this thread...;)



#65 Racer.Demon

Racer.Demon
  • Member

  • 1,705 posts
  • Joined: November 99

Posted 05 March 2001 - 22:07

Originally posted by fines
Somewhere I've seen a picture of the car, it really looked ridiculous!


Michael, would that be here?

http://home.wanadoo....wteam/dywa1.jpg
http://home.wanadoo....wteam/dywa2.jpg
http://home.wanadoo....wteam/dywa3.jpg

But, errm, looking at the radiator mountings and the lack of any meaningful sidepods (where did they put the skirts!) it could be argued that it was, well, somewhat ahead of time! I mean, a 1980 car looking like a 1983 Ligier? Or is that why the JS21 also failed miserably?;)


#66 fines

fines
  • Member

  • 9,647 posts
  • Joined: September 00

Posted 06 March 2001 - 21:37

Hmm, I can't really remember, but judging from those pics the car actually didn't look too bad, eg the front suspension is quite modern in a 1980 context. From when and where are the pictures? I don't recognise the track or the driver's name, to me it looks neither like Imola nor Monza, but I could be wrong, of course!;)

#67 Paolo

Paolo
  • Member

  • 1,673 posts
  • Joined: May 00

Posted 22 October 2001 - 21:42

I remember reading on Autosprint about Dywa as a candidate to F3000 races in the first year of the series.
The car should have been driven by Peo Consonni, who, in my memory, also owned the team.
The sidepods were exactly as these shown in the pictures : then a possible explanation is that these pictures are from F3000 testing in 1984 (?) and not from 1980 F. Aurora.

#68 Prostfan

Prostfan
  • Member

  • 826 posts
  • Joined: September 01

Posted 23 October 2001 - 19:24

Anyone suggested Eifelland already?

#69 ghinzani

ghinzani
  • Member

  • 1,990 posts
  • Joined: October 01

Posted 23 October 2001 - 19:51

I think thats got to be the f3000 Dywa in those pictures cos there are no ground effect tunnels... the story was that the truck went down a ravine on its way to silverstone for the first f3000 round in 85.

#70 Joe Fan

Joe Fan
  • Member

  • 5,591 posts
  • Joined: December 98

Posted 23 October 2001 - 19:56

Originally posted by Barry Boor
Zippy, I cannot accept the Scarab. It was a very fair car for its time. Unfortunately, its time was 1958 and it didn't appear until 1960.


Bingo! I totally agree! It was a decent car that just took too long for it make its way into action.

#71 mhferrari

mhferrari
  • Member

  • 3,238 posts
  • Joined: August 00

Posted 23 October 2001 - 20:06

Life 1990.

Lapped Imola in a time something like 7' 42".

#72 TAB666

TAB666
  • Member

  • 1,755 posts
  • Joined: November 00

Posted 23 October 2001 - 20:41

This is my first visit to the Nostalgia forum. Damn that i didnt folow F1 in 1990 would have been fun to see the Lifes in action.
This was one funny and informative thread

#73 Barry Boor

Barry Boor
  • Member

  • 10,824 posts
  • Joined: October 00

Posted 23 October 2001 - 20:53

TAB, I DID follow F1 in 1990 but I still never saw any Life!

Except the one I built for slot-racing; that went reasonably well!!!!! :lol:

#74 Graham Clayton

Graham Clayton
  • Member

  • 1,070 posts
  • Joined: January 01

Posted 06 January 2013 - 10:41

The 1985 Alfa Romeo Tipo 185T deserves a mention. The Alfa engine was too thirsty to comply with the newly introduced 195 litre fuel limit, so in mid-season Autodelta manager Giovanni Tonti was forced to scrap two chassis, convert the third back to 1984 Tipo184T specifications, and use two superseded Tipo184T cars for the remainder of the season, after which Alfa Romeo withdrew as a complete team from Formula 1.

#75 jcbc3

jcbc3
  • Member

  • 5,055 posts
  • Joined: November 04

Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:02

Looking for pictures of the Dywa (since the old links above were broken), I cam across this site: http://f1minardi.fre...1neverraced.htm

Some real horrors to look at there.

#76 ensign14

ensign14
  • Member

  • 36,816 posts
  • Joined: December 01

Posted 06 January 2013 - 11:31

The picture credited as the Dywa 010 from 1980 is from 1983 - it was being re-fettled with a view to entry in the new Formula 3000 1985. Consonni at the wheel. Guido Dacco was tabbed as a driver, before Ballabio took over the project. More detail here.

If you want pics in its Aurora form, see here. A picture of the Dywa actually trying to qualify though seems to be about as rare as a Jean-Pierre Frey lap record.


#77 RogerFrench

RogerFrench
  • Member

  • 382 posts
  • Joined: February 08

Posted 06 January 2013 - 13:28

How about the Trossi-Monaco as a candidate for this thread?

#78 Hieronymus

Hieronymus
  • Member

  • 2,031 posts
  • Joined: May 02

Posted 06 January 2013 - 15:28

Perhaps one must consider the budget which was available before coming to a final conclusion. Big budget-crap car surely weighs heavier than small budget-crap car.

#79 JMH

JMH
  • Member

  • 57 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 06 January 2013 - 18:10

Looking for pictures of the Dywa (since the old links above were broken), I cam across this site: http://f1minardi.fre...1neverraced.htm

Some real horrors to look at there.


Just down from the top of the linked page is the Gleed-MG. Believe it or not, there was a pukka R-type engine in there, not such a horror, just real scary!

JH

Advertisement

#80 Macca

Macca
  • Member

  • 3,311 posts
  • Joined: January 03

Posted 06 January 2013 - 18:45

I did have the (mis)fortune to see 3 of the worst as suggested above - the Life and Coloni in 1990, and the Andrea Moda in 1992:

Posted Image

Other contenders might be the Apollon (but that was in a second like, having been a Williams originally), the first Maki, or any of the Merzarios.

However, reading the above nothing could be as bad as the Dywa.

Paul M

#81 byrkus

byrkus
  • Member

  • 786 posts
  • Joined: October 01

Posted 06 January 2013 - 22:49

What about 1955 DB Monomill... 750 cc 2 cyl boxer engine, compressor - and FWD! Used at Pau GP, but never to be seen again afterwards. I wonder why. :drunk:


#82 No brain no pain

No brain no pain
  • Member

  • 162 posts
  • Joined: September 05

Posted 08 January 2013 - 20:57

Errr... they're on the underside of the front suspension rocker arms!;)

Burago did sponsor Ballabio's F3000 Lola at Donington Park in 1985, so that's probably what I was thinking of.

BTW, didn't Fulvio later become a successful powerboat racer, along with his fellow F2 / F3000 journeymen Lambert Leoni and Aldo Bertuzzi?

Cheers, Paul



Yep, Ballabio was good in powerboat-racing. Had "the pleasure" of being a passenger on his Offshore Class1 Boat once, but never again :eek:

#83 ChrisJson

ChrisJson
  • Member

  • 215 posts
  • Joined: May 08

Posted 09 January 2013 - 16:32

Perhaps one must consider the budget which was available before coming to a final conclusion. Big budget-crap car surely weighs heavier than small budget-crap car.



And the persons involved!

You´d think that a project managed by Carl Haas and Teddy Mayer with an car designed
and built under the supervision of Neil Oatley, Ross Brawn and Adrian Newey, the engine
constructed by Keith Ducksworth and driven by Alan Jones should gather more than six
points in two years.


Christer

#84 dnhrudi

dnhrudi
  • Member

  • 68 posts
  • Joined: April 07

Posted 24 June 2013 - 18:05

Maki F102A. So bad that all the team managers appealed for the car to be banned for fear of Tony Trimmers safety at Fuji in 76. There was even an offer for him to drive the spare Lotus as an incentive but this was nixed by Maki teams sponsor, Tony did one lap and the organizers dumped the car out.

#85 Lee Nicolle

Lee Nicolle
  • Member

  • 5,642 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 25 June 2013 - 03:36

If you are going to the story via my website, it took you to Franco Varani's Motor Racing Retro site. Unfortunately, Crosswinds have lost a lot of Franco's stuff. I suspect that is the problem.

The story can be read, as far as I know, on the F1 Test Site, which I seem to have lost the URL for. I'll check it up.

Obviously, Roger, I need to insert my story onto my own site. That would simplify matters, wouldn't it?

I wondered if anyone would attach the 'worst grand prix car' tag to the Connew eventually. I cannot argue with anyone who puts us in that bracket.

Barry, like many I have read your article about the car and the team. At least your car started a GP. And from what I read it could have been a competitive backmarker with a few more dollars to run it. So that makes it far better than some mentioned. Though ofcourse having a Cosworth helped as at least they were comparitivly simple and reliable compared with the rest