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2012 Jenson vs Lewis scorecard


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#1201 trogggy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:51

JB or his RE saw he could/might be faster on wets and pitted even if it meant undercutting LH.


LH and the whole world saw he would be faster if he pitted in OZ but couldn't coz of the undercut,right? Leading driver makes the call? Lewis wanted to stay on inters right his call? Well so did JB.

What difference does it make wet or dry when the goal is the same?Gaining positions!

No, not right. That's an assumption.
Unless there's something on the radio between LH and AL the lap before JB pitted in Aus?
Anyway it's always been that way when the weather's changing. If LH had chosen to come in then JB would either have to queue or do an extra lap.

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#1202 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:53

Lewis is so fast in these conditions, especially on full wets I think. Expect him to walk it if this race ever restarts again.

#1203 robefc

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:53

Can we stop the leading driver nonsense?
:rolleyes:


Completely different situations, you're reaching

#1204 trogggy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:55

Lewis is so fast in these conditions, especially on full wets I think. Expect him to walk it if this race ever restarts again.

Yep, I'm thinking the same. If it stays wet he'll win. Or spin.

#1205 Sevach

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:57

It was weird to see Button pitting before Hamilton, it was an obvious call and one would think the guy in the lead would get priority.
The only reason Hamilton is still leading is the fact that Button lost some time behind MS.

Otherwise, this call would have switched them.

#1206 BinaryDad

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:58

Yep, I'm thinking the same. If it stays wet he'll win. Or spin.


The Massa thread is that direction --> ;)


#1207 jjcale

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:58

Hard to predict how this will go... anybody down to FA could win this if it restarts.... if pushed I'd make LH the favourite with JB second favourite (as they have the clear best car... and LH is mighty on full wets)

#1208 Jeag

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:58

The only reason Hamilton is still leading is the fact that Button lost some time behind MS.


I think a lot of people missed this fact.

Not that it means much, Lewis is great in full wet conditions, especially when he doesn't have someone else's spray in his face.

Edited by Jeag, 25 March 2012 - 09:01.


#1209 undersquare

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 08:59

Lewis is so fast in these conditions, especially on full wets I think. Expect him to walk it if this race ever restarts again.

Going to go damp/drying later on - JB territory too.

#1210 trogggy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:02

The Massa thread is that direction --> ;)

!. It was a joke.
2. Did you watch Hungary last year?
3. No, never mind.

#1211 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:04

It was weird to see Button pitting before Hamilton, it was an obvious call and one would think the guy in the lead would get priority.
The only reason Hamilton is still leading is the fact that Button lost some time behind MS.

Otherwise, this call would have switched them.

Really getting tired of this 'poor Lewis' bs.

Hamilton: "The rain is getting heavier, but it's okay. The car is aquaplaning in places, but it's okay."
Button: "Box this lap."
Jenson pits for full wets.

Perhaps he should just indicate that he wants to pit, then McLaren will make it happen for him. Jeez.

#1212 ForzaGTR

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:05

I think a lot of people missed this fact.

Not that it means much, Lewis is great in full wet conditions, especially when he doesn't have someone else's spray in his face.


It was one of the reasons, not the only reason. Had Lewis not kept such a decent lap time on the inters he would have lost the place.

#1213 jrg19

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:08

Lewis would have got the call and when he chose to stay out jenson gets the option to change

#1214 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:08

No, not right. That's an assumption.
Unless there's something on the radio between LH and AL the lap before JB pitted in Aus?
Anyway it's always been that way when the weather's changing. If LH had chosen to come in then JB would either have to queue or do an extra lap.

Assumption?Even better then.
AL is an idiot,he showed it yet again,good for Ham being fast enough not to lose the lead.
Always or when JB arrived? I don't see them doing it with Heikki and risking P1 for Lewis.

Bravo JB/RE bravo.

#1215 robefc

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:10

It was one of the reasons, not the only reason. Had Lewis not kept such a decent lap time on the inters he would have lost the place.


He had a slow stop too i think.

Similar to oz in 2010, lewis had better pace on the inters hence less likely to want to stop.

#1216 mlsnoopy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:11

Hmm. So why was Button nallowed to pit before Hamilton, I thought that the second driver must wait for the leading driver to pit.
So in the second race that what I was arguing last race got confirmed.

#1217 revlec

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:12

It was weird to see Button pitting before Hamilton, it was an obvious call and one would think the guy in the lead would get priority.
The only reason Hamilton is still leading is the fact that Button lost some time behind MS.

Otherwise, this call would have switched them.


this. :up:

I was surprised to see Lewis in front.


#1218 DefJack

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:12

In the rain Lewis is the fastest, Jenson is good on a drying track though.

#1219 mlsnoopy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:12

Lewis would have got the call and when he chose to stay out jenson gets the option to change


Why didn't they do that last year in China?

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#1220 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:13

Really getting tired of this 'poor Lewis' bs.

Hamilton: "The rain is getting heavier, but it's okay. The car is aquaplaning in places, but it's okay."
Button: "Box this lap."
Jenson pits for full wets.

Perhaps he should just indicate that he wants to pit, then McLaren will make it happen for him. Jeez.


It's his RE's job to see these things,JBs one is friikkin toying with them,every time.Every race.

#1221 revlec

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:14

Lewis would have got the call and when he chose to stay out jenson gets the option to change


You could apply the same logic in the last race in Australia.
BUT decided to stay out because he was fine, but HAM was struggling. he didn't pit anyway and had to wait for BUT to pit first.

#1222 trogggy

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:16

Hmm. So why was Button nallowed to pit before Hamilton, I thought that the second driver must wait for the leading driver to pit.
So in the second race that what I was arguing last race got confirmed.

You thought wrong.


#1223 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:19

It's his RE's job to see these things,JBs one is friikkin toying with them,every time.Every race.

It's just as much the RE's job as it is the drivers job, so your comment also applies to Lewis.

Why act like Lewis is just some puppet.

Either way, Lewis is fricking fast here in the wet, so you don't have to worry much. Even if Button would pass him under pitstops I expect Lewis to be able to overtake.

#1224 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:20

You could apply the same logic in the last race in Australia.
BUT decided to stay out because he was fine, but HAM was struggling. he didn't pit anyway and had to wait for BUT to pit first.

Exactly! Who cares wet or dry when the outcome is the same?

#1225 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:24

It's just as much the RE's job as it is the drivers job, so your comment also applies to Lewis.

Why act like Lewis is just some puppet.

Either way, Lewis is fricking fast here in the wet, so you don't have to worry much. Even if Button would pass him under pitstops I expect Lewis to be able to overtake.

Pit » HAM: "I'll do that as best I can Lewis."
1 second ago

Hamilton: "Please keep me up-to-date about the weather."

#1226 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:25

Pit » HAM: "I'll do that as best I can Lewis."
1 second ago

Hamilton: "Please keep me up-to-date about the weather."

Button: "What's the forecast doing?"

It's information they all want to know. Doesn't change my point.

#1227 revlec

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:35

Nothing new here.. same story..

#1228 ImDDAA

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:37

Did Button ruin Karthikeyan's race?

#1229 ImDDAA

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 09:45

Have McLaren messed up their tyre pressures on the inters? Both Button and Hamilton struggling for pace, both good in these conditions ordinarily.

#1230 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:38


Lewis race engineer is not incompetent. Not even close. If he was, within an organisation like McLaren he would have been long gone. They are far better placed to judge this than the likes of you.

I'll bookmark this and bump it after 10 races,.McLaren have computers do their judging :wave: when it comes to strategy,whether in Quali or in the Race.


How about 1 race?

#1231 ImDDAA

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:40

Hamilton has looked terribly slow since the inters went on, even on the dry tyres he's not been able to pick anything back up. Still, another podium isn't bad.

#1232 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:52

Hamilton has looked terribly slow since the inters went on, even on the dry tyres he's not been able to pick anything back up. Still, another podium isn't bad.

He had mad pace than before restart they took off a lot of wing,isn't that a strategy f*** up? He was 1.5 second faster than Vettel,pre red flag.

#1233 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:58

Oh this feels bad. This really sucks. But what a terrible race for McLaren overall. Multiple pitstops went wrong, strategies were questionable. Nice podium for Lewis for his championship position, but overall a race to forget. Where was the pace? It looked like the whole field was playing level, Hamilton couldn't keep up with a Ferrari and Sauber and Button had a tough time passing other cars.

#1234 ermo

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:59

Well, well -- the tables have turned: Good job by Lewis today to keep it cool and keep it together for a podium. Shame about his slow-ish pitstops, but he still got some good points on the board.

Jenson? Hrmpf. Had to go and do a Lewis and break his front wing on Karthikeyan's car on an over optimistic overtaking maneuver. To add insult to injury he was overtaken by Rosberg on the last lap. :rolleyes:

Q: Lewis 2, Jenson 0.
R: Lewis 1, Jenson 1.
P: Lewis: 30, Jenson: 25.

#1235 Trust

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 10:59

Lewis the RAINMASTER finishes 3rd. :rotfl:
Even then, still better than Button. So kudos to that.

#1236 f1fastestlap

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:03

Button: "That was a horrendous day at the office. Sorry guys. I just didn't slow the car down enough with KAR. A terrible day."

#1237 teejay

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:05

Lewis gets this one I dare say

#1238 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:05

Oh this feels bad. This really sucks. But what a terrible race for McLaren overall. Multiple pitstops went wrong, strategies were questionable. Nice podium for Lewis for his championship position, but overall a race to forget. Where was the pace? It looked like the whole field was playing level, Hamilton couldn't keep up with a Ferrari and Sauber and Button had a tough time passing other cars.

Not when he got pole :| sorry mate.I wrote this 4 days ago..............


Sepang is a brutal track,his side/team have to get the setup spot on for race pace and also don't waste too many tires in Qualy.I'd rather have Lewis start 6th with fresh tires on hand and a good race setup than on pole with all used tires left.Which is I'm afraid they'll do,again,and he'll start going backwards and end of stints and end up with one more pitstop.

Luck or not FA started 13th? and got only 5pts less than Lewis in the end,so that's how races could go and how irrelevant Quali can be if you have good race pace vs one lap speed,i.e Merc.


I'll hate saying I told you so :cry: I've lost all faith in Lewis' side of garage. And I will be happy to eat my words if I'm wrong.

I told you so.Sorry mate but MAC is the most incompetent outfit there is.


#1239 f1fastestlap

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:05

Lewis the RAINMASTER finishes 3rd. :rotfl:
Even then, still better than Button. So kudos to that.


He was faster guy when was raining... :cool:

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#1240 teejay

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:06

Lewis the RAINMASTER finishes 3rd. :rotfl:
Even then, still better than Button. So kudos to that.


Schumacher the rain master was no where near third... point?

#1241 PNSD

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:08

I bet some Lewis fans looking pretty stupid now. Saying season over after 1 race.

Jenson was god awful today. Pace was as good as Hamiltons however, but he just floundered. Being overtaken by Nico at the end is a non-issue. I dont think he would have been bothered.

Lewis did a good job despite Mclaren trying their best to ruin his race!!


#1242 bonjon1979a

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:08

Bad calls from the team there - but conspiracy theorists should look elsewhere. I think that they favored Jenson a little with the first switch to inters but that's probably because he asked to come in. I think Hamilton will have to start making these calls but I guess this is where Jenson's experience helps - knocking his wing off though was a real rookie move. If that were hamilton this board would be full of people lambasting him...

Anyway, I think that in the end it was great damage limitation by Hamilton as Mclaren did a horrible job on the pit wall. That's how the championship's going to won this year though - pick up the podiums and the wins will come. Shades of 2007.

#1243 Tstag

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:09

Hamilton was calm in difficult conditions today. Those points are valuable and will all add up at the end of the season. I think this is Lewis Hamiltons year!

#1244 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:09

I'll hate saying I told you so :cry: I've lost all faith in Lewis' side of garage. And I will be happy to eat my words if I'm wrong.

I told you so.Sorry mate but MAC is the most incompetent outfit there is.

Lol. We've yet to hear from Lewis but you're saying i'ts just in the way they saved tyres in qualifying? Sorry but the pace in the dry was not there, that had nothing to do with qualifying as they had enough fresh tyres, right?

#1245 TheBunk

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:10

They both didnt do good, and should be ashamed of the result with the car theyre driving. Having said that at least Lewis got a result, where Button absolutly dropped it. The weekend goes to Lewis imo.

#1246 Lights

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:12

They both didnt do good, and should be ashamed of the result with the car theyre driving. Having said that at least Lewis got a result, where Button absolutly dropped it. The weekend goes to Lewis imo.

Ehm, not really a question even is it. Button binned it and Hamilton did nothing wrong all race.

#1247 Sevach

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:14

Lewis gets this one by default.

I'm befuddled by his pace however... and the bad pit stops.

#1248 zack1994

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:18

Well that was a disaster poor mistake from button
Solid result from lewis :up:

#1249 fieraku

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:18

Lol. We've yet to hear from Lewis but you're saying i'ts just in the way they saved tyres in qualifying? Sorry but the pace in the dry was not there, that had nothing to do with qualifying as they had enough fresh tyres, right?

I'd rather have Lewis start 6th with fresh tires on hand and a good race setup than on pole

Luck or not FA started 13th? and got only 5pts less than Lewis in the end,so that's how races could go and how irrelevant Quali can be if you have good race pace vs one lap speed,i.e Merc.


Which makes my point even truer.Imagine if it was a dry race,McLaren were setup heavily Quali biased,thus no race pace from Ham again.

And Alonso had race pace,again.And Mec did not again.
Coincidences?


Mclaren are being out smarted,a Ferrari driver leads the WDC standings,Ferrari mate. :wave:

Edited by fieraku, 25 March 2012 - 11:23.


#1250 P123

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Posted 25 March 2012 - 11:21

I bet some Lewis fans looking pretty stupid now. Saying season over after 1 race.

Jenson was god awful today. Pace was as good as Hamiltons however, but he just floundered. Being overtaken by Nico at the end is a non-issue. I dont think he would have been bothered.

Lewis did a good job despite Mclaren trying their best to ruin his race!!


Hmmm, I don't think it was just some Lewis fans saying that....

JB's pace as good as Hamilton's? Only when he had to change for another set of fresher inters (awaiting all the talk about JB unable to manage tyres, but expecting tumbleweed...). In the end he was passed by Rosberg.