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Autosport Driver Ratings 2012


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#1 hhg1

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 20:42

Following each race weekend, Autosport Editor Edd Straw rates the overall performance of every driver on the grid. Here, we can keep track of the overall ratings and debate their accuracy.

Australian Grand Prix
Button 10
Alonso 9
Vettel 8
Schumacher 8
Ricciardo 8
Vergne 8
Hamilton 7
Webber 7
Kobayashi 7
Raikkonen 7
Perez 7
Maldonado 7
Glock 7
Grosjean 7
Hulkenberg 7
Pic 7
Di Resta 6
Kovalainen 6
de la Rosa 6
Karthikeyan 6
Rosberg 5
Petrov 5
Massa 4
Senna 4

Even though Rosberg disappointed, that seems like a pretty harsh rating. Yes, he made two mistakes in qualifying, and his race craft was poor. Still, he made a pretty good start, and the car, which showed promise in testing and in qualifying, could not maintain the same pace throughout the race. That's not necessarily his fault, and we don't really know how well Schumacher would have done under similar circumstances. Sure, he didn't prove his genius (which, as we have said over and over again, he needs to very soon), but he wasn't just a small step above the abysmal Felipe Massa.

Grosjean too seems to be ranked a bit low for my taste. His performance in qualifying was stunning (although we have no idea how well Raikkonen would have done), and, in all likelihood, he would have beaten Raikkonen if it were not for Maldonado.

Maldonado also deserves to be ranked with Vettel, Schumacher, Ricciardo, and Vergne. Sure, there were some lairy moments (with Gosjean, in particular), and his crash on the final lap did little to boost his reputation. Still, this was a Monaco-spec Maldonado who displayed great attack and resolve. Additionally, he completely outshone his teammate and took Williams to heights it hasn't seen in a while.

Thoughts?

Edited by hhg1, 19 March 2012 - 20:43.


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#2 mursuka80

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 20:49

9 for Alonso is too high. Perez and Raikkonen made more places in race and plus he screwed up the qualy.

#3 ev0lution

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 20:58

9 for Alonso is too high. Perez and Raikkonen made more places in race and plus he screwed up the qualy.


What, you mean like unlike Fernando, Kimi did not screw up qual ? It was an early Saturday, but I am pretty sure I saw Kimi go out in Q1. Alonso did well, given what he had to work with.

#4 mursuka80

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:00

Yes he screwed up qualy, but to me 9 for Alonso is too high. Last year 9 was usually given for almost perfect weekend and Alonsos definately wasnt one.

#5 TheBunk

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:04

Massa 4? For what? 0 would have been more appropriate.

#6 korzeniow

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:05

Yes he screwed up qualy, but to me 9 for Alonso is too high. Last year 9 was usually given for almost perfect weekend and Alonsos definately wasnt one.


I think when in comparsion with Massa he should have 20

#7 slmk

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:07

7 for Hamilton was harsh considering he did get pole and a podium. I think 8 would have been appropriate. If MSC got 8 for a 4th place and a DNF, then so should LH.

#8 Atreiu

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:07

7 for Maldonado is too much, IMO. How long has Williams been waiting for an encouraging result? How long has Maldonado been waiting to leave pay driver status behind? You don't mess up like that. Who knows if the other teams will jump them in the development race and then no other opportunity for a decent result appeaers?

#9 Sakae

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:08

Where are rating criteria stated?

#10 Group B

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:14

I can't see how Button can get 10 when he failed to get pole in a pole-sitting car. Great weekend, but not perfect. Fred's 9 a tad kind, Rosberg's 5 a bit harsh, otherwise not too much argument.

#11 crespo

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:15

7 for Maldonado is too much, IMO. How long has Williams been waiting for an encouraging result? How long has Maldonado been waiting to leave pay driver status behind? You don't mess up like that. Who knows if the other teams will jump them in the development race and then no other opportunity for a decent result appeaers?

I'm sure all of that flashed through his brain as he careened into the wall.

A great race topped off by a hapless mistake = 7 in my book. The gravity of that mistake balances out the great race he had, and seeing what his teammate did with the same equipment, 7 sounds about right to me.

#12 RealRacing

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:16

Where are rating criteria stated?


Exactly,

Maldonado, race driver> 9

Maldonado, point scorer> 2

#13 icecream_man

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:16

Massa 4? For what? 0 would have been more appropriate.


:rotfl:

Must admit I think there's some harsh ratings there.

those that particularly stand out are :-

Grosjean - much as it pains me to say it cos I can't stand the guy, was outstanding in quali, and got nerfed off in the race. I suppose it could be argued that he shouldn't have given Maldonado the opportunity in the first place, but still...

Rosberg - Was right with MS in quali until that one mistake, and the car just simply didn't have race pace, we saw in testing that it was going to struggle with tyre deg, 5 is far too harsh imo

Alonso - Had it not been for the numerous errors and misfortunes of others he'd have been out of the points, I'm not convinced 9 is justified really

Edited by icecream_man, 19 March 2012 - 21:17.


#14 Mr j

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:18

Massa 4? For what? 0 would have been more appropriate.

I think you´re beeing a bit to to generous with giving him an 0, you must be a Felipe fan giving him a high grade like that, I would say a minus 10 would be more accurate. :lol:

#15 crespo

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:18

7 for Hamilton was harsh considering he did get pole and a podium. I think 8 would have been appropriate. If MSC got 8 for a 4th place and a DNF, then so should LH.

Yeah, it's a bit harsh, I'd say... 8 sounds more reasonable. He probably got a 7 because of how easily Button *appeared* to get away from Lewis in clean air. Lewis didn't show his best yesterday.

#16 icecream_man

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:26

I can't see how Button can get 10 when he failed to get pole in a pole-sitting car. Great weekend, but not perfect. Fred's 9 a tad kind, Rosberg's 5 a bit harsh, otherwise not too much argument.


Depends really, if he compromised on quali performance slightly for the sake of race pace with his setup then I think a 10's still fair despite not getting pole, difficult to say really - it's possible that his quali lap was the absolute best he could possibly have got out of the car with his setup, who knows, but he certainly didn't put a foot wrong whatsoever and made it look all too easy to pull a gap when he needed to and maintain it thereafter

Edited by icecream_man, 19 March 2012 - 21:29.


#17 Fastcake

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:26

I can't see how Button can get 10 when he failed to get pole in a pole-sitting car. Great weekend, but not perfect. Fred's 9 a tad kind, Rosberg's 5 a bit harsh, otherwise not too much argument.


Much as I think Button deserved to get a 10 anyway, I do agree with you when considering last year many winning drivers were only scored nines.

Think Alonso was a tad overrated, an 8 for a great drive but his recovery was aided by retirements of cars in front. Might of also given Hamilton and Perez another point, at the cost of Vergne.

Not that it matters, these ratings solely exist for us to make fun off  ;)

#18 korzeniow

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:27

Yeah, it's a bit harsh, I'd say... 8 sounds more reasonable. He probably got a 7 because of how easily Button *appeared* to get away from Lewis in clean air. Lewis didn't show his best yesterday.


But he lost not only to Button but also to Vettel. He couldn't overtake Perez who has been on the one set of tyres for the half of the race while Hamilton put new rubber on. He's race pae wasn't great either. 7 is fine IMO

#19 TheBunk

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:30

I think you´re beeing a bit to to generous with giving him an 0, you must be a Felipe fan giving him a high grade like that, I would say a minus 10 would be more accurate. :lol:


Lol, I was thinking the same about Straw. Why is he kissing Felipes rear end? Just what exactly did he do right this weekend? Ok, he didnt drive the track backwards but thats just about it. He even has an engineer who needs to remind him at every corner wich pedal does what.

I think the 7 for Lewis is too low. Without the sc he wouldv been P2, with a pole. Should be 8.

Edited by TheBunk, 19 March 2012 - 21:32.


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#20 Group B

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:31

Depends really, if he compromised on quali performance slightly for the sake of race pace with his setup then I think a 10's still fair despite not getting pole, difficult to say really - it's possible that his quali lap was the absolute best he could do with his setup, who knows, but he certainly didn't put a foot wrong whatsoever and made it look all too easy to pull a gap when he needed to and maintain it thereafter

Well, according to JB he missed pole because of a mistake, not setup choice, so I whilst his race was indeed excellent I don't see it as a 'perfect 10' weekend.

#21 icecream_man

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:36

But he lost not only to Button but also to Vettel. He couldn't overtake Perez who has been on the one set of tyres for the half of the race while Hamilton put new rubber on. He's race pae wasn't great either. 7 is fine IMO


To be fair he lost out to Vettel because of unfortunate SC timing, we'll never know whether Vettel would have otherwise had him on track or not

Agree with the rest though

Edited by icecream_man, 19 March 2012 - 21:39.


#22 Mr j

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:37

I can't see how Button can get 10 when he failed to get pole in a pole-sitting car. Great weekend, but not perfect. Fred's 9 a tad kind, Rosberg's 5 a bit harsh, otherwise not too much argument.

How can winning be less than 10, especially when starting from a position lesser than pole and beating the driver who is supposed to be the fastest driver in F1, who is better than the most complete driver, Alonso. Is it possible that Button is actually the best driver among all the drivers today. I mean beating the fastest driver who in his rookie season beat the the great Alonso.

Or is it perhaps that Hamilton is not that great of a driver and Alonso even less of a great driver since Button, with not that of a great teammate stat, is actually better than both?


Edited by Mr j, 19 March 2012 - 21:53.


#23 icecream_man

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:37

Well, according to JB he missed pole because of a mistake, not setup choice, so I whilst his race was indeed excellent I don't see it as a 'perfect 10' weekend.


Fair enough can't argue with that, maybe a 9.5 then  ;)

#24 Group B

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:40

Fair enough can't argue with that, maybe a 9.5 then ;)

Yep, I'd go with that. :)

#25 hhg1

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:41

Where are rating criteria stated?


As it turns out, Straw fails to delineate any sort of rating criteria, so it's really up for us to decide. Ranking is an idle activity in general (numbers can only show so much), but it's even more so without any sort of standards.

#26 Sakae

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:42

How can winning be less than 10, especially when starting from a position lesser than pole and beating the driver who is supposed to be the fastest, who is better than the most complete driver, Alonso. Is it possible that Button is actually the best driver among all the drivers today. I mean beating the fastest driver who in his rookie season best over all driver, the great Alonso.

Or is perhaps Hamilton not that great of a driver and Alonso even less of a great driver since Button, with not that of a great team mate stat, actually better than both?

Vettel won some races last year, and if my memory serves me, I think he got even 8 points, despite winning the race.

#27 Group B

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:48

How can winning be less than 10, especially when starting from a position lesser than pole and beating the driver who is supposed to be the fastest, who is better than the most complete driver, Alonso. Is it possible that Button is actually the best driver among all the drivers today. I mean beating the fastest driver who in his rookie season best over all driver, the great Alonso.

Or is perhaps Hamilton not that great of a driver and Alonso even less of a great driver since Button, with not that of a great team mate stat, actually better than both?

Winning can be less than a 10 because the scores are supposed to reflect both days. The rest of your post tails off into silly waffle that could be countered by arguing the same logic makes Ralf and Fisi racing gods. I'm not attempting to slag JB off or belittle his performance, I'm saying he didn't have a perfect weekend - he made a mistake which he himself admits probably cost him pole. That being the case I think a 9 would have been a bit more appropriate.

Edited by Group B, 19 March 2012 - 21:48.


#28 Buttoneer

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:48

Vettel won some races last year, and if my memory serves me, I think he got even 8 points, despite winning the race.

Do a search and find out for sure.

http://forums.autosp...howtopic=149890

He got 9 for Australia 2011 which is what I think Button's performance for the last weekend deserved.

#29 Sakae

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:55

Do a search and find out for sure.

http://forums.autosp...howtopic=149890

He got 9 for Australia 2011 which is what I think Button's performance for the last weekend deserved.


I meant one of the races in the course of the year, and not necessarily in Australia. Point was, I am not sure what criteria are used, but the argument that winning the race should guarantee 10 point on the BB might not necessarily apply. (BTW the link is not working for me; clicking on it brings in a while screen, that's all).

#30 TFLB

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 21:59

Massa should have got a 0. I struggle to see how qualifying 1 second behind your teammate (who crashed), fighting for 16th in the race in a Ferrari before crashing and generally being a liability all weekend can earn a 4.

Edit: Rosberg should get a 0 as well, he just collapses under any form of pressure. He's made mistakes while leading in the past to, like in China 2010. He'll never win a race.

Edited by TFLB, 19 March 2012 - 22:03.


#31 Kubiccia

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:00

How can winning be less than 10, especially when starting from a position lesser than pole and beating the driver who is supposed to be the fastest driver in F1, who is better than the most complete driver, Alonso. Is it possible that Button is actually the best driver among all the drivers today. I mean beating the fastest driver who in his rookie season beat the the great Alonso.

Or is it perhaps that Hamilton is not that great of a driver and Alonso even less of a great driver since Button, with not that of a great teammate stat, is actually better than both?


those are very subjective claims

Anyway, why people keep saying Rosberg made 2 mistakes in Q3? I only saw a single, rather small, one in his last attempt, for the braking of T3.

People just seems bitter because Nico was 3 and a half tenths slower than his hated(by most) team mate.

#32 Group B

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:02

I meant one of the races in the course of the year, and not necessarily in Australia. Point was, I am not sure what criteria are used, but the argument that winning the race should guarantee 10 point on the BB might not necessarily apply. (BTW the link is not working for me; clicking on it brings in a while screen, that's all).

I don't think it ever has applied. I didn't follow the thread religiously last year, but it seemed pretty clear that to get a 10 you needed to get to most possible out of your machinery on both days while making no significant mistakes. That's NOT to say I always agreed with the scores handed out of course, but it seemed to be the accepted principle.

#33 korzeniow

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:02

those are very subjective claims

Anyway, why people keep saying Rosberg made 2 mistakes in Q3? I only saw a single, rather small, one in his last attempt, for the braking of T3.

People just seems bitter because Nico was 3 and a half tenths slower than his hated(by most) team mate.


He locked his tyres on both of his flyers in Q3. But I agree he looked faster than Schumacher.

Edited by korzeniow, 19 March 2012 - 22:03.


#34 LiJu914

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:06

He locked his tyres on both of his flyers


Very poetic.

#35 McHonda

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:09

To answer 1st post. I think this whole autosport rating thing is absolute dogs bollocks.

#36 Buttoneer

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:12

I meant one of the races in the course of the year, and not necessarily in Australia. Point was, I am not sure what criteria are used, but the argument that winning the race should guarantee 10 point on the BB might not necessarily apply. (BTW the link is not working for me; clicking on it brings in a while screen, that's all).

As Group B says, pole and win won't guarantee a 10 but perhaps it should.

Link works for me so not sure what the problem is.

#37 Buttoneer

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:13

To answer 1st post. I think this whole autosport rating thing is absolute dogs bollocks.

So you think it's brilliant then?

#38 Mr j

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:14

Winning can be less than a 10 because the scores are supposed to reflect both days. The rest of your post tails off into silly waffle that could be countered by arguing the same logic makes Ralf and Fisi racing gods. I'm not attempting to slag JB off or belittle his performance, I'm saying he didn't have a perfect weekend - he made a mistake which he himself admits probably cost him pole. That being the case I think a 9 would have been a bit more appropriate.


This is a surpise to me. Are you saying that the criteria of a race weekend is based on qualifying and the actual race? So you mean that a driver who wins every race in a season hasn¨t had a perfect year beacause he didn¨t qualify on pole every race, even when set up his car for winning races, which is when then points are decided?

#39 Buttoneer

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:20

This is a surpise to me. Are you saying that the criteria of a race weekend is based on qualifying and the actual race? So you mean that a driver who wins every race in a season hasn¨t had a perfect year beacause he didn¨t qualify on pole every race, even when set up his car for winning races, which is when then points are decided?

He's saying that this is what appears to be the case. We don't know what the scoring criteria are.

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#40 Watkins74

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:20

To answer 1st post. I think this whole autosport rating thing is absolute dogs bollocks.

I agree when they judge my favorite drivers harshly.

When Autosport gives my favorites high marks I find it spot on.

edit: My post makes no sense and now I have been educated on what "dogs bollocks" actually means.

Edited by Watkins74, 19 March 2012 - 22:27.


#41 robefc

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:22

This is a surpise to me. Are you saying that the criteria of a race weekend is based on qualifying and the actual race? So you mean that a driver who wins every race in a season hasn¨t had a perfect year beacause he didn¨t qualify on pole every race, even when set up his car for winning races, which is when then points are decided?


And then the problem is you're expected to win from pole whereas someone else can make up places and will then look like they deserve a higher score than the winner who can therefore only get a 9!

I don't think the criteria is that constant tbh.

I think a couple of people said lewis and alonso should both have got 8, i can understand a 1 point switch for either in isolation but not together, fred definitely deserves a higher score than lewis imo.

#42 discover23

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:22

Alonso made a mistake in qualifying but if you really think about that didn't impact his result in this race. He he a great start and an extra set of new tires that kept him in the game until the end. If he would have made it to Q3 most likely he would've qualified somewhere between P7-P10 with both mclaren and redbull still in front.

Given the pace of the Ferrari compared to the other teams finishing P5 was the best result possible for Alonso.


#43 trogggy

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:23

I agree when they judge my favorite drivers harshly.

When Autosport gives my favorites high marks I find it spot on.

dogs bollocks = fantastic, the best...  ;)

#44 discover23

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:25

I think a couple of people said lewis and alonso should both have got 8, i can understand a 1 point switch for either in isolation but not together, fred definitely deserves a higher score than lewis imo.

Lewis had the best car and earned pole, it was his race to lose ...

#45 Watkins74

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:26

dogs bollocks = fantastic, the best...;)

Really, I never heard it before.....it sounded bad. :lol:

I fall on the sword and now I know! edit: Thank you Buttoneer!

Edited by Watkins74, 19 March 2012 - 22:31.


#46 Buttoneer

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:27

Dogs Bollocks.

#47 KateLM

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:31

4 is being remarkably kind to Massa, I have to say. Rosberg didn't have a great weekend but he did actually show some pace so only one mark better seems a bit harsh. I wouldn't have given Massa more than a 2 in all honesty.

I'd give Button, Vettel and maybe Alonso a mark less each but that's based on my interpretation of what marking on the whole weekend means, which seems to vary from week to week in Straw's book.

I'm not sure what 6 for the HRT drivers is based on either, other than an arbitrary figure because the car was so bad that there no point in analysing how the drivers did.

#48 Sakae

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:35

As Group B says, pole and win won't guarantee a 10 but perhaps it should.

Link works for me so not sure what the problem is.


I think my initial response was to a post #22.

I went into last year thread, and like slave scroll bunch of pages, and at the end I think I was wrong. My recall was that Seb got 8, 7, even 6 (in Germany), but he did not win any of those races. From his 11 wins Autosport gave him 6 x full 10 points, and 5 x 9 points only. I am not sure that I have good grasp of this rating, unless someone is playing cruel joke on us, and loughing at us behind one way mirror.

#49 weareracing

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:37

HRT drivers score 6?

#50 Kubiccia

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Posted 19 March 2012 - 22:43

He locked his tyres on both of his flyers in Q3. But I agree he looked faster than Schumacher.


Agree with who? Looked faster? :rolleyes:

Schumacher was faster on both runs they had in Q3 and I saw qualifying twice but couldn't see this first mistake you mention