84 replies to this topic

[sofarapartguy]

Well after a couple of seasons it's clear that some drivers have tracks where they perform way better that their usual level.

For example:

Kimi and Spa
Rosberg and China
Button and Hungary
Lewis and Abu Dabi

and so on
What do you think? Is it due to some driving styles and set-up preferences, that just suits different tracks? Or is it just a coincidence?

Got any other examples?

Edited by sofarapartguy, 17 April 2012 - 14:03.

[Markn93]

Massa and Turkey comes to mind. And Lewis and Canada is probably his most obvious one.

Edited by Markn93, 17 April 2012 - 13:44.

[Pits]

Schumi and Spa, Schumi and Monza, Schumi and Suzuka, Schumi and Canada etc...

[HopkinsonF1]

Well after a couple of seasons it's clear that some drivers have tracks where they perform way better that their usual level.

For example:

Kimi and Spa
Rosberg and China
Button and Hungary
Lewis and Abu Dabi

and so on
What do you think? Is it due to some driving styles and set-up preferences, that just suits different tracks? Or is it just a coincidence?

Got any other examples?

Lewis and Canada more than Yas Marina, I would have thought.

[sofarapartguy]

Massa and Turkey comes to mind. And Lewis and Canada is probably his most obvious one.

If talk about Massa v.1 I'd add Brasil.

[Zava]

Seb at suzuka, though last year was not phenomenal, but 2009-2010 was utterly dominant, winning every single session both years.
also, Bobby K at monaco, and maybe you could add Button at melbourne, Hamilton at Canada.

[sofarapartguy]

Lewis and Canada more than Yas Marina, I would have thought.

I'll always remember first F1 visit to Abu Dabi and Lewis pole lap. You couldn't ask for more dominance, could you?

[sofarapartguy]

Seb at suzuka, though last year was not phenomenal, but 2009-2010 was utterly dominant, winning every single session both years.
also, Bobby K at monaco, and maybe you could add Button at melbourne, Hamilton at Canada.

Didn't see anything special, sorry. 09-10 simply due to car on rails - it was the home of RB that years. And he failed in 2011, when the car was truly superior.

Edited by sofarapartguy, 17 April 2012 - 13:50.

[pingu666]

kevin harvick and jj at fontana

[Disgrace]

Button and Hungary

Not so sure about this one. He's won twice in the wet, but otherwise, he's had no other notable results. 2007 in particular was a horror show when his Honda was outpaced by a Spyker before he broke down.

Maldonado and Monaco is another example.

Alonso usually does well at Barcelona, other than in 2007.

[Markn93]

I'll always remember first F1 visit to Abu Dabi and Lewis pole lap. You couldn't ask for more dominance, could you?

His 2010 pole lap at Montreal was quite something. First person to snap RB pole streak.

[joshb]

Vettel gone well round Abu Dhabi, not been off the front row and won both races he finished.
Suzuka similar, though the track suited the cars characteristics.

Hamilton/Canada
Alonso/Singapore
Maldonado i think goes well at street tracks (thats not just from F1)
Webber is strong at Nurburgring
Kimi/Spa
Schumi gone well round a lot of tracks, hard to nail one in particular, didn't he win like 7 or 8 times at Magny Cours?

[Markn93]

Any chance of adding to the thread title the other aspect of this, namely, drivers and their worst tracks?

[sofarapartguy]

Any chance of adding to the thread title the other aspect of this, namely, drivers and their worst tracks?

Any examples of driver/worst track? I can think only about Massa/wet Silverstone

[Alarcon]

Vettel and Suzuka. He ran there just 3 times and he achieved 3 poles (on of these the most competitive pole ever at this circuit), 2 victories and 1 WDC.
Vettel and Monza, where he did pole and win with two different cars.
Vettel and Valencia too.
Vettel and Abu Dhabi, 2 pole positions and 2 victories over 3 races.

Alonso and Bahrein, where he won 3 times.

Button and Melbourne where he won 3 times.

And Schumacher and France where he won 8 times (if I´m not bad)!

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 14:30.

[sofarapartguy]

Vettel and Suzuka. He ran there just 3 times and he achieved 3 poles and 2 victories.

Alonso and Bahrein, where he won 3 times.

Button and Melbourne where he won 3 times.

And Schumacher and France where he won 8 times (if I´m not bad)!

I don't think that wins/poles or podiums are a good indicator.. Fisi almost won in Spa in a FI after pole, but doesn't mean he's next god of that track.

Edited by sofarapartguy, 17 April 2012 - 14:22.

[Markn93]

Any examples of driver/worst track? I can think only about Massa/wet Silverstone

Maybe not worst tracks but off the top of my head, Webber's never done particularly well in Australia with some pretty dominant cars and Lewis hasn't been good in Brazil.

[Alarcon]

I don't think that wins/poles or podiums are a good indicator.. Fisi almost won in Spa in a FI after pole, but doesn't mean he's next god of that track.

No, maybe the best indicator on the thread "drivers at their best tracks" are the circuits where they DNF...

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 14:26.

[sofarapartguy]

Maybe not worst tracks but off the top of my head, Webber's never done particularly well in Australia with some pretty dominant cars and Lewis hasn't been good in Brazil.

But they wasn't horrible at all. If we take the other side of "being above the level', then it should be some really miserable example, like Massa in Barcelona' 11.

Edited by sofarapartguy, 17 April 2012 - 14:26.

[sofarapartguy]

No, maybe the best indicator on the thread "drivers at their best tracks" are the circuits where they DNF...

I'm sure you'll find that this is the case with many tracks and Kimi

[Alarcon]

The worst for Vettel: Nurburgring...

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 14:28.

[Alarcon]

I'm sure you'll find that this is the case with many tracks and Kimi

Kimi = Spa.

Mr.Spa.

He won 4 times (if I´m not bad). But what about if he would never won there? Then nobody would call him Mr.Spa, isn´it?

[sofarapartguy]

Kimi = Spa.

Mr.Spa.

He won 4 times (if I´m not bad). But what about if he would never won there? Then nobody would call him Mr.Spa, isn´it?

Even if he didn't win in 09, people would still claim he is special on this circuit. He says this himself.

[Markn93]

But they wasn't horrible at all. If we take the other side of "being above the level', then it should be some really miserable example, like Massa in Barcelona' 11.

True, it's funny though that it's only Massa examples that I can think of for being really poor around a circuit.

Also Senna was great around San Marino, (and most places), with 8 poles.

[Trust]

The only real specialist is Kimi. You wonder why?

Well, there is only one criteria for that. Whenever he finished the race there, he won it. Can the same be said for other drivers?

Edited by Trust, 17 April 2012 - 14:36.

[Markn93]

The only real specialist is Kimi. You wonder why?

Well, there is only one criteria for that. Whenever he finished the race there, he won it. Can the same be said for other drivers?

Hamilton, Canada.

[Trust]

Hamilton, Canada.

Ok, so only two specialists really. Anyone else?

[August]

Of ex-drivers:
Senna at Monaco
Häkkinen at Catalunya

[Alarcon]

I forgot the driver/worst circuits for:

Alonso = Brazil, Canada and... Spa!

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 15:24.

[lifeohlife]

Hamilton - Canada
Kimi - Spa (though MS has been very good in Spa too)
Vettel - Suzuka
Alonso is a street circut specialist.

[sofarapartguy]

I forgot the driver/worst circuits for:

Alonso = Brazil, Canada and... Spa!

He finished 3d in 2010. Wasn't particularly best, but don't think he was that bad at this circuit.

Agree with statement above, Alonso is good at streets. His quali pace in the year of Singapore-gate in a dog of a car was just exceptional.

[sofarapartguy]

Ok, so only two specialists really. Anyone else?

TBF very few drivers had a luxury of a potentially winning car during their career. I'm sure Alonso would've done better on the huge ammount of tracks, but wasn't able to show some absolutely perfect results due to periods like 08-09.

[goingthedistance]

Alonso - Singapore
Vettel - Suzuka
Webber - Nurburgring, Catalunya
Hamilton - Abu Dhabi
Ralf Schumacher - Canada

[sofarapartguy]

Alonso - Singapore
Vettel - Suzuka
Webber - Nurburgring, Catalunya
Hamilton - Abu Dhabi
Ralf Schumacher - Canada

Mb it's just me but.. Well, I will agree on that if Seb wins Suzuka this year, with car not the best of the best.

[Stormsky68]

worst = anyone driving a Mclaren at Interlagos, I can't recall the last time an MP4 looked really good there




oops, am I implying the car might have something to do with drivers looking good or bad!

Edited by Stormsky68, 17 April 2012 - 16:14.

[Alarcon]

worst = anyone driving a Mclaren at Interlagos, I can't recall the last time an MP4 looked really good there

Alonso in 2007? Considering he had no pressure on his tyres...

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 16:21.

[GX390]

Maldonado/Spa

[sofarapartguy]

worst = anyone driving a Mclaren at Interlagos, I can't recall the last time an MP4 looked really good there

oops, am I implying the car might have something to do with drivers looking good or bad!

Kimi 2003?

Last year Mclaren has lost only to both RB as well - probably the best possible result.

Edited by sofarapartguy, 17 April 2012 - 16:21.

[BigCHrome]

The only real specialist is Kimi. You wonder why?

Well, there is only one criteria for that. Whenever he finished the race there, he won it. Can the same be said for other drivers?

Hamilton destroyed Raikkonen in 2008 in Spa, and he crashed all on his own. Your arguement is silly.

[Trust]

TBF very few drivers had a luxury of a potentially winning car during their career. I'm sure Alonso would've done better on the huge ammount of tracks, but wasn't able to show some absolutely perfect results due to periods like 08-09.

You could say that for every driver.
The fact is, there is no driver who could choose F60 over Toyotas, Saubers, Force Indias, Brawns in SPA, or 2004 McLaren over Ferrari.

[Trust]

Hamilton destroyed Raikkonen in 2008 in Spa, and he crashed all on his own. Your arguement is silly.

Or he crashed due to the car characheristics i.e cold tyres? We know how was Ferrari in the wet back then? You could argue Kimi was destroying Hamilton till 3 laps before end, and Lewis destroyed him at the end.

If Kimi finished the race, it was very probable he would win it.

One question for you? If Hamilton destroyed Kimi back then, what did he do against all other drivers? Is there a word for that?

[BigCHrome]

Or he crashed due to the car characheristics i.e cold tyres? We know how was Ferrari in the wet back then? You could argue Kimi was destroying Hamilton till 3 laps before end, and Lewis destroyed him at the end.

If Kimi finished the race, it was very probable he would win it.

One question for you? If Hamilton destroyed Kimi back then, what did he do against all other drivers? Is there a word for that?

I used the word "destroyed" not because he outpaced him, but because he passed him, then Kimi crashed trying to catch up.

If you say he crashed because of car characteristics, then we can argue that he won his races only because of car characteristics too - dominant car in 2005 and 2007, KERS and blatant cutting of the track in 2009.

[SirRacer]

Alonso - Singapore
Alonso - Australia
Alonso - Italia
Alonso - Monaco
Alonso - Korea

[BullHead]

I guess some tracks just 'click' with some drivers quicker and better than others. But the machinery and set up will still massively affect the outcome. I found in karting for example that certain locations / layouts seemed to flow for me better than others - can't think of any one real reason for that.

[Alarcon]

I used the word "destroyed" not because he outpaced him, but because he passed him, then Kimi crashed trying to catch up.

If you say he crashed because of car characteristics, then we can argue that he won his races only because of car characteristics too - dominant car in 2005 and 2007, KERS and blatant cutting of the track in 2009.

You mean he passed him after a dirty move or because cutting the chicane?



You know this race he was penalty and the FIA changed the rules after this dirty move?

Edited by Alarcon, 17 April 2012 - 16:54.

[Zava]

Alonso - Korea

based on what exactly?

[Jolkins]

Schumi and Spa, Schumi and Monza, Schumi and Suzuka, Schumi and Canada etc...

+1

Edited by Jolkins, 17 April 2012 - 17:24.

[Trust]

I used the word "destroyed" not because he outpaced him, but because he passed him, then Kimi crashed trying to catch up.

If you say he crashed because of car characteristics, then we can argue that he won his races only because of car characteristics too - dominant car in 2005 and 2007, KERS and blatant cutting of the track in 2009.

Can I say that Hamilton Canada victories came in dominant car?

We're going no where. Stop being unreasonable. If I can acknowledge Hamilton is special around Canada, why can't you do the same about Kimi in Spa?

[spinster]

Or he crashed due to the car characheristics i.e cold tyres? We know how was Ferrari in the wet back then? You could argue Kimi was destroying Hamilton till 3 laps before end, and Lewis destroyed him at the end.

If Kimi finished the race, it was very probable he would win it.

One question for you? If Hamilton destroyed Kimi back then, what did he do against all other drivers? Is there a word for that?

I was there in the paddock in 2008...and if someone say that Hamilton trashed Kimi in spa 2008...well than it's time to go to a doc my friend...

Kimi was more than 5 seconds ahead of him before rain came...and it doesn't need any explanation that the F2008 was a s**** car in rain (remember england,....)

[spinster]

Or he crashed due to the car characheristics i.e cold tyres? We know how was Ferrari in the wet back then? You could argue Kimi was destroying Hamilton till 3 laps before end, and Lewis destroyed him at the end.

If Kimi finished the race, it was very probable he would win it.

One question for you? If Hamilton destroyed Kimi back then, what did he do against all other drivers? Is there a word for that?

He won SPA 4 times...and Hamilton? errrrr... Never!