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Rosberg chopping both Hamilton and Alonso


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#1 jrg19

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 13:56

Rosberg putting both Lewis and fernando off track, does he deserve a penalty?

He wouldn't have made moves like that at a track like Monaco.

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#2 sultanofhyd

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 13:58

Absolutely he does, much worse than what Schumacher did to Barrichello at Hungary, the only difference being the absence of a wall.

#3 sharo

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 13:58

Actually what is the situation with the new tighter overtaking rule? Seems nothing has changed.

#4 Diablobb81

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 13:59

If it had been Schumacher this would have been a fun 100-page thread.

But Britney is such a nice guy.

#5 krapmeister

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:01

Actually I was willing to let Rosberg get away with the first one as I thought that was a bit out of character for him but then he did it to Alonso and very nearly Di Resta as well.

Wouldn't be surprised to see a grid drop next race...

#6 Kvothe

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:01

I like Rosberg, and the move he pulled off was borderline but then to whine about Lewis overtaking him off track was absolutely laughable!

#7 jrg19

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:02

He will probably get some kind of penalty because he's been investigated for the same thing twice.

#8 Crafty

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:03

Got to be worth a time penalty I think.

#9 GotYoubyTheBalls

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:03

Lewis penalty for overtaking off the track.

#10 Fastcake

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:04

Well he's not going to have much of a defence going up against the stewards when he's under investigation twice for the same incident. It was very impressive of Hamilton in overtaking Rosberg after he got pushed off though.

#11 choyothe

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:04

Not really, he just did the basic cut early to inside and misjudged how early both could get to his side. In Monaco Hamilton or Alonso wouldn't have gone inside but since theres concrete there in Bahrain it's different.

#12 robefc

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:04

Commentators and journos on twitter keep saying you don't have to leave a car's width when you make your defensive move but only when you return to the racing line.

But what the hell has tha got to do with when a car's alongside you? I thought there was a 'you can't crowd a car off the circuit' rule in place? Both swerves loked ridiculous to me and then the whining just topped it off.

#13 timmy bolt

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:06

Was amazed when Rosberg complained at being passed by Hamilton off the track though. Like there was some sort of advantage for Hamilton to leave the track on a straight and drive over sand.

I really don't know the rules about overtaking in that circumstance, I can understand Rosberg's position because whats even the point of defending on a straight if you always have to leave room at the edge of the track for a car even if it hasn't got alongside you yet.

#14 Requin

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:06

Absolutely he does, much worse than what Schumacher did to Barrichello at Hungary, the only difference being the absence of a wall.


Let's not blow this out of proportion; the reason why what Schumacher did to Barrichello in Hungary was so appaling was because there was a wall.

What Rosberg did was tough and possibly deserves a penalty, but it didn't endanger the lives of Hamilton or Alonso.

We've seen similar moves plenty of times before: (Vettel on Button, Suzuka 2011; Hamilton on Massa, Silverstone 2011; Schumacher on Hamilton, Monza 2011; Alonso on Vettel, Monza 2011) to name a few. Would you put those in the category of Schumacher/Barrichello?



#15 Raziel

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:08

Lewis penalty for overtaking off the track.


lol can you remember last lap Massa-Kubica fight at FUJI 2007? it seems you can't! :yawnface:


#16 aditya-now

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:09

Nico seems to feel the need to gain more respect on the track now that he is going to be a contender.

However, using bully tactics is the wrong way, he will gain more respect by simply delivering
on track. Like Kimi does for example. And somehow I feel that that is what Nico stands for as well - I'd take Bahrain as a one-off.

Still some reprimand or punishment is due.

#17 SeanValen

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:09

Nothing spectacular, 16 seconds behind Rosberg. Neither Mercedes seemed very strong here, shame.


I've noticed over the years Rosberg has this sharp quick response moves to defend his posiition, but they are so sharp, they don't seem calculated enough, more brush aside then squeen someone with awareness of track. But to have 2 incidents investigated, clearly his most hot head race I've seen. I wanna see replays as the race had so much going on.




#18 RockyRaccoon68

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:10

I looked away and missed the Hamitlon one but his move on Alonso was ridiculous. Rosberg actually had two wheels on the white line, he left no space at all for another car.

#19 BigCHrome

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:13

lol can you remember last lap Massa-Kubica fight at FUJI 2007? it seems you can't! :yawnface:


I think we can all agree that the rulebook is not the same for Hamilton and Ferrari.

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#20 discover23

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:14

Absolutely he does, much worse than what Schumacher did to Barrichello at Hungary, the only difference being the absence of a wall.

Exactly becausr of the wall Schumacher's move was way more dangerours.

#21 Baddoer

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:15

Nico finally in race winning car so he can do whatever he want, LEAVE HIM ALONE.

Edited by Baddoer, 22 April 2012 - 14:22.


#22 salamin

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:16

with the new stricter rules it should be a + 20 sec or +5 grid penalty

#23 kosmos

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:17

He should be penalized, and penalized in this race and not with 5 grid penalty for Barcelona. As Alonso said after the race, with a wall there, both could be in the hospital right now.

#24 FlashMaster

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:17

Well done Nico, nice defensive driving :up:

#25 Octavian

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:18

It should be a 20 second penalty for the move on Hamilton and a 5 grid slot penalty for the next race for the move on Alonso. Double the crime twice the penalty.

#26 Tarzaan

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:18

Rosberg putting both Lewis and fernando off track, does he deserve a penalty?

He wouldn't have made moves like that at a track like Monaco.



Schumi does less in Hungaroring and he had banned + hot a 10 place grid penalty (and that time doesn' have this years rule)

#27 Ellios

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:19

5 place grid penalty for HAM for overtaking off the track
reprimand for ROS for squeezing opponent off the track
pat on the back for ALO for not punching ROS in the face after the race

#28 Disgrace

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:19

Rosberg made one move. On the edge of the rules, but easily within them.

A quiet word with Ross is all is needed, because on another day it can result in contact but it didn't so move on.

Leave the stewards out of it, or they'll make a precedent and ruin many races to come.

#29 onewingedangel

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:20

To do the same move to Alonso when he (or at least the team) knew he was under investigation for the move on Hamilton must mean a penalty.

#30 P123

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:20

He should be penalized, and penalized in this race and not with 5 grid penalty for Barcelona. As Alonso said after the race, with a wall there, both could be in the hospital right now.


Or grass. Not sure what the hell Rosberg was thinking. The rule prohibiting crowding is still there, otherwise a legitimate form of defence becomes running your competitors off track (and then whining if they still have the temerity to pass you whilst doing it).

#31 spacekid

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:20

I'd honestly have to see the Hamilton incident again. Although Nico was hilarious claiming that Hamilton gained the advantage of driving over sand to get past him.

The Alonso move Nico looked a wee bit cheeky, but not penalty worthy.

The fact he did the same thing twice might count against him.

#32 Anomnader

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:21

5 place grid penalty for HAM for overtaking off the track
reprimand for ROS for squeezing opponent off the track
pat on the back for ALO for not punching ROS in the face after the race


try not to be biased.


#33 Tarzaan

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:21

Exactly becausr of the wall Schumacher's move was way more dangerours.



BS

Schumi leave enough room for 2bens + 2bens was behind him while he move evenly , but Nico move suddenly and Hamilton was NEAR him, and he forces Lewis out of track...

#34 P123

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:22

Rosberg made one move. On the edge of the rules, but easily within them.

A quiet word with Ross is all is needed, because on another day it can result in contact but it didn't so move on.

Leave the stewards out of it, or they'll make a precedent and ruin many races to come.


No, you can't just drive another car off track in the manner he did. Twice. Everybody else managed to race without doing so.

#35 gramsy1977

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:22

Well that's what you get for not penalizing him in the first place. He does it again on Alonso and then almost on Di Resta too. Great stewards. And it has nothing to do with the "one change of direction". Both Hamilton and Alonso were alongside him. And the 5 places grid penalty would be a joke too.

Edited by gramsy1977, 22 April 2012 - 14:25.


#36 dau

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:22

Rosberg putting both Lewis and fernando off track, does he deserve a penalty?

He wouldn't have made moves like that at a track like Monaco.

Alonso and Lewis wouldn't have tried that move either if there would've been walls i guess. I'm not sure they were already alongside Rosberg. I hope we'll get some onboards.

Edited by dau, 22 April 2012 - 14:23.


#37 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:24

Alonso and Lewis wouldn't have tried that move either if there would've been walls i guess. I'm not sure they were already alongside Rosberg. I hope we'll get some onboards.

well rubens did try and there was an outrage on schumacher then
of course if britney does it it's ok

#38 Aieljose

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:24

Rosberg made one move. On the edge of the rules, but easily within them.

A quiet word with Ross is all is needed, because on another day it can result in contact but it didn't so move on.

Leave the stewards out of it, or they'll make a precedent and ruin many races to come.

And what type of precedent does allowing drivers to get away with running other drivers off the race track multiple times in one race set?? And then to complain about it after.... :lol:

#39 Fudce

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:25

Without having seen rosberg, or more crucially Hamilton/Alonso onboards, I can't really call this either way.

My initial impressions though... Rosberg shouldn't have chopped Hamilton, Hamilton overtook outside of track limits. Both get reprimanded.

For the Alonso incident, Rosberg repeated the same crime he did on Hamilton, so he gets 20s penalty (drive through).


The letter of the law says he didn't break the newly changed 'one move' rule - as he made his legal move, then moved back to the racing line, leaving enough room on the racing line. That rule doesn't specify leaving racing room on the outside.

We need to see onboard with Hamilton and Alonso though. If they were even a small amount along side, he forced them off the road. That'd be a certain penalty in my opinion. If they were still behind, it's still naughty but not as clear cut for penalty.

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#40 Smile17

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:25

No penalty for Rosberg yet? The stewards better punish him if they want to have at least some consistency in their decision making... Or make it look like it.

#41 Henrik B

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:26

Okay, I might not be marching in step with the rest of you but didn't Rosberg move over BEFORE Lewis and Alons was even a tiny bit alongside?

If Rosberg moves first, no penalty (or one to Hamilton, because he did indeed overtake off the track). He can choose his line freely when he's alone on the track.

If Rosberg moves when Lewis and/or Alonso are alongside, I THINK he should get one. But Button didn't get one in Canada last year and no one got anything for a similar incident in the gp2 race at the same spot. I usually argue in vain that I think the leading driver doesn't have the right to take away the space in front of the car behind IF they are even a tiny bit alongside.

#42 NoDivergence

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:27

Without having seen rosberg, or more crucially Hamilton/Alonso onboards, I can't really call this either way.

My initial impressions though... Rosberg shouldn't have chopped Hamilton, Hamilton overtook outside of track limits. Both get reprimanded.

For the Alonso incident, Rosberg repeated the same crime he did on Hamilton, so he gets 20s penalty (drive through).


The letter of the law says he didn't break the newly changed 'one move' rule - as he made his legal move, then moved back to the racing line, leaving enough room on the racing line. That rule doesn't specify leaving racing room on the outside.

We need to see onboard with Hamilton and Alonso though. If they were even a small amount along side, he forced them off the road. That'd be a certain penalty in my opinion. If they were still behind, it's still naughty but not as clear cut for penalty.


Once Hamilton was on the dirt, what do you expect him to do???

#43 Jazza

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:28

I have only seen them once, but i think the Alonso and Hamilton incidents were different.

On the first one, Rosberg went to his right to chose the inside line, and Hamilton chose to follow him. It wasn't a block. With alonso however, Fernando went right to get past, then Rosberg tried to block him by moving the same direction.

One was a defensive move of choosing the inside line. The other was a reaction to chop the other driver. The second one should be a penalty.

#44 gramsy1977

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:28

Without having seen rosberg, or more crucially Hamilton/Alonso onboards, I can't really call this either way.

My initial impressions though... Rosberg shouldn't have chopped Hamilton, Hamilton overtook outside of track limits. Both get reprimanded.

For the Alonso incident, Rosberg repeated the same crime he did on Hamilton, so he gets 20s penalty (drive through).


The letter of the law says he didn't break the newly changed 'one move' rule - as he made his legal move, then moved back to the racing line, leaving enough room on the racing line. That rule doesn't specify leaving racing room on the outside.

We need to see onboard with Hamilton and Alonso though. If they were even a small amount along side, he forced them off the road. That'd be a certain penalty in my opinion. If they were still behind, it's still naughty but not as clear cut for penalty.

I think the one move rule is against "waving". Hamilton and Alonso were not behind Rosberg when he changed direction. That's why we heard Alonso saying something like "we are supposed to leave room". He practically thrown them out of track

#45 cdracer

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:28

very poor driving, i guess winning last week has gone to his head

#46 robefc

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:31

Okay, I might not be marching in step with the rest of you but didn't Rosberg move over BEFORE Lewis and Alons was even a tiny bit alongside?

If Rosberg moves first, no penalty (or one to Hamilton, because he did indeed overtake off the track). He can choose his line freely when he's alone on the track.

If Rosberg moves when Lewis and/or Alonso are alongside, I THINK he should get one. But Button didn't get one in Canada last year and no one got anything for a similar incident in the gp2 race at the same spot. I usually argue in vain that I think the leading driver doesn't have the right to take away the space in front of the car behind IF they are even a tiny bit alongside.


Button maintained the racing line, which creeps across the track on that straight in canada, rosberg changed direction sharply.

We do obviously need to see it again to ascertain relative positions of the cars.

#47 Fudce

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:31

Once Hamilton was on the dirt, what do you expect him to do???

Give the place back.

If he had, I'd be almost cetain Rosberg would have got a penalty in race, but the fact remains that he overtook outside the track limits.


Compare it to two drivers braking in to a chicane. The car on the inside going in pushes the other car wide, and that car cuts the second part and takes the position. Nobody would question the need to give the place back in that situation, and the rules show that it's not "cutting a corner", but "outside the track limits" that matters.

#48 AMG FAN

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:32

Let's not blow this out of proportion; the reason why what Schumacher did to Barrichello in Hungary was so appaling was because there was a wall.

What Rosberg did was tough and possibly deserves a penalty, but it didn't endanger the lives of Hamilton or Alonso.

We've seen similar moves plenty of times before: (Vettel on Button, Suzuka 2011; Hamilton on Massa, Silverstone 2011; Schumacher on Hamilton, Monza 2011; Alonso on Vettel, Monza 2011) to name a few. Would you put those in the category of Schumacher/Barrichello?

yes because there wasn't a barrier when Rosberg did it huh?

#49 Cenotaph

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:34

I think it was fair enough defensive driving. What I found hilarious was that Rosberg was the one actually complaining about Hamilton overtaking off the track, now that was just stupid. But penalty for Rosberg would be a bit harsh. I mean, didn't Alonso force Vettel off the track at Monza last year as well?

#50 NoDivergence

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 14:35

Give the place back.

If he had, I'd be almost cetain Rosberg would have got a penalty in race, but the fact remains that he overtook outside the track limits.


Compare it to two drivers braking in to a chicane. The car on the inside going in pushes the other car wide, and that car cuts the second part and takes the position. Nobody would question the need to give the place back in that situation, and the rules show that it's not "cutting a corner", but "outside the track limits" that matters.


It was not an "unfair advantage" gained. We're not talking about a corner here. We're talking about a part of the track before a corner. Totally different scenario AND speed. When considering how Rosberg forced him off the track so aggressively in the first place (and not even within a corner or entering a corner). There's no reason to give back the position.

The reason why there is a "outside track limits" rule is for safety and legitimate racing. However, nothing is more dangerous or dirty than a driver forcing another off track

Edited by NoDivergence, 22 April 2012 - 14:39.