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Fernando Alonso - Part II


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#2301 kosmos

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 03:51

In the pre-season, Alonso didn't have a fragile 1+ race win points advantage in the WDC with 7 races to go. :drunk: indeed. :smoking:



And that's exactly why it's an opinon and not mind games, he said the same thing under different circumstances 7 months ago, next time try harder :smoking:

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#2302 RedOne

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 06:28

When Kubica was in F1 Alonso said he was the best driver. I don't see why Alonso can't have an opinion while the rest of you are entitled to it. He shows respect to all the drivers of and on the race track. For example he said he likes racing with Kimi at the start of the season becuase he is fast but fair on the track and he can trust him.

Edited by RedOne, 15 September 2012 - 06:29.


#2303 Smile17

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 08:29

And that's exactly why it's an opinon and not mind games, he said the same thing under different circumstances 7 months ago, next time try harder :smoking:


You're clearly wrong here Kosmos, that was 100% mind games. Alonso does it all the time.

#2304 kosmos

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 08:57

You're clearly wrong here Kosmos, that was 100% mind games. Alonso does it all the time.



Explain to me what is the point of mind games in pre-seson when the chances of him fighting against Hamilton were zero.

#2305 Konsta

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 11:42

When Kubica was in F1 Alonso said he was the best driver. I don't see why Alonso can't have an opinion while the rest of you are entitled to it. He shows respect to all the drivers of and on the race track. For example he said he likes racing with Kimi at the start of the season becuase he is fast but fair on the track and he can trust him.

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.

#2306 prty

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 18:20

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.


Nothing untrue in that though, at least for the moment.


#2307 as65p

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:15

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.


I don't believe the bolded for a second. On the contrary, I think you're trying really hard to make Alonso look as small as you always thought he is.

Unfortunately you've chosen a complete non-issue to make that point. So Alonso doesn't give your favorite drivers enough credit, in your opinion? Without even mentioning their names, least we forget. Cry me a river.

I'm sure the day will come Alonso does something silly or stupid, all humans do (only the frequency might be different). If that day comes, rejoice, but it's not now, and not this harmless interview.

#2308 fabr68

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:53

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best a good car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.


Fixed that for you. :p

I think Alonso was being cheeky and having fun. It is working!!!

Edited by fabr68, 15 September 2012 - 20:53.


#2309 Bruce

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 04:38

Wow - you guys are all getting your knockers in a twist over that? C'mon - it's just mind games - same as Ferrari saying that the threat they really fear is Kimi... I mean - I'm not surprised that they'd have their eye on Kimi, but given that Hamilton has just vaulted himself into 2nd place, it would seem that they were damning him with faint praise....

#2310 Konsta

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:29

I don't believe the bolded for a second. On the contrary, I think you're trying really hard to make Alonso look as small as you always thought he is.

Unfortunately you've chosen a complete non-issue to make that point. So Alonso doesn't give your favorite drivers enough credit, in your opinion? Without even mentioning their names, least we forget. Cry me a river.

I'm sure the day will come Alonso does something silly or stupid, all humans do (only the frequency might be different). If that day comes, rejoice, but it's not now, and not this harmless interview.


You can believe or not whatever you choose. FA is definitely my 2nd favorite driver. Can you imagine how awkward I would feel if Kimi was out there claiming that Fernando is a mentally weak dominant who can only win when there is no intra-team rivalry. I´d be ashamed of "my boy". You might just as well be right and this is only mindgames and FA knows that Seb and Kimi are not affected and Lewis (his biggest contender IMO) could just be.

Edited by Konsta, 16 September 2012 - 07:31.


#2311 as65p

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 07:43

You can believe or not whatever you choose. FA is definitely my 2nd favorite driver. Can you imagine how awkward I would feel if Kimi was out there claiming that Fernando is a mentally weak dominant who can only win when there is no intra-team rivalry. I´d be ashamed of "my boy". You might just as well be right and this is only mindgames and FA knows that Seb and Kimi are not affected and Lewis (his biggest contender IMO) could just be.


FA said nothing remotely similar like that about KR, not now nor ever. You just make something up of thin air to then get excited about.

#2312 Konsta

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 11:53

FA said nothing remotely similar like that about KR, not now nor ever. You just make something up of thin air to then get excited about.

Well, without mentioning names he did say that others cannot win without the best car. IMO that is remotely similar to what I wrote. Mindgames or not, I am still puzzled as to why FA had to say something like that.

#2313 as65p

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 12:38

Well, without mentioning names he did say that others cannot win without the best car. IMO that is remotely similar to what I wrote. Mindgames or not, I am still puzzled as to why FA had to say something like that.


He say "a good car", not "best car", as has been pointed out before. Frankly it's get boring with you hellbound to make this something it simply isn't.

#2314 Konsta

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 12:58

He say "a good car", not "best car", as has been pointed out before. Frankly it's get boring with you hellbound to make this something it simply isn't.

I am more than willing to quit pickering but OTOH how can you defend FA saying crappy things. Please do elaborate why isn't there anything in Fernando claiming that his rivals can only win when they have the best car at their disposal (apparently opposed to himself and Lewis)?

#2315 Ferrari2183

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 13:33

I am more than willing to quit pickering but OTOH how can you defend FA saying crappy things. Please do elaborate why isn't there anything in Fernando claiming that his rivals can only win when they have the best car at their disposal (apparently opposed to himself and Lewis)?

I too share Alonso's opinion and I'll tell you why...

The others just ain't good enough. It's not rocket science.

Vettel has the makings though.

#2316 discover23

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 13:55

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.



Is true..

#2317 ali_M

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 14:14

You cannot have it both ways. What I really dislike about his comment (I have been assured that the translation was correct) is him blatantly saying that Kimi and Seb can ONLY win when they have the best car. That is not just an opinion but pure badmouthing. I really would´ve thought that FA had been bigger than that.


I thought he said good car and not 'best' car. Anyway, when did Hamilton win and his car wasn't good? I'm more interested in the proof of the credit Fernando bestowed, rather than the discrediting he did.

#2318 RockyRaccoon68

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 14:14

I too share Alonso's opinion and I'll tell you why...

The others just ain't good enough. It's not rocket science.

Vettel has the makings though.


:up:

#2319 Suntrek

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 15:55

I am more than willing to quit pickering but OTOH how can you defend FA saying crappy things. Please do elaborate why isn't there anything in Fernando claiming that his rivals can only win when they have the best car at their disposal (apparently opposed to himself and Lewis)?


Well I always claim Alonso and Hamilton stand out from the rest because they'll drive the socks off anything. They both have the capability to put any car above where it belongs, be it a good or bad car. And they ALWAYS do it. They never give up. Kimi OTOH can certailnly do the same - but only when he feels like it. In 2006, for example, he underperformed vastly. True, the car wasn't the best but Kimi didn't exactly shine either.

Vettel we can leve out of this equation altogether. I've never seen him do anything extraordinary when the car wasn't a winning one - bar maybe Monza 2008. Although the Toro Rosso was obviously very good in the wet - I mean, even Bourdais was up there in qualy...

So I have to agree with Alonso here. :)

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#2320 turssi

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 16:24

Raikkonen did win some races when the Ferrari was not good.

But on the topic at hand, I do love when the pilots make the stingy jokes and play mind games. This is why I recommend watching live interviews and press conferences!

#2321 Skinnyguy

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 21:32

It´s just another generic "Vettel´s not on Lewis´ level" comment.

Let´s just say I agree with this statement, but I suspect I do not think the same way as Alonso about these two guys, in fact, quite the opposite. ;)



#2322 discover23

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 22:03

Raikkonen did win some races when the Ferrari was not good.

But on the topic at hand, I do love when the pilots make the stingy jokes and play mind games. This is why I recommend watching live interviews and press conferences!

It is most likely that Alonso is talking about current form and not what drivers did in the past. The Lotus this season has been a winning car in several occasions and.... Based on that his comments are spot on.
Fernando knows that he was leading the WDC at a point when other drivers had better cars than his. This tells the whole story about who should he fear the most for the remaining of the season.. The other guys bar Vettel, if he had the best car, cannot simply perform at Alonso's level week in and week out.
RBR is no longer dominant after they got caught cheating..

Edited by discover23, 16 September 2012 - 22:10.


#2323 FirstWatt

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 06:06

I have a hard time trying to find out when Vettel showed to be able to win even without the fastest car.
This year he didn't show it, and in the past years, he had fastest car.

#2324 HPT

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 07:13

I have a hard time trying to find out when Vettel showed to be able to win even without the fastest car.
This year he didn't show it, and in the past years, he had fastest car.


I'm not a Vettel fan so don't think I'm defending him but I do think a special set of circumstances need to come together if a driver were to win in a car that isn't the fastest. Monaco 2011, Vettel definitely didn't have the fastest car but by running one pitstop less than his rivals, he had track position. I know the red flag took Alonso's and Button's advantage of having fresh tires away but even without the stoppage, I think Vettel would have hung on. It's Monaco after all.

You could also argue that he didn't have the fastest car in his first win in Monza in the Toro Rosso. His car was probably fastest in those conditions compared to those immediately around him - which was no different to Alonso's win in Malaysia this year. Those who could have challenged him, including Hamilton, started way back and that is one of those special conditions that I mentioned.

#2325 forixfan

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 07:30

Wow - you guys are all getting your knockers in a twist over that? C'mon - it's just mind games - same as Ferrari saying that the threat they really fear is Kimi... I mean - I'm not surprised that they'd have their eye on Kimi, but given that Hamilton has just vaulted himself into 2nd place, it would seem that they were damning him with faint praise....



How is giving Hamilton great praise mind games? I would think mind games would be trying to minimise him and say he is not that good, not saying he is an amazing driver. He has said the same thing before as well. Alonso is simply being honest, and you will find most people actually agree with what he said.

#2326 Clatter

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 07:46

How is giving Hamilton great praise mind games? I would think mind games would be trying to minimise him and say he is not that good, not saying he is an amazing driver. He has said the same thing before as well. Alonso is simply being honest, and you will find most people actually agree with what he said.


Think he is just playing games with the fans seeing how it's got some of the more rabid fans knickers in a twist. I doubt the driver give 2 hoots.

#2327 as65p

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 08:11

How is giving Hamilton great praise mind games? I would think mind games would be trying to minimise him and say he is not that good, not saying he is an amazing driver. He has said the same thing before as well. Alonso is simply being honest, and you will find most people actually agree with what he said.


Not saying it is the case at all, but the best thing to play mind games on Hamilton might indeed be to make his head grow. People are different, they are unsettled by different things. Just saying.

#2328 Kvothe

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 08:55

I'm not a Vettel fan so don't think I'm defending him but I do think a special set of circumstances need to come together if a driver were to win in a car that isn't the fastest. Monaco 2011, Vettel definitely didn't have the fastest car but by running one pitstop less than his rivals, he had track position. I know the red flag took Alonso's and Button's advantage of having fresh tires away but even without the stoppage, I think Vettel would have hung on. It's Monaco after all.

You could also argue that he didn't have the fastest car in his first win in Monza in the Toro Rosso. His car was probably fastest in those conditions compared to those immediately around him - which was no different to Alonso's win in Malaysia this year. Those who could have challenged him, including Hamilton, started way back and that is one of those special conditions that I mentioned.


I think he did have the fastest car, he opened up opened out a comfortable gap on JB and FA. It was only because JB opted to go on the ss again while V went to the softs and than stayed on them for nearly 60 laps to maintain track position, did it look like he had a slower car.

#2329 Nonesuch

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 15:50

Time for something a little more light-hearted; help Alonso pick the right sunglasses!  ;) https://twitter.com/...722854886551553

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#2330 pRy

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 15:57

Awesome. That's man at peace with the world.

#2331 prty

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 17:33

Liked this one:

Ahora anuncio para la mejor bebida energética.. TNT


Which means: "Now I'll make an advertisement for the best energy drink... TNT" :lol:

#2332 RedOne

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Posted 17 September 2012 - 19:01

Time for something a little more light-hearted; help Alonso pick the right sunglasses! ;) https://twitter.com/...722854886551553

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Haha awesome pic!

#2333 kosmos

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 06:46

Some nice words from Kubica:

“It’s a very interesting championship,” the Pole told Italy’s Omnicorse.

“It’s difficult to read because the balance of power has been changing often, but there has been one driver who has made the difference with something other than the best car.

“Fernando (Alonso) showed from the first race that he has the edge over all the others, because he is maybe the only one able to make a difference even with an uncompetitive car.

“He’s the favourite,” said Kubica. “He’s out of this world and I don’t see any big rivals for him.

“Knowing F1, we can’t say that the season is decided already, but if there is no car that is much better than his, then I think Alonso is 80 per cent sure (to win),” added Kubica.


More from other driver in the link. Totalf1

#2334 FirstWatt

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 07:37

Thanks for this link, kosmos.
Every time a very respected (ex) driver, (ex) team boss or another F1 long time follower says something like that, I have to smile wrt to some voices here (and in the forum I participated some time ago) which are consistently praying that Alonso is nothing special and only has lots of luck.

#2335 DarkknightRises

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 08:10

kimi and alonso

thankfully after 11 years, they are still competing!!

#2336 kosmos

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Posted 18 September 2012 - 12:43

A little more stuff.

Carlos Sainz, did my best to translate it.

You know Fernando Alonso quite well, how is he as a person?, and from driver to driver, is he the best in the world of F1?.

Fernando is much more normal than people think, usually has a lot of pressure around. But is a great person and in short distance he gains a lot (hard to translate). As a driver there is little doubt that, today, is the best in the world and in the history of Formula 1, to this day, he is already one of the best. I will not be surprised if he is recognized as the best in the history when he retires.



From the Kubica interview there is bit missing, Kubica said the he and Fernando are friends, but when he lowers the visor of his helmet, he try to get the best result.

#2337 RedOne

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Posted 19 September 2012 - 18:44

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Track inspection for Alonso

#2338 Vesuvius

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Posted 20 September 2012 - 11:00

Well I always claim Alonso and Hamilton stand out from the rest because they'll drive the socks off anything. They both have the capability to put any car above where it belongs, be it a good or bad car. And they ALWAYS do it. They never give up. Kimi OTOH can certailnly do the same - but only when he feels like it. In 2006, for example, he underperformed vastly. True, the car wasn't the best but Kimi didn't exactly shine either.

Vettel we can leve out of this equation altogether. I've never seen him do anything extraordinary when the car wasn't a winning one - bar maybe Monza 2008. Although the Toro Rosso was obviously very good in the wet - I mean, even Bourdais was up there in qualy...

So I have to agree with Alonso here. :)


I think all of these four can win even if the car is not the best, they have all done it in the past and will do in the future as well.

I don't understand why you are saying Kimi didn't shine or perform well in 2006, he totally crushed his team mates Montoya and De La Rosa and sometimes outqualified Montoya over a second and he was thought to be very fast over one lap.2006 car wasn't good enough for wins.

Vettel can win even without the best car, he drove one of the most fantastic weekends with an midfield car and dominated tähe monza weekend, it's not his fault that RedBull since then have done great cars but even then he has won races were RBR hasn't been the best car :)

All of these four drivers are extremelly talented,fast drivers who are close to each other in every area, differences are minimal, Fernando is the most complete of them at the moment.

#2339 Gintonious

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Posted 20 September 2012 - 13:36

Helmet for the weekend!

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#2340 edwamack

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Posted 20 September 2012 - 13:45

Lap in the simulator: www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZBgNiSNAas

#2341 kosmos

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Posted 20 September 2012 - 14:14

Helmet for the weekend!



Very cool, no need for a new design, just some glitter :smoking:

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#2342 selespeed

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Posted 20 September 2012 - 14:19

don't like it...but probably will look good in the darkness...or should i say artificial lighting...

#2343 kosmos

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 09:27

Schumi and Barrichello think Fernando will do it this year. 1 and 2.

"We saw that most recently in Monza, where he drove very cautiously and carefully," said Schumacher.


Not sure what he means, from 10th to 3rd with some good overtakes, specially the risk he took with Vettel, I don't think that is carefully, I think he was agressive at the start of the race, after he passed Massa, there was nothing to gain, so there was no need to be agressive.

#2344 Arry2k

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:11

Very cool, no need for a new design, just some glitter :smoking:


This is one sweet lid. Much better than the Monaco specials!


#2345 Showty

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:21

Nando is slowly but safely feeling the track, he does a quick lap, followed but a slow one, then a quick...3rd in the standings right now.

#2346 jeze

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:28

Nando is slowly but safely feeling the track, he does a quick lap, followed but a slow one, then a quick...3rd in the standings right now.

Was 0.2 seconds behind after S2 before messing up S3 that he'd done quicker on previous laps, way quicker in fact. I'd expect him to be 0.5 seconds off Vettel on qualifying pace right now. Hope it's enough to beat Hamilton and Webber tomorrow. If he starts from front row and reaches Turn 1 in second he might have a shot at beating Vettel - who has to be seen as the big fish this weekend (Red Bull's braking stability + no big straights).



#2347 joshb

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:36

Was 0.2 seconds behind after S2 before messing up S3 that he'd done quicker on previous laps, way quicker in fact. I'd expect him to be 0.5 seconds off Vettel on qualifying pace right now. Hope it's enough to beat Hamilton and Webber tomorrow. If he starts from front row and reaches Turn 1 in second he might have a shot at beating Vettel - who has to be seen as the big fish this weekend (Red Bull's braking stability + no big straights).


last year the gaps were massive, so if you were half a second off in qualy, you'd be 4th or 5th, and the midfield were 2-3s off the leading pace. I remmeber after about 10 laps Vettel being 50 seconds clear of those in the lower midfield and 80 seconds clear of the HRTs. It's a long lap and it seems to expose the cars with less downforce quite brutally.
Alonso may well slot in the first 2 rows, even if his car is half a second shy

#2348 jeze

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:45

last year the gaps were massive, so if you were half a second off in qualy, you'd be 4th or 5th, and the midfield were 2-3s off the leading pace. I remmeber after about 10 laps Vettel being 50 seconds clear of those in the lower midfield and 80 seconds clear of the HRTs. It's a long lap and it seems to expose the cars with less downforce quite brutally.
Alonso may well slot in the first 2 rows, even if his car is half a second shy


Yeah looking at ultimate sector times I wouldn't be surprised to see:


1, VET

2, HAM

3, ALO

4, BUT/WEB/MAL

As long as Fernando does an acceptable S3 I expect him to be more competitive with regards to the top two. He is always better on race pace than in qualifying too. So as long as he starts clear of idiots like Maldonado and Grosjean and in third right behind Hamilton, he'll race Lewis all the way IMO.

But of course it's just speculation so far.



#2349 jstrains

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 16:38

Vettel winning and Fernando on the podium is good for our championship :up:

#2350 Ravenak

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 16:44

Vettel winning and Fernando on the podium is good for our championship :up:


Exactly!

Of course, we all hate damage limitation and not being able to fight for a pole/win, but it's Formula 1, and it's like this.

A lot of championships have been built like that. Schumacher just said that Fernando only has to manage his advance, and he's right.

Wait & see

Edited by Ravenak, 21 September 2012 - 16:45.