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Mercedes-AMG 2012 W03 - Part II


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#101 Scotracer

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 16:06

Remember you can trade-off straight line speed for more downforce. If you know you naturally have a fast car in a straight line, you can put on a bit extra wing that whilst removing your advantage in a straight-line will balance out corner performance.

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#102 ivand911

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 16:37

W03 rear wing looks gigantic comparing to RBR. Have to check Ferrari RW. Yes, I check it and it is smaller than W03 , but it is bigger than RBR one. I think W03 and McL car have the biggest rear wing.

Edited by ivand911, 09 June 2012 - 16:47.


#103 BetaVersion

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 16:38

No-one has been able to create a more unreliable car than MGP methinks. A shame for this ruined Nicoś entire session.

yep. They just can't have a weekend without tech problems. Even HRT is more reliable nowadays, tbh.

For Schumacher's sake, at least this time wasn't on him again. It's a pitty for Nico, though. The car doesn't seem to be as fast as expected in such track but still Nico lost some valuable time in FP3 :down:

#104 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 16:59

MS only 316.9 km/h in FP3.


But accelerates and reaches terminal velocity faster than others hence why top speeds are not uber uber important.

The DDRS on Mercedes will be best suited for overtaking IMO.

#105 Scotracer

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 17:23

Michael looking better in Q1 and FP3.

#106 BetaVersion

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:07

Expected much more pace. Everything I was expecting from them happened the opposite. They were very good in Monaco and average here. This goes against logic of the characteristics of this car.

Edited by BetaVersion, 09 June 2012 - 18:10.


#107 rog

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:10

Expected much more pace. Everything I was expecting from then happened the opposite. They were very good in Monaco and average here. This goes against logic of the characteristics of this car.



I second that. It really surprised me. The gap to Red Bull and Hamilton, Alonso is pretty big for such a short track. But as mentioned their topspeed was gone for some reason here.

#108 F1Champion

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:10

Quite a bit slower today, not bad in Q1 and Q2 but Q3 was poor.

#109 korzeniow

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:11

Didn't I hear 1-2 for Mercedes before the weekend?

Well, race is tomorrow, I hold you to your word.

#110 exmayol

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:12

Didn't I hear 1-2 for Mercedes before the weekend?

Well, race is tomorrow, I hold you to your word.


1-2 is optimistic but both cars in top 5 should have been totally achievable... not sure what they messed up this time.

#111 RedBaron

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:15

Massa blocked Schumacher didn't he? Disappointing 3 tenths off in first sector should have put him on target for 3rd-5th. Not 9th. So this isn't a representable time for Mercedes, Rosberg is more realistic, although I think Schumacher should have been ahead of him. Should have put in a better first lap.

Steer clear of Grosjean...

Edited by RedBaron, 09 June 2012 - 18:16.


#112 anbeck

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:16

Another bad call from Merc.... :down:

#113 gluon

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:17

Schumacher said on RTL that the team told him on the radio to abort the last lap because they thought he crossed the line after the checkered flag!!!

#114 exmayol

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:18

Schumacher said on RTL that the team told him on the radio to abort the last lap because they thought he crossed the line after the checkered flag!!!


Seems like they should abort that.

#115 RedBaron

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:20

Schumacher said on RTL that the team told him on the radio to abort the last lap because they thought he crossed the line after the checkered flag!!!


I thought Massa blocked him, camera cut late and I saw him wave his hand.

Amazing if Mercedes screwed this up.

#116 rog

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:32

http://www.formula1....speed_trap.html


Apart from Red Bull Mercedes with the slowest topspeed. Not so good for the race.

#117 ivand911

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:36

Is it the time to think about changing exhaust? Lets see the race tomorrow.

#118 BetaVersion

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:37

21 7 Michael Schumacher 13:07:14 317.0
22 8 Nico Rosberg 13:10:25 316.9
23 1 Sebastian Vettel 13:10:08 316.0
24 2 Mark Webber 13:16:26 316.0

Mercedes speed trap is only better than one team. Well, not that it matter as this team is the one that actually is on pole


Either the tires had it saying again, or MGP screwed big time their setup for this track

This track should, in theory, be better for them than even China as there are only low speed corners, where the car is good, and long straights.

#119 race addicted

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:44

Pretty unbelieveable they advised Schumacher to abort, when there was time left!!! He could well have been fourth or fifth, judging by his 14.48 in Q2.

Edited by race addicted, 09 June 2012 - 18:44.


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#120 BetaVersion

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:45

1-2 is optimistic but both cars in top 5 should have been totally achievable... not sure what they messed up this time.

MSC best sector times would give him 1.14.330 which I think would be enough to beat Massa and Webber. And MSC could have gone faster, I would suppose, as he didn't have clear lap in Q3

Nico did his best in Q3 but he also could have gone a bit faster if didn't have problem in FP3

Incredibly Mercedes managed to screw both their drivers this time :down:

#121 Schumacher7

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 18:50

http://www.formula1....speed_trap.html


Apart from Red Bull Mercedes with the slowest topspeed. Not so good for the race.

I would have thought the opposite, a lower top speed will be much more achievable come the race tomorrow when they cannot use the DRS whenever they like will it not?

#122 Lamag

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:09

MSC best sector times would give him 1.14.330 which I think would be enough to beat Massa and Webber. And MSC could have gone faster, I would suppose, as he didn't have clear lap in Q3

Nico did his best in Q3 but he also could have gone a bit faster if didn't have problem in FP3

Incredibly Mercedes managed to screw both their drivers this time :down:



Agree, I think if we look at Rosberg time at Q3 and considering that he was not able to run during the FP3. I think Rosberg could be at 1m13s today without the practice issue.

#123 ivand911

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:12

RBR have the skinniest RW, nobody can catch Vettel today. I don't know why the team went for such big rear wing?

#124 Lamag

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:17

RBR have the skinniest RW, nobody can catch Vettel today. I don't know why the team went for such big rear wing?


To get better downforce for the race pace maybe? Mercedes race pace is far from bad, at least from what we saw during the practice the race pace is on the same level as the other top teams out there.

#125 ivand911

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:21

To get better downforce for the race pace maybe? Mercedes race pace is far from bad, at least from what we saw during the practice the race pace is on the same level as the other top teams out there.

The same pace is not helping. We need better pace.


#126 Lamag

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:25

Is far better to have the same pace as the leader that be behind. If Mercedes can manage to have an amazing start for both drivers, the podium could be possible, at least Rosberg.

#127 rog

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:43

http://www.fia.com/e...ying-speeds.pdf




Intermediate 1 and 2 topspeed not as fast as usual. It seems the DRS/duct advantage is gone.

#128 Schumacher7

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 19:45

Is far better to have the same pace as the leader that be behind. If Mercedes can manage to have an amazing start for both drivers, the podium could be possible, at least Rosberg.

Indeed, Rosberg's in with a good shout for a podium tomorrow, I'd like a top five for Michael but it's not overly realistic, hey who knows maybe he'll get a bit of luck with a safety car or something.

#129 Lamag

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 21:56

Rosberg about the race pace.

But still, it's a good position to start from tomorrow, not quite as in Monaco in qualifying it seems but maybe race pace wise we can beat one or two of the cars in front and the podium has to be the goal."


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I can still hope for a podium finish tomorrow as we have worked very hard on our race pace over the weekend. That's why I feel quite positive because the race will depend on good tyre management as the key factor."



#130 BigCHrome

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 22:04

Damn what happened?? Theoretically this car should've been really fast here.

#131 Sof1

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Posted 09 June 2012 - 22:08

Mercedes is a Joke when it comes to Schumacher! It nearly makes me regret just buying a Mercedes car :p

Edited by Sof1, 09 June 2012 - 22:08.


#132 ivand911

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 06:21

Damn what happened?? Theoretically this car should've been really fast here.

Tyres maybe. Will see tomorrow.


#133 MrMontecarlo

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 08:19

WTF happened to Mercedes top speed? Only better than Red Bull. It seems other teams are doing a better job in reducing drag.

#134 Schumacher7

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 09:54

http://www.fia.com/e...ying-speeds.pdf




Intermediate 1 and 2 topspeed not as fast as usual. It seems the DRS/duct advantage is gone.

I assume they just geared lower for the race, as they've done a lot this season.

#135 MrMontecarlo

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 10:04

I assume they just geared lower for the race, as they've done a lot this season.


Don't you think all the teams gear lower for the race?

#136 Schumacher7

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 10:11

Don't you think all the teams gear lower for the race?

Well as I meant I assume Merc have geared lower than the other teams I don't see how all the teams can have geared lower than all the teams. :p
They haven't been very high in any speed trap this season iirc but I may be wrong.
Edit: Remember they can't change gear ratios between qualy and the race.

Edited by Schumacher7, 10 June 2012 - 10:12.


#137 RedBaron

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 10:59

According to Sky F1 Mercedes don't like to give too much away about failures and reliability of their F1 car because it reflects poorly on their commercial brand image.

So the way I see it is if you buy a Mercedes road car, don't take it to the official dealership because they'll screw everything up. Wheels will fall off, the gearbox will break, hydraulics will fail and you'll be crashed into by a Frenchman as you pull off the forecourt.

#138 Longtimefan

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 11:41

Hot day today, I hope the cars don't eat the tyres. :(

and one quick message.. OY! Grosjean, Keep away!! ;)


#139 ivand911

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 12:07

Hot day today, I hope the cars don't eat the tyres. :(

and one quick message.. OY! Grosjean, Keep away!! ;)

This is the smallest problem. If it eats tyres, this mean car is in the race. Still.


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#140 schumimercamg

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 13:22

According to Sky F1 Mercedes don't like to give too much away about failures and reliability of their F1 car because it reflects poorly on their commercial brand image.

So the way I see it is if you buy a Mercedes road car, don't take it to the official dealership because they'll screw everything up. Wheels will fall off, the gearbox will break, hydraulics will fail and you'll be crashed into by a Frenchman as you pull off the forecourt.


:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

#141 rog

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 14:19

I assume they just geared lower for the race, as they've done a lot this season.



This can be the case for the max rpm on the longest straight but not for the intermediate speedtrap since the car isn't rpm limited there. As mentioned Rosberg/Schumacher were frequently placed under the Top 6 intermediate speedtrap list. This is the first race they weren't.

#142 Schumacher7

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 14:26

This can be the case for the max rpm on the longest straight but not for the intermediate speedtrap since the car isn't rpm limited there. As mentioned Rosberg/Schumacher were frequently placed under the Top 6 intermediate speedtrap list. This is the first race they weren't.

Ah I see, more downforce then perhaps, although I don't know why. :well:
I can't see that their top speed has just disappeared though, surely it must be something they've done on the car for a reason?

#143 RedBaron

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 14:51

I can't see that their top speed has just disappeared though, surely it must be something they've done on the car for a reason?


That's what I'd go with. Their is a reason for it, hopefully whatever it is it's the right decision.

#144 Sakae

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 15:11

According to Sky F1 Mercedes don't like to give too much away about failures and reliability of their F1 car because it reflects poorly on their commercial brand image.

So the way I see it is if you buy a Mercedes road car, don't take it to the official dealership because they'll screw everything up. Wheels will fall off, the gearbox will break, hydraulics will fail and you'll be crashed into by a Frenchman as you pull off the forecourt.

They faced similar problem when they bought into Ilmore works. Fans, especially on this forum, fondly reffered to those units as an "Ilmore" engine every time it had any success, minimal as that was long time ago, and as "Mercedes" engine every time it blew up. That period has of course is now a historical footnote.

Edited by Sakae, 10 June 2012 - 15:14.


#145 ivand911

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 16:55

Posted Image
MERCEDES AMG F1 ‏:
The boys watching the Germany match yesterday!

Edited by ivand911, 10 June 2012 - 16:56.


#146 Augurk

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 17:00

Posted Image
MERCEDES AMG F1 ‏:
The boys watching the Germany match yesterday!

Seeing the handbag near Nico... let's keep this civilized boys :lol:

#147 1Devil1

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 17:04

is this timo glock on the right side with the german shirt?

Edited by 1Devil1, 10 June 2012 - 17:06.


#148 Sakae

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 18:09

Michael had a good start, but was blocked by slower drivers ahead of him on the grid. Road was too narrow to squeez three cars side by side. Pitty.

Edited by Sakae, 10 June 2012 - 18:10.


#149 Paco

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 18:47

Another horrible call by anyone watching the race knew it was way to early to bring in Schumi - well except for the team teamselves.

#150 BetaVersion

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Posted 10 June 2012 - 19:03

:rotfl:

Congratulations Mercedes, you managed to make the silliest mistake that even HRT couldn't do