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Sebastian Vettel Thread Part II


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#3551 krea

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 08:59

well, I would say they were in the blind spot of each other, so it was an accident.



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#3552 string158

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:01

http://blog.axisofov...l-him-what.html

Are there any German speaking fans on this board? Is that really what he said? Because if it is.... :eek:


Looking at that second video I've got to agree that Vettel could have left more room for Senna.

Kudos to Kimi though, he had to act fast, sooooo close to hitting Vettel there!

#3553 EvanRainer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:19

How could he leave more space for someone he didn't know was there.

As krea said Vettel and Senna simply couldn't see each other and didn't know each other was there.

#3554 Diablobb81

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:31

Vettel extends his contract until 2016.

#3555 Zava

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:36

Vettel extends his contract until 2016.

source?

#3556 Diablobb81

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:38

Bild.de

#3557 Jovanotti

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:38

source?

Vettel extends contract: http://sport.oe24.at...d-Bull/86451623

Edit: The news doesn't seem to spread exactly fast around here :p

Edited by Jovanotti, 28 November 2012 - 10:01.


#3558 EvanRainer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 09:59

There goes that myth.

#3559 apoka

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 10:16

Vettel extends contract: http://sport.oe24.at...d-Bull/86451623


Thanks for posting. :up:

Let's see whether this will be confirmed by other sources.

Quite interesting that they also extended contracts with other key personnel (Horner and Newey). It seems Mateschitz is still very hungry for more success.

There are a couple of interesting questions: What kind of salary will he get? Which role did Ferrari play in the contract negotiations?

Btw. would it be too early to open the "Vettel to Ferrari in 2017" thread? :D

Edit: The news doesn't seem to spread exactly fast around here :p

Everyone is busy with yellow and green flags and lights.  ;)

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#3560 Jovanotti

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 10:33

Everyone is busy with yellow and green flags and lights. ;)

:lol: Was thinking the same..

#3561 choyothe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 10:35

:clap: Brilliant.

Senna and Vettel's fault combined. One shouldn't have dived down the inside and the other should have left room. Remember the arguments for Hamilton/Webber Singapore '11 and Hamilton/Maldonado '12. Racing incident caused by both drivers.


The difference is though that in those incidents the guy in front had no obstructions blocking his view from the guy trying to overtake though, also the way Senna was making up the gap was much more radical than in a normal overtaking situation.

#3562 H2H

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 10:50

This would be great news, however I would like to see it confirmed by other sources. Still the paper 'Oesterreich' seems to be well informed, with an article about the search of a house in Austria. Altaussee is according to the paper the most likely candidate. He lives in Switzerland - mostly of course for tax reasons - in a rural, simple environment. The potential place is certainly beautiful, also rural and layed-back. The Hangar 7/Salzburg airport nearby should make it rather close to the rest of the world.

Edited by H2H, 28 November 2012 - 10:51.


#3563 bourbon

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 11:16

Vettel extends contract: http://sport.oe24.at...d-Bull/86451623

Edit: The news doesn't seem to spread exactly fast around here :p


Sweet. I like the boys in blue as they are. Good to hear Newey and Horner are also to remain. That will be a smashing 4 seasons. :up:

Edited by bourbon, 28 November 2012 - 11:19.


#3564 Jovanotti

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 11:28

Confusion atm, sport.oe24.at being the only source of the rumour.

Handelsblatt: „Wir haben einen Vertrag bis 2014. Das ist es und nichts Weiteres und nichts mehr“, sagte Red Bulls Motorsportberater Helmut Marko. (Marko: "We got a contract until 2014, that's it").

#3565 mnmracer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 12:10

Part of me wouldn't mind seeing Vettel do a Jim Clark. History doesn't remember him as "the guy who only won in a Lotus".
But part of me would also like to see him venture out. There's only so many times you call it lucky coincidences when a driver is the first to bring success to a team (TR, RB), so it'd be thrilling to see if he can do what very very very few have done in history.

#3566 H2H

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 12:29

Confusion atm, sport.oe24.at being the only source of the rumour.

Handelsblatt: „Wir haben einen Vertrag bis 2014. Das ist es und nichts Weiteres und nichts mehr“, sagte Red Bulls Motorsportberater Helmut Marko. (Marko: "We got a contract until 2014, that's it").


Catched it too. Handelsblatt is the leading German business paper and I have to read it regulary.

Nach seinem dritten Formel-1-Titel mit etwa drei Millionen Euro Prämie der nächste Paukenschlag bei Sebastian Vettel: Der neu verlängerte Vertrag mit Red Bull wird den 25-Jährigen voraussichtlich zum bestbezahlten Formel-1-Fahrer machen.


According to them Seb will likely become the highest-paid driver. Of course we can not know for sure, especially given the bonus payments linked to performance.





#3567 Cenotaph

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 12:33

SEBASTIAN VETTEL YOU ARE THE WORLD CHAMPION!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just felt like saying that :p

#3568 H2H

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 12:44


Horner Q&A

At the end of it, Sebastian Vettel is only the third man after Juan Manuel Fangio and Michael Schumacher to win a third successive World Championship. Have his performances of the season perhaps been in races he hasn't won?
CH: "Absolutely. Sebastian has fought so hard for this championship and I think that, of the three, this has been by far the hardest.

"We haven't had a car advantage throughout this year and if you go back to the first race of the season at Australia, he fought on every lap to be on the podium. There have been other races later in the year when he has put in phenomenal drives that have largely gone unnoticed - the fourth positions, the fifth positions - and then, as we have managed to chip away at the performance, he has capitalised on that. Putting that run of four successive race wins at the fly-aways from Singapore through to India was a hugely impressive performance. To come back from being forty points behind, it's been quite remarkable to see what he has achieved."


By the way Christian and Seb seem to be quite similar in the way the think.

#3569 EvanRainer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 14:09

Other than races with special circumstances (alternators, cucumbers etc) Vettel's worst finish was one 6th place. No worse than 5th other than that.

That, with a car that was struggling to get into Q3 at times in the first part of the season. The car still had good race pace of course, it's not magic, but THIS is how you win championships. Sebastian NEVER goes backwards in the race (excluding mechanical issues/crashes etc). That's what sets the top drivers apart.

#3570 joshb

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 14:10

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104634

seems like Seb reads these boards from time to time.
Good to see him putting the record straight and saying what I've been saying for 3 or 4 years

"It's actually a little bit of comedy to look back now and you were the driver who can't overtake," said Vettel during a media event at the Red Bull factory.

"Now after just two races people have changed their mind.

"To win from the front and to come through the field is the same. You still do your best, and people credit you have overtaken.

"You have come through the field, more than you pulling away and pulling lead of 8s or something. They don't maybe understand what it is worth to pull that gap.

"Last year we always started from a great position and, yeah, we didn't have to overtake, and then you get criticised for not overtaking."

Its true. People under rate his performances when he wins from pole like India.
But when he drops the ball in qualy (like Australia) and comes 2nd people rave about it, even though he wasn't spot on all weekend

Edited by joshb, 28 November 2012 - 14:11.


#3571 EvanRainer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 14:13

A driver's job is to get the maximum out of whatever hand they are dealt.

I still think that RBR lost the title in 2009 not because of Brawn's early advantage but because due the team's and Seb's inexperience, they failed to maximise their points (e.g. binning it in Australia at the end)

#3572 joshb

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 14:13

Other than races with special circumstances (alternators, cucumbers etc) Vettel's worst finish was one 6th place. No worse than 5th other than that.

That, with a car that was struggling to get into Q3 at times in the first part of the season. The car still had good race pace of course, it's not magic, but THIS is how you win championships. Sebastian NEVER goes backwards in the race (excluding mechanical issues/crashes etc). That's what sets the top drivers apart.


I wouldn't say NEVER
think Germany, Hungary, USA

but then 35% of the time, he can't go forwards from his starting position.

Although think of the hopeless situations he had in China, Spain, Monaco, Spa, Abu Dhabi, Brazil- all races where he started or was running out of the points at some stage, yet he made 71 points from those 6 races, when he could easily of had only 20 or 30

Edited by joshb, 28 November 2012 - 14:14.


#3573 EvanRainer

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 14:15

Well USA almost pulled it off against a faster package on the day. Great performance. Germany, bullshit was involved ;)

Obviously there is no 100% perfection.

#3574 PolarF1

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:10

Vettel didn't see Senna. Are you really implying he decided to turn in on him and throw his championship away?

But you know, whatever fits your agenda.

It's still Vettels fault. He went wide in the corner and then closed the door. At the start you should expect someone to use the gap if u leave it open. He changed his line from going wide to the inside line, and thus risking his championship when he only needed 7th position or something like that. He should have just stayed on the outside line through the corner and everything would be fine . Mistakes like that happen sometimes to the best, there are too many cars at the start to process.
And I don't have any agenda.

I totally disagree - Senna misjudged his braking point and just divebombed into SV´s side. Stupid of BS to think that he could outbrake ForceIndia that much.

I don't think Senna misjudged anything, he was going totally different line than Vettel and went for the inside line which was wide open, then Vettel closed in on him, there is no way Senna could see that coming.
Watch the bad overtake in this video, now that is divebombing:


and then watch this from 1:00 mark:

They were almost side by side !


#3575 ArnageWRC

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:25

Catched it too. Handelsblatt is the leading German business paper and I have to read it regulary.



According to them Seb will likely become the highest-paid driver. Of course we can not know for sure, especially given the bonus payments linked to performance.



Do you mean they pay him to drive? That'll never catch on ;)

I've spent too long in the WRC forums, were to drive you have to pay....... madness

#3576 H2H

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:28

Do you mean they pay him to drive? That'll never catch on ;)

I've spent too long in the WRC forums, were to drive you have to pay....... madness


 ;)

Indeed, madness.

#3577 choyothe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:32

I don't think Senna misjudged anything, he was going totally different line than Vettel and went for the inside line which was wide open, then Vettel closed in on him, there is no way Senna could see that coming.
Watch the bad overtake in this video, now that is divebombing:


and then watch this from 1:00 mark:

They were almost side by side !


Except Rubens still made a lot less ground than Senna did and the point of contact was pretty much the same.

#3578 superuser

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:39

I wonder if Ferrari didn't shot themselves in the foot badly by alienating Vettel with their actions this year. I can totally see him taking a decision to NOT join them and instead beating them with RB and McLaren for the foreseeable future. Their love story with Alonso will end pretty badly for Ferarri, I think.

#3579 sniper80

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:21

Nah, I don't think so, Alonso will beat Vettel if he has the same car, any time. Ferrari can't screw up their design every year.
Potentially, they will not win next year, but they will start dominating the sport again after that. It's all a matter of history cycles.

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#3580 Mr.Wayne

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:24

Nah, I don't think so, Alonso will beat Vettel if he has the same car, any time. Ferrari can't screw up their design every year.
Potentially, they will not win next year, but they will start dominating the sport again after that. It's all a matter of history cycles.

Alonso couldn't beat a rookie in 2007.

Alonso cannot take a strong driver on equal footing.

The cars were so evenly matched this year, with Ferrari having a massive upper hand in reliability and off-the-line traction; not to mention that, as Alonso said, in the race their pace was "second to none".

Vettel might lose against Alonso, or might defeat him, but it will not be as easy for Alonso as some might want to sell...

#3581 superuser

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:35

Nah, I don't think so, Alonso will beat Vettel if he has the same car, any time. Ferrari can't screw up their design every year.
Potentially, they will not win next year, but they will start dominating the sport again after that. It's all a matter of history cycles.


Well, I don't agree with you. Vettel is faster than Alonso and almost as consistent. He's also better under pressure. But even if you were right, it's obvious that Ferrari can't produce an equal car. And if there was no Vettel in Red Bull, they would have two more WDCs. So Vettel is beating them, regardless of the car.

#3582 mey3059

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:42

I wonder if Ferrari didn't shot themselves in the foot badly by alienating Vettel with their actions this year. I can totally see him taking a decision to NOT join them and instead beating them with RB and McLaren for the foreseeable future. Their love story with Alonso will end pretty badly for Ferarri, I think.


Ferrari now are in love with the guy who uttered these words against them... " Formula 1 is not a sport anymore " ," ... as long as the car is not red" .
Same could happen in Vettel's case too - forget the past and move on.

#3583 superuser

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:47

Ferrari now are in love with the guy who uttered these words against them... " Formula 1 is not a sport anymore " ," ... as long as the car is not red" .
Same could happen in Vettel's case too - forget the past and move on.


You are absolutely right, but let's remember that Alonso had no other option when he turned to Ferrari. Vettel can go where he wants.

#3584 Mr.Wayne

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:54

Ferrari now are in love with the guy who uttered these words against them... " Formula 1 is not a sport anymore " ," ... as long as the car is not red" .
Same could happen in Vettel's case too - forget the past and move on.

Unlike Alonso, Vettel does not have the largest Spanish bank on his back...

#3585 mey3059

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:55

You are absolutely right, but let's remember that Alonso had no other option when he turned to Ferrari. Vettel can go where he wants.


You are right too :) . Vettel is no Alonso! , but I suspect he has a secret desire to drive for the Red team, it being Schumacher's team and all

#3586 superuser

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:08

You are right too :) . Vettel is no Alonso! , but I suspect he has a secret desire to drive for the Red team, it being Schumacher's team and all


I hope that Vettel is smart enough to see that Ferrari is not going anywhere with the current management. And if he makes a wrong carrier move, he may end up like Alonso, waiting for years for his next WDC.

#3587 F.M.

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:27

You are right too :) . Vettel is no Alonso! , but I suspect he has a secret desire to drive for the Red team, it being Schumacher's team and all

Maybe Vettel has more desire to do what Schumacher didn't do: win as a German in a Silver Arrow instead of doing what Schumacher already did: win in a Prancing Horse?

Edited by F.M., 28 November 2012 - 19:27.


#3588 joshb

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:35



Onboard of Seb on laps 3,4,5. At the start he is P20 and by the end of lap 5, when he takes Kovalainen, up to P13

Really getting out of shape in T1/2 and also how draggy the RB is- Pic was pulling away on the straight- he couldn't take him in T1, had to wait till T4

#3589 encircled

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:38

To be fair to the RB8, the exhaust was damaged, but I get the point. :)

#3590 PolarF1

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:13

Except Rubens still made a lot less ground than Senna did and the point of contact was pretty much the same.


The incidents are not the same, Vettel left the apex unguarded, invited Senna in and then closed the door.
He gained a lot of ground because Seb was slower to make tihgter turn, and they touched almost side by side.
On starts once you go wide u stay there, or else u risk being hit, there are a lot of cars around.

#3591 bourbon

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:23

SEBASTIAN VETTEL YOU ARE THE WORLD CHAMPION!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just felt like saying that :p



SEBASTIAN, YOU ARE TRIPLE WORLD CHAMPION!!! YOU ARE THE MAN!!! :up:

#3592 gillesthegenius

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 03:47

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104634

seems like Seb reads these boards from time to time.
Good to see him putting the record straight and saying what I've been saying for 3 or 4 years

"It's actually a little bit of comedy to look back now and you were the driver who can't overtake," said Vettel during a media event at the Red Bull factory.

"Now after just two races people have changed their mind.

"To win from the front and to come through the field is the same. You still do your best, and people credit you have overtaken.

"You have come through the field, more than you pulling away and pulling lead of 8s or something. They don't maybe understand what it is worth to pull that gap.

"Last year we always started from a great position and, yeah, we didn't have to overtake, and then you get criticised for not overtaking."

Its true. People under rate his performances when he wins from pole like India.
But when he drops the ball in qualy (like Australia) and comes 2nd people rave about it, even though he wasn't spot on all weekend


He used to be 'the guy who couldnt win with inferior machinery' too. But that was only untill last Sunday.

If people say that the Ferrari was the best car of 2006 and 2008, then Mclaren was imho the best of the field this year. So Alonso has to think twice before implying that only himself and the rookie who beat him can win championships with inferior machinery.

#3593 Ricardo F1

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 04:50

Well USA almost pulled it off against a faster package on the day.

Seriously? I have never seen two cars more evenly matched than McLaren and Red Bull in Austin. He got caught by a backmarker, without it Hamilton could never have passed. RBR had the fastest car that day equal with McLaren, Vettel was unfortunate.


#3594 Ricardo F1

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 04:52

If people say that the Ferrari was the best car of 2006 and 2008, then Mclaren was imho the best of the field this year.

Possible, but then it didn't finish the race a few times which handed the Championship to Vettel. Therefore not exactly the best car is it? Ask Kimi Raikonnen for more info.


#3595 Weyoun

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 06:17

McLaren might have had the faster car, but they weren't able to use this advantage most of the time. Generally I don't like it myself when everyone is talking about the "best package" (e.g. car, driver, team). But this year proved at length, that success does not depend on one person or one factor alone.

McLaren lost because of mistakes and reliability
Ferrari argueably lost because they enforce their Alonso Nr.1 philosophy
Red Bull had the best package overall in the season because of their improvements later in the season

Just imagine Ferrari, who had a real fast car in the race, employing a better 2nd driver than Felipe. They could easily won the constructors championship and maybe the drivers as well....since a better driver would have been able to take points away from Seb in the early races and the overall season. But since they need to please Alonso so desperately, they do not deserve better than to lose.

It boggles my mind that they still don't see that. Massa only had 11 points after 8 (!) races. While Alonso had 100+ points. I guess they thought that Alonso's skill and talent would be enough. But in the end of the day it is a team sport. Not just one person.



#3596 gillesthegenius

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 06:21

Possible, but then it didn't finish the race a few times which handed the Championship to Vettel. Therefore not exactly the best car is it? Ask Kimi Raikonnen for more info.


Massa's Ferrari didnt enjoy the best reliability in 2008 either. Even Schumi suffered with reliabilty at the most untimely of moments. Besides Vettel didnt enjoy a very reliable car this year either.

That is why I said that if people say that the Ferraris of 2006 and 2008 were the best of their respective fields then I would say that the Mclaren of 2012 is the best of its field.

Edited by gillesthegenius, 29 November 2012 - 06:25.


#3597 Ricardo F1

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:12

Massa's Ferrari didnt enjoy the best reliability in 2008 either. Even Schumi suffered with reliabilty at the most untimely of moments. Besides Vettel didnt enjoy a very reliable car this year either.

That is why I said that if people say that the Ferraris of 2006 and 2008 were the best of their respective fields then I would say that the Mclaren of 2012 is the best of its field.

Then you're an idiot. If the Mclaren was the best of its field then Hamilton would be WDC and Vettel resigned to a has-been.

#3598 H2H

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:14

It is quite funny indeed. Seb did get the job done three times, twice with the fastest car and once with the second-fastest. Reliability-wide 2010 was all but great but the performance advantage was good, as long as RBR was able to start up front. Not every other top driver can say he got the job done if he had the best car, doesn't he? Quite a few drivers in the paddock can not say that...

Edited by H2H, 29 November 2012 - 07:21.


#3599 Der Pate

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:30

It´s really funny to see, that some people (especially the Hamilton-fanboys, who might disappear after an useless season at Mercedes) try to convince others, that Vettel is rubbish although he won the championship 3-times, and that Hamilton should have won, although he wasn´t even in strike-distance...

Suddenly the championship-points are useless, but Vettel also won most of the GPs, had most of the best laps...Hamilton only won regarding the pole-positions, but I remember seasons in the 80s, when Piquet had most of the poles in 1984 and was nowhere in the championship or Senna in 1986/1987...

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#3600 gillesthegenius

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 07:48

Then you're an idiot. If the Mclaren was the best of its field then Hamilton would be WDC and Vettel resigned to a has-been.


Excuse me.

Hamilton didnt challenge for the world championship because of the many errors his team made and the incidents he got involved in. Reliability wasnt his only problem. As a matter of fact, Seb also suffered from reliability issues. But RBR didnt make as many mistakes as Mclaren made. Mclaren, according to the same logic that people use to prove that Alonso and Hamilton won in inferior cars, had the best car this year and they messed up big time. Vettel capitalised on it and brought the title home with what could be called 'inferior machinery'. Deal with it without calling names.

Besides, what would you call yourself for suggesting that the same statement made by the same idiot was 'possible' in your earlier reply?