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Turning the tables on the WDC & WCC


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#1 Buttoneer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 11:07

Last year during the summer break we embarked on a quest to see what stupidity we could prove by simple teammate comparison and Gillesthegenius was able to show that Danica Patrick is better than most of the current F1 champs on the grid http://forums.autosp...a...t&p=5232814

Early this year in F1 we had a really well mixed grid with cars and drivers performing at different levels from what we might normally expect, and this threw up some interesting results and a smattering of opinions that maybe these drivers were all damn good, and just needed to have the right equipment and opportunities to become WDC's. I think we all know that these drivers would not compete unless they believed they had it in them to win races and championships.

So lets see if we can give them a boost up the table.

The purpose of this thread is to try and lay on the bullshit thicker than last year (but not spread it as far) and try to get current drivers or teams that are losing badly in the WDC or WCC table out front. How can we get Pedro de la Rosa to the head of the standings? Or better still, crown HRT as WCC leaders? Is it even possible? How far up the table can we get these guys? How far down can we get Alonso and Red Bull? Maybe you just want Kimi to be heading the table. Give it a try.

The rules of this thread are;

  • Standard 2012 points allocations may not be used, especially in any challenge to a bullshit system used by a poster. Obvious really, but I learned last year that sometimes these things do need to be said. You can use any of the previous systems though, if you find that they work.
  • Any metric employed must be measurable and demonstrable. ‘He looks faster’ is neither measurable nor demonstrable, but number of career race participation's, overtakes or retirements is.
  • Be clear about the measure used. You must provide enough information that others may verify, duplicate or challenge your findings. Googlefight search strings, for example.
  • It doesn’t matter if the metric used is a positive or negative one. If it’s real, and measurable, then it counts.
  • The ‘winner’ is the poster who can get the current WDC or WCC table bottom feeders to the top and the current leaders to the bottom by the same measure. However, if you just want to usurp the current leader with anyone else, go ahead and see what you can do.
  • In the unlikely event of a tiebreaker, a positive metric (such as number of overtakes) wins over a negative one (such as the number of retirements). If we have more than one positive, my word is final.
  • You can go back in time to build your numbers if this helps, but it must apply only to this years championship. We are not looking for ‘Bestest Evah!’ but all drivers have driven the same number of races in 2012, but the total ever driven differs greatly across the grid.
  • Don’t get mad, get even. I don’t want to see cries of ‘fanboy’ or ‘hater’ here. If you’re upset that ‘KarthikeyanFan’ has found a way to get Narain ahead of Vettel, then find a new way to get Vettel to the top. Overcome them with bullshit, not douchery.
  • As with last year, those who take any of the bullshit seriously should be awarded the rolleyes smiley, especially those who clearly demonstrate that they have not properly read this post and these rules.

So to get the ball rolling, Force India are at the top of the WDC table with 11 typed characters and HRT at the bottom with three. The full WCC table is;

1. Force India (11)
2. Toro Rosso (10)
=3. Caterham (8)
=3. Red Bull (8)
=3. Mercedes (8)
=3. Marussia (8)
=3. Williams (8)
=8. Ferrari (7)
=8. McLaren (7)
10. Sauber (6)
11. Lotus (5)
12. HRT (3)

Congratulations Vijay Mallya!

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#2 Risil

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 12:20

BS, that table doesn't even take into account the numerological values of the letters involved. I have a corrected edition:

1. Toro Rosso (154)
2. Marussia (101)
3. Williams (98)
4. Lotus (87)
5. Force India (84)
6. Ferrari (75)
7. Red Bull (74)
8. Mercedes (72)
9. Caterham (69)
=10. Mclaren (66)
=10. Sauber (66)
12. HRT (46)

Lotus really punching above their weight, no doubt we can attribute this to Kimi Raikkonen :up:

#3 Red17

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:17

BS. Any given table must take in consideration the impact of constructors outside their F1 Bubble. Build a open wheeler? Big Deal! Swiming in the big Shark Ocean, that is the real challenge!

So, let's see what these guys are doing outside Bernie F1.

1- HRT. They have zero, nothing. Their car was made by Dallara, all they do is upgrade the thing using temporary engineers. Only a couple weeks ago they didn't have an HQ of their own!
2- Lotus. Not only they have been an exclusive Formula 1 outfit, but they have continuously licensed names over the years, no identity of their own. I do give them credit for at least have built all their cars so far.
3- Force India. Since it's not UB Racing I am dismissing the thousands of drinks they have made over the years (see below). But they have a bonus for the boss's yatch in Monaco which technically makes them the only earth-water entry in Formula 1.
4- Marrusia. Good thing they dropped the Virgin name or I would include the thousands of records published by Virgin as well as the plane fleet. So that's 2 cars to their name. They leap-frog Caterham for being virtually unknown outside Formula 1.
5- Caterham. Only 2 cars so far, the 7 and the 21 that was axed long ago.
6- Sauber. Tough one. But let's say the Lemans Sauber Mercedes and all other earlier C adventures count. If only Peter had some hair...
7 - Williams. We have shaving cream in hundreds and the non-official Clio. Sorry Frank, your name is too common.
8- McLaren. Again, 2 cars to their name. But they leap-frog Ferrari for their multiple entries as McLaren Electronics as well as the tons of complaints.
9- Ferrari. Over 60 cars built so far.
10- Mercedes. Over 80 cars to their name.
11- STR. Since It's now only half owned by Red Bull I am halving their impact to 2,35 bilion cans per year.
12- Red Bull. Reported to have sold 4,5 bilion cans last year.

Edited by Red17, 09 August 2012 - 13:46.


#4 Buttoneer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:24

^
I like the concept but it's a clear violation of rule 2, so I invoke the penalty at rule 9;

:rolleyes:

#5 Red17

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:32

^
I like the concept but it's a clear violation of rule 2, so I invoke the penalty at rule 9;

:rolleyes:

Updated sir.

edit2: Added numbers to the Red Bull entries. Is it enough to pass scrutineering?

Edited by Red17, 09 August 2012 - 13:48.


#6 DanardiF1

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:42

I think you should have to use the team's full corporate names...

1. Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team (25)
2. Vodafone McLaren Mercedes (23)
3. Sahara Force India F1 Team (22)
4. Scuderia Toro Rosso (17)
5. Scuderia Ferrari (15)
6. Caterham F1 Team (14)
7. Marussia F1 Team (14)
8. Williams F1 Team (14)
9. Red Bull Racing (13)
10. Sauber F1 Team (12)
11. Lotus F1 Team (11)
12. HRT F1 Team (9)

Edited by DanardiF1, 09 August 2012 - 13:43.


#7 Buttoneer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:47

There's nothing new under the sun is there? I did think that something like this had been done before and it has, at the end of 2009. Burai started this great thread to give everyone an opportunity to demote Jenson from his WDC winning position. There are some great ideas for alternative scoring in there, and a far better set of rules.

The "Jenson Doesn't Deserve It" Points System Thread, Contrive a way to rob him of the title and give it to your favourite

#8 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 13:54

WCC table based on team principal's age:

Williams 70
Sauber 69
Mercedes 58*
Marussia 58
Force India 57
Toro Rosso 56
McLaren 54
HRT 53
Caterham 48
Ferrari 47
Lotus 39
Redbull 38

thread\ :p


*Brawn is 1 month older than Booth.

#9 phil1993

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:08

Combined age of the two drivers

HRT 76
Mercedes 70
Ferrari 62
Red Bull 60
McLaren 59
Lotus 58
Caterham 57
Williams 55
Marussia 52
Force India 50
Sauber 47
STR 45

Ah that didn't work...

#10 wrcva

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:10

Data:
Driver, Team, Age
KARTHIKEYAN HRT 35
Delarosa HRT 41
Timo Marussia 30
Pic Marussia 22
Kova Caterham 31
Petrov Caterham 28
Toro Rosso Ricciardo 23
Toro Rosso Vergne 22
FI di Resta 26
FI Hulkenberg 25
Williams Maldonado 27
Williams Senna 29
Sauber Kobayashi 26
Sauber Perez 22
Merc Schumacher 43
Merc Rosberg 27
Ferrari Alonso 31
Ferrari Massa 31
Lotus Kimi 33
Lotus Gro 26
McLaren Button 32
McLaren Hamilton 27
RBR Vettel 25
RBR Webber 36


Edited by wrcva, 09 August 2012 - 14:38.


#11 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:15

but I did beat y'all :cool: made my fav team leaders, and Redbull tails the WCC! :p

#12 Buttoneer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:23

WCC table based on team principal's age:

Williams 70
Sauber 69
Mercedes 58*
Marussia 58
Force India 57
Toro Rosso 56
McLaren 54
HRT 53
Caterham 48
Ferrari 47
Lotus 39
Redbull 38

thread\ :p


*Brawn is 1 month older than Booth.

I do like this one. Go Willys! :D

(How do we verify?)

#13 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:27

I do like this one. Go Willys! :D

(How do we verify?)


Search the team principals in google! :p

#14 flyer121

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:30

but I did beat y'all :cool: made my fav team leaders, and Redbull tails the WCC! :p


But you used the wrong rule. According to the great Greek sporting regs compiled in 16th century - in case of ties or photo finishes the younger guy wins over the older because the latter (older and wiser ) has a natural advantage of experience over the former :)

So lets turn your table on its head and RB wins with Williams languishing at the bottom.

Edited by flyer121, 09 August 2012 - 14:31.


#15 TheWilliamzer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 14:48

But you used the wrong rule. According to the great Greek sporting regs compiled in 16th century - in case of ties or photo finishes the younger guy wins over the older because the latter (older and wiser ) has a natural advantage of experience over the former :)

So lets turn your table on its head and RB wins with Williams languishing at the bottom.


there's no tie or photo finish between Williams and Horner :) but we can apply this rule on Ross & John! :D

#16 Red17

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:05

My updated entry still has not been cleared by the stewarts. :|

#17 7MGTEsup

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:07

Ross Brawn is really that old? Shit I thought he was just into his 50's.

And what sort of youth tonic is Peter Sauber taking?

Edited by 7MGTEsup, 09 August 2012 - 15:08.


#18 Buttoneer

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:24

My updated entry still has not been cleared by the stewarts. :|

Sorry, there's a backlog.

I think I'm clear on the basic premise; how well the teams are known outside the F1 world by reference to ...and that's where it loses me. In some you've talked about cars, in others yachts or hair...I'm just not sure where the consistency is. I do like the concept though as it's about as far outside the box as you can get. How much Whyte & Mackay has Mallya sold, I wonder?

#19 Risil

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:31

Personally? Probably about as much as he's drunk. Or not...

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#20 Kvothe

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:40

Excellent thread:

In my World championship table the drivers are allocated a classification at the end of each race depending on the number of times they've been overtaken in a race, the more they are overtaken the higher up the classification they will finish. If there is a tie break between two or more drivers who have both been overtaken the same amount of times, the higher finishing position will be awarded to the driver who have overtaken the least during that race, and so on. In the result of a further tie break with two or more drivers having both been overtaken the same amount of times and pulled the same number of overtakes, then the positions will be awarded inverse to the drivers finishing position so the driver who finished lowest in the actual race will be awarded the highest position. The finishing position will be based on where the drivers were classified in the race by the Formula 1 governing body, regardless of any DNS' or DNFs.

Based on the above criteria drivers will then be awarded points equivalent to the 2012 system depending on where they are classified. For example the person who has been overtaken the most, will be at the top of the table and will receive 25 points, the person who has been overtaken the second highest amount of times will be awarded 18 and so on, and just like the 2012 system there are no points awarded for finishing lower than tenth. The points from each race will be added up cumulatively for each driver and by the end of the season the driver with the most points is the champion. Furthermore the points of both drivers of the same time will be added cumulatively together to reflect the number of points a team has scored and at the end of the championship the team with the most points wins the WCC. In the event of a tie in World Championship points, the higher position in the WDC will be allocated to the driver who has been overtaken the most in a single race. In the even that there is a further tie then it will be awarded to the person with the second highest amount of times overtaken in a race. This will continue until there is no longer a tie break.

All overtaking statistics have been taken from Clip the apex using the criteria below:

http://cliptheapex.c...ity/overtaking/

The overtaking figures for each race (across all data sets) do not include:
Position changes on the first lap of the race
Position changes due to drivers lapping backmarkers
Positions gained in the pits
Positions gained due to drivers yielding
Positions gained when a car has a serious technical problem; e.g. puncture, accident damage, etc.
The final criteria involves subjective judgements and consequently figures can never be regarded as ‘definitive’. Gaps in the available data, such as moves missed by TV cameras or obscured on lap charts by pit stops or retirements, mean that the data do not lend themselves to detailed analysis at the micro level, but are indicative of general trends.


I did think about making being lapped the main criteria, and using the overtaking statistics as count back, which would have have probably totally put the grid in reverse order but I didn't have the time.

Post Hungary:

WDC
POS Driver Points
1. Timo Glock 110
2. Charles Pic 98
3, Pedro De La Rosa 92
4. Daniel Ricciardo 86
5. Buno Senna 76
6. Naain Kathikeyan 74
7. Nico Rosberg 70
8. Heikki Kovalainen 69
9. Jean Eric Vergne 67
10. Sergio Perez 66
11. Paul Di Resta 56
12. Vitaly Petrov 45
13. Pastor Maldonado 37
14. Kimi Raikkonen 35
15. Kamui Kobayashi 34
16. Fernando Alonso 21
17. Felipe Massa 14
18. Jendon Button 12
19. Nico Hulkenberg 11
20. Lewis Hamilton 08
21. Mark Webber 06
22. Michael Schumacher 04
23. Romain Grosjean 03
24. Sebastian Vettel 00

WCC:

Pos. Team Points
1. Marussia 208
2. HRT 166
3. Torro Rosso 153
4. Caterham 114
5. Williams 113
6. Sauber 100
7. Mercedes 74
8. Force India 67
9. Lotus 38
10. Ferrari 35
11. McLaren 20
12. Red Bull 06

I have written up the methodology and the statistics for ever race which I deemed to long to post, but I would be willing to do so at request.

I'd also like to note that my championship seems to heavily favour those who have completed races and not DNFd.

Edited by Kvothe, 09 August 2012 - 15:48.


#21 7MGTEsup

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 15:43

After reading through the thread from 2009 I have come up with a good system to level the playing field for everyone.

At the start of the season and then at 3 race intervals. Each car is driven by a third party professional driver and a lap time is set for each car (the fastest time achievable in each car by said driver) The fastest car has a weighting factor of 0 and each car after that has a weighting factor based on its time.

So if your car was 0.137 seconds slower than the fastest car your points would be weighted by that amount.

i.e. if you won you would get 25 x 0.137 = 3.425 on top of your points total for the race.

So in theory if you finished 6th in a HRT that was 2.375 seconds slower than the fastest car you would score more points than than if you won in the fastest car (8x2.375=19 19+8 = 27) V (25x0=25). As getting into 6th in an HRT would be much more heroic than winning in a Redbull.

This is probably a bit off topic sorry

#22 Red17

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 16:11

I have come up with a more controversial championship. Penalties.

Reading through the wikipedia reports for each race in 2012 we have the following standings for penalties.
Do note that I have taken in consideration all penalties mentioned in the report including drive-throughs

According to my crude maths there are 15 drivers with penalties:

Maldonado 5
Perez 4
Hamilton 2
Schumacher 2
Pic 2
Kovalainen 1
Raikonen 1
Kartikayan 1
Vergne 1
Kobayashi 1
Hulkenberg 1
Grosjean 1
Webber 1
Rosberg 1
Vettel 1


Total by teams with most penalties:

Sauber 5
Williams 5
Mercedes 3
Lotus 2
Red Bull 2
Mclaren 2
Marrusia 2
Force India 1
Toro Rosso 1
Caterham 1
HRT 1
Ferrari 0


But we don't want the bad behavoiur guys to win!
So we flip the table and we have a surprise winner in Ferrari with HRT edging Caterham and the STR's eyeing the podium.

Disclaimer: These wikipedia numbers are by no means endorsed by FOM or the FIA

Edited by Red17, 09 August 2012 - 16:13.


#23 Kvothe

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 17:30

I have come up with a more controversial championship. Penalties.

Reading through the wikipedia reports for each race in 2012 we have the following standings for penalties.
Do note that I have taken in consideration all penalties mentioned in the report including drive-throughs

According to my crude maths there are 15 drivers with penalties:


Total by teams with most penalties:



But we don't want the bad behavoiur guys to win!
So we flip the table and we have a surprise winner in Ferrari with HRT edging Caterham and the STR's eyeing the podium.

Disclaimer: These wikipedia numbers are by no means endorsed by FOM or the FIA


How good is your crude maths? :p
By my reckoning Vettel has had two, one in Barcelona and one in Hockenheim.

Edited by Kvothe, 09 August 2012 - 17:31.


#24 phil1993

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 19:30

I have come up with a more controversial championship. Penalties.


Here you go then. All penalties are counted...

Maldonado - 9
Schumacher - 4
Vettel - 4
Vergne - 3
Hulkenberg - 3
Perez - 3
Karthikeyan - 2
Pic - 2
De La Rosa - 2
Kobayashi - 2
Hamilton - 2
Raikkonen - 2
Kovalainen - 1
Petrov - 1
Senna - 1
Grosjean - 1
Massa - 1
Webber - 1
Rosberg - 1
Button - 1
Glock - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Di Resta - 0
Alonso - 0

#25 Kvothe

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 19:41

Here you go then. All penalties are counted...

Maldonado - 9
Schumacher - 4
Vettel - 4
Vergne - 3
Hulkenberg - 3
Perez - 3
Karthikeyan - 2
Pic - 2
De La Rosa - 2
Kobayashi - 2
Hamilton - 2
Raikkonen - 2
Kovalainen - 1
Petrov - 1
Senna - 1
Grosjean - 1
Massa - 1
Webber - 1
Rosberg - 1
Button - 1
Glock - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Di Resta - 0
Alonso - 0


Vettel 4?

Apart from Barcelona and Hockenheim I honestly can't recall any of his others, would greatly appreciate it if you could fill in the blanks.

#26 Tiakumosan

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 19:51

Great Topic!

My contribution:

Sum finishing positions from each pilot;
Ret, DNQ or DNS means 24th position;
Driver with less points win;

Using data from wikipedia, we get:

Position		   Driver	Sum of Positions		Avg. Position
	1	 Fernando Alonso			   41		3,727272727
	2	 Mark Webber			   56		5,090909091
	3	 Kimi Räikkönen			   60		5,454545455
	4	 Sebastian Vettel			   69		6,272727273
	5	 Lewis Hamilton			   83		7,545454545
	6	 Nico Rosberg			   87		7,909090909
	7	 Jenson Button			   102		9,272727273
	8	 Paul di Resta			   121		11
	9	 Sergio Pérez			   123		11,18181818
   10	 Nico Hülkenberg			   127		11,54545455
   11	 Felipe Massa			   133		12,09090909
   12	 Romain Grosjean			   138		12,54545455
   13	 Bruno Senna			   145		13,18181818
   14	 Kamui Kobayashi			   148		13,45454545
   15	 Jean-Éric Vergne			   156		14,18181818
   15	 Daniel Ricciardo			   156		14,18181818
   17	 Pastor Maldonado			   158		14,36363636
   18	 Michael Schumacher		 181		16,45454545
   19	 Heikki Kovalainen			   196		17,81818182
   20	 Vitaly Petrov			   206		18,72727273
   21	 Timo Glock			   210		19,09090909
   22	 Charles Pic			   221		20,09090909
   23	 Pedro de la Rosa			   233		21,18181818
   24	 Narain Karthikeyan		   238		21,63636364


#27 phil1993

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 20:01

Vettel 4?

Apart from Barcelona and Hockenheim I honestly can't recall any of his others, would greatly appreciate it if you could fill in the blanks.


Reprimand in Canada for contact with Senna in practice, fined for pit lane speeding in Malaysia.

#28 Kvothe

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 20:22

Reprimand in Canada for contact with Senna in practice, fined for pit lane speeding in Malaysia.


Thanks.

#29 wrcva

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 21:08

My son went nuts with this... looks like he tried different variables and stopped with tires. here is the outcome, sorted by total tires used (data from F1 Fanatic)

Team			 Age T TP Age Age TotaAccidentPenaltie  Hard  MediSoftSuperWet  Inter Total Tires
	12		 HRT				76	  53	 129	   7	   3	 126 305 397   96   31   45		 1000
	 3	   Lotus				59	  39	  98	   4	   2	 184 357 502   80	8   35		 1166
	 5		Merc				70	  58	 128	   7	   4	 155 322 525   93   17   61		 1173
	11	Marussia				52	  58	 110	   5	   1	 122 389 488  115   22   56		 1192
	 7	Williams				56	  70	 126	   3	   7	 133 476 397   93   46   47		 1192
	 6	  Sauber				48	  69	 117	   4	   5	 146 389 488   88   22   59		 1192
	10	Caterham				59	  48	 107	   4	   1	 100 474 473   69   19   58		 1193
	 8		  FI				51	  57	 108	   1	   1	 156 479 441  106   23   56		 1261
	 9  Toro Rosso				45	  56	 101	   2	   2	 155 380 600  102   15   69		 1321
	 1		 RBR				61	  38	  99	   1	   3	 181 436 550  101   19   60		 1347
	 2	 McLaren				59	  54	 113	   1	   2	 178 549 426  115   18   62		 1348
	 4	 Ferrari				62	  47	 109	   1	   1	 187 514 475  104   21   57		 1358



			  Team	  Driver  Age				 AccidentPenaltie  Hard  MediSoftSuperWet  Inter Total Tires
			 Lotus		 Gro	26					   4	   1	  90 175 191   21	0	3		  480
			   HRT	Delarosa	41					   3	   1	  74 158 216	0   16   23		  487
			  Merc  Schumacher	43					   6	   3	  57 126 218   47	9   30		  487
			   HRT KARTHIKEYAN	35					   4	   2	  52 147 181   96   15   22		  513
		  Caterham	  Petrov	28					   3			  39 258 185   18	9   30		  539
		  Williams   Maldonado	27					   2	   6	  95 208 173   41   34   20		  571
			Sauber   Kobayashi	26					   3	   1	  95 181 236   25	8   32		  577
		  Marussia		 Pic	22					   3	   1	  46 200 246   61   12   27		  592
		  Marussia	   Timo	 30					   2			  76 189 242   54   10   29		  600
			Sauber	   Perez	22					   1	   4	  51 208 252   63   14   27		  615
		  Williams	   Senna	29					   1	   1	  38 268 224   52   12   27		  621
				FI  Hulkenberg	25							   1	  97 222 218   50   11   29		  627
				FI	di Resta	26					   1			  59 257 223   56   12   27		  634
		Toro Rosso	  Vergne	22					   1	   2	  76 177 318   33	5   42		  651
		  Caterham		Kova	31					   1	   1	  61 216 288   51   10   28		  654
			   RBR	  Vettel	25					   1	   2	  84 180 303   55   10   30		  662
		Toro Rosso   Ricciardo	23					   1			  79 203 282   69   10   27		  670
		   Ferrari	   Massa	31					   1	   1	  94 242 243   55   11   27		  672
		   McLaren	Hamilton	27					   1	   2	  97 275 214   46	9   32		  673
		   McLaren	  Button	32									  81 274 212   69	9   30		  675
			   RBR	  Webber	36							   1	  97 256 247   46	9   30		  685
			  Merc	 Rosberg	27					   1	   1	  98 196 307   46	8   31		  686
		   Ferrari	  Alonso	31									  93 272 232   49   10   30		  686
			 Lotus		Kimi	33							   1	  94 182 311   59	8   32		  686


#30 Atreiu

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 21:47

The same as we have now with points (same system) given for qualifying results (after penalties) and fastest laps as well.
Can someone do the math?

#31 Marbles

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 22:55

It's common knowledge that a beautifully liveried race car is a better race car. If we use the Federal Standard 595 Federal Standard Color Reference System to assign numerical values to the liveries of the 2012 teams, we clearly see that the new, more innovative teams are spending money where it matters--on pretty paint.

Before we look at the results, there are a few limitations inherent with describing colors, and while FS-595's five-number system is widely considered to be among the best systems for color standardization, it is not perfect. As a result, I've made a few simplifications in my ranking. For example, the FS-595 system could allow us to assign points to the various reds used by several teams based upon their hues, intensities, etc. At the end of the day, though, color perception is an inherently subjective task, so it makes sense to simply concentrate on the primary colors within each teams' livery.

Finally, three teams are certain to generate some reasonable discussion. Having squandered their budgets on development costs, Ferrari, McLaren, and Mercedes appear to have been relegated to inferior two color liveries this season. I believe most reasonable individuals would agree that the Ferrari is red and white, the McLaren is silver and orange, and the Mercedes is silver and green. Sure, there are other colors in there, but they are almost exclusively the result of the few sponsors these spendthrift teams have been able to attract.

Results:

Rank: Team: Score: Colors:

1 Marussia 22 Grey 7, Fl. Orange 8, Silver 7

2 (t) HRT 15 White 7, Gold 7, Red 1

2 (t) Lotus 15 Black 7 Gold 7, Red 1

2 (t) McLaren 15 Silver 7, Fl. Orange 8

3 (t) Sauber 14 White 7, Grey 6, Red 1

3 (t) Williams 14 White 7, Blue 5, Red 1

3 (t) Caterham 14 Green 4, Yellow 3, White 7

4 (t) STR 13 Blue 5, Red 1, Gold 7

4 (t) Force India 13 Green 4, White 7, Orange 2

5 Mercedes 11 Silver 7, Green 4

6 RBR 9 Blue 5, Yellow, 3, Red 1

7 Ferrari 8 Red 1, White 7







#32 Nustang70

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 01:41

This doesn't exactly turn the championships on their heads, but here's my contribution anyway.

Points are solely awarded for qualifying positions: 20-14-10-8-6-5-4-3-2-1

WDC as of Hungary:
Hamilton 150
Vettel 106
Alonso 76
Webber 74
Schumacher 70
Grosjean 60
Rosberg 58
Button 56
Maldonado 41
Raikkonen 39
Perez 16
Massa 15
Hulkenberg 14
Kobayashi 13
di Resta 7
Ricciardo 6
Senna 2


WCC:

Mclaren 206
Red Bull 180
Mercedes 128
Lotus 99
Ferrari 91
Williams 43
Sauber 29
Force India 21
Toro Rosso 6


#33 anbeck

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 07:04

WDC standing by "Autosport hotness".
Operationalized by number of posts in the team's car/team discussion thread here on the Forum. A thread change is considered technical infringement and leads to a penalty of the older threads' posts ignored for the final score. (in other words: I couldn't be bothered finding all the threads and do the math).


1. Ferrari 3625
2. Williams 3206
3. Red Bull 3140
4. HRT 1987
5. Caterham 1467
6. Mercedes 1062
7. Lotus 839
8. Sauber 799
8. Force India 226
9. McLaren 539
10. Marussia 427
11. Toro Rosso 93

Congratulations, Williams, to 2nd in the standings! HRT and Caterham also punching above their weight.

Edited by anbeck, 10 August 2012 - 07:04.


#34 Red17

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 08:10

Reprimand in Canada for contact with Senna in practice, fined for pit lane speeding in Malaysia.

I ivoke rule number 3 and challenge your claim.
How can a reprimand that has no pratical effect be the same as an actual penalty that demotes places in the race?.

#35 ATM_Andy

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 08:57

Are you playing the Trumpington's Variations or the Tudor Court Rules?

#36 Red17

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 09:16

Another Outside the Box Championship.
Tho this one is actually important for most teams bar one.

This is the chammpionship where the real mix up goes on. 3 tiers clearly defined, each one very tight.
This is also where the most cheating goes on, 2 teams need to be called to race control.
Please note that I am not accounting for supliers. Also, some teams use the term «partner» for sponsor.
Sponsor Championship, Most Logos.

Lotus - 30 http://www.lotusf1te...-Partners-.html

Sauber - 26 http://www.sauberf1t...rtner/claro.cfm

Williams - 25 http://www.williamsf...m/team/partners

Force India - 19 http://www.forceindiaf1.com/partners

Caterham - 16 http://www.caterhamf1.com/partners

Toro Rosso - 16 Does not have a proper partner page. They are listed on top of their site http://www.scuderiatororosso.com

McLaren - 13 (The main page has supliers and sponsors all mixed up, i have subtracted the number of supliers) http://www.mclaren.com/partners

Marussia - 13 http://www.marussiaf...m.com/partners/

Mercedes - 12 http://www.mercedes-...tegory/partner/

Red Bull - 10 http://www.redbullra...001242811070589

Ferrari - 7 http://www.ferrari.c...s/partners.aspx

HRT - 3 http://www.hrtf1team...patrocinadores/

As it is the table places Lotus alongside most of the midpack at the top. But it should be noted that Caterham and Force India's numbers are suspicous at best.

BUT.... if were to flip the table we would have a surprise winner in HRT beating Ferrari by far!

Edited by Red17, 10 August 2012 - 09:18.


#37 Tiakumosan

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Posted 10 August 2012 - 19:06

Another 1:

10-6-4-3-2-1 points for each race.
4-2-1 points for each quali.

1	 Fernando Alonso	63
2	 Lewis Hamilton		53
3	 Sebastian Vettel	49
4	 Mark Webber		42
5	 Kimi Räikkönen		30
6	 Jenson Button		27
7	 Nico Rosberg		26
8	 Romain Grosjean	23
9	 Pastor Maldonado	15
10	 Sergio Pérez		11
11	 Michael Schumacher	9
12	 Kamui Kobayashi	7
13	 Felipe Massa		4
14	 Nico Hülkenberg	2
15	 Paul di Resta		1
15	 Bruno Senna		1
17	 Jean-Éric Vergne	0
17	 Daniel Ricciardo	0
17	 Heikki Kovalainen	0
17	 Vitaly Petrov		0
17	 Timo Glock		0
17	 Charles Pic		0
17	 Narain Karthikeyan	0
17	 Pedro de la Rosa	0


#38 Jimisgod

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 10:38

Based on Scrabble scoring:

1. Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team = 39
-. Vodafone McLaren Mercedes = 39
3. Sahara Force India F1 Team = 35
4. Caterham F1 Team = 25
5. Williams F1 Team = 23
6. Scuderia Ferrari = 21
7. Marussia F1 Team = 20
-. Scuderia Toro Rosso = 20
9. Red Bull Racing = 19
10. Sauber F1 Team = 18
11. HRT F1 Team = 16
12. Lotus F1 Team = 15



Michael Schumacher = 36
Heikki Kovalainen = 34
Kamui Kobayashi = 32
Narain Karthikeyan = 31
Kimi Räikkönen = 27
Jean-Éric Vergne = 27
Nico Hülkenberg = 26
Romain Grosjean = 24
Mark Webber = 23
Sergio Pérez = 23
Vitaly Petrov = 23
Lewis Hamilton = 21
Jenson Button = 21
Pastor Maldonado = 21
Daniel Ricciardo = 21
Sebastian Vettel = 20
Charles Pic = 19
Fernando Alonso = 18
Felipe Massa = 18
Timo Glock = 18
Pedro de la Rosa = 17
Nico Rosberg = 16
Paul di Resta = 14
Bruno Senna = 12


#39 Jimisgod

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 11:07

Keeping up the Scrabble scoring. Past champions, too:

Alain Prost = 12
Ayrton Senna = 14
Nigel Mansell = 15
Jackie Stewart = 29
Jim Clark = 23
Niki Lauda = 14
Juan Manuel Fangio = 29
Nelson Piquet = 23
Stirling Moss = 15
Jack Brabham = 33
Graham Hill = 19
Damon Hill = 15
Jacques Villeneuve = 41 :rotfl:
Mika Häkkinen = 29
Jody Scheckter = 35
Emerson Fittipaldi = 25
Alberto Ascari = 17
Mario Andretti = 16
Alan Jones = 16
James Hunt = 21
Denny Hulme =19
John Surtees = 21
Jochen Rindt = 24
Nino Farina = 13
Keke Rosberg = 22
Mike Hawthorn = 27
Phil Hill = 16

And non champions:

Mikko Kozarowitzky = 59
Fabrizio Barbazza = 52
Heinz-Harald Frentzen = 47
Jacky Ickx = 38
Clay Regazzoni = 37
Juan Pablo Montoya = 32


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#40 jeze

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Posted 11 August 2012 - 22:46

Qualifying standings

1, Hamilton 155
2, Vettel 145
3, Webber 108
4, Alonso 107
5, Schumacher 103
6, Grosjean 92
7, Rosberg 90
8, Button 82
9, Maldonado 54
10, Räikkönen 48

#41 Buttoneer

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 09:28

It's common knowledge that a beautifully liveried race car is a better race car. If we use the Federal Standard 595 Federal Standard Color Reference System to assign numerical values to the liveries of the 2012 teams, we clearly see that the new, more innovative teams are spending money where it matters--on pretty paint.

[snip]

Rank: Team: Score: Colors:

1 Marussia 22 Grey 7, Fl. Orange 8, Silver 7

2 (t) HRT 15 White 7, Gold 7, Red 1

...
6 RBR 9 Blue 5, Yellow, 3, Red 1

7 Ferrari 8 Red 1, White 7

I like this one, nicely done. Some serious table turning there.


#42 BillBald

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 12:47

It's common knowledge that a beautifully liveried race car is a better race car.


Now we're really getting to the heart of the matter.

Too much yellow kills a team's chances. Look at Renault, when they won the titles they had enough blue to offset the yellow.

Revived liveries from a bygone era are just ridiculous, especially if you take the name of a defunct team.

Too much red is for show-offs.







#43 Frank Tuesday

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 14:23

The most important thing is to beat your teammate. 1 point for each position you finish ahead of your teammate. Max 10 points per event. For DNF, the finishing position is one lower that then last classified finishers. (ie. if the last finisher was 17th, all DNFs get 18 for point calculations) If you finish behind your teammate, you get 0, no negative points.

Alonso: 70
Rosberg: 60
Raikonnen: 52
Hamilton: 48
Perez: 38
Senna: 34
Kobayashi: 25
Webber: 23
Button: 23
Vettel: 20
di Resta: 20
Maldonado: 19
Hulkenberg: 19
Schumacher: 17
Ricciardo: 15
Glock: 15
Grosjean: 14
Kovalainen: 13
Verne: 12
Petrov: 12
Pic: 9
de la Rosa: 9
Karthikeyan: 2
Massa: 0

Constructors

Mercedes: 77
McLaren: 71
Ferrari: 70
Lotus: 66
Sauber: 63
Williams: 53
Red Bull: 43
Force India: 39
Torro Roso: 27
Caterham: 25
Marussia: 24
HRT: 11



#44 Atreiu

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 14:30

Very interesting, but the constructor table makes no sense. A team could have all 1-2s and would stil lose to a team who had all 3-8s...

#45 Red17

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 14:54

WCC ordered by less ownership changes. If teams are tied they are ordered by letters to keep it simple since other tie breakers may have happened in diferent ownerships and eras.

Caterham - No changes in ownership.

Marrusia - No changes in ownership (apparently, ownership continued with Manor Grand Prix).

Williams - No changes of ownership.

Ferrari - 1 change of ownership.

McLaren - 1 change of ownership.

HRT - 2 changes of ownership.

Red Bull - 2 changes of ownership.

Sauber - 2 changes of onwership (yes 2, even if owner number 3 happens to be owner number 1)

Toro Rosso - 2 changes of ownership.

Force India - 3 Changes of ownership.

Lotus - 3 changes of ownership.

Mercedes - 4 changes of ownership.

Edited by Red17, 13 August 2012 - 16:06.


#46 Frank Tuesday

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 15:45

Very interesting, but the constructor table makes no sense. A team could have all 1-2s and would stil lose to a team who had all 3-8s...


Yeah, I agree, but it was easy. How about constructors are ranked by the order (not position) of their top finishing car in each race, using the current point system. eg. In Hungary, Vettel finished 4th, behind Hamilton, and the two Lotus. In this case, McLaren would get 1st (25pts) Lotus second (18pts) and Red Bull third (15 pts)...

Ferrari - 188
Red Bull - 172
McLaren - 170
Lotus - 157
Mercedes - 123
Sauber - 101
Williams - 79
Force India - 74
Torro Roso - 34
Caterham - 11
Marussia - 2
HRT - 0


#47 Frank Tuesday

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 15:53

WCC ordered by less ownership changes. If teams are tied they are ordered by letters to keep it simple since other tie breakers may have happened in diferent ownerships and eras.

Caterham - No changes in ownership.

Marrusia - No changes in ownership (apparently, ownership continued with Manor Grand Prix).

Williams - No changes of ownership.

Ferrari - 1 change of ownership.

McLaren - 1 change of ownership.

HRT - 2 changes of ownership.

Red Bull - 2 changes of ownership.

Sauber - 2 changes of onwership (yes 2, even if owner number 3 happens to be owner number 1)

Toro Rosso - 2 changes of ownership.

Force India - 3 Changes of ownership.

Lotus - 3 changes of ownership.

Mercedes - 3 changes of ownership.


Mercedes should be 4: Mercedes, Brawn, Honda, BAR, Tyrell,




#48 Red17

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Posted 13 August 2012 - 16:08

Mercedes should be 4: Mercedes, Brawn, Honda, BAR, Tyrell,

Ah yes, that is indeed true. I guess I too got bitten by the «Jacques Who?» virus.
Post corrected.

#49 ViMaMo

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 06:59

Based on the summation of finish positions:


 Heikki Kovalainen 172
 Timo Glock 162
 Pedro de la Rosa 161
 Narain Karthikeyan 142
 Vitaly Petrov 134
 Charles Pic 134
 Jean-Éric Vergne 132
 Daniel Ricciardo 132
 Felipe Massa 109
 Nico Hülkenberg 103
 Paul di Resta 97
 Nico Rosberg 87
 Bruno Senna 83
 Pastor Maldonado 78
 Sergio Pérez 75
 Jenson Button 68
 Kimi Räikkönen 60
 Kamui Kobayashi 58
 Mark Webber 56
 Sebastian Vettel 45
 Romain Grosjean 42
 Fernando Alonso 41
 Lewis Hamilton 40
 Michael Schumacher 37

No points for DNF, DNQ, DNS

Edited by ViMaMo, 14 August 2012 - 06:59.


#50 Buttoneer

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Posted 14 August 2012 - 12:17

That might have been a really poo one without the 'no points for DNF etc' decision which turns it into something much more interesting. It makes Schumie look good.