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Lewis Hamilton - Part III


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#1151 Bruce

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:21

I don't recommend Mercedes. I do maintain that they are the same franchise that won the 2009 WDC and WCC. There has been enough continuity for that to be a reasonable statement, in my opinion. How they won it (a controversial rule interpretation) is completely beside the point as far as my point is concerned.


What is NOT beside the point is that Brawn has spent the last 3 seasons languishing in a distant 4th in the championship so it doesn't really matter who they are or how much continuity there is - you're as good as your last result - and Mercedes don't have much to feel pleased about since - well - Brawn. The worst McLaren has done in the same time is 3rd - and that year, Lewis' fans were screaming blue murder at McLaren for not providing him the car they thought he deserved.

Let's keep this on topic - not Brawn, not McL - but Lewis; your argument (correct me if I'm wrong) appears to be that he is clever to be moving to Mercedes because in 2009 they won the WDC and CC under the name of "Brawn" (ignoring the more immediate and telling lacklustre past 3 years). You appear to think that he is better off without McLaren even though they consistently finish 2nd in the CC and give him a shot at the WDC most years.

I get it, if you admit that championships are likely a long way away for Lewis now (not taking this year into consideration) and think that's OK due to the reduced expectations on him and the reduced pressure. What I think you may be failing to take into consideration is that there will be CONSIDERABLE pressure and expectation from within the team. Given what he is costing Mercedes, they will want him to perform. He escapes the pressure cooker of a competitive team to take on the more arduous task (from the perspective of dealing with the team) of the pressure cooker of a less competitive team.

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#1152 Bruce

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:29

This move will be worth it for Lewis as long as he is winning at least a race or two per year. In three years he'll still be in his prime.


That's a big "if". He'd still have been in his prime in 3 years if he stayed with McLaren and he's never failed to win less than 2 races a year with them from the outset - averaging (including this year, unfinished though it is) 3.3 wins per season. Not sure if it's "worth it" if there is a question as to whether he will be able to win next year (there is) and assumption that he won't be able to fight for the WDC next year (assumed). Time will tell though.

#1153 garoidb

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:35

What is NOT beside the point is that Brawn has spent the last 3 seasons languishing in a distant 4th in the championship so it doesn't really matter who they are or how much continuity there is - you're as good as your last result - and Mercedes don't have much to feel pleased about since - well - Brawn. The worst McLaren has done in the same time is 3rd - and that year, Lewis' fans were screaming blue murder at McLaren for not providing him the car they thought he deserved.


It is beside the only point I made, which is that the 2009 WDC and WCC are associated with the team now known as Mercedes. Apart from that, I agree with a lot of what you are saying, and have posted accordingly. Mercedes could work out for Lewis, but McLaren would have been my bet. There is no certainty.

Let's keep this on topic - not Brawn, not McL - but Lewis; your argument (correct me if I'm wrong) appears to be that he is clever to be moving to Mercedes because in 2009 they won the WDC and CC under the name of "Brawn" (ignoring the more immediate and telling lacklustre past 3 years). You appear to think that he is better off without McLaren even though they consistently finish 2nd in the CC and give him a shot at the WDC most years.


No, you have either read far too much into what I said, or are confusing me with another poster. Check out my many posts on this. It is true that I am not as apocalyptic about his move as you seem to be, but it is very risky.

I get it, if you admit that championships are likely a long way away for Lewis now (not taking this year into consideration) and think that's OK due to the reduced expectations on him and the reduced pressure. What I think you may be failing to take into consideration is that there will be CONSIDERABLE pressure and expectation from within the team. Given what he is costing Mercedes, they will want him to perform. He escapes the pressure cooker of a competitive team to take on the more arduous task (from the perspective of dealing with the team) of the pressure cooker of a less competitive team.


I am not sure how he would handle that situation. He can't afford to let distance grow between himself and the team, no matter how tough it gets.

#1154 alframsey

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:40

This move will be worth it for Lewis as long as he is winning at least a race or two per year. In three years he'll still be in his prime.

Where will he go after the three years though? McLaren won't have him back and RBR and Ferrari have their drivers for the foreseeable future, and if Vettel does leave RBR there is no garuntee they will be up there in 3 years time. The current set of regs could just have been around at the right time for them. For this move to be worth it Merc need to come good in 2014 and deliver a challenger, if they don't the move will not have been worth it.

#1155 as65p

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:41

"My argument was, 'if you're looking for a new challenge then frankly the Mercedes team is one'. Thinking the other way round, if Michael Schumacher could not get the Mercedes team - for three years running - up front and you next year are doing much better, this makes a huge impact on your personality and people will rate you much higher than you are rated now.""


That is so Lauda :lol: . I admired him greatly as a driver, and during the horrid years I had to watch german RTL he was like a breath of fresh air most of the time. But as a professional, I wouldn't want him anywhere near me, he just loves to talk too much. I doubt Hamilton will like being portrayed as the sort of vain character that could be persuaded to change teams by promises of fame and legendary status in the future. Even if it's true.

#1156 alframsey

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:44

So Lauda finally reveals the truth behind Hamilton's move!

http://www.superspor...ove_to_Mercedes

Lewis is so insecure that he'll fall for anykind of bullshit...

"My argument was, 'if you're looking for a new challenge then frankly the Mercedes team is one'. Thinking the other way round, if Michael Schumacher could not get the Mercedes team - for three years running - up front and you next year are doing much better, this makes a huge impact on your personality and people will rate you much higher than you are rated now.""

Lewis has been known to take Mclaren on wild goose chases around setup and development and probably one of the reason why they lost their way this season, yet he has it in his mind that he can develop Mercedes into something that Schumacher couldn't.

If schumacher was that bad then they should also sack Rosberg for being equally incompetant!

You have no shame, I thought it was Button who had set up issues this season? And I can never recall Lewis having a prolonged period of set up issues, just the odd race here and there. Even last season he was quick and avoided set up problems, he was just driving not so well unfortunately.

#1157 Seven

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:47

So Lauda finally reveals the truth behind Hamilton's move!

http://www.superspor...ove_to_Mercedes

Lewis is so insecure that he'll fall for anykind of bullshit...

"My argument was, 'if you're looking for a new challenge then frankly the Mercedes team is one'. Thinking the other way round, if Michael Schumacher could not get the Mercedes team - for three years running - up front and you next year are doing much better, this makes a huge impact on your personality and people will rate you much higher than you are rated now.""

Lewis has been known to take Mclaren on wild goose chases around setup and development and probably one of the reason why they lost their way this season, yet he has it in his mind that he can develop Mercedes into something that Schumacher couldn't.

If schumacher was that bad then they should also sack Rosberg for being equally incompetant!



http://en.espnf1.com...tory/81863.html

http://www.yallaf1.c...-mclaren-setup/

http://www.guardian....pean-grand-prix

#1158 whitevisor

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:48

The Pirelli tyres are going to have a broader working range next year so the cars will be even closer. Not to mention we are going to see the real results of Costa, Bell, Elliot, Willis on the new car. I have no worries about Hamilton fighting for the championship next year. All these nay-sayer looking on "incomplete" statistics when its obvious that a new page will be turned for Merc next year.

Brawn always takes a few years to reap the fruits. Check it out:

TD Benetton 1991 >>>> 1994 WDC, 1995 WDC, WCC
Joined Ferrari in late 1996 >>> WCC 1999......up to 2004 WDC, WCC
TP of Honda in late 2007>>>>2009, WCC, WDC
TP Mecedes in 2010>>>> 2013???

So Brawn takes about 3 years to build winning teams. Hamilton has clever timing.

Edited by whitevisor, 30 September 2012 - 21:49.


#1159 alframsey

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 21:58

The Pirelli tyres are going to have a broader working range next year so the cars will be even closer. Not to mention we are going to see the real results of Costa, Bell, Elliot, Willis on the new car. I have no worries about Hamilton fighting for the championship next year. All these nay-sayer looking on "incomplete" statistics when its obvious that a new page will be turned for Merc next year.

Brawn always takes a few years to reap the fruits. Check it out:

TD Benetton 1991 >>>> 1994 WDC, 1995 WDC, WCC
Joined Ferrari in late 1996 >>> WCC 1999......up to 2004 WDC, WCC
TP of Honda in late 2007>>>>2009, WCC, WDC
TP Mecedes in 2010>>>> 2013???

So Brawn takes about 3 years to build winning teams. Hamilton has clever timing.

I see you point but Brawn hasn't been the one 'building' the teams until now, he has just been part of the team being built by somebody else.

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#1160 BigCHrome

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:03

OK - Fair enough - you want to credit Brawn's victories (based largely upon the rear diffuser which had NOTHING to do with Mercedes and EVERYTHING to do with Honda and Toyota), feel free - It actually makes the situation worse (from a Mercedes perspective). They have one WDC and one CC since 2009 - more than McLaren. However, since their SINGLE year of success, they have sunk into 4th place obscurity. If you really want to recommend Mercedes based upon a single success they had which was based upon a one off technical wheeze appropriated from another team, and somehow infer that therefore, this team is a world beater where McLaren, with all it's second places and multiple wins is not, then - well - good luck to you. I'll look forward to your excuses next year. And the next. And the next...


I'm crediting Brawn's victories to Ross Brawn and the rest of the their factory. A lot of the people responsible for that are still employed there. Also a their down years had a lot to do with them having to follow the RRA to a T, which other teams did not follow. Which is why they've been on a hiring spree since 2011 in order to get to the same level as the other top teams.

Mercedes is nothing, all they do is provide the money for the operation and have their colors on the car.

I have it looks to me like a pointless diversion ... I was hoping you could explain


He's trying to save face on his completely flawed point.

Edited by BigCHrome, 30 September 2012 - 22:08.


#1161 jjcale

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:25

That is so Lauda :lol: . I admired him greatly as a driver, and during the horrid years I had to watch german RTL he was like a breath of fresh air most of the time. But as a professional, I wouldn't want him anywhere near me, he just loves to talk too much. I doubt Hamilton will like being portrayed as the sort of vain character that could be persuaded to change teams by promises of fame and legendary status in the future. Even if it's true.


This is one of the most noble motivations known to man .... What do you think made Scott go to the pole or Hilary to the peak of the world or Columbus cross the Atlantic?

Is this not a better motivation than seeking after filthy lucre - or the more prosaic "seeking a new challenge" ... ie boredom in the current role. That is for mid level office workers?



#1162 bub

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:29

Yep, he's been doing great so far.... :lol:



The Pirelli tyres are going to have a broader working range next year so the cars will be even closer. Not to mention we are going to see the real results of Costa, Bell, Elliot, Willis on the new car. I have no worries about Hamilton fighting for the championship next year. All these nay-sayer looking on "incomplete" statistics when its obvious that a new page will be turned for Merc next year.

Brawn always takes a few years to reap the fruits. Check it out:

TD Benetton 1991 >>>> 1994 WDC, 1995 WDC, WCC
Joined Ferrari in late 1996 >>> WCC 1999......up to 2004 WDC, WCC
TP of Honda in late 2007>>>>2009, WCC, WDC
TP Mecedes in 2010>>>> 2013???

So Brawn takes about 3 years to build winning teams. Hamilton has clever timing.




Hopefully you're right. Would be good for Hamilton, good for Mercedes and good for F1 to have them competing with the others for wins and championships.


#1163 techspeed

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:41

I'm crediting Brawn's victories to Ross Brawn and the rest of the their factory. A lot of the people responsible for that are still employed there.

Except none of the people in charge of the design and development of the BGP 001 are there any more. Car development was done by Honda in Brackley and in Japan, the defunct Super Aguri team at Leafield and by Dome in Japan. The car designers at Brawn were Bigois and Zander, both have now left. I'm sure some of the less senior designers are still there, but they never had a big part in the BGP 001.
Now if you believe that the BGP 001 was all down to Ross Brawn, how come Ross hasn't managed to repeat his success since then.

#1164 BigCHrome

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:46

Except none of the people in charge of the design and development of the BGP 001 are there any more. Car development was done by Honda in Brackley and in Japan, the defunct Super Aguri team at Leafield and by Dome in Japan. The car designers at Brawn were Bigois and Zander, both have now left. I'm sure some of the less senior designers are still there, but they never had a big part in the BGP 001.
Now if you believe that the BGP 001 was all down to Ross Brawn, how come Ross hasn't managed to repeat his success since then.


Most of the car development was done in Brackley. There are over 200 people working there. There's more to building a successful car than just the big names.

#1165 glorius&victorius

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 22:49

who is next?

LH split with Anthony to be his own man
LH split with McLaren to be his own man
LH splits with Nicole to become a man?? :p

#1166 Coral

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 23:14

who is next?

LH split with Anthony to be his own man
LH split with McLaren to be his own man
LH splits with Nicole to become a man?? :p

:rotfl:

Let's hope so! :p

#1167 zack1994

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 23:21

Its amazing how things change in formula 1, who would have thought lewis would leave mclaren one day. BTW not a dig at lewis just i suppose a little sad it didn't turn out the way some people thought it would.
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#1168 BillBald

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 23:40

The Pirelli tyres are going to have a broader working range next year so the cars will be even closer.


I'm not sure where you get that from.

It's because the tyres have been so difficult to work with that we had some rather random and surprising results this year, including the Merc win in China.

If the tyres become less of a factor, it will be the teams with better aero who come to the fore again.



#1169 weareracing

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 23:43

Lewis is an exceptional talent.
Having been privileged enough to watch him leave the field struggling in the horrendous conditions at Silverstone 2008, it was akin to having seen Senna's 1st race win in Portugal.
Lewis WAS magic that day and, that drive (as much as any other) was the key to the 2008WDC.
Take the mickey regarding his lifestyle choices, his sense of fashion, EVEN his choice of partners and friends, BUT...............
on track Lewis is a fearsome competitor and one of the top 3 drivers on the grid today.
McLaren's loss is Mercedes' gain.
I hope that Lewis is given a car to showcase his talents, this is the BIGGEST doubt in my mind.
Current Mercedes drivers have done everything asked of them, the MGP01, 02 AND 03.....have been woefully inadequate :down:


#1170 Kvothe

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Posted 30 September 2012 - 23:52

Isn't Lewis' lucky number supposed to be 4?

Next years car is the MGP04....BAM WDC 2013 you heard it here first!

Edited by Kvothe, 30 September 2012 - 23:53.


#1171 pinkypants

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 00:54

http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be

): ):

#1172 Bruce

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:30

No, you have either read far too much into what I said, or are confusing me with another poster.


Sorry - I do indeed think I was "crossing my wires".... :wave:


#1173 Bruce

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:42

I'm still amazed that people perceive a move to the 4th best team (a distant 5th this year) is in some way now "being on the right tack". As to his ability, I think he may be in for a tough time. Lewis is at his best at the front... (most drivers are) where there are no distractions and you can simply flog the car for all it's worth. Where Lewis has tended to get into trouble is the close quarters racing a little further back toward the mid-field. He has an amazing facility to pass and make progress, but we have also seen that at times he tries too hard and overdrives, leading to contact... and, in the past, this has seemed to occur more often than not when he is further down the grid...

Same is true for any driver really - harder to race in the pack than out front, yeah? I think he's going to shine a couple of times next year - but he's also going to have a tough row to hoe.

Edited by Mandzipop, 01 October 2012 - 12:35.
Quoting a deleted post


#1174 light

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:54

I'm still amazed that people perceive a move to the 4th best team (a distant 5th this year) is in some way now "being on the right tack". As to his ability, I think he may be in for a tough time. Lewis is at his best at the front... (most drivers are) where there are no distractions and you can simply flog the car for all it's worth. Where Lewis has tended to get into trouble is the close quarters racing a little further back toward the mid-field. He has an amazing facility to pass and make progress, but we have also seen that at times he tries too hard and overdrives, leading to contact... and, in the past, this has seemed to occur more often than not when he is further down the grid...

Same is true for any driver really - harder to race in the pack than out front, yeah? I think he's going to shine a couple of times next year - but he's also going to have a tough row to hoe.

i hear you mate and its true that moving away from mclaren is certainly a questionable act......but what about the power of freedom?
every man has to learn to do things on their own and thats exactly what he is doing now. maybe you'll think i'm crazy but i really believe that mercedes have what is necessary to unlock the potential in Hamilton.
And yes i can not disagree about Lewis losing that composure from time to time but before monaco11 they were mostly just blips and would occur towards the end of a season.
We have all seen what he is capable of and he is still a young man at the age of 27......i think the real journey is just begining for this brilliant talent.

#1175 TurboF1

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:57

http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be

): ):



I gotta say, watching that video brings me back to a time of such utter promise at McLaren. Since then, to watch them lose the best 2 drivers of recent times with only one WDC to show for it is pretty poor form for McLaren. So much hope, So much disappointment. Hopefully they end the year on a high with both championships at least.


:( :mad:

#1176 wrexter

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 02:51

Hopefully he can take the Number 1 on the car to Mercedes next year

#1177 justin14100

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 03:13

I gotta say, watching that video brings me back to a time of such utter promise at McLaren. Since then, to watch them lose the best 2 drivers of recent times with only one WDC to show for it is pretty poor form for McLaren. So much hope, So much disappointment. Hopefully they end the year on a high with both championships at least.


:( :mad:

Its amazing to see how much I think McLaren lost out without Alonso there, it seemed like such a dream team - he seemed to excited to be there. The rest is history now though, 2007 and 2008 where some of the best years of F1 (and I'm not a Lewis fan by any means) He he adds excitement to the sport. He'll perform regardless of the car next year - dont doubt it!

#1178 light

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 03:18

2007 and 2008 where some of the best years of F1

yes they were and it will never be forgotten.

#1179 as65p

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 05:53

This is one of the most noble motivations known to man .... What do you think made Scott go to the pole or Hilary to the peak of the world or Columbus cross the Atlantic?

Is this not a better motivation than seeking after filthy lucre - or the more prosaic "seeking a new challenge" ... ie boredom in the current role. That is for mid level office workers?


I firmly believe you get fame and legendary status by aiming for the 'more prosaic' stuff like winning races and championships. Not the other way round.

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#1180 Lazy

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 06:00

This is one of the most noble motivations known to man .... What do you think made Scott go to the pole or Hilary to the peak of the world or Columbus cross the Atlantic?

Is this not a better motivation than seeking after filthy lucre - or the more prosaic "seeking a new challenge" ... ie boredom in the current role. That is for mid level office workers?


Have to disagree with that, only the insecure seek fame and fortune. Which is why the ruling classes are a bunch of nutters.

#1181 Lazy

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 06:05

I firmly believe you get fame and legendary status by aiming for the 'more prosaic' stuff like winning races and championships. Not the other way round.


Exactly, do what you do and do it well. If fame comes because of it, that's an unfortunate side effect you have to deal with.

#1182 pinkypants

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 06:43

I firmly believe you get fame and legendary status by aiming for the 'more prosaic' stuff like winning races and championships. Not the other way round.



Agreed - and all Lewis wants to do is win races and championships :)

#1183 undersquare

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 06:57

Where will he go after the three years though? McLaren won't have him back and RBR and Ferrari have their drivers for the foreseeable future, and if Vettel does leave RBR there is no garuntee they will be up there in 3 years time. The current set of regs could just have been around at the right time for them. For this move to be worth it Merc need to come good in 2014 and deliver a challenger, if they don't the move will not have been worth it.

Mac would have him back, why not? And back on a better basis with more respect. Brawn has focussed on listening to him as part of the draw at Mercedes, and while he's away McLaren will learn to see him the same way.

#1184 Number62

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 07:49

Exactly, do what you do and do it well. If fame comes because of it, that's an unfortunate side effect you have to deal with.


I think you underestimate human motivations and especially elite athlete motivations.

Why is the podium SO important? Why not 4th place. What about this; " it's great to be on the podium but I wanted to be on the top step"

Was there ever a more graphic representation of display of ranking.

Wanting to be known as the best is very different from wanting to be the best known.

#1185 as65p

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 08:12

Agreed - and all Lewis wants to do is win races and championships :)


Which is not was Laudas words indicate, instead he claims to have lured Hamilton with promises of enhanced status by doing better than the great MS.

Besides, I don't pretend to know what LH really wants, but there is no way around the fact that if it were race wins and championships, he made an odd choice, at this point in time. There might be valid reasons for his choice, which he must value more than race wins and championships right now. Which sort of disproves your claim that all he wants is race wins and championships.

#1186 jjcale

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 08:17

Have to disagree with that, only the insecure seek fame and fortune. Which is why the ruling classes are a bunch of nutters.


Notice I described it as a "noble" motivation ... so you are agreeing with me. .... and IMO you have to slightly unbalanced to be really successful - almost by definition.

@as65p = the motivation is what makes people get up at 5 everymorning to train to do the prosaic stuff.... So it comes first before success.... The Motivation is no guarantee of success but it was a necessay prerequsite. F1 more than any other sport is about gaining legendary status. People used to die doing this ... they were not risking all to make up another place or even to win the race... they wanted to be heroes.... death was not just a risk to be avoided it was actually an enabler ... like in war.

@pinkypants - when I say "fame and fortune" I dont mean celebrity in the way we understand it today...I am not thinking Cheryl Cole.... I am thinking Christopher Columbus.

I know that this is grandioise but I do think that deep down this is how LH's mind works (even if he himself does not realise this) - it is why as a nine year old he had the bottle to tell Ron he was going to drive for him one day... and mean it. And that's what got this whole ball rolling (with all due respect to Anthony's three jobs and LH's Kadet series titles).



#1187 as65p

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 08:38

@as65p = the motivation is what makes people get up at 5 everymorning to train to do the prosaic stuff.... So it comes first before success.... The Motivation is no guarantee of success but it was a necessay prerequsite. F1 more than any other sport is about gaining legendary status. People used to die doing this ... they were not risking all to make up another place or even to win the race... they wanted to be heroes.... death was not just a risk to be avoided it was actually an enabler ... like in war.


I think what you describe is the fans view (mine too, roughly). I still maintain that for a pro it's the wrong approach to go for glory over results. If you look closer at 'heros' of all kind, more often than not they were very pragmatic, un-glamorous characters with their eyes only on the prize and nothing else. Take Jim Clark, for example. Or Senna in 1993 - he must have felt that his driving genius was probably recognized more than any time before, yet still he basically looked pi**ed all year for not being able to seriously trouble Prost in the championship.

#1188 Kingshark

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:02

Lewis Hamilton fans, not to disappoint you, but you really have to lower your expectations on the final 6 races. It seems that so many on this thread believe that Lewis can easily win every race for the remainder of the season. However, what you should realize is that only twice in the history of the sport has a driver actually won 6 races consecutively, right? Ascari in 1952 and Schumacher in 2004, hell, even Vettel last season never won more than 3 times in a row. How about Lewis? He's never won more than twice in a row.

I'm certainly not counting Lewis out of the championship yet, but I want to pump some reasonability back in into this topic.

#1189 maverick69

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:12

Lewis Hamilton fans, not to disappoint you, but you really have to lower your expectations on the final 6 races. It seems that so many on this thread believe that Lewis can easily win every race for the remainder of the season. However, what you should realize is that only twice in the history of the sport has a driver actually won 6 races consecutively, right? Ascari in 1952 and Schumacher in 2004, hell, even Vettel last season never won more than 3 times in a row. How about Lewis? He's never won more than twice in a row.

I'm certainly not counting Lewis out of the championship yet, but I want to pump some reasonability back in into this topic.


Like who?


#1190 Kingshark

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:18

Sorry, not this thread, can easily get confused by the countless Hamilton-related threads on this board. But I swear I read some people write that how if Mclaren were to iron out their mistakes, Lewis would win the next 6 races easily. I call bogus on that.

#1191 Raziel

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:20

Ok guys, let us be reasonable here. Ask Horner or Domenicali, two chiefs from two big rival teams only few questions:

What do you fear most? Lewis Hamilton at McLaren or Lewis Hamilton at Mercedes? Which combo would be stronger and more dangerous against your teams for the championship titles?

I think you got your answer!  ;)

Ask Alonso and Vettel these same questions and you'll get your answer.

There is only one thing clear, all these people at Ferrari & Red Bull are really happy right now! They are biggest winners in this story!

#1192 pinkypants

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:52

Brawn admitted it was "pleasant" that Hamilton just wanted the same chances as the German driver when he joins next year.

"Lewis never asked for any priority at all, he just asked for equality," Brawn told AUTOSPORT.

"He was pleasant in that he had no desires to have any special treatment or any unique facilities. Lewis just expects to have an equal opportunity in the team, as we would like to do as well.

"The conversation was relatively short in that area and I was impressed that he was positive enough to take that view and not attempt to protect some sort of position which would have been quite difficult for the team to accept.

"We never got into a discussion because Lewis didn't raise it. And if he had raised it, we probably wouldn't have wanted to do it."

Brawn reckons there will be no frictions between Rosberg and Hamilton, who remain friends having been team-mates when they raced in karting.

"They are good ex-colleagues and friends and I know that they travel to races together often," Brawn added.

"I don't expect them to have any issues at all. I've kept Nico informed as things have progressed and he is quite excited actually to have Lewis joining the team.

"I see that as a positive. We'll have the normal drivers trying to beat each other issues and that's what they have to be because we don't want a driver who doesn't want to beat his team-mate. But it is important that it's done in the right way. I think that will be a very good combination."

The team boss has little doubt that Hamilton will adapt to life at Mercedes, despite having spent his entire Formula 1 career at McLaren.

"I'm sure he's had a great deal of support at McLaren but you never know until you start working with anyone really," said Brawn when asked if Mercedes could bring the best out of Hamilton.

"We have our views on how we should approach things and it seems to align with Lewis's views of how he'd like to approach things and I'm optimistic that it's going to be a strong team, not just with me but the rest of the company."


http://www.autosport...t.php/id/102991

#1193 maverick69

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:52

Sorry, not this thread, can easily get confused by the countless Hamilton-related threads on this board. But I swear I read some people write that how if Mclaren were to iron out their mistakes, Lewis would win the next 6 races easily. I call bogus on that.


Maybe one or two across the message board then. A significant minority. So I don't really get the relevance of your post........

#1194 royalblue0

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:59

Brawn admitted it was "pleasant" that Hamilton just wanted the same chances as the German driver when he joins next year.

"Lewis never asked for any priority at all, he just asked for equality," Brawn told AUTOSPORT.

"He was pleasant in that he had no desires to have any special treatment or any unique facilities. Lewis just expects to have an equal opportunity in the team, as we would like to do as well.

"The conversation was relatively short in that area and I was impressed that he was positive enough to take that view and not attempt to protect some sort of position which would have been quite difficult for the team to accept.

"We never got into a discussion because Lewis didn't raise it. And if he had raised it, we probably wouldn't have wanted to do it."

Brawn reckons there will be no frictions between Rosberg and Hamilton, who remain friends having been team-mates when they raced in karting.

"They are good ex-colleagues and friends and I know that they travel to races together often," Brawn added.

"I don't expect them to have any issues at all. I've kept Nico informed as things have progressed and he is quite excited actually to have Lewis joining the team.

"I see that as a positive. We'll have the normal drivers trying to beat each other issues and that's what they have to be because we don't want a driver who doesn't want to beat his team-mate. But it is important that it's done in the right way. I think that will be a very good combination."

The team boss has little doubt that Hamilton will adapt to life at Mercedes, despite having spent his entire Formula 1 career at McLaren.

"I'm sure he's had a great deal of support at McLaren but you never know until you start working with anyone really," said Brawn when asked if Mercedes could bring the best out of Hamilton.

"We have our views on how we should approach things and it seems to align with Lewis's views of how he'd like to approach things and I'm optimistic that it's going to be a strong team, not just with me but the rest of the company."


http://www.autosport...t.php/id/102991



Oh dear. how disappointing for those who might have thought Lewis stormed in demanding No 1 status :)


#1195 maverick69

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:59

Ok guys, let us be reasonable here. Ask Horner or Domenicali, two chiefs from two big rival teams only few questions:

What do you fear most? Lewis Hamilton at McLaren or Lewis Hamilton at Mercedes? Which combo would be stronger and more dangerous against your teams for the championship titles?

I think you got your answer! ;)

Ask Alonso and Vettel these same questions and you'll get your answer.

There is only one thing clear, all these people at Ferrari & Red Bull are really happy right now! They are biggest winners in this story!


That would hardly be a revelation though would it?

Car wise, as a Hamilton fan, I'd prefer him in a McLaren all day long.

But he has made is move to see if he can get that big tick of winning with a "lesser team" and/or outside the bussom of McLaren..... just what a lot of people on here and in the media have been asking for since he entered the sport.......

Edited by maverick69, 01 October 2012 - 11:02.


#1196 jeze

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:53

Lewis Hamilton fans, not to disappoint you, but you really have to lower your expectations on the final 6 races. It seems that so many on this thread believe that Lewis can easily win every race for the remainder of the season. However, what you should realize is that only twice in the history of the sport has a driver actually won 6 races consecutively, right? Ascari in 1952 and Schumacher in 2004, hell, even Vettel last season never won more than 3 times in a row. How about Lewis? He's never won more than twice in a row.

I'm certainly not counting Lewis out of the championship yet, but I want to pump some reasonability back in into this topic.

Schumacher won five in 2004. However, in between Monza 2000 and Sepang 2001 he took six consecutive pole-victories.




#1197 pinkypants

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:02

Winners and Loser's of his move:

http://www1.skysport...ners-And-Losers

#1198 bauss

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:18

Ok guys, let us be reasonable here. Ask Horner or Domenicali, two chiefs from two big rival teams only few questions:

What do you fear most? Lewis Hamilton at McLaren or Lewis Hamilton at Mercedes? Which combo would be stronger and more dangerous against your teams for the championship titles?

I think you got your answer! ;)

Ask Alonso and Vettel these same questions and you'll get your answer.

There is only one thing clear, all these people at Ferrari & Red Bull are really happy right now! They are biggest winners in this story!


actually IMO it depends on the car, yes McLaren atm are more likely to build a quick car but I tend to think a team under Brawn's helm won't have wasted a quick car with so many mistakes
like the one under MW's helm has done this year.

#1199 Clatter

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:25

actually IMO it depends on the car, yes McLaren atm are more likely to build a quick car but I tend to think a team under Brawn's helm won't have wasted a quick car with so many mistakes
like the one under MW's helm has done this year.


Have you not noticed the mistakes Merc have made?

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#1200 robefc

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:51

Winners and Loser's of his move:

http://www1.skysport...ners-And-Losers


Is Pete Gill writing for Sky now or are they just lifting off PF1?

Regardless I think his summary under 'Lewis the F1 driver' is pretty spot on.

Biggest undisputable winner incidentally -Perez.