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Vettel off to Ferrari in 2014?


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Poll: Vettel off to Ferrari in 2014? (518 member(s) have cast votes)

Do you think Vettel is heading to Ferrari in 2014?

  1. Yes, he's going (162 votes [31.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.33%

  2. No, he's staying (196 votes [37.91%])

    Percentage of vote: 37.91%

  3. Not enough information to form an opinion either way (159 votes [30.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.75%

If he did move to Ferrar would it be the right choice?

  1. Yes (175 votes [33.85%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.85%

  2. No (259 votes [50.10%])

    Percentage of vote: 50.10%

  3. I don't have enough information to form an opinion either way (83 votes [16.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.05%

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#401 Wheels23

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:36

What's really going to happen is this.

Vettel goes to Ferrari and then is loved by Ferrari but Alonso won't have it. "How dare the Italian crowd cheat on me with that one finger person" but luckily Alonso puts that behind him and makes sure that the team gets Vettel to "Sweep the leg" of Lewis. "But Vettel was all like "But I'll be disqualified" as Luca stared at him "Do you have a problem with that?" Then Vettel looks shocked and surprised "No sensei"

However at Red Bull Webber was retained signing "I'm Canberra Milk Kid" until the wore plugs to avoid listening to his awful signing. Red Bull decided to sign Felipe Massa to get the secrets at Ferrari. So they sent Felipe to a mission to collect the data Mission Impossible style with Ricciardo helping him. It went well until they found out it was the fake data to get Felipe to steal it. :o

Back at McLaren, Button smiled and Perez smiled. At Mercedes well they weren't doing much except Nico and Lewis were sneaking into Monaco's fashion gala to be at the top but the car was stating "Woof Woof" and they couldn't go anywhere.

In the end nothing happened and Ferrari lost the championship to Felipe's new Red Bull team even though Mark Webber won the championship. Perez won a race all because Narain's HRT decided to die and just block Vettel on a chicane near the finishing line.

Kimi drank and that's about it



Seriously though I have no idea what I just typed. I really don't think that Vettel will go to Ferrari. Not because of the Fernando thing but why would Vettel leave Red Bull. If Mark didn't...why would Seb?

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#402 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:36

Teams don't always have the ability to stop drivers leaving, as we have recently seen. If money is the dealbreaker, then yes, they can fix that. If he just wants a new challenge, or to work with an engine manufacturer, or simply the prestige of driving for Ferrari, then what can they do?


Since RBR pay Newey so much I doubt they'd want to raise Vettel's salary to Alonso-esque levels.


I certainly hope he comes, we really need him.



#403 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:43

What's really going to happen is this.

Vettel goes to Ferrari and then is loved by Ferrari but Alonso won't have it. "How dare the Italian crowd cheat on me with that one finger person" but luckily Alonso puts that behind him and makes sure that the team gets Vettel to "Sweep the leg" of Lewis. "But Vettel was all like "But I'll be disqualified" as Luca stared at him "Do you have a problem with that?" Then Vettel looks shocked and surprised "No sensei"

However at Red Bull Webber was retained signing "I'm Canberra Milk Kid" until the wore plugs to avoid listening to his awful signing. Red Bull decided to sign Felipe Massa to get the secrets at Ferrari. So they sent Felipe to a mission to collect the data Mission Impossible style with Ricciardo helping him. It went well until they found out it was the fake data to get Felipe to steal it. :o

Back at McLaren, Button smiled and Perez smiled. At Mercedes well they weren't doing much except Nico and Lewis were sneaking into Monaco's fashion gala to be at the top but the car was stating "Woof Woof" and they couldn't go anywhere.

In the end nothing happened and Ferrari lost the championship to Felipe's new Red Bull team even though Mark Webber won the championship. Perez won a race all because Narain's HRT decided to die and just block Vettel on a chicane near the finishing line.

Kimi drank and that's about it


Seriously though I have no idea what I just typed. I really don't think that Vettel will go to Ferrari. Not because of the Fernando thing but why would Vettel leave Red Bull. If Mark didn't...why would Seb?


:lol: :lol: :lol: about your 2014 season preview

Ferrari didn't exactly offer Webber $20 million per season for three years... They arguably offered $5-6 million for one year. There's a big difference between what Phillip Morris would pay for the 'new Schumacher' and for a 36-year old Australian #2 driver...

Also if Alonso wins the title this year Ferrari might respect his opinion, but if he loses it to Vettel again I think enough is enough and Ferrari will ignore his opinion even if he says he doesn't want Vettel as team mate... Then there is always the question about what the 2013 clause in Vettel's contract really means, will Ferrari buy him out if necessary or just wait until 2015? Five consecutive Vettel/RBR titles would be a disaster to Alonso's reputation, so if Vettel wins this year he'd probably rather give it a straight go against him.

But then again, Allen, Allevi and Buxton have all said that Vettel is coming so one can only hope. I'm so tired of those ugly yellow nosed-cars winning.

Edited by jeze, 06 October 2012 - 14:44.


#404 garoidb

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:43

Since RBR pay Newey so much I doubt they'd want to raise Vettel's salary to Alonso-esque levels.


I certainly hope he comes, we really need him.


Vettel and Alonso at Ferrari would be mouth watering, I agree.

#405 garoidb

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:46

If Webber turned down a deal with Ferrari this year because he wanted two years... why would they offer him that for 2014 when the four years younger Button is out of contract? :eek: Not forgetting Rosberg either obviously.


Are you sure Button is out of contract for 2014? They were quite vague about how long the contract was when it was announced.

Also, now that Lewis is leaving, Jenson has a great chance to be team leader at McLaren and compete for another WDC. Why would he leave?

#406 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 14:51

Are you sure Button is out of contract for 2014? They were quite vague about how long the contract was when it was announced.

Also, now that Lewis is leaving, Jenson has a great chance to be team leader at McLaren and compete for another WDC. Why would he leave?


I don't think Button is certain to leave even if offered a deal, but at the end of the day, even for a British driver it'd be something to drive for Ferrari. I think his contract ends at the end of 2013 with performance-related clauses there too from what I'd suspect. But Jenson would very much be a plan B, and even if Vettel would be locked into a 2014 RBR contract he'd still be free to go wherever he wanted for 2015 which would suit Ferrari too. I'd say it's Hülkenberg or Massa next year, with a chance for that driver to stay on for 2014 if Vettel's not available for some reason. Gut feeling says it's Hülkenberg, they'd announced Massa if it wasn't IMHO.




#407 garoidb

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 15:05

I don't think Button is certain to leave even if offered a deal, but at the end of the day, even for a British driver it'd be something to drive for Ferrari. I think his contract ends at the end of 2013 with performance-related clauses there too from what I'd suspect. But Jenson would very much be a plan B, and even if Vettel would be locked into a 2014 RBR contract he'd still be free to go wherever he wanted for 2015 which would suit Ferrari too. I'd say it's Hülkenberg or Massa next year, with a chance for that driver to stay on for 2014 if Vettel's not available for some reason. Gut feeling says it's Hülkenberg, they'd announced Massa if it wasn't IMHO.


Could be Hülkenberg, I agree.

On Button, I would say he cannot believe his luck to have the chance of being team leader at McLaren, getting more victories and having a chance to compete for the WDC (without Lewis having the same machinery). To go to Ferrari, have a less competitive car (probably) and be pitched against Alonso would not make sense.

On a slightly different point, while I somewhat understand Lewis's reasons for leaving McLaren, I don't think Jenson is looking for a chance to build a struggling team around him in the mould of Schumacher. He has tried that, and bears the scars. I am guessing that race wins and WDC opportunities are all that matter to him for the rest of his career, and he could not hope for abetter opportunity than the one in front of him at McLaren.

#408 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 15:10

Could be Hülkenberg, I agree.

On Button, I would say he cannot believe his luck to have the chance of being team leader at McLaren, getting more victories and having a chance to compete for the WDC (without Lewis having the same machinery). To go to Ferrari, have a less competitive car (probably) and be pitched against Alonso would not make sense.

On a slightly different point, while I somewhat understand Lewis's reasons for leaving McLaren, I don't think Jenson is looking for a chance to build a struggling team around him in the mould of Schumacher. He has tried that, and bears the scars. I am guessing that race wins and WDC opportunities are all that matter to him for the rest of his career, and he could not hope for abetter opportunity than the one in front of him at McLaren.


Yeah for Ferrari Button would be the perfect Plan B, but I think he'll be content with defeating Pérez (which I think he will), all the while 2013 is a Vettel/Alonso showdown again if Ferrari get the Toyota windtunnel to work at least.


I don't see any reason for Ferrari to match McLaren's overvaluation of Jenson... but then again, I didn't understand the logic of signing Kimi over Alonso back in 2007 either. At least Vettel would be a logical move - hurt RBR and have the two best drivers in their car.



#409 NotSoSilentBob

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 15:24

If Webber turned down a deal with Ferrari this year because he wanted two years... why would they offer him that for 2014 when the four years younger Button is out of contract? :eek: Not forgetting Rosberg either obviously.


I don't think Webber turned them down because he wants two years, I think Webber turned them down because it would have been suicide for his 2012 chances at the time. At the time, he was a close second in the WDC and ahead of his teammate. As it turns out, he probably should have accepted a move.

However I don't think Webber will be fooled again unless he's the runaway leader of the 2013 WDC, ala Button in 2009. And we know he won't be that, ergo a one year Ferrari deal as Alonso's No 2 whilst driving the new spec of car and engine will be a nice feather in the cap before retirement.

#410 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 15:26

I don't think Webber turned them down because he wants two years, I think Webber turned them down because it would have been suicide for his 2012 chances at the time. At the time, he was a close second in the WDC and ahead of his teammate. As it turns out, he probably should have accepted a move.

However I don't think Webber will be fooled again unless he's the runaway leader of the 2013 WDC, ala Button in 2009. And we know he won't be that, ergo a one year Ferrari deal as Alonso's No 2 whilst driving the new spec of car and engine will be a nice feather in the cap before retirement.

If he was told 'hey... Ferrari are looking to sign Seb anyway. If he goes you'll be out of job for 2014 and we ain't taking you back. Mind... if you stay you might be our #1 driver that season' - that would be a pretty good reason to commit himself to RBR.

I also believe RBR turned down the chance to sign Hamilton due to:

1) He's too expensive.
2) Hamilton's situation was rather urgent (breakdown of relations with team management, he needed a 2013 seat)

That's why he didn't end up there.

Edited by jeze, 06 October 2012 - 15:28.


#411 NotSoSilentBob

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 15:33

for a 36-year old Australian #2 driver...


A 36 year old Australian who's finished 3rd in the WDC twice, and who does EXACTLY what Ferrari crave - deliver regular big points, be fast enough to push the #1, help with setup and development work, and be there to pick up a win or podium when Alonso has an off day. And thus help Ferrari win that pot 'o gold known as the World Constructors Championship instead of helping Red Bull do it.

No, I don't know why they'd crave Webber either.

Edited by NotSoSilentBob, 06 October 2012 - 15:37.


#412 jeze

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 16:48

A 36 year old Australian who's finished 3rd in the WDC twice, and who does EXACTLY what Ferrari crave - deliver regular big points, be fast enough to push the #1, help with setup and development work, and be there to pick up a win or podium when Alonso has an off day. And thus help Ferrari win that pot 'o gold known as the World Constructors Championship instead of helping Red Bull do it.

No, I don't know why they'd crave Webber either.

Webber barely beat Alonso with the RB7 - arguably because of team orders in the final race, so I struggle to see the point in Ferrari chasing him with big-money offers.

Edited by jeze, 06 October 2012 - 17:03.


#413 WatchingF1since4yearsold

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Posted 06 October 2012 - 17:23

if the Vettel rumours are true, then I can see Button going to Red Bull in 2014, Horner is clearly a fan of JB and Red Bull are good at making the car to a good setup, with Button that could be a good partnership, especially if Button wins the WDC next year (I think he will be a big contender, McLaren driver one and they are likely to have a good car and learn from this years mistakes)

this is all just my speculating of course, but it's food for thought :)



#414 Wheels23

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:08

I don't see Button going anywhere bar McLaren. If Vettel is moving, Mark will stay at Red Bull because they will then have two new drivers which is not always the best thing. It also depends on Ricciardo or Vegene cause they could be the next drivers. So their likely 2013 performance could be very important.

#415 emby1999

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:22

A 36 year old Australian who's finished 3rd in the WDC twice, and who does EXACTLY what Ferrari crave - deliver regular big points, be fast enough to push the #1, help with setup and development work, and be there to pick up a win or podium when Alonso has an off day. And thus help Ferrari win that pot 'o gold known as the World Constructors Championship instead of helping Red Bull do it.

No, I don't know why they'd crave Webber either.


They already have a driver who has finished 2nd in the WDC. Webber will not be finishing anywhere near the podium in the cars Ferrari have been delivering in the last few years. Webber has been flattered by driving the fastest car since 2009, and everyone including him would be in a rude shock once he got dropped into a F2012, and the car is no longer super glued to the track.

Edited by emby1999, 07 October 2012 - 02:29.


#416 Wiggy

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 04:19

I can't fathom why vettel would choose to leave redbull to go to Ferrari next to Alonso...

Seems none of the quick guys enjoy having quick cars.

#417 jeze

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 13:33

We need this guy. Tired of racing against him.

Please Luca make it happen!



#418 jeze

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 13:34

I can't fathom why vettel would choose to leave redbull to go to Ferrari next to Alonso...

Seems none of the quick guys enjoy having quick cars.


Vettel has such high confidence in his ability that he's dubbed the Ferrari the best car... so you'd have to ask him how he came to the conclusion. Kimi's widows and Sebastian Vettel are the only ones with that opinion in the whole wide world :smoking:




#419 Jackmancer

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 13:39

I can't fathom why vettel would choose to leave redbull to go to Ferrari next to Alonso...



Same... As long as Red Bull is beating Ferrari, why leave? Ferrari also seems solid 'Alonso territory', I can't see the two team up. That's why I'm still gutted Ferrari let Perez go. I just don't think Vettel will go to Maranello.

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#420 jeze

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 13:45

Same... As long as Red Bull is beating Ferrari, why leave? Ferrari also seems solid 'Alonso territory', I can't see the two team up. That's why I'm still gutted Ferrari let Perez go. I just don't think Vettel will go to Maranello.


Benetton used to beat Ferrari in 1994 and 1995 too eh ;)

As long as the victory margin is relatively margin Vettel may feel HE is the difference rather than the car. If so he might feel he can beat Alonso and get a bigger paycheck while at it.

Whether his self-confidence is compatible with reality if ever faced with Alonso is a completely different matter.

All I know is that if Vettel beat Alonso at Ferrari and won the title there, he'd go down as possibly the best driver in history. If it was the other way round, Alonso would have such a glory.

Since Ferrari will give him a bigger pay check and he's already secured his legacy as a multiple WDC I fail to see why he shouldn't take that punt. If he wants to end the popular notion that Alonso is the best driver around, it'd be a perfect ego boost to come into Fernando's team trying to beat him. Also, a title won in a Ferrari is like winning two titles in another car in terms of legacy - unless you are Ayrton Senna. There's no question whether he will be a Ferrari driver some day, the question is: 2014 or 2017?

Post-Schumacher, Ferrari now have the financial resources and the prestige to sign a driver whether they want.

They wanted Kimi Räikkönen for 2007, they made sure they got him.

They wanted Fernando Alonso for 2010, they made sure they got him too, even buying out Kimi's contract.

They didn't want Lewis Hamilton for 2013, so they didn't sign him - which forced Hamilton to sign for a midfield team since he was desperate to leave McLaren. The tiny difference with Vettel to those guys is that he wins titles. But since they signed Schumacher, it couldn't be ruled out. If Ferrari feel they can't offer Alonso a car with which to beat Vettel with they might as well want to eliminate that threat. And if Vettel arrived as a 4x WDC with Alonso having won 2 times... that would eradicate Alonso's power quickly. Be sure of that. The prime medicine for a team that designs poor cars is a great driver. I've given up on our technical team so that's why I'm desperate to have Vettel at the team. Unless the car's a real dog Fernando is P2 or P3 every year anyway.

I'm sceptical for this to happen, since I've been brainwashed by all the Ferrari #1-driver people and by the notion that Ferrari rarely do the right thing. Since Luca took over the show we've won jack sh*t.

Edited by jeze, 07 October 2012 - 13:54.


#421 garoidb

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 14:07

Benetton used to beat Ferrari in 1994 and 1995 too eh ;)

As long as the victory margin is relatively margin Vettel may feel HE is the difference rather than the car. If so he might feel he can beat Alonso and get a bigger paycheck while at it.


I think Schumacher had a (much) bigger gap to his main driving cometition in the mid 1990s than anyone enjoys today. Vettel is very good, and might even be better than Alonso (we don't know yet), but this is not the same situation Schumacher was in.

Whether his self-confidence is compatible with reality if ever faced with Alonso is a completely different matter.


There could be big trouble within the team. If I were running Ferrari, I would say, if we take Vettel then let Alonso go.

All I know is that if Vettel beat Alonso at Ferrari and won the title there, he'd go down as possibly the best driver in history. If it was the other way round, Alonso would have such a glory.


It would be great entertainment for us, but unless it was very conclusive there would always be arguments.

If Ferrari feel they can't offer Alonso a car with which to beat Vettel with they might as well want to eliminate that threat.


Good point, actually. Red Bull would be seriously weakened.

And if Vettel arrived as a 4x WDC with Alonso having won 2 times... that would eradicate Alonso's power quickly. Be sure of that.


Also true. However, we don't know whether Vettel would be able to beat Alonso. If not, then it is advantage Fernando (and a lot of internal team strife). The ultimate beneficiary could be someone like Button in a McLaren.


#422 jeze

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 14:24

I think Schumacher had a (much) bigger gap to his main driving cometition in the mid 1990s than anyone enjoys today. Vettel is very good, and might even be better than Alonso (we don't know yet), but this is not the same situation Schumacher was in.



There could be big trouble within the team. If I were running Ferrari, I would say, if we take Vettel then let Alonso go.



It would be great entertainment for us, but unless it was very conclusive there would always be arguments.



Good point, actually. Red Bull would be seriously weakened.



Also true. However, we don't know whether Vettel would be able to beat Alonso. If not, then it is advantage Fernando (and a lot of internal team strife). The ultimate beneficiary could be someone like Button in a McLaren.


1, Over one lap, VET, ALO and HAM are clearly the best. Of course drivers can pick themselves up on race day, but from what I've seen VET and ALO stand out there too. BUT is an equal race driver to HAM in general but is often too slow on Saturdays. RAI is probably on that level too.


2, If Ferrari explain the reasoning behind if you can't beat them join them to Alonso, he might actually relish the chance of taking him on. We always hear Alonso downplaying Vettel's ability and vice versa.

3, Haha no kidding. The sight of Ferrari 1-2's would be much better for my health too.

4, Same there, with the technical geniuses of RBR and McLaren relying on Webber/Button to win titles and Hamilton being stuck at Mercedes, which looks to have a rare occurence (a worse technical team per spent dime than Ferrari). That's divide and rule and would be strategic genius IF Alonso and Vettel can keep their traps shut when inevitably one guy is 10-15 points ahead at some stage of the season. Even so, they could walk around hating each other for three years as long as they get their pay checks and don't fall out with Luca or Stefano. The team need to keep it strictly neutral for it to work. With their relatively similar driving styles, the technical direction would be fairly easy between the two sides, so now Hamilton/Button conflict there.

5, If Alonso goes in 4-2 Vettel will be the little boy, if Vettel goes in 4-2 it's the other way around. 3-3 is probably the best balance there. McLaren took a dare with Button which ended up in them losing Hamilton three years later... but on the other hand Fernando is almost a retiree in five years time, so at the end of 2016 if Ferrari have to choose it's always going to be Vettel. I can't for the whole world not see Vettel driving for Ferrari during the 2017 season regardless of how this saga ends. There comes a day when Ferrari decide what to do (bringing in Räikkönen against Schumacher's will 1.5 years in advance).

Edited by jeze, 07 October 2012 - 14:30.


#423 garoidb

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 14:41

1, Over one lap, VET, ALO and HAM are clearly the best. Of course drivers can pick themselves up on race day, but from what I've seen VET and ALO stand out there too. BUT is an equal race driver to HAM in general but is often too slow on Saturdays. RAI is probably on that level too.


I agree with all this.

2, If Ferrari explain the reasoning behind if you can't be them join them to Alonso, he might actually relish the chance of taking him on. We always hear Alonso downplaying Vettel's ability and vice versa.


True. You get to race Vettel in equal equipment - he won't have a Red Bull anymore! Seb might go for it too, as the next challenge is to win in a new team (like Hamilton hopes to do). Also, it would be good for F1, especially if RedBull/Vettel are threatening to string together endless world championships.

5, If Alonso goes in 4-2 Vettel will be the little boy, if Vettel goes in 4-2 it's the other way around. 3-3 is probably the best balance there. McLaren took a dare with Button which ended up in them losing Hamilton three years later... but on the other hand Fernando is almost a retiree in five years time, so at the end of 2016 if Ferrari have to choose it's always going to be Vettel. I can't for the whole world not see Vettel driving for Ferrari during the 2017 season regardless of how this saga ends. There comes a day when Ferrari decide what to do (bringing in Räikkönen against Schumacher's will 1.5 years in advance).


Vettel will be there eventually if he wants to be (and it seems he does). I still think it would be tricky managing them both at the same team. Have we learned nothing from Senna/Prost and Alonso/Hamilton (or even Vettel/Webber). It could all blow up before Fernando retires circa 2016. We would be looking at potentially three seasons of having them paired together. That is not really succession planning, more like outright war.

#424 jeze

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 17:29

I agree with all this.



True. You get to race Vettel in equal equipment - he won't have a Red Bull anymore! Seb might go for it too, as the next challenge is to win in a new team (like Hamilton hopes to do). Also, it would be good for F1, especially if RedBull/Vettel are threatening to string together endless world championships.



Vettel will be there eventually if he wants to be (and it seems he does). I still think it would be tricky managing them both at the same team. Have we learned nothing from Senna/Prost and Alonso/Hamilton (or even Vettel/Webber). It could all blow up before Fernando retires circa 2016. We would be looking at potentially three seasons of having them paired together. That is not really succession planning, more like outright war.


On the other hand... Alonso should be a bit wiser these days, however, Vettel's raced with Webber who did push him very hard in 2010. So I think they could handle it. Perhaps it's Alonso's one chance to win a title in the coming years is to have Vettel in identical equipment, since there's not a snowball in hell he's going to go to Mercedes. If he wants to get rid of the Newey/Vettel combo, he'd better accept him as team mate. He's also said repeatedly (2011 to Spanish media and 2012 to F1 Racing) that he wouldn't mind Vettel as team mate. All conspiracy nonsense about #2 drivers will probably have Vettel think more about it than Fernando.




#425 bourbon

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 17:49

If Vettel goes to Ferrari, he would like to play it like Kimi I'd imagine. He has expressed again and again that he holds a similar viewpoint when it comes to F1 politics/teammates. That can change - the world is...people are not static - but it appears that is his thinking at the present. I think his earlier comment regarding contracts and so forth was just to emphasize that he is not going to place himself in a situation that is completely outside of his political ideology.

#426 bourbon

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:18

I will reiterate - in my opinion, Vettel should stay put.

Edited by bourbon, 15 October 2012 - 07:18.


#427 Wheels23

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:42

I'm just saying but if Red Bull do sign Massa then my stupid post above makes seem a little less stupid.



#428 kosmos

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:09

I will reiterate - in my opinion, Vettel should stay put.


If you compare RB with Ferrari from 2009 to 2012, it makes zero sense to move, I know Vettel is in love with Ferrari but at this moment in time RB is a guarantee of success, Ferrari is not, at least not till they fix all their problems. The best thing Vettel can do is to stay in RB for 3 more years and wait till Ferrari gets better.

#429 Gintonious

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:14

Mr.Benson has this up on the BBC site now. Not sure if that really means anything though.

#430 engel

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:34

If you compare RB with Ferrari from 2009 to 2012, it makes zero sense to move, I know Vettel is in love with Ferrari but at this moment in time RB is a guarantee of success, Ferrari is not, at least not till they fix all their problems. The best thing Vettel can do is to stay in RB for 3 more years and wait till Ferrari gets better.


By 2014 Vettel can be a triple (or even a quadruple) world champion. I guess Ferrari is the best team to monetize his success (cause keep in mind, at RedBull he's still on a performance contract)



#431 King Six

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:38

Has anyone posted this?

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/19941541

If the BBC put it up, it's usually true. The BBC have been busy boys, first they said Sauber to Hulkenberg..I mean...shit it's too early. Then they are now saying Vettel to Ferrari

Edited by King Six, 15 October 2012 - 08:39.


#432 engel

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:39

Has anyone posted this?

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/19941541


The Telegraph is running a similar article here -> http://www.telegraph...ri-in-2014.html

#433 Zava

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:45

TheHorseWhisperer ‏@GrilloRampante
There must be a contagious virus: those who think they know everything about Ferrari first emerge in Brazil, now in England!

#434 F1ultimate

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:10

Although this is plausible, would vettel be stupid enough to move to Ferrari and let someone like Lewis and others get to jump on Adrian Newey. Don't get me wrong. Vettel is an excellent driver but there's no denying that Adrian Newey plays a big role in his success.

#435 engel

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:15

Although this is plausible, would vettel be stupid enough to move to Ferrari and let someone like Lewis and others get to jump on Adrian Newey. Don't get me wrong. Vettel is an excellent driver but there's no denying that Adrian Newey plays a big role in his success.


Newey's contract runs out in 2014 I think. You never know, Luca might build him a technical base in England like he did for Barnard all those years ago ;)


PS I still don't believe the whole Vettel to Ferrari is done deal, I think there may be an option giving Ferrari first call similar to the one Alonso had but ... that's not a contract.

#436 Gareth

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:17

The thing that I don't get in this: Vettel is supposedly under contract to RB for 2014. Reports then say "ah but there are performance clauses that mean Vettel can get out of it". What possible performance clause could RB fail to achieve if they perform in 2013 as they have done in 2010, 2011 and 2012?

#437 Atreiu

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:20

Do the performance clauses tie Vettel to Red Bull or simply give him automatic options?

#438 King Six

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:21

The thing that I don't get in this: Vettel is supposedly under contract to RB for 2014. Reports then say "ah but there are performance clauses that mean Vettel can get out of it". What possible performance clause could RB fail to achieve if they perform in 2013 as they have done in 2010, 2011 and 2012?

That's what I've been thinking too. Maybe if it's something to do with the new engines and rules, but RBR are probably more likely to make the most out of the new aero rules anyway, could be the engine/kers mechanical side though which brings the manufacturer-oriented teams more into fold.

Saying that, Red Bull are effectively the Renault manufacturer team anyway. And Renault aren't really a slouch in Formula One. I think they'll be up there as long as they don't lose...key personnel.

Vettel moving away from Red Bull is probably one of them flying away from the nest jobs. Like Hamilton and McLaren. Even if it doesn't make the most logical sense, sometimes it's more of an emotional move away.

#439 maverick69

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:29

I think it's a done deal - just like Kimi and Alonso was a couple of years before.... and Monty et al started making noises about said drivers.

I believe the following has happened (some of this I've been told): Monty has turned around and said that he wants two top drivers in his cars because having such a big difference in relative performances is hurting its WCC efforts and thus the brand - those drivers being Hamilton (Stefano is a big fan) and Vettel (I think that Kubica was in there before his accident). Fred has a veto clause on who his teammate is and outright vetoed Hamilton. However, Vettel was not vetoed because a) Fred only has one veto, or b) he thinks he will tonk Vettel anyways.


:smoking: ;)

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#440 Alarcon

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:29

The reason is very simple:

If we can´t beat Seb with our Ferrari... then we put him on our Ferrari and nobody would beat us. ;)

Now seriously, I´ve the feeling the next step will be JB on Ferrari with Alonso and S.Vettel on McLaren with Perez. Even if Seb´s dream is on red...

#441 fed up

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:36

The thing that I don't get in this: Vettel is supposedly under contract to RB for 2014. Reports then say "ah but there are performance clauses that mean Vettel can get out of it". What possible performance clause could RB fail to achieve if they perform in 2013 as they have done in 2010, 2011 and 2012?


They are Ferrari performance clauses.

My guess is the Ferrari contract will take precedence over the RBR one if the clauses are met. If not, RBR have him.

Good position to be in :up:

#442 Ferrari2183

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:41

The thing that I don't get in this: Vettel is supposedly under contract to RB for 2014. Reports then say "ah but there are performance clauses that mean Vettel can get out of it". What possible performance clause could RB fail to achieve if they perform in 2013 as they have done in 2010, 2011 and 2012?

From the BBC article

However, Red Bull adviser Dr Helmut Marko - the right-hand man of the company's boss Dietrich Mateschitz - has already said the contract contains performance clauses and if Vettel wants to leave, Red Bull could not make him stay.


The bolded bit is interesting. Anyway, my thoughts on the Vettel to Ferrari matter is that it will happen. James Allen recently said that his Italian sources close to the matter believe that the letter of intent/agreement or whatever you would like to call it has already been signed. James Allen was one of the few who stuck to his guns regarding the Hamilton to Mercedes fiasco and didn't change his tune every second a new piece of information was made available.



#443 goingthedistance

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:42

So today we have "Ferrari inside sources" saying that Vettel is going to Ferrari - interesting timing yes? Great way to unsettle Red Bull Racing in the final few races of a tight championship battle with Ferrari.

I think Seb does have options (what driver in his position wouldn't, with the car regs changing so much in 2014?) but the likelihood of him taking up the Ferrari option is fairly low. It would require a Red Bull slump and a Ferrari resurgence.

#444 engel

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:50

So today we have "Ferrari inside sources" saying that Vettel is going to Ferrari - interesting timing yes? Great way to unsettle Red Bull Racing in the final few races of a tight championship battle with Ferrari.

I think Seb does have options (what driver in his position wouldn't, with the car regs changing so much in 2014?) but the likelihood of him taking up the Ferrari option is fairly low. It would require a Red Bull slump and a Ferrari resurgence.


The only Ferrari insider that has any credence in my eyes is Pino Allievi, and he's been running this story for months. So no it's not a "lets destabilize RB" thing

#445 ayali

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:51

Of course Seb has options, he's the hottest property in F1 and with a 3rd WDC very much possible his position in 2013 will be even better.
Way too early to decide now, let's see what 2013 brings and make a decision sometime next summer.

It must be nice having the choice of teams for 2014 :up:

I hope that in 2014 Alonso and Vettel (then both with 3 WDC titles) take each other on in a Ferrari, that would be awesome for the sport.

#446 Atreiu

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:52

They'd have to be infants to let this unsettle them. As if Newey would panic over his coffee and lose all motivation and insight to keep working while Marko would get on a binge and Horner cry himself to sleep every night.

#447 smoothcrim

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:58

Vettel is a clever cookie,when 2014 comes and he is out of contract i think Mclaren,Ferrari and RBR will throw big money at him.

#448 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:58

These deals done over a year in advance don't sit well with me. You can have a situation like Alonso and McLaren where he spent as much time signed up to drive for them as he actually did in the end. It's very risky to make such a long term commitment to another team. The other aspect is how it forces other drivers to accept short term deals which might not be best for them.

#449 sawyer_si

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 09:59

Sky Sports F1 ‏@SkySportsF1
Ferrari president Luca di Montezemolo has denied reports that Sebastian Vettel is poised to join the team in 2014. http://bit.ly/WnLQXE

#450 noikeee

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 10:02

People are underestimating the rule changes effect, 2014 is the right time to be making a move for a new challenge. Nobody knows for sure who the regs will benefit, but Ferrari and Mercedes are the only teams directly associated with making the new engines themselves, and it's interesting top drivers are flocking to them.

I think it's the right move for Seb. Okay facing Alonso could be an acid move but he's going to get paid more, drive for the team everyone wants to drive, and if it goes right he'll get a level of recognition he can't get sticking to his comfort zone at Red Bull. It isn't even hugely risky in terms of car, Ferrari have been winning races every year, it's not like he's moving to Mercedes like Lewis.

As for Ferrari, they risk internal turnmoil, but gain a lot of strength to attack the WCC, weaken severely their fiercest competitor, and even if things go wrong internally and are force to dump one driver, they still get the chance of picking the best out of two multiple world champions.

Win-win for both parties, and it's only a massive loss for RBR. This all assuming the contractual situation lets him leave though, which given the widely reported rumours seems possible but still is a little unclear!