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IndyCar for 2013, it's official.


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#1 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 14:24

Season over, R-H-R's trip around New York done and Helio trotting round a dance floor, can only mean on thing. Time for a new thread for 2013.

I'll plonk a random news link here to start the ball rolling and if some kind mod might close t'other thread?

fanks


http://www.ibj.com/i...S/article/36877


(PS, I know there's a silly season thread, but I have to fill my quota of the word 'official' every year)

Edited by wewantourdarbyback, 26 September 2012 - 14:25.


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#2 Victor_RO

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 14:30

Pocono? Make that a third 500-miler please and then we'd be happy. A good trifecta of 500s is what this series needs on the oval front.

Also, Road America please (despite what is said in that article). Please please please.

#3 PayasYouRace

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 14:36

I don't like them counting the double headers as seperate races (though obviously they are) as a way of bumping up the race count.

It's not that I'm against double headers either. It's just that they're looking at a 17-event season. Saying a 19 race season, while true, seems like a cheap way of artificially inflating the value.

#4 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 14:52

But if it's increased value I don't care how they conjured it up.

Cheap and artificial? Best way to do it.

#5 teejay

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 15:24

Needs more RA.

And Laguna

Cleveland would be nice too.

Maybe some lola's and reynards in the mix...

Wait im falling into a fuzzy happy old memory.

#6 Rob

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 15:38

Wait im falling into a fuzzy happy old memory.

Stop, you're going to make me cry. :cry:

#7 P123

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 15:47

Cleveland would be nice too.

Maybe some lola's and reynards in the mix...

Wait im falling into a fuzzy happy old memory.


Something like this?

#8 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 15:47

Well Alex is trying to come back...

#9 Prost1997T

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 16:04

Well Alex is trying to come back...


A great shame that Alex Lloyd has no race seat in a major series. He raced competitively with Lewis Hamilton here in the UK and his family had to resort to re-mortgaging their home to fund a ride in the US...

Edited by Prost1997T, 26 September 2012 - 16:04.


#10 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 16:06

Cleveland - yes

RA - Maybe, if it's a good event

Laguna - not interested

CART specs - Never going to happen. People in all series need to realise this isn't the 90s anymore.

#11 Prost1997T

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 16:12

CART specs - Never going to happen. People in all series need to realise this isn't the 90s anymore.


Doesn't stop the rose-tinted goggles on every single Indycar video on youtube, and on web forums. That said, I would like to see more powerful engines in the near future and some chassis competition as well.

#12 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 16:16

I think chassis 'competition' would just upset the competitive balance we have amongst the teams. I don't know how last the current system will stay this way, but putting teams in different equipment won't make the racing better in my view.

More power might work, but so would less aero. Or shitty tires. Or whatever. Changes that would have the same effect but not lead to more DNFs or costs for the engine manufacturers who are already taking losses to support the series.

#13 Prost1997T

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 17:45

I think chassis 'competition' would just upset the competitive balance we have amongst the teams. I don't know how last the current system will stay this way, but putting teams in different equipment won't make the racing better in my view.


Possibly, but weren't the teams complaining about the Dallara costs? That and I've heard people dislike the "spec series racing" (though I don't think they quite appreciate the difference between Penske\Ganassi and the rest).

More power might work, but so would less aero. Or shitty tires. Or whatever. Changes that would have the same effect but not lead to more DNFs or costs for the engine manufacturers who are already taking losses to support the series.


I understand that and I've said the same elsewhere - I'm not expecting 1000hp, but enough so they aren't in danger of being overtaken by GP2 cars or drifting back into "IRL crapwagon" status.

Edited by Prost1997T, 26 September 2012 - 17:45.


#14 Muppetmad

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 18:37

A Houston road course hosting the finale? Are they insane? Where would all the tension be? The awesome thing about IndyCar finales is that they always seem to happen on ovals - the road course events on the IndyCar schedule are good, but they certainly aren't tense. It'll be an anticlimactic end to the season I think if this news is true.

#15 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 18:42

I dunno, imagine if Baltimore was the race that ended this year?

#16 Prost1997T

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 18:51

I dunno, imagine if Baltimore was the race that ended this year?


There'd be even more whining about RHR getting a 'pass for jumping the start' than there is now.

Edited by Prost1997T, 26 September 2012 - 18:51.


#17 sblick

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 19:59

California will still be the season ender if they sign up. There is still rumblings of COTA but I don't see Bernie letting that happen. Allegedly all the fans want different body work but the owners don't. I think the manufacturers would have to push this. Curt Cavin has some thoughts on drivers in Indy Star if you want more tid bits

http://www.speedcafe...or-indycar-date

#18 Risil

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 20:13

By now I think we know all the silly season pieces, it's just waiting to see how they're made to fit together. RM said in his mailbag that there are a few "outside" drivers looking for seats, which (discounting Saavedra -- did you know that Miguel de Cervantes's mother's name was Saavedra?) probably means Vautier, Filippi, possibly Allmendinger. Any others spring to mind? Surely Alexander Rossi will start to be affected by Indycar's gravitational field, with his Euro open-wheel career running low on revs, if not yet stalling.

#19 Risil

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 20:16

(PS, I know there's a silly season thread, but I have to fill my quota of the word 'official' every year)


I think the two threads should make like American sports car racing and merge.

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#20 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 01:42

Schedule is out, pretty much this year but...


-Edmonton out
-Pocono in

-1meeeelion dollars to the driver that can win all three of the triple crown (Indy, Pocono, Fontana)

-Double headers at Detroit, Toronto, Houston
-One race each of those weekends will be standing start

-Fontana still season closer, now in October.

#21 PayasYouRace

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 07:15

2013 IndyCar schedule:

24 March St Petersburg (street)
7 April Barber (road)
21 April Long Beach (street)
5 May Sao Paulo (street)
26 May Indianapolis 500 (oval, triple crown)
1 June Detroit (street)
2 June Detroit (street)
8 June Texas (oval, night)
15 June Milwaukee (oval)
23 June Iowa (oval)
7 July Pocono (oval, triple crown)
13 July Toronto (street)
14 July Toronto (street)
4 August Mid-Ohio (road)
25 August Sonoma (road)
1 September Baltimore (street)
5 October Houston (street)
6 October Houston (street)
19 October Fontana (oval, night, triple crown)

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/102985

Not bad. Keeping most of this year's races should be good for the stability of the series. Excited about Pocono, not just because it's a new oval. I never saw any Indycar at the track the first time (too young). Houston should be interesting. I'm assuming its the later Champcar circuit. I never saw any races at that one either but it looked better than the CART one from the late 90s which was literally all 90 degree corners.

Not sure if I'm that fussed about the double headers. I'm just hoping I'll get to see any of this on TV. All the doubles are street courses. I can see some long Saturday nights for the mechanics.

Edited by PayasYouRace, 01 October 2012 - 07:18.


#22 Bloggsworth

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 08:53

6 oval races, that's more like it.

#23 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 09:21

How will these double headers work do we know? Will they both be full length races?

#24 HistoryFan

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:15

Triple Crown is back for the first time since 1989. Was there ever a Triple Crown winner?

#25 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:16

Yep. Full distance, full points. Two complete races. One Saturday, one Sunday, one with a standing start.

#26 teejay

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:40

Actually not a bad line up.

#27 greenman

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:42

Double header at Detroit? Ouch.

I'd swap one of these doubleheader races for an oval race in september. It's a shame that there will be a month long break, but if it was either that or ending the year on a street course... Then they made a good decision. Also, Pocono will be a 500-mile race right? Sounds awesome.

#28 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:44

Points-paying schedule's even more road course-biased than usual. Good news for Willy P.

Putting the Triple Crown mini-series in there is going to increase the sense of compromise for engine builders. Do you prioritise handling for (short, twisty) road courses and probably the overall championship, or outright power (I'm simplifying) for the media buzz around the three Big Events (even though only Indy's likely to have a big crowd, again)?

Pocono's gonna be a 400-miler, sadly. Mind you, Fontana was going to run 200 laps as well, then they changed it.

Edited by Risil, 01 October 2012 - 10:45.


#29 greenman

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:01

Yeah I saw now on another forum that it's because ABC will only give a window for a 400-miler. That's a shame, the "Triple Crown" races should really be all 500-milers IMO. It also bothers me that both double header races will pay the same amount of points as every other race. It's heavily biased for the RC/SC specialists this way.

#30 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:13

Unfortunately Ed Carpenter wasn't going to challenge for the title so I don't think it really hurts anyone.

It's interesting that the doubleheaders seem to be ABC races (at least Detroit and Toronto) so that's a big bump in ratings just by going to two races a weekend.

Interesting to see what it does to crowds.

#31 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:20

Damnit ABC you're supposed to be a broadcast partner not a cartoon villain.

I'm sad we're missing out on the Brown University Grand Prix, but on the other hand I'm genuinely surprised that Baltimore's up for a third year. In a mostly good way.

I need to brush up on my post-2001 CART, can't remember the Reliant Park circuit at all. The original one in downtown Houston was a bit of a Baltimore, characterised more by crazy happenings than anything good about the circuit. Rainstorm in 1998, championship leader running into a parked car in 1999, absolute chaos in 2000. And a labyrinthine pit entry. Happy days!

#32 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:23

Unfortunately Ed Carpenter wasn't going to challenge for the title so I don't think it really hurts anyone.


Yeah, there really aren't many real oval specialists (read: toss on road courses) left in the series. Will Power has a knack for finding trouble on them but he's plenty quick. It probably does impact a bit on drivers' rookie seasons though, especially if they haven't done Lights.

On the other hand, Mike Conway's probably phoning up AJ Foyt as we speak, telling him to order balloons and cake for his 2013 Indycar championship party.

Edited by Risil, 01 October 2012 - 11:25.


#33 Victor_RO

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:26

And a labyrinthine pit entry.


Watching the '98 race from there... I thought the pit exit was the crazy one, the pit entry was straight off the final corner. :p

#34 Fulcrum

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:45

Triple Crown is back for the first time since 1989. Was there ever a Triple Crown winner?


Big Al won in 1978.

Edited by Fulcrum, 01 October 2012 - 21:00.


#35 PayasYouRace

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:57

Damnit ABC you're supposed to be a broadcast partner not a cartoon villain.

I'm sad we're missing out on the Brown University Grand Prix, but on the other hand I'm genuinely surprised that Baltimore's up for a third year. In a mostly good way.

I need to brush up on my post-2001 CART, can't remember the Reliant Park circuit at all. The original one in downtown Houston was a bit of a Baltimore, characterised more by crazy happenings than anything good about the circuit. Rainstorm in 1998, championship leader running into a parked car in 1999, absolute chaos in 2000. And a labyrinthine pit entry. Happy days!


I know it had a very long sweeping curve of a back straight and suffered from Champcar temporary chicanitis near the first corner.

http://en.wikipedia....Prix_of_Houston

#36 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:30

This is a Houston 2007 onboard. Will be similar-ish, I assume.



#37 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:49

Watching the '98 race from there... I thought the pit exit was the crazy one, the pit entry was straight off the final corner. :p


You're correct, of course. :)

Bit of internet research suggests a few things. #1 They've got a nice sponsorship deal with Shell/Pennzoil to secure the race till 2017. #2 The City of Houston found the CCWS race at Reliant Park good value for money, and has been trying to make a race work there since 2010 (also known as the year IRL Indycar sold out to the road course jerk-offs). #3 Mike Lanigan of Rahal-Letterman-Lanigan fame is back in the race promoting business. #4 Mike Lanigan looks like a prematurely-aged Paul Tracy.

#38 OfficeLinebacker

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 12:59

I thought for sure Baltimore was done. Glad to see it back.

#39 PayasYouRace

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 13:06

The Indycar guys are wasting no time with Pocono https://twitter.com/...749381399359488

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#40 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 13:33

Why are all doubleheaders on street circuits? Is it to avoid the 1st race carnage thinning the numbers for the second race? On another note, I"m glad that Pocono is back, I may just attend my first Indy race live.

#41 montoyasminion

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 13:40

Awesome to see them back at Pocono.

#42 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 13:56

For those of you pining for the CART days

"Former IndyCar Series CEO Tony George has put together an investor group that includes some of the sport’s top team owners — Chip Ganassi, Roger Penske, Michael Andretti and Kevin Kalkhoven — as well as motorsports marketer Zak Brown that recently proposed the board sell them the IndyCar Series. The group has hired the Midwest-based law firm Faegre Baker Daniels and begun a financial due diligence evaluation of the series."


Schedule good news lasted all of 12 hours before normal service was resumed. That must be a record.

#43 Woody3says

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 14:11

oh dear.....where did that come from?

#44 William Hunt

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 14:12

don't like the double headers at all, would have preferred more (oval) races instead

#45 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 14:17

For those of you pining for the CART days

Schedule good news lasted all of 12 hours before normal service was resumed. That must be a record.


Hmmmmmmm. With rich-guy soap opera action like that, looks like Indycar missed a trick putting together a race in Houston. Shoulda gone to Dallas instead. :smoking:

Edited by Risil, 01 October 2012 - 14:18.


#46 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 16:30

For those of you pining for the CART days



Schedule good news lasted all of 12 hours before normal service was resumed. That must be a record.

FFS, really? It seems like a vicious circle. The more owners screw around with Indycar, the more worthless it becomes, which just makes it more affordable for owners who have too much money burning a hole in their pocket to screw around with it some more.

#47 Risil

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 16:38

Indeed. Although, if they put out a White Paper, I'd read it.

Edited by Risil, 01 October 2012 - 16:38.


#48 sblick

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 16:51

The only person not denying this story is Tony George everyone else has called it BS

Former IndyCar Series CEO Tony George has put together an investor group that includes some of the sport’s top team owners — Chip Ganassi, Roger Penske, Michael Andretti and Kevin Kalkhoven — as well as motorsports marketer Zak Brown that recently proposed the board sell them the IndyCar Series. The group has hired the Midwest-based law firm Faegre Baker Daniels and begun a financial due diligence evaluation of the series."

#49 TimRTC

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 16:58

So no attempts to go overseas this year aside from Brazil. I was hoping (against hope) that the series might run a race in Europe, is there any likelihood of this in the next few years or are they only likely to look at new markets (eg. Asia or the Middle East) if they run any more flyaways?

#50 djparky

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Posted 01 October 2012 - 17:13

Needs more RA.

And Laguna

Cleveland would be nice too.

Maybe some lola's and reynards in the mix...

Wait im falling into a fuzzy happy old memory.



there is some fab stuff on You Tube- there is almost complete Michigan 1998, plus other complete races from that era- the cars, the engines, the noise- brings back happy fuzzy memories