Jump to content


Photo

Should McLaren Have Signed Raikkonen Instead...


  • Please log in to reply
192 replies to this topic

#51 Mandzipop

Mandzipop
  • RC Forum Host

  • 4,184 posts
  • Joined: May 09

Posted 14 October 2012 - 23:01

From both perspectives no. Kimi is happy where he is. Mclaren need a younger driver.

They should have gone for the Hulk.

Advertisement

#52 as65p

as65p
  • Member

  • 17,508 posts
  • Joined: June 04

Posted 14 October 2012 - 23:12

From both perspectives no. Kimi is happy where he is. Mclaren need a younger driver.

They should have gone for the Hulk.


TBH I'm not sure either way. I don't think any current midfield team driver stands head and shoulders above his midfield team peers. This is where hindsight will come in, in due time.  ;) As of now, I feel it's impossible to judge who has a brighter future ahead between H├╝lkenberg and Perez. There is also the distinct possibility that neither of them will ever become a consistent top scorer. Or maybe both will, who knows.



#53 Ian G

Ian G
  • Member

  • 1,060 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 14 October 2012 - 23:14

To be perfectly honest, this pairing of Kimi and McLaren do have unfinished business and Martin is a big admirer but they don't gel togethor very well and Kimi is better suited at Lotus. The only other team I can see him fitting so well into is Red Bull.

In regards to Perez though, I do think McLaren jumped the gun a little and signed a driver largely through desperation and hype. I would've gone with Hulkenberg, now there's someone for the future or perhaps sign someone on a 1 year deal and then look for a top class driver in 2014 with the shakeup. I do feel the Perez and Button combination is weak.


I'm not so sure,limited number of Drivers available that would suit Mac.,remember rumours that LH was leaving were around since the Canadian GP last year and one of the reasons RB resigned Mark in a hurry with both Ferrari & Mac. sounding out drivers for 2013.

#54 Orn

Orn
  • New Member

  • 10 posts
  • Joined: September 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:54

Aha ha!

:)

Inspite of what you may think, McLaren have more resources and have the greater capacity to provide Kimi with race victories, etc.

Let's be brutally honest here. We're talking about a team (from Woking) that can win races even during their worst seasons (like 2009, 2006).


I don't mean to sound like a pretentious a**, but I don't think they won any races in '06

Edited by Orn, 15 October 2012 - 03:57.


#55 teejay

teejay
  • Member

  • 3,709 posts
  • Joined: May 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:20

I guess Kimi's interest in McLaren for 2013 was about 0.

#56 Afterburner

Afterburner
  • In the running for best OP of 2014

  • 3,435 posts
  • Joined: January 11

Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:35

If processes are the new McLaren thing - Kimi shoud stay far away from that team.
Kimi doesn't seem to be a process kind of guy...

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

And see what happened - the processed HAM escaped in desire to be real meat again?!

:up: :rotfl:


#57 Jimisgod

Jimisgod
  • Member

  • 2,806 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:40

Yes, he's the closest driver to the top 3 tier in F1 (Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel). Doesn't have any glaring weaknesses.


Posted Image

#58 NotSoSilentBob

NotSoSilentBob
  • Member

  • 929 posts
  • Joined: January 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:11

Frankly tired of the Kimi fans trying to get him out of Lotus and into anywhere that's more likely to win a race.

First it was about getting him back into F1 anyway they could (Williams, Red Bull, Renault), now it's about moving him somewhere else (Ferrari, Red Bull, McLaren..... )

It's gotten old.

#59 Jimmy

Jimmy
  • Member

  • 382 posts
  • Joined: August 00

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:00

The Hulk is still too green.

Advertisement

#60 glorius&victorius

glorius&victorius
  • Member

  • 4,327 posts
  • Joined: June 02

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:04

No. I'd like to see Kimi do well next year.


best answer! :up:

as for the signing... the panic execution of plan B... because "we cannot let Lewis announce that he is leaving us and we look empty handed"... could have been given more time... look at Hulkenberg now... growing and growing in his role.

#61 andysaint

andysaint
  • Member

  • 253 posts
  • Joined: May 07

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:14

I think that Perezs' reduced wage and his sponsorship played an even bigger factor than is being made of

#62 Wheels23

Wheels23
  • Member

  • 416 posts
  • Joined: November 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:21

Perez has many more years and can be molded by McLaren. Plus we need young drivers in F1 to be able to go into top teams.

#63 john_smith

john_smith
  • Member

  • 243 posts
  • Joined: January 03

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:29

it takes two to tango. mclaren has to want kimi, and kimi has to want to go there.

much as i'd like to see kimi return to mclaren, i don't think he'd want all the PR obligations and dealing with the press.

i do agree though, that next year mclaren will have the weakest driver pairing for a long time.

#64 tifosiMac

tifosiMac
  • Member

  • 6,734 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:45

best answer! :up:

as for the signing... the panic execution of plan B... because "we cannot let Lewis announce that he is leaving us and we look empty handed"... could have been given more time... look at Hulkenberg now... growing and growing in his role.

I quite agree. Hulkenburg has mtaured very nicely and I too think McLaren panicked somewhat with their choice. He would have been their best option. I do think Perez will shine though over time.

#65 Torsion

Torsion
  • Member

  • 627 posts
  • Joined: February 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:12

Perez has many more years and can be molded by McLaren. Plus we need young drivers in F1 to be able to go into top teams.


The question is, can Maclaren afford to wait until such time Perez starts to deliver consistently? he may do this from race one, but if he has a poor season, the whole thing could well end up being a 1 year thing.

I also agree that they were too hasty to fill the seat, without really waiting to see who among the young drivers were doing well towards the end of the season. I know this might not be a popular choice, but if they were looking for a fast driver to mold in to a good one, I think Romain could have been an interesting choice too - may be on a one year deal. He is a good qualifier, so could have complimented Button well.




#66 BillBald

BillBald
  • Member

  • 3,668 posts
  • Joined: April 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:34

To be honest, I don't think they're interested in signing and retaining top drivers anymore. Just like they weren't too desperate to keep Newey. They seem to want to build a system that will keep working even without the stars, be it drivers or designers. In fact signing Perez is a pretty strong signal that they aren't really interested in the best drivers, but rather are looking to get solid drivers and put the right processes in place to help them succeed.

Good luck to them, it's a different approach.


Well, maybe it would be a viable approach if they were getting it right. In fairness, they did manage to build a fast car without any star designers.

But that's the only part of their system which does work. The processes they have in place produce unreliable cars, and strategies which give away podium positions.

If they sort themselves out, Perez will do OK, and Kimi was never an option.

Edited by BillBald, 15 October 2012 - 12:35.


#67 Jon83

Jon83
  • Member

  • 1,856 posts
  • Joined: November 11

Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:37

It seems a bit early to ask this question.

#68 Longtimefan

Longtimefan
  • Member

  • 3,067 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:37

No, they should have signed Schumi for a year. Ron always wanted him in the team.

Perez needs more experience, I fear he'll do another 'Heikki' and hurt his career.


#69 GotYoubyTheBalls

GotYoubyTheBalls
  • Member

  • 301 posts
  • Joined: March 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:41

Signing Perez isnt the problem. He is a good young driver with tons of potential, and will help bring sponsorship to the team.

The problem is Button. He just isnt a team leader. A good driver on his day and has shown he can beat Hamilton but he has too many problems per season to be top class.

Mclarens problem the past few years is that they did not have a driver to rally behind and is sure to get results. RB have it with Vettel and a very good backup Webber. Ferrari have Alonso the best driver of his generation. Merc has MSC, but they also had Brawn hence the failure.

Mclaren needed Raikkonen and Perez IMO, or MSC and Button. I think they were too hasty renewing Jenson contract more than anything.

#70 2ms

2ms
  • Member

  • 2,212 posts
  • Joined: November 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 13:44

None of it adds up as far as the choice between these two drivers are concerned. There's no way McL would have chosen someone like Perez if Kimi had been available. By the same tolken, there's no way Kimi would have chosen to stay at Lotus if he had been free to move to McL next season. WDCs are practically never won in 2nd tier teams and Kimi has been more vocal than any other driver in F1 that he is only interested in driving if he can win WDCs.

All the evidence indicates that Kimi was already commited to either Red Bull or Ferrari for 2014. In other words, I believe that Kimi will be taking Webber or Vettel's seat at RB in 2014.

#71 tifosiMac

tifosiMac
  • Member

  • 6,734 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 15 October 2012 - 13:50

There's no way McL would have chosen someone like Perez if Kimi had been available. By the same tolken, there's no way Kimi would have chosen to stay at Lotus if he had been free to move to McL next season.

I think thats rubbish. Just my opinion. Kimi has history with McLaren and I don't think he has any wish to go back any time soon. Mclaren have won less titles in the last 10 years than the team he is at now don't forget.  ;)

#72 Santosdf

Santosdf
  • Member

  • 236 posts
  • Joined: November 05

Posted 15 October 2012 - 14:39

If they were the same age and brought the same sponsor money I'm absolutely sure they'd have tried to sign Raikkonen. We don't know how far negotiations went but I'm not convinced Kimi was that keen, the contract might have been too demanding PR-wise.

Perez is not bringing any sponsor money at least not the big one (Telmex) he's been hired to race .

#73 boldhakka

boldhakka
  • Member

  • 2,802 posts
  • Joined: September 10

Posted 15 October 2012 - 15:31

None of it adds up as far as the choice between these two drivers are concerned. There's no way McL would have chosen someone like Perez if Kimi had been available. By the same tolken, there's no way Kimi would have chosen to stay at Lotus if he had been free to move to McL next season. WDCs are practically never won in 2nd tier teams and Kimi has been more vocal than any other driver in F1 that he is only interested in driving if he can win WDCs.

All the evidence indicates that Kimi was already commited to either Red Bull or Ferrari for 2014. In other words, I believe that Kimi will be taking Webber or Vettel's seat at RB in 2014.


That's just not true.

"Kimi Raikkonen: Second Formula 1 title wouldn't change my life" Autosport.com

"I always said that if I win one I'm happy and then if something comes after that good, but I am not desperate on it,"
...
"When I feel I want to stop I will stop and it's not that I try to carry on and try to win. It's not going to be the reason why I am going to stay here."



#74 Craven Morehead

Craven Morehead
  • Member

  • 4,571 posts
  • Joined: February 06

Posted 15 October 2012 - 15:42

Posted Image

Well they did make a processed HAM for a few years...


:lol: That cracked me up. :up:

#75 RayInTorontoCanada

RayInTorontoCanada
  • Member

  • 570 posts
  • Joined: March 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 16:37

I don't mean to sound like a pretentious a**, but I don't think they won any races in '06


:up:

Sorry, I meant '04.

My bad.

And, no, you're not sounding like one. I made an error. It was, of course, '04, not '06.

#76 TifosiUSA

TifosiUSA
  • Member

  • 142 posts
  • Joined: July 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 16:50

:confused: :confused: :confused:

are you serious ??? mend what ??? it's a open secret that he was shoved aside by santander money ... and don't give us that ''motivation'' Bullcrap. ):

He was actually fired due to having his ass handed to him by Massa for 1.5 seasons (until Massa's injury).

#77 ZooL

ZooL
  • Member

  • 2,063 posts
  • Joined: June 08

Posted 15 October 2012 - 17:24

No, they should have signed Schumi for a year. Ron always wanted him in the team.

Perez needs more experience, I fear he'll do another 'Heikki' and hurt his career.

They had talks but Ron wouldn't let Schumacher have his own sponshorship deals thats why the deal was never done.

#78 rijole1

rijole1
  • Member

  • 633 posts
  • Joined: November 09

Posted 15 October 2012 - 20:03

Signing Perez isnt the problem. He is a good young driver with tons of potential, and will help bring sponsorship to the team.

The problem is Button. He just isnt a team leader. A good driver on his day and has shown he can beat Hamilton but he has too many problems per season to be top class.

Mclarens problem the past few years is that they did not have a driver to rally behind and is sure to get results. RB have it with Vettel and a very good backup Webber. Ferrari have Alonso the best driver of his generation. Merc has MSC, but they also had Brawn hence the failure.

Mclaren needed Raikkonen and Perez IMO, or MSC and Button. I think they were too hasty renewing Jenson contract more than anything.


You're maybe right. He hasn't been is this position before - as experienced driver with a promising rookie.
It can be a success, at least we should give Jenson a try :)



#79 RayInTorontoCanada

RayInTorontoCanada
  • Member

  • 570 posts
  • Joined: March 12

Posted 15 October 2012 - 20:33

Woking are in trouble for 2013.

They no longer have an Ace qualifier who can put their cars well up the grid consistently enough.

One can see the risk of under-qualifying the car into a mid-pack situation on the grid: That of a costly tangle that has little to do with what you're doing going into the first series of corners.

Shame that Checo has been out-qualified by Koba far too often this season. It doesn't bode well for McLarens simply because I don't think Koba-san is a banzai qualifier. If he was, Sauber wouldn't be getting ready to dump him.

Kimi, as far as I can see, keeps improving...and he's become a leader who can provide the likes of Permane and Allison direction/input. I didn't think Kimi had that in him. I was wrong.

Edited by RayInTorontoCanada, 15 October 2012 - 20:36.


Advertisement

#80 Flyhigh

Flyhigh
  • Member

  • 410 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 16 October 2012 - 03:09

Kimi and Button are similar type of drivers similar in talent and even characteristics, smooth, clean, non-aggressive personalities. I think Mclaren needs some fire, not sure I would go with Perez he does seems to have the speed, but still a bit green, but on the long run could be a very good choice. Kimi would be less risky, but with more mediocre results in my view, a not highly motivated Kimi that is.

#81 Bartel

Bartel
  • Member

  • 887 posts
  • Joined: April 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 05:41

Hulkenberg was the better option but thats just my opinion.

#82 Mauseri

Mauseri
  • Member

  • 7,531 posts
  • Joined: March 05

Posted 16 October 2012 - 07:37

Kimi and Button are similar type of drivers similar in talent and even characteristics, smooth, clean, non-aggressive personalities. I think Mclaren needs some fire, not sure I would go with Perez he does seems to have the speed, but still a bit green, but on the long run could be a very good choice. Kimi would be less risky, but with more mediocre results in my view, a not highly motivated Kimi that is.

Button and Kimi are too similar, reliable result makers. They need a different driver so that both dont look slow and boring if the car is. Perez crashing people will understand Buttons value, and maybe Perez can sometimes do something else too to catch the camera?

Edited by Mauseri, 16 October 2012 - 07:38.


#83 eronrules

eronrules
  • Member

  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined: January 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 10:00

Button and Kimi are too similar, only in the sense that they are both reliable result makers. other wise they are so different that you can't put them in the same continent



here you go, i corrected it for you :kiss:


#84 Coops3

Coops3
  • Member

  • 1,592 posts
  • Joined: March 11

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:51

I would agree that McLaren were perhaps too hasty to sign Perez, but Kimi is under contract for 2013, which I would imagine is the reason they didn't go for him.

#85 Paul Parker

Paul Parker
  • Member

  • 1,721 posts
  • Joined: October 02

Posted 16 October 2012 - 14:56

Hulkenberg was the better option but thats just my opinion.


I agree, it is noticeable that Nico H has not as yet landed a prime F1 drive despite his obvious potential and outright speed.

So he moves to Sauber, a second league team which he will surely have to move on from if he is ever to get to the top of the slippery pole unless Sauber significantly improve. It seems surprising to me that he wan't signed up by Mercedes, a lot cheaper than LH, a German racer for a German team and I'd wager very little if at all slower than Lewis in the same car albeit less experienced but time quickly sorts this out if you are good enough. As for his Force India team mate well it doesn't look good does it?

Meanwhile the also rapid but inconsistent Perez (being even handed perhaps it is more down to the machinery) goes to McLaren and I wonder if this was, at least in part, driven by the major sponsor(s).

In response to the thread's title no I don't think McLaren should have signed KR.

#86 Callisto

Callisto
  • Member

  • 2,672 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:01

No

#87 Santosdf

Santosdf
  • Member

  • 236 posts
  • Joined: November 05

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:06

Meanwhile the also rapid but inconsistent Perez (being even handed perhaps it is more down to the machinery) goes to McLaren and I wonder if this was, at least in part, driven by the major sponsor(s).In response to the thread's title no I don't think McLaren should have signed KR.


Perez was signed to race , he is not bringing sponsors . Mclaren rate him higher than all the other available options , we will see soon enough if they were right . IMO they made the right choice

#88 SpaMaster

SpaMaster
  • Member

  • 5,856 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:28

Suddenly I see a lot of people saying Kimi has become a leader. He hasn't done anything different on this regard since 2001. If he is a team leader now, he was one in 2004 and 2008 as well. If he wasn't a team leader in 2006 and 2009, he isn't one now.

#89 Watkins74

Watkins74
  • Member

  • 5,767 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:30

Suddenly I see a lot of people saying Kimi has become a leader. He hasn't done anything different on this regard since 2001. If he is a team leader now, he was one in 2004 and 2008 as well. If he wasn't a team leader in 2006 and 2009, he isn't one now.

I agree. He is no leader.

#90 Vesuvius

Vesuvius
  • Member

  • 6,027 posts
  • Joined: August 09

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:32

I agree. He is no leader.


None of the drivers is ;)

Edited by Vesuvius, 16 October 2012 - 15:33.


#91 Ramses1348

Ramses1348
  • Member

  • 576 posts
  • Joined: December 07

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:39

I agree. He is no leader.


Thank god he is not. I much prefer have him driving the car instead :o

#92 Paul Parker

Paul Parker
  • Member

  • 1,721 posts
  • Joined: October 02

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:54

Perez was signed to race , he is not bringing sponsors . Mclaren rate him higher than all the other available options , we will see soon enough if they were right . IMO they made the right choice


I was referring to McLaren's existing sponsors, with rare exception most F1 drivers are capable of winning/achieving good results (in the dry at least) if they have the best or second best car and the global marketability of any given driver is a big factor in their employment.

History is well stocked with those who could have achieved more but instead spent their best years in second rate or worse machinery because they weren't 'hot' to use the modern parlance. Some overcame this but not many. In this instance Hulkenberg's F1 potential is being damaged and squandered in much the same way that Button's was post Williams.

#93 Vesuvius

Vesuvius
  • Member

  • 6,027 posts
  • Joined: August 09

Posted 16 October 2012 - 15:56

Perez was signed to race , he is not bringing sponsors . Mclaren rate him higher than all the other available options , we will see soon enough if they were right . IMO they made the right choice


Ferrari didn't rate Perez that high so will see if McLaren was right or not...judging by last two gp's perez has lot to do still.

#94 Torsion

Torsion
  • Member

  • 627 posts
  • Joined: February 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 16:07

I agree. He is no leader.


I am curious as to what you think are qualities of a driver which would qualify him/her as a leader in this context?

Edited by Torsion, 16 October 2012 - 17:11.


#95 Jimisgod

Jimisgod
  • Member

  • 2,806 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 16 October 2012 - 16:11

Hulkenberg was the better option but thats just my opinion.


I see Hulk ran across the garage and stole Di Resta's 'overrated' mantle. :rolleyes:

#96 eronrules

eronrules
  • Member

  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined: January 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 16:35

get this straight people, kimi never wanted the title of ''team leader'' cause it requires unnecessary quible with team which kimi can't be bothered with. now, with teams like mclaren and lotus, the team understands what he is and makes the team more accepting towards kimi and let's him roam free. in these cases, we see kimi shine. during kimi's mclaren stint, kimi was the fastest of the 2 drivers, same as in lotus. however, during ferrari period, the team just didn't understand his style at all, he's not bothered to play team-mate game. they focused on and pampered massa instead of kimi and we all know what become of it. and now people wills point to me all the things massa achieved (with his merit, no question), but the question is,how much of that is due to making the car more suited to massa and less suited to kimi, the role played by Schumi as driver mentor to massa, the role played by team and LDM once Alonso was chosen to join the team during '08 season and the subsequent blunders made by the team towards kimi's races... like pit stops and running bone dry GP with rain tires .... it's there for all to see.

#97 beute

beute
  • Member

  • 1,213 posts
  • Joined: October 09

Posted 16 October 2012 - 16:37

Button and Kimi are too similar, reliable result makers.

how the hell is button a reliable result maker?
He is the most inconsistent driver from the top4 teams...

Sometimes he misses q3 for no real reason, sometimes he cruises around in position 15 for no good reason.
he finished outside the points 4 times without suffering any major problems that were out of his own hands.
Complete contrast to Hamilton, who finished every race he finished in the points, not to mention that he suffered more real retirements and still is considerably ahead than button.(no I dont count driving around in 14th position and then giving up shortly before race end as a real retirement, sry button)

2010 was more or less the same, 2011 was great, 2012 shitty again.
this happens, as I said already, also in a race to race basis...


button is not someone you should rely on, Kimi on the other hand is sitting in a position where he and the car he is driving have no business to be, solely because he was more reliable and consistent than the guys behind him.(maybe exclude hamilton, as all of his 4 retirements were no fault of his own)

Edited by beute, 16 October 2012 - 16:38.


#98 eronrules

eronrules
  • Member

  • 3,225 posts
  • Joined: January 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 16:54

how the hell is button a reliable result maker?
He is the most inconsistent driver from the top4 teams...

Sometimes he misses q3 for no real reason, sometimes he cruises around in position 15 for no good reason.
he finished outside the points 4 times without suffering any major problems that were out of his own hands.
Complete contrast to Hamilton, who finished every race he finished in the points, not to mention that he suffered more real retirements and still is considerably ahead than button.(no I dont count driving around in 14th position and then giving up shortly before race end as a real retirement, sry button)

2010 was more or less the same, 2011 was great, 2012 shitty again.
this happens, as I said already, also in a race to race basis...


button is not someone you should rely on, Kimi on the other hand is sitting in a position where he and the car he is driving have no business to be, solely because he was more reliable and consistent than the guys behind him.(maybe exclude hamilton, as all of his 4 retirements were no fault of his own)

:up:

#99 MrMontecarlo

MrMontecarlo
  • Member

  • 546 posts
  • Joined: May 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 17:10

Aha ha!

:)

Inspite of what you may think, McLaren have more resources and have the greater capacity to provide Kimi with race victories, etc.

Let's be brutally honest here. We're talking about a team (from Woking) that can win races even during their worst seasons (like 2009, 2006).

The team from Enstone has only 1 legitimate win in 6 seasons.


In 2006 McLaren didn't win any race.

Advertisement

#100 MrMontecarlo

MrMontecarlo
  • Member

  • 546 posts
  • Joined: May 12

Posted 16 October 2012 - 17:15

I love Raikkonen, for me he is amazing and I've always been a fan. But I don't think he should have got back to McLaren now. He is not so young anymore, his commitment can switch suddenly as we saw from F1 to rally from rally to F1, so you can't build anything on the long term with him. Moreover let's not forget he decided to leave McLaren in 2006, for Ferrari, a direct competitor, so McLaren wouldn't want to allow such a comeback otherwise all the future drivers will see McLaren only as a step of their career not the pinnacle.

Yet is Perez better than Kimi ? No, never, in any sort of form. He is young but he's not world top 3 material. And he's too commited to Ferrari as well, so he will got to Italia after 2-3 years, I'm sure. I continue to pretend that Vettel was the only option for McLaren. By not getting him signed they showed financial weakness and strategical error for their own future.


I don't think Perez will ever go to Ferrari. You just don't sign for McLaren planning to go to Ferrari later, he's not commited to Ferrari anymore.