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How much does Q-setup compromises race-setup in F1?


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#1 scandyman

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 11:12

I was wondering since Vettel probably starts from the pitlane and his car will be setuped again. Most likely Redbull will put more topspeed (easier to overtake) and tweak gearings.

So if F1 car is adjusted only to race and totally forgetting qualifyings, how big influence does this have to laptimes and tyre usage?

Edited by scandyman, 04 November 2012 - 11:13.


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#2 OfficeLinebacker

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 12:14

Here is an article that lists three areas of change:

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104014

"made changes to the suspension"

#3 scandyman

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 15:50

Here is an article that lists three areas of change:

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104014

"made changes to the suspension"

Alright but...article just states obvious. I would be more interesting to see how much it affects laptime when car is totally on race setup and never been configured to Q.

Case A: Vettel's car's laptime on normal race (setup both race + qualifyings).
Case B: Vettel's car's laptime optimised to race only.

Is the car just as fast in both cases except in case B car has easier to overtake in track?

#4 Kalmake

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 20:09

You can make a better compromise with ride height when low fuel performance isn't crucial. But then again you can't ruin full fuel performance in either case, so the difference isn't huge probably.

We would see more starting from the pits if there was a big gain.

#5 Wolf

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 12:56

I don't think there is a way to answer this, especially this season- if one compares race fastest laps against pole position times there is a gap of several seconds (usu. between 2 and 5 seconds, the only exception being Silverstone with wet qualifying and dry race). It has been a bit off-putting for me, but that is besides the point... Will it help the question if I mention that Vettel's race FL was almost three seconds slower than his qualifying time, but Alonso's only 2.5?

#6 Kalmake

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 14:35

I was surprised how slow Vettel was in the last part. He had softer and fresher tires than anyone around him. Still, very hard to draw conclusions.

#7 Bloggsworth

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 17:25

Not a lot of difference in the dry, but if it had been wet, the difference might have been huge.

#8 Wolf

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 17:54

Not a lot of difference in the dry, but if it had been wet, the difference might have been huge.


Why? Aren't they all allowed to set-up cars for wet races if they qualified in the dry? AFAIK, they are, on safety grounds...

#9 Bloggsworth

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 21:26

Why? Aren't they all allowed to set-up cars for wet races if they qualified in the dry? AFAIK, they are, on safety grounds...


In a limited way.

#10 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 21:40

Id be interested to know what Vettel's Q laptime would have been with the race setup he ended up using. In theory he would have been lower than the 3rd place but considering he started from the pitlane then dropped to the back again later on and still finished third anyway surely it would have been worth his while starting 6th or so with this more optimised race setup? Not unfeasible to think he could have won from there. I know The SC and other events worked out well for him but his race pace was excellent until the last stint which was strange. I've often thought RB are too qual focused, this proves it somewhat for me.

Edited by Tenmantaylor, 05 November 2012 - 21:43.


#11 WhiteBlue

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 06:06

I can't tellyou in lap time but in straight line speed through the trap. Before the setup change the the Red Bulls were dead slowest through the trap. After the setup Vettel was fourth fastest. So it was a massive downforce shed they did. Basically they must have shifted their performance from the fast cornering to the straits in a big way. It is impressive that they did it without being able to test the setup. It was all derived from simulations.

#12 gruntguru

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:34

It is impressive that they did it without being able to test the setup. It was all derived from simulations.

. . . and shedloads of practice data.

#13 Kalmake

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:24

I can't tellyou in lap time but in straight line speed through the trap. Before the setup change the the Red Bulls were dead slowest through the trap. After the setup Vettel was fourth fastest. So it was a massive downforce shed they did. Basically they must have shifted their performance from the fast cornering to the straits in a big way. It is impressive that they did it without being able to test the setup. It was all derived from simulations.


They did change gearing to avoid hitting the rev limiter when overtaking as RBR infamously tends to do. I wouldn't draw too many conclusions from best trap speeds when they are done with drafting and DRS open.