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Hungaroring still host F1 at least until 2021


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#1 Tarzaan

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 15:49

It seems Hungaroring will renew their contract util 2021. :love: They agreed with Mr. Ecclestone in Abh-Dhabi, but the contract isn't signet yet.

http://formula.hu/in...hir_hirid=74675

After the 2013 race there will be some modification/reconstruction, Sebastian Vettel, Fernando Alonso, Michael Schhumacher and Niki Lauda will help the designers (who - i hope - will be not Mr. Tilke).

:up:

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#2 Zava

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 15:57

:up: best news of the day!
I can't wait to see the layout change plans, hopefully it will be good with 4 multiple champions adding their feedback.

the only bad news is they mentioned that maybe every runoff will become tarmac runoff. :(

#3 BoschKurve

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 16:05

There's nothing wrong with this track, and it should be left alone.

Something tells me they will try and widen parts to allow for more overtaking.

God forbid anyone should have to work to overtake nowadays.

#4 UPRC

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 16:21

I'll wait until I see the changes to the circuit before I judge them. It's a shame that Hungaroring doesn't suit F1 cars too much because the layout of the circuit itself is really nice.

#5 Baddoer

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 16:25

Tilke+Hungaroring=Self destruction. Thats what I hope for :)

#6 T-Mobile

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 16:36

It's difficult to deny that Hungary produces some of the most boring races of the season. I hope that these changes improve things, along with the new regulations.

I'm sure 2014 will be interesting either way.

#7 olliek88

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 17:03

I have never understood the appeal of this place, its like a street circuit with none of the pros but most of the cons. Bores me silly, wish they'd get rid of it.

#8 BoschKurve

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 17:09

The Hungaroring has a fantastic flow to it.

No offense, but not all of us like to see overtaking made easy. Overtaking historically has never been easy in F1. It's just something new to the sport because people whined too much. Good thing most people weren't watching 20 years ago.

#9 olliek88

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 17:41

The Hungaroring has a fantastic flow to it.

No offense, but not all of us like to see overtaking made easy. Overtaking historically has never been easy in F1. It's just something new to the sport because people whined too much. Good thing most people weren't watching 20 years ago.


None taken. Mostly  ;) .

Its not just the overtaking element though, its doesn't have any character for me, its in the middle of a featureless dust bowl with bland surroundings, the layout does little for me too, like i said previously its doesn't strike me as a real challenge for the drivers, there's loads of get out of jail free run off areas so although its corner after corner its doesn't make you pay at all if your get it wrong. But thats just me.

#10 P123

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 18:42

None taken. Mostly ;) .

Its not just the overtaking element though, its doesn't have any character for me, its in the middle of a featureless dust bowl with bland surroundings, the layout does little for me too, like i said previously its doesn't strike me as a real challenge for the drivers, there's loads of get out of jail free run off areas so although its corner after corner its doesn't make you pay at all if your get it wrong. But thats just me.


Get out of jail free run-off... aren't you describing every circuit on the calendar? Hungaroring does still have some gravel traps. The corner after corner aspect is generally it's challenge. Get the line wrong in one and you're basically losing time for several more. Still a boring track for racing though.

#11 Tarzaan

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 18:59

I have never understood the appeal of this place, its like a street circuit with none of the pros but most of the cons. Bores me silly, wish they'd get rid of it.



The track is good for
- the spectators near the circuit, because they can see half of the track
- the sponsors, because its usually a long race, so you watch the sponsor logos longer
- the VIP guests, because the airport are close and there are a lot of hotels/restaurants in Budapest
- the FOM, because Hungaroring pay high license price
- the teams, because its in Europe

#12 Zava

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Posted 07 November 2012 - 19:05

The track is good for
- the spectators near the circuit, because they can see half of the track
- the sponsors, because its usually a long race, so you watch the sponsor logos longer
- the VIP guests, because the airport are close and there are a lot of hotels/restaurants in Budapest
- the FOM, because Hungaroring pay high license price
- the teams, because its in Europe

you forgot the most important:
- for Charlie, because the SC signs are out at every marshal post in about 2 seconds, 3-4 times faster than at the second fastest track. :p

#13 BigCHrome

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 00:46

It's a good track, I hope they don't mess with it (though I know they will, and it will make the track worse).

#14 jeze

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 09:36

We had some discussions in another thread about possible changes, and what I'd hope to see is the removal of the final complex of corners where the current second turn will be placed to make a longer straight there and a faster turn 3 too. Then remove the chicane at the back of the track which is a completely unnecessary feature and straightline the back straight all the way into the final corner and make in 90-degree-ish and relatively quick so drivers can make mistakes there - enabling at least a little better chance of overtaking at the end of the straight! It also keeps the laptime up that the turn 2 complex is moved 300 metres to the east.

Edited by jeze, 08 November 2012 - 09:48.


#15 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 10:20

IMO it's a fantastic circuit for sports and touring cars - FIA GT and LMS events in the past were very entertaining, and in fact so are the now annual WTCC races (if only because of certain Hungarian driver participating - now that's what you call athmosphere).

However, unsurprisingly it does not really suit the GP cars, and wet weather is extremely rare here - and even if it did rain, the repeat of the 2006 would never happen as Charley would call red flag as soon as one of the drivers saw a raindrop on his helmet.

#16 SparkPlug

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 11:26

I always thought Hungaboring was unexciting as a race venue. Unless there is bad weather, the races are terribly boring and processional. The track is too narrow, and the layout prevents any sort of wheel to wheel action very much like the old Barcelona circuit.

#17 GotYoubyTheBalls

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 11:28

I want Tilke to get involved and help the circuit become more exciting.

#18 engel

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 11:35

I know there's Hungarian posters here that are very proud of their track but personally ... I 've never been able to enjoy a race there ... I just find the circuit to be very bland

#19 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 11:39

By making the track more "exciting" for F1 you may destroy it for the other categories that actually CAN race there successfully... and when has Tilke ever actually improved an existing track?!

In a way I wish F1 had stopped going to Spa around ten years ago, then the massive asphalt run offs and other pointless tweakings the circuit now has would have never happened as sub-F1 categories do not require such things (actually, nor does F1 really "need" them, but it is their obsessity to sanitize everything nowadays).

Most of the American, Canadian and Australian tracks still remain as the best on the planet as they have been left virtually untouched since 80's.

Edited by SonnyViceR, 08 November 2012 - 11:40.


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#20 byronbolscher

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 11:52

I know there's Hungarian posters here that are very proud of their track but personally ... I 've never been able to enjoy a race there ... I just find the circuit to be very bland


Nothing wrong with the circuit, actually a really nice track driving wise, but it's too short for F1 to overtake, which ends in boring races mostly.. If only they could extend the straight by alot, would make the track a whole lot better.

#21 joshb

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:26

By making the track more "exciting" for F1 you may destroy it for the other categories that actually CAN race there successfully... and when has Tilke ever actually improved an existing track?!

In a way I wish F1 had stopped going to Spa around ten years ago, then the massive asphalt run offs and other pointless tweakings the circuit now has would have never happened as sub-F1 categories do not require such things (actually, nor does F1 really "need" them, but it is their obsessity to sanitize everything nowadays).

Most of the American, Canadian and Australian tracks still remain as the best on the planet as they have been left virtually untouched since 80's.


when watching an ALMS race, i do like watching the cars thread the eye of a needle at high speed between grass and very close concrete barriers. Gives the impression of a real challenge unlike some of the modern car parks

#22 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:31

Indeed.

I think that the only "European tracks" (as in rather sterile) in North America are now
* Circuit of the Americas
* Miller Motorsports Park

Some newer circuits such as Barber have some modern-esque features and limited tarmac run-offs but only in the crucial places. Also places like Road America and Mosport have added some of it in one or two corners, but you never really feel bothered. It feels NATURAL

Edited by SonnyViceR, 08 November 2012 - 12:35.


#23 GotYoubyTheBalls

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:36

I like car parks and driver safety and cars recovering from silly offs, to spectacular unforgiving tracks.

Edited by GotYoubyTheBalls, 08 November 2012 - 12:36.


#24 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 12:51

So does anyone seriously prefer these
Posted Image
Posted Image Posted ImagePosted Image Posted Image
Posted Image

to these
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

:confused:

Edited by SonnyViceR, 08 November 2012 - 13:07.


#25 chdphd

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 13:42

...get out of jail free run off areas ...

Felipa Massa is probably quite happy about that.

#26 Tarzaan

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 14:14

So does anyone seriously prefer these


to these


:confused:


That's because of the FIA.


#27 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 14:15

Really now.

#28 johnmhinds

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:11

So does anyone seriously prefer these
Posted Image

to these
Posted Image

:confused:


Yes, because the Hungaroring has no tarmac run offs....

Posted Image

Oh wait, apart from turns 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13 and 14...

Edited by johnmhinds, 08 November 2012 - 17:18.


#29 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:33

Not really sure what that has to do my comparison of Dubai Autodrome vs Virginia...

and didn't I just declare a few post earlier how dissatisfied I am with the state of European (/Asian) tracks? Not only Grade 1 circuits, most of the Grade 2s have become incredibly sterile as well

Edited by SonnyViceR, 08 November 2012 - 17:35.


#30 salamin

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:37

according to motorsporttotal they might add another straight which would be between T11 and T14

#31 johnmhinds

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:46

Not really sure what that has to do my comparison of Dubai Autodrome vs Virginia...

and didn't I just declare a few post earlier how dissatisfied I am with the state of European (/Asian) tracks? Not only Grade 1 circuits, most of the Grade 2s have become incredibly sterile as well


The general feeling throughout the thread as been that people don't want the track to change because Tilke will turn it into a boring tarmac carpark like the rest of the modern tracks.

I was just pointing out it they've already done that to this track and nobody seemed to care or have noticed that much, and it hasn't changed the racing at the Hungaroring, it's as boring as it has ever been...

IMO they can change anything they want on this track, none of the corners are memorable or worth saving even for nostalgias sake.

#32 Zava

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:46

according to motorsporttotal they might add another straight which would be between T11 and T14

haha, that article is like a direct translation of the hungaroring to be reconstructed topic's opening post. :p

#33 olliek88

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 17:54

Get out of jail free run-off... aren't you describing every circuit on the calendar? Hungaroring does still have some gravel traps. The corner after corner aspect is generally it's challenge. Get the line wrong in one and you're basically losing time for several more. Still a boring track for racing though.


You misunderstood me (or, more likely i didn't explain myself properly! :) ) I meant it has too many get out of jail free runs offs to be considered a big driver challenge, which its twisty nature leads some to believe it is. But thats just my view, its never done anything for me but i appreciate that why other do like it.

#34 SonnyViceR

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 18:05

Anyone actually saw the 2010 LMS night race here? Now that was a proper race in the dark, even places like LM and Sebring are so well lit up nowadays once the sun has gone down that you can hardly appreciate it, but this even was held in almost total pitch dark outside the start/finish straight. And the battles were amazing


Edited by SonnyViceR, 08 November 2012 - 18:08.


#35 SCUDmissile

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 18:06

I have never understood the appeal of this place, its like a street circuit with none of the pros but most of the cons. Bores me silly, wish they'd get rid of it.


I agree with you.
For F1 at least, it produces mediocre racing, and Tilke is not an excuse for it. The only point I see for the track is that many poles, Finns and other countries nearby who don't have races go there. But the best races have been 2006 and 2011, as in washouts.

#36 Tuxy

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 18:29

I dislike this track.

#37 my_own_shadow

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 18:32

I agree with you.
For F1 at least, it produces mediocre racing, and Tilke is not an excuse for it. The only point I see for the track is that many poles, Finns and other countries nearby who don't have races go there. But the best races have been 2006 and 2011, as in washouts.

And what about epic 1998? Or a year before, 1997? Or Senna being overtook by Piquet in 1986 or by Mansell in 1989? These races have become the Golden Heritage of Grand Prix racing!!!


#38 Fastcake

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 18:32

I agree with you.
For F1 at least, it produces mediocre racing, and Tilke is not an excuse for it. The only point I see for the track is that many poles, Finns and other countries nearby who don't have races go there. But the best races have been 2006 and 2011, as in washouts.


It holds a special memory for me as the scene of Button's exciting first win back in 2006 :)

But yes it doesn't always provide the most entertaining races, with 2011 being another exception as a good race.

#39 PinkZepStones

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 19:06

I actually quite like this grand prix and look forward to it every year, some say boring yes i have seen those two, but then it isnt like it cant produce good races.

Plus the flow to it is really nice and theres not many silly run off bits.

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#40 Tarzaan

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 19:28

OFF


I update a little bit my "plan" which I post in the other topik some days/weeks ago:


Posted Image


http://img152.imagev...2_122_378lo.JPG

start/finish line extended by 200m to 1000m
straight between turn2 and 3 extended to 4000m
nothern straight extended by 200m to 400+m.
nothern chichane and corner 12 would be much sharper, like Oschersleben turn1 with alternate line for bikes.
The entrance of corner 14 were also a little bit sharper

purple: (new)sitting places
orange: standing places




#41 SCUDmissile

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 19:30

And what about epic 1998? Or a year before, 1997? Or Senna being overtook by Piquet in 1986 or by Mansell in 1989? These races have become the Golden Heritage of Grand Prix racing!!!

Valencia and Abu Dhabi have been the best races this year...

And i agree, those races, especially 1998 were very good, there wasn't much other on track action then, and back then it was also easier to overtake.
I bet if tracks like Korea were made in the 70s, they may have become hits for overtaking. maybe not for the challenge though.

#42 johnmhinds

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 19:44

OFF


I update a little bit my "plan" which I post in the other topik some days/weeks ago:


Posted Image


http://img152.imagev...2_122_378lo.JPG

start/finish line extended by 200m to 1000m
straight between turn2 and 3 extended to 4000m
nothern straight extended by 200m to 400+m.
nothern chichane and corner 12 would be much sharper, like Oschersleben turn1 with alternate line for bikes.
The entrance of corner 14 were also a little bit sharper

purple: (new)sitting places
orange: standing places


^Why would you add in tight chicanes here, chicanes were added to tracks to slow them down in an age when the high speeds were overtaking the safety of the cars and the tracks.
They aren't needed in modern circuits and they don't create passing opportunities.

Even Herman Tilke has completely abandoned the use of chicanes in his circuit designs in favor of more flowing mid speed corners.

The last few corners always need to be flowing so that the cars can get close and follow each other down the main straight before passing into turn 1.
just look at Barcelona for how adding a pointless slow chicane before the main straight can ruin any passing.

Edited by johnmhinds, 08 November 2012 - 19:46.


#43 athlon

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 20:50

A Hungarian F1-expert, Gábor Wéber's opinion about a possible extension of the circuit.

Posted Image

#44 my_own_shadow

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Posted 08 November 2012 - 21:04

A Hungarian F1-expert, Gábor Wéber's opinion about a possible extension of the circuit.


Right place (Turn Five), wrong idea (it creates nothing, just a new go-kart track)...

So you even won't need nearly $5 million budget to the same effect, just $100 for this sign:

Posted Image

#45 Zava

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 17:01

another thinking outside the box attempt, I quite like the idea, but not sure if it is an 'easy fix':

Posted Image

#46 Tarzaan

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 17:48

another thinking outside the box attempt, I quite like the idea, but not sure if it is an 'easy fix':

Posted Image


Not soo bad. Maybe the best after my version:) But too much wood should be cut for this.

Edited by Tarzaan, 10 November 2012 - 17:55.


#47 my_own_shadow

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 18:03

another thinking outside the box attempt, I quite like the idea, but not sure if it is an 'easy fix':

They must be crazy!!! Did they forget that there is a Bernie statue right where they think to build a new straight after the first turn???!!!


#48 Zava

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:22

another great idea. :p
Posted Image

#49 Dolph

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:44

another great idea. :p
Posted Image


:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: Somebody's been Hocking some heim :rotfl: Hey does anybody remember Mr. Bolshevik, was it!? :clap:

#50 BigCHrome

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:04

another thinking outside the box attempt, I quite like the idea, but not sure if it is an 'easy fix':

Posted Image


That could turn into an amazing idea, if they did it correctly. Hint - make it into a fast slightly banked sweeper, similar to the glory days of Watkins Glen.

However, it's FIA and Tilke, they will make it completely horrible.