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Carlos Slim to Sauber: Gutierrez or no money


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#1 tarmac

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:28

According to reports from Mexican media Slim has been boasting around Austin that it must be a this driver or he is out of F1

Edited by tarmac, 17 November 2012 - 06:28.


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#2 Seanspeed

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:33

Its probably not a good sign about a driver's ability when your backers have to threaten teams to let you drive.

Edited by Seanspeed, 17 November 2012 - 06:34.


#3 DracoN

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:41

So Sauber wanna keep Kobayashi and Slim is angry now ?

Edited by DracoN, 17 November 2012 - 06:43.


#4 jals99

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:43

According to reports from Mexican media Slim has been boasting around Austin that it must be a this driver or he is out of F1

I heard only about his statements that Gutti will 100% drive for Sauber, he is not threat them, he just is sure he will be in Sauber, other sources are also sure, Esteban will be race driver in Sauber.


#5 Kelateboy

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 06:59

According to reports from Mexican media Slim has been boasting around Austin that it must be a this driver or he is out of F1

It would not be the first time that Peter Sauber has alienated his main sponsors/partners. Remember Red Bull and Petronas? The team used to be called Red Bull Petronas Sauber F1.

I am sure Carlos Slim will get his wishes. Because this time around, Sauber has no more main sponsors lining up to take the void if Carlos Slim decides to quit sponsoring the team.

#6 Sakae

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 07:03

Mr. Slim could buy HRT, and get his wish. I think that it would be better for Sauber that way, and I might feel good about it as well (since I want Kamu to remain in the sport).

#7 sesku

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 07:13

It would not be the first time that Peter Sauber has alienated his main sponsors/partners. Remember Red Bull and Petronas? The team used to be called Red Bull Petronas Sauber F1.

I am sure Carlos Slim will get his wishes. Because this time around, Sauber has no more main sponsors lining up to take the void if Carlos Slim decides to quit sponsoring the team.

It was called Red Bull Sauber Petronas. Red Bull leaves Sauber because they already purchase Jaguar F1 while Petronas leave Sauber because of BMW pullout and Petronas want to associate with manufacturer.

Edited by sesku, 17 November 2012 - 07:14.


#8 jals99

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 07:24

Are there any links for these articles? Internet now is just full of statesments of Slim that Gutti will drive for Sauber, but nothing about threats.

#9 dau

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 11:18

It was called Red Bull Sauber Petronas. Red Bull leaves Sauber because they already purchase Jaguar F1 while Petronas leave Sauber because of BMW pullout and Petronas want to associate with manufacturer.

In 2001, Sauber wasn't too happy with Red Bull's choice of young prospect Enrique Bernoldi as one of their drivers and instead insisted on some Finnish guy. Marko went ballistic and Red Bull sold their shares in the team to Credit Suisse. Red Bull remained as a sponsor through 2004, probably to honour their original agreement, but it was clearly a different kind of relationship.

#10 Jimisgod

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 16:27

F1 has chewed up many bozos with bigger wallets than brains, don't think you're going to be special, Carlos.

I will be delighted when Slim pays for repairs to all the cars Gutierrez damages out of his own pocket. Hopefully E. G. and his sugar daddy vacate the sport sooner rather than later and leave the cars to the talented folks.

#11 johnap

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:01

Sauber have stated that they will see what happens in the constructors championship (they are close to Merc) and then decide on the second driver. If they get ahead of Merc they might not need Mr Slim's money...

#12 jals99

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:08

Sauber have stated that they will see what happens in the constructors championship (they are close to Merc) and then decide on the second driver. If they get ahead of Merc they might not need Mr Slim's money...

Monisha yesterday said they would definetely announce second driver before Interlagos.



#13 kosmos

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:09

F1 has chewed up many bozos with bigger wallets than brains, don't think you're going to be special, Carlos.

I will be delighted when Slim pays for repairs to all the cars Gutierrez damages out of his own pocket. Hopefully E. G. and his sugar daddy vacate the sport sooner rather than later and leave the cars to the talented folks.



Did you have the same opinion about Perez too?.

#14 Disgrace

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:11

According to reports from Mexican media Slim has been boasting around Austin that it must be a this driver or he is out of F1


This is obvious, however, I'd like to know why he's found the need to "boast" unless provoked by Sauber.

#15 DanardiF1

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:34

Gutierrez would cost Sauber more money (and points) than Kobayashi would in repair bills... I expect that regardless of what money is being offered, Peter and Monisha have this to consider.

#16 Santosdf

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:56

Esteban's record in junior formulas is far better than Kamui's I don't know why is everybody writting down Esteban , there are several current f1 drivers that achived less before entering F1. I like Kamui and think he deserves a drive for 2013, but that is not Esteban's fault nor his sponsor.

#17 Jimisgod

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 17:58

Did you have the same opinion about Perez too?.


Nope. Because he wasn't obviously trying to bully the team into a decision that ultimately excluded a current driver using the treat of removing sponsorship. There was merely a free seat, not a "do as I say or I'm taking my toys and going home" situation.

#18 Fastcake

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 18:53

Nope. Because he wasn't obviously trying to bully the team into a decision that ultimately excluded a current driver using the treat of removing sponsorship. There was merely a free seat, not a "do as I say or I'm taking my toys and going home" situation.


Well Gutierrez is just trying to get a seat, he's hooked up with the person most likely to give him one. F1's not a pleasant business, and ultimately it's Slim's money to spend as he wishes.

#19 teejay

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 19:23

Gutierrez is another Pastor - raw speed that is tempered with accidents aplenty

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#20 DanardiF1

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 19:24

Did you have the same opinion about Perez too?.


Perez didn't spend his 2nd year in GP2 shooting himself in the foot despite being one of the faster guys in the field...

#21 jals99

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 19:27

Esteban's record in junior formulas is far better than Kamui's I don't know why is everybody writting down Esteban , there are several current f1 drivers that achived less before entering F1. I like Kamui and think he deserves a drive for 2013, but that is not Esteban's fault nor his sponsor.

Totally agree :) Very sad to see this Esteban hate...His results in junior formulas were better than Sergio's as well :)
And what's wrong with Slim wanting to leave if they would not sign Esteban? He sponsor drivers, not team. PDVSA will leave Williams, if they will fire Maldonado, and Sibur will leave Caterham if they would not extend Petrov's contract. Telmex and Slim are Perez and Gutierrez sponsors, not Suber

Edited by jals99, 17 November 2012 - 19:30.


#22 Baddoer

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 21:32

I guess Koba can go back to make sushi in Tokyo

#23 ayali

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 21:45

F1 has chewed up many bozos with bigger wallets than brains, don't think you're going to be special, Carlos.

I will be delighted when Slim pays for repairs to all the cars Gutierrez damages out of his own pocket.

LOL you've really no idea who Carlos Slim is do you :lol:
The man could buy F1 with his pocket change from Bernie and CVC

If Sauber wants to retain the sponsorship they'll do what Carlos (' underling) tells them to do.
Money talks, BS walks


#24 george1981

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 21:58

Sauber have stated that they will see what happens in the constructors championship (they are close to Merc) and then decide on the second driver. If they get ahead of Merc they might not need Mr Slim's money...


However if they get ahead of Merc and get Slim's money then they're really onto a winner. Sauber generally give good value for money, negating when they were owned and run by BMW, so they could really step up next year. It's unlikely that Gutierrez will be terrible, he might crash more than people would like but he should still get good results and Hulkenberg gets lots of praise; the team could be regular podium challengers occasional winners next year.

#25 Balths

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 22:21

F1 has chewed up many bozos with bigger wallets than brains, don't think you're going to be special, Carlos.

I will be delighted when Slim pays for repairs to all the cars Gutierrez damages out of his own pocket. Hopefully E. G. and his sugar daddy vacate the sport sooner rather than later and leave the cars to the talented folks.


You do know that Carlos Slim is worth $70billion.

He could buy F1 8 times.

Edited by Balths, 17 November 2012 - 22:27.


#26 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 22:29

'Worth' is a funny thing, it's rarely cash in the bank(which Bernie actually has a lot of). And he's not spending his money but the company money.


#27 One

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 22:34

You do know that Carlos Slim is worth $70billion.

He could buy F1 8 times.


IMHO, Sanber team is a very reliable team, in terms of business agreement. If Sauber must take unexperienced driver for money and risk losing championship position, then it is most logical that this sponsor to close contract for coming ten years investment on team at the level of say Santandair to Ferrari.

#28 Balths

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 22:35

'Worth' is a funny thing, it's rarely cash in the bank(which Bernie actually has a lot of). And he's not spending his money but the company money.


You don't have to tell me. I'm an Accountant mate.

And the valuation is based on rights and ownership of his liquid and non liquid assets.

It'd be safe to assume he could buy F1 atleast once with his liquid assets.

E.g. If a 20% stake in Telmex was market capped at £5bn, he could liquidate or sell off his equity, and tada...It's cash in the bank.

Obviously a simple illustration, but face it, cash in the bank is overrated and and if that's all Bernie has he should probably rethink that strategy.

#29 Balths

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 22:37

IMHO, Sanber team is a very reliable team, in terms of business agreement. If Sauber must take unexperienced driver for money and risk losing championship position, then it is most logical that this sponsor to close contract for coming ten years investment on team at the level of say Santandair to Ferrari.


Spot on.

End of the day if Sauber adhere or commit to Esteban... It'd be best practice to ask Slim to commit funds long term.



#30 Woody3says

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Posted 17 November 2012 - 23:19

Funny enough, all this talk of men with money. Mr Slim was chatting with George Lucas today in Austin.

#31 packapoo

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 06:08

Mr. Slim could buy HRT, and get his wish. I think that it would be better for Sauber that way, and I might feel good about it as well (since I want Kamu to remain in the sport).


True. He could.
Mind's boggling presently on this scenario, headquartered in Mehico even. :D

#32 Dolph

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:08

Nope. Because he wasn't obviously trying to bully the team into a decision that ultimately excluded a current driver using the treat of removing sponsorship. There was merely a free seat, not a "do as I say or I'm taking my toys and going home" situation.


Where was a free seat?

#33 nada12

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:25

In 2001, Sauber wasn't too happy with Red Bull's choice of young prospect Enrique Bernoldi as one of their drivers and instead insisted on some Finnish guy. Marko went ballistic and Red Bull sold their shares in the team to Credit Suisse. Red Bull remained as a sponsor through 2004, probably to honour their original agreement, but it was clearly a different kind of relationship.

I remember that bit. Not the proudest moment in Helmut Marko's F1 career. :lol:

#34 LiJu914

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:49

I hope Kobayashi can stay.

Mainly because Sauber and the fans would still have a benchmark for next year.  ;)


I guess it won´t happen though.

#35 string158

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:58

I always thought Saubers *thing* was having a real eye for picking young up coming talent. With that in mind I can only see him taking Slims money if a) he absolutely needs it, or b) he thinks the kid is going to perform.


#36 fisssssi

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 17:17

I guess Koba can go back to make sushi in Tokyo


Except he's not from Tokyo.

#37 charly0418

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 07:52

A lot of people in Mexico (including myself) don't believe Esteban will be successful in F1.

He's going to be in Sauber next season, no doubt about that, but I think he'll be a 1 and out pilot

#38 taran

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:19

I always thought Saubers *thing* was having a real eye for picking young up coming talent. With that in mind I can only see him taking Slims money if a) he absolutely needs it, or b) he thinks the kid is going to perform.


You´d have to qualify this statement...
Sauber has indeed picked a fair number of promising drivers but he also has pïcked a fair number of duds....(arguably) Wendlinger, Bouillon, Fontana were journeymen at best.

Besides, it has enjoyed pretty solid sponsorship in the past which allowed it to pick drivers on merit. Alas, where $30m would make you a solid midfield runner in the 90s, that ballooned to $100m in the 00s and I'd say its not much less these days. Which means commerical considerations are more important than (ever) before.

In the end, it wouldn't even be Sauber but Kaltenborn who decides....

#39 selespeed

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 08:27

i wouldn't call wendlinger a journeyman but ok...

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#40 noikeee

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 12:05

Wendlinger was quite good, but that massive Monaco shunt ruined his speed. Definitely a level above Bouillon and Fontana, and not really Sauber's fault things didn't go right for him.

Edited by noikeee, 19 November 2012 - 12:06.


#41 taran

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Posted 20 November 2012 - 09:43

i wouldn't call wendlinger a journeyman but ok...



Why not?

Sure, his accident probably ended any chance at a decent F1 career but even before he was considered the weakest of the Mercedes juniors.