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Should Alonso leave Ferrari?


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Poll: Should Alonso leave Ferrari? (187 member(s) have cast votes)

Should Alonso leave Ferrari?

  1. Yes, third year without win a WDC is a fiasco (31 votes [16.67%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.67%

  2. Yes, Ferrari don´t deserve Fernando (21 votes [11.29%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.29%

  3. No, Michael took five years to win a WDC (134 votes [72.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 72.04%

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#51 denthierry

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 00:34

Yep, that's why I know the Alonsada has been shouting asking for heads to roll and Alonso deserving to go to a better team for a while already. I think, the funniest moment was when they started to suggest he should go to Lotus after Bahrein.


Oh no pleaase... Can he please stop moving to whichever team Kimi "found first"?

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#52 fum3s

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 00:38

I voted, and then realized that my chosen option, and in fact all the options, can be read either way: putting the blame on Alonso or on Ferrari. Getting the driver you deserve cuts both ways, etc ...

#53 as65p

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 00:44

I'll be happy if Alonso leaves Ferrari .. for Ferrari's sake however.



That's exactly why I am happy when he leaves Ferrari.


My opinion on the thread question is "no".

That out of the way, your posts raise the obvious question a) do you think in his time at Ferraro Alonso has been bad for the team and b) what driver do you believe could do a better job with the cars available?



#54 Otaku

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 00:44

Well, im spanish and this is amazing, three years, and Ferrari isn´t able to give him a winning car.

After Austin qualy where Alonso with all updates qualified nineth, even his teammate Massa did better job.

Poll, you must vote if Alonso should leave Ferrari yet.

Thanks



Then maybe it wasn't the car's fault but Alonso's ?? :rolleyes:

#55 chrcol

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 00:56

ferrari 2nd best team in f1 atm.

reliable
good pit performance
good team support

only failure is aero.

so he is best to stay.

if his spa dnf didnt happen where would he be in standings?

#56 keeppari

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:00

Yes. Or maybe Ferrari could stop sucking the fat Santander tit and replace the wannabe samurai with someone who could actually seal the deal instead of choking year in, year out. The hype surrounding this guy is immense and yet he has failed to deliver since 2006.

#57 BernieEc

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:07

I think the same mate, but........


if Ferrari is a joke, what do you think Macca have been this year. I think macca has been worse. they are more like the village idiot.Okay thats HRT. more like the court jester

#58 Rentta

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:13

This must be one of the funniest polls i have seen here for a while.
I mean look at the choices :D

#59 Disgrace

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:13

Yes. Or maybe Ferrari could stop sucking the fat Santander tit and replace the wannabe samurai with someone who could actually seal the deal instead of choking year in, year out. The hype surrounding this guy is immense and yet he has failed to deliver since 2006.


Please elaborate on your list of superior choices.

If choking isn't your thing, I would guess you must look down on the current set of drivers when you have Vettel who creamed into Button in a title fight at Spa '10, Schumacher who drove into two WDC contenders during finales and stalled at another, Hamilton who lost his head at Fuji '08 two races from the end of the year and Button who qualified 14th at the event he won the title...

Edited by Disgrace, 18 November 2012 - 01:20.


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#60 keeppari

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:55

If choking isn't your thing, I would guess you must look down on the current set of drivers when you have Vettel who creamed into Button in a title fight at Spa '10, Schumacher who drove into two WDC contenders during finales and stalled at another, Hamilton who lost his head at Fuji '08 two races from the end of the year and Button who qualified 14th at the event he won the title...


Apart from the Schumi stuff, which is pretty much ancient history, all of those mentioned have actually won the title in their respective years. The definition of choking is having the title in the palm of your hand and pissing it away. That's pretty much the story of our samurai since the Renault years. I.e:

-2007 Fuji onwards
-2010 Abu Dhabi
-2012 Losing a healthy ~40 point WDC lead in effectively 2 races

#61 ASFA2011

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 01:56

Yes. Or maybe Ferrari could stop sucking the fat Santander tit and replace the wannabe samurai with someone who could actually seal the deal instead of choking year in, year out. The hype surrounding this guy is immense and yet he has failed to deliver since 2006.


The amount of hate and trolling on this post is quite unbelievable
First of all " to seal the deal " as you call it then you need to have the right equipment to do it ( as SV has ) , something that FA doesn't have currently and secondly do you even know what choking is ?

#62 sailor

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:02

Well, im spanish and this is amazing, three years, and Ferrari isn´t able to give him a winning car.

After Austin qualy where Alonso with all updates qualified nineth, even his teammate Massa did better job.

Poll, you must vote if Alonso should leave Ferrari yet.

Thanks

Where s the option ... No , he wont get this royal treatment anywhere and if he goes elsewhere will face the ignonimity of teaMmate defeat

#63 George Costanza

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:06

Yes. Or maybe Ferrari could stop sucking the fat Santander tit and replace the wannabe samurai with someone who could actually seal the deal instead of choking year in, year out. The hype surrounding this guy is immense and yet he has failed to deliver since 2006.



Other than Michael Schumacher, who would be better in that Ferrari?

#64 Disgrace

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:08

Apart from the Schumi stuff, which is pretty much ancient history, all of those mentioned have actually won the title in their respective years. The definition of choking is having the title in the palm of your hand and pissing it away. That's pretty much the story of our samurai since the Renault years. I.e:

-2007 Fuji onwards
-2010 Abu Dhabi
-2012 Losing a healthy ~40 point WDC lead in effectively 2 races


Your arguments are hopelessly simplistic, with total disregard to championship standings at the time of the events listed and cause of lost championships. Likewise you have declined to boost your position by naming superior drivers without an instance of an error in the twilight of a title battle. I can only assume you have no wish to debate.

#65 George Costanza

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:12

You can't compare Alonso with Schumacher's Ferrari eras... Schu clearly had more pressure on him, in fact, he had extreme pressure on him compared to Alonso.

#66 Massa

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:13

Ferrari give him a car able to have 31 podiums in three years. Only Vettel have more podium.
Ferrari give him a car capable enough to win 9 races since Bahrain 2010. Only Vettel have more win.
Ferrari give him a car capable enough to fight for WDC in 2010 and 2012.

So Alonso have to leave ? If he have to leave, it's only to go at Red Bull, because it's the only team who have been better than Ferrari since 2010.

In 2010, the Ferrari was better than all others car bar Red Bull. Mclaren faster before Silverstone, Ferrari faster after.
2011 : third fastest car. Mclaren and Red Bull were better... But the car was able to have 10 podiums... Like the F10.
2012 : 2nd in WCC, even with a poor Massa. 11 podiums ( !! ). And he had a chance to be WDC.

#67 JBLeon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:19

If Fernando wants to win another WDC his best chance will be in another team, not Ferrari.

#68 Creepy

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:26

Kimi, cielo, if you are trying to quote Lobato, you forgot to add that the only reason Alonso is still there fighting for the championship is the magic he does with the car every time he steps in it.


No need to be snide. After all, the only real reason why Alonso is still fighting the WDC is because of luck, eh? :rolleyes:

If It was up to me I'd mute both Lobato and the guys you find in the extreme oposite side bashing Fernando.

And to answer the thread, NO.

Edited by Creepy, 18 November 2012 - 02:28.


#69 Creepy

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:33

Ferrari give him a car able to have 31 podiums in three years. Only Vettel have more podium.
Ferrari give him a car capable enough to win 9 races since Bahrain 2010. Only Vettel have more win.
Ferrari give him a car capable enough to fight for WDC in 2010 and 2012.

So Alonso have to leave ? If he have to leave, it's only to go at Red Bull, because it's the only team who have been better than Ferrari since 2010.

In 2010, the Ferrari was better than all others car bar Red Bull. Mclaren faster before Silverstone, Ferrari faster after.
2011 : third fastest car. Mclaren and Red Bull were better... But the car was able to have 10 podiums... Like the F10.
2012 : 2nd in WCC, even with a poor Massa. 11 podiums ( !! ). And he had a chance to be WDC.


Yeah, who cares about the circumstances when you can go and throw them down the toilet and sum up seasons with barely 20 words.

#70 SvenF1

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:42

If Fernando wants to win another WDC his best chance will be in another team, not Ferrari.


He would have won it the first year at Ferrari if he hadn't made so many mistakes.

Also, he really has nowhere else to go. Mclaren don't want him. Based on his actions during the McLaren year, neither does Red Bull, and besides they already have Vettel. Lotus? Doubt they'll be anywhere in the future. Mercedes, doubt he would ever join Hamilton again. :lol:


#71 Reinmuster

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:56

Next year gonna be his last chance to win the title. Come 2014, Ferrari will struggle again with new regulation and Nando have to wait few more years to win again.

As for the question, I think he should stay and try to win by next year, if not he should join Red Bull in 2014.

Edited by Reinmuster, 18 November 2012 - 03:04.


#72 JBLeon

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 02:59

He would have won it the first year at Ferrari if he hadn't made so many mistakes.

Also, he really has nowhere else to go. Mclaren don't want him. Based on his actions during the McLaren year, neither does Red Bull, and besides they already have Vettel. Lotus? Doubt they'll be anywhere in the future. Mercedes, doubt he would ever join Hamilton again. :lol:


You'd be surprised with the Mercedes option... Brawn has always spoken very well of Fernando and I actually see that relationship working. I know Lewis is going to be there and all but... at this point it's all Alonso's got (and it's all his fault).

I don't this anybody in their right mind sees Ferrari being able to produce a car like the RB8 any time soon.

#73 kosmos

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 03:52

No, he should stay and will stay.

#74 Brother Fox

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:22

So RC has completed its transition into a humour website.

One bad qualy session while running a close second in the championship and he should leave????


#75 jstrains

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 04:33

I think going to Ferrari in 2010 was a logical decision he made. Whereelse should he go? McLaren? You never step in the same river twice. Red Bull? Noone expected them to become a team that would win constantly. Williams? Glory years are gone... :wave:

#76 BackOnTop

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:27

Q-Should Alonso leave Ferrari?
A- It's started already. Alonso-Ferrari till 2016 is a very strong combination.

Q-No, Michael took five years to win a WDC
A- While Kimi, the man Alonso replaced, did it in the first year.

His Off-Track CV sucks & is a hindrance for any team that's only interested in Racing with 2 strong drivers, & are not interested in Politics!!!

Edited by BackOnTop, 18 November 2012 - 12:40.


#77 packapoo

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:31

[quote name='F1ultimate' date='Nov 17 2012, 23:31' post='6028110']
To go where exactly?

He must've sucked quite a decent sum out of Santander - go and live on that. Anywhere!

Edited by packapoo, 18 November 2012 - 05:54.


#78 NotSoSilentBob

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:36

He can't go to McLaren, Red Bull have Vettel (and would promote from within rather than take Alonso), Lotus isn't faster than Ferrari (and I think there's some burned bridges there as well) and Mercedes won't take him either with Lewis there.

Alonso will finish his career at Ferrari, and they are a WDC contender almost every year so he's in the best seat he can get.


This.

What a whine-y thread this is to start. I think the poster's more annoyed about Vettel being on the verge of his third title, rather than Alonso. It's the same reason a whole bunch of Hamilton fans dont like Vettel... there's this sense that Vettel doesnt deserve his titles and "my favourite driver" deserves them more.

Alonso's got a great seat with Ferrari, arguably the plum F1 drive even considering Vettel & Webber's car.

#79 joshb

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:48

Not at all. The Ferrari cars are bullet proof, the team has operated at such a high level last year or 2. The only thing they miss is a better starting car and better development once they go themselves in the title race.
And the fact the opposition is so good to exploit any car advantage these days makes it harder than in MS early Ferrari days

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#80 skinnylizard

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 05:53

sure.. leave but have you thought about where he would go? who wants him? only two other teams have a winning combo for now and

McLaren - No
Red Bull - long shot but unlikely

besides its difficult to say who is going to be where next season.. things change very quickly.


#81 fifi

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:22

He can't go to McLaren, Red Bull have Vettel (and would promote from within rather than take Alonso), Lotus isn't faster than Ferrari (and I think there's some burned bridges there as well) and Mercedes won't take him either with Lewis there.

Alonso will finish his career at Ferrari, and they are a WDC contender almost every year so he's in the best seat he can get.


this

#82 topical

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:28

read the poll title and the first three words "well, i'm spanish" and stopped.

i'm just waiting for someone to now start a "should ferrari sack alonso?" thread.

#83 tomjol

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:47

Apart from the Schumi stuff, which is pretty much ancient history, all of those mentioned have actually won the title in their respective years. The definition of choking is having the title in the palm of your hand and pissing it away. That's pretty much the story of our samurai since the Renault years. I.e:

-2007 Fuji onwards
-2010 Abu Dhabi
-2012 Losing a healthy ~40 point WDC lead in effectively 2 races


This is quite clearly a ridiculous argument, and nullifies any other points you're making.

Edited by tomjol, 18 November 2012 - 10:47.


#84 toxicfusion

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 10:53

Q-No, Michael took five years to win a WDC
A- While Kimi, the man Alonso replaced, did it in the first year.


Ah! this again. Don't mention how McLaren's implosion allowed Kimi to snatch the title, nor how the car Kimi was driving was an evolution of the 2006 car which by the end of the season was the fastest out there. By the time Kimi left the car was no longer as strong or as competitive.

Since 2009 Ferrari have been all over the place with car development, occasionaly getting it right but more often than not (particularly through 2011 and 2012) finding things don't add up quite how the wind tunnel and CFD had suggested.

Edited by toxicfusion, 18 November 2012 - 10:53.


#85 kartinhero

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:10

Where's the option: Yes, Fernando doesn't deserve Ferrari

#86 PapaD

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:10

Who else could he go to?

He's at ferrari till the end of his career.

Maybe they can persuade jean Todt to 'realign' the FIA along more '2000s' values! :)

#87 Wander

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:14

Ferrari is the only top team that's left for Alonso as many have already pointed out. I really don't know if he's going to win a championship for them, but I have a feeling that eventually he will.

#88 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:14

Alonso's got no place to go now does he. He's been at Renault (Lotus) twice now, moving a third time wouldn't really be ideal. He's been at McLaren, the cold atmosphere there didn't help much. Red Bull is occupied by Vettel. So no, he can't really go anywhere. Though I would love to see him try again at McLaren. I mean, Lewis is leaving and Ron Dennis is long gone, so the atmosphere is a lot less cold now.

#89 motorhead

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:29

Since 2009 Ferrari have been all over the place with car development, occasionaly getting it right but more often than not (particularly through 2011 and 2012) finding things don't add up quite how the wind tunnel and CFD had suggested.


That puts Alonso´s car developing and team leading skills in whole new light, doesn´t it :cool:

#90 SCUDmissile

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:34

Point is invalid, as the only team doing a better job than Ferrari right now is RedBull.
Just because Hamilton left McLaren, doesn't mean other top drivers want to do the same ;)

Edited by SCUDmissile, 18 November 2012 - 11:34.


#91 Lord_Shaitan

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:35

It's Adrian who should leave Red Bull...

#92 toxicfusion

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:46

That puts Alonso´s car developing and team leading skills in whole new light, doesn´t it :cool:



If the wind tunnel isn't doing what its supposed to, the first time they find out is when the driver has the parts on a Friday bar some straight line tests but that can't test what the parts are like through corners. All the skill in the world can't make a part that's been through a dodgy wind tunnel work properly.

This is Aero-F1 where aero rules supreme and last I checked Fernando wasn't an aerodynamicist.

Edited by toxicfusion, 18 November 2012 - 11:47.


#93 motorhead

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:49

This is Aero-F1 where aero rules supreme and last I checked Fernando wasn't an aerodynamicist.


Actually when he joined Ferrari everybody seemed to believe he is

#94 toxicfusion

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:50

Actually when he joined Ferrari everybody seemed to believe he is


Considering the R29 I doubt that. :drunk:

#95 garoidb

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 11:52

Alonso's got no place to go now does he. He's been at Renault (Lotus) twice now, moving a third time wouldn't really be ideal. He's been at McLaren, the cold atmosphere there didn't help much. Red Bull is occupied by Vettel. So no, he can't really go anywhere. Though I would love to see him try again at McLaren. I mean, Lewis is leaving and Ron Dennis is long gone, so the atmosphere is a lot less cold now.


If Vettel goes to Ferrari, maybe Alonso would go to Red Bull, who knows? Perhaps they would prefer to promote one of their youung drivers. As for McLaren, I think they need to strengthen their driver line up for 2014 versus 2013. Ideally, they would find the next young star (I am not convinced about Perez) but, if not, then they might need to look at established stars such as Kimi or even Alonso if either became available. Maybe the bridges are too badly burned, but stranger things have happened.

#96 turssi

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:12

As for the question, I think he should stay and try to win by next year, if not he should join Red Bull in 2014.


Red Bull seems to have an impossibly big markwting budget, so yeah, they might pay the contractual fines and use Alonso to replace Webber. Why not?

#97 HP

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:24

My opinion on the thread question is "no".

That out of the way, your posts raise the obvious question a) do you think in his time at Ferraro Alonso has been bad for the team and b) what driver do you believe could do a better job with the cars available?

First of all let me say that Alonso has IMO been one of the best, if not the best driver this year. His driving quality at Ferrari has been in general great.

But to a) For example, when he lost the WDC in 2010. That was mainly blamed on the strategy call that Ferrari made at Abu Dhabi. But if you look closely, there were more races in 2010. And in some of them Alonso could have done better. Just in one race a little bit better, and he'd won the championship. But few people want to look at it that way, especially not his fans.
And how many times have we heard from him in some way this year that the car is bad, but he's so good? The car isn't as bad as Alonso makes it look like. With Massa doing better, WCC would be still a realistic possibility for Ferrari, and even not, 2nd or 3rd it will be. There are many people that work very hard to give him a car that enables him to even stay within striking distance for the WDC. Just being grateful when you win, is not helping the team to move forward. And Alonso is also not helping F1 in general, if he talks down Vettel's achievements of this year. Vettel is as worthy to win the championship as Alonso. He doesn't do any favor to himself with this kind of attitude, even though he arguably is the best ATM. I mean, if we all agree that he's the best, then we just hand him the WDC at Melbourne and be done with it. Nobody want's that however, since they do have to earn their trophies in the races. And to me it's either you get the job done with the equipment you have at your disposal, or you don't. If you don't make it shut up and try harder next time. It's not that anyone forced him at gun point to drive for Ferrari. He has to live with the decisions he made.

b) I can't answer you that question for certain, except for Massa obviously not getting the job done. But I go out on a limb and say that I believe Hamilton and Vettel could do as good a job as he does. Vettel IMO has a better way to work with and for his team, which sometimes is exactly what is required to make the difference between a win and an also ran. There's no way I could prove this however. Same goes for Hamilton, who IMO would overall qualify better than Alonso does, which sometimes also makes the difference between a win or an also ran. This year for example Hamilton might have ended up one or 2 places further up in qualifying than Alonso (remember that qualifying was 10 (LH) :7 (FA) for Hamilton in 2007, with Hamilton being a rookie), which had enabled him to stay out of trouble instead of being taken out by other drivers at the start. In that case, everything else similar, the Ferrari driver would still be ahead of Vettel in points. (Never mind about Alonso leading in the WDC and still moaning about his bad Ferrari, might get you the idea, why I think Alonso is way off with his stance on things)

Ok there's a lot of if's that we simply don't know how things had worked out.

And it works both ways, Ferrari agreed to have Alonso, which bugs me even more. For me Ferrari winning with Massa, would mean so much more and it'd be much better for Ferrari. Not that I think it will happen anytime, but one can always dream..

Edited by HP, 18 November 2012 - 12:31.


#98 Kelateboy

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:51

Why is the team a joke?

Because it can't beat Red Bull, the team that is backed by years of experience in manufacturing energy drinks in Asia, especially Thailand. :)

#99 Miggeex

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:52

There's not really better place for him than Ferrari at the moment. And Red bull probably has their own driver plans so they wouldn't most likely take Alonso. (Costs too much)

It really is funny how many people are downplaying Ferrari and throwing suggestions like "should Alonso leave Ferrari?" I'm not really a fan of Alonso or Ferrari but the people who are, it's quite weird really.
I've always thought that Ferrari fans would never say that some DRIVER should leave the team. It has been more like the TEAM should consider getting rid of someone.

(I know. There's a difference between Ferrari-fan and Alonso-fan.)

But yeah I think that Alonso fits perfectly in Ferrari. Same culture and similar perspective towards the sport.

Edited by Miggeex, 18 November 2012 - 12:54.


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#100 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 18 November 2012 - 12:53

Because it can't beat Red Bull, the team that is backed by years of experience in manufacturing energy drinks in Asia, especially Thailand. :)

Come on now. Ferrari had the best car at the end of 2010. It was sheer luck that Vettel got the title there. If Alonso hadn't followed Webber into the pits that early, nothing would have happened and Alonso would have been champion in his first year at Ferrari.