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Confirmed: Bottas to replace Senna


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#151 stillOrange

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:10

Very happy to see a new driver coming into F1.

I hope he will fulfill some rather big expectations that some posters here have for him.

Is it only me or he looks a bit chubby or overweight?

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#152 motorhead

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:34

Very happy to see a new driver coming into F1.

I hope he will fulfill some rather big expectations that some posters here have for him.

Is it only me or he looks a bit chubby or overweight?


He is doing triathlons so I think he is one of those fittest guys in the paddock...

#153 Zava

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:40

He is doing triathlons so I think he is one of those fittest guys in the paddock...

yup, when I read about the runthattrack on hungaroring from a hungarian journo, he wrote that Bottas won the round with 15:30, that equals 17 kph average speed, not bad at all ;)

#154 BoschKurve

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:42

Very happy to see a new driver coming into F1.

I hope he will fulfill some rather big expectations that some posters here have for him.

Is it only me or he looks a bit chubby or overweight?


Why wouldn't there be expectations?

After all, Williams has been singing about how fast he is. For their sake, I hope they are right on this.

#155 Topsu

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:47

This will be good. I predicted this in 2007 :p

#156 spacekid

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:48

I'm cautiously optimistic about this. I don't think Surname is an F1 driver - nice kid and all, but I think Maldonado has shown him up pace wise this year - and Bottas looks like a good candidate for the future.

I am hopeful that Williams are being forward looking with this one. I'm much more pleased than I would have been if Senna had been announced for another year, which would surely have been only financial.

#157 motorhead

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:53

yup, when I read about the runthattrack on hungaroring from a hungarian journo, he wrote that Bottas won the round with 15:30, that equals 17 kph average speed, not bad at all ;)


Yeah, here is the link. :)

#158 stillOrange

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:54

He is doing triathlons so I think he is one of those fittest guys in the paddock...


Thank you for that info.

Why wouldn't there be expectations?

After all, Williams has been singing about how fast he is. For their sake, I hope they are right on this.


Who said there shouldn't be expectations? :)
As you said, Williams talk him up, few here hope for him to be a new Kimi. I just genuinely hope he will meet these expectations. We need more great drivers.

#159 rubbersoul

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 15:59

Thank you for that info.



Who said there shouldn't be expectations? :)
As you said, Williams talk him up, few here hope for him to be a new Kimi. I just genuinely hope he will meet these expectations. We need more great drivers.



He can never be a new Kimi.

Edited by rubbersoul, 28 November 2012 - 16:02.


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#160 911

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 16:00

Happy for Bottas. I've been impressed with him in P1 this year. I think Williams will have 2 talented drivers next year.

#161 olliek88

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:13

I like Senna, i think he has decent potential but a combination of the Pirelli's style and shortage of FP1's have resulted in him under performing a bit IMHO, hopefully he gets a ride next season.

However, its as clear day that BOTTAS as much, much more potential and, if the things being said about BOTTAS are to be believed, he good be a "real deal" type of driver, i'm glad a young driver with not much money has been given a chance based almost entirely on his talent.

Also, Williams get a big :up: from me. They, unlike one top team who clearly settled for a driver because of the "commercial opportunities" he presents :rolleyes:, went for talent.

#162 BoschKurve

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:42

I like Senna, i think he has decent potential but a combination of the Pirelli's style and shortage of FP1's have resulted in him under performing a bit IMHO, hopefully he gets a ride next season.

However, its as clear day that BOTTAS as much, much more potential and, if the things being said about BOTTAS are to be believed, he good be a "real deal" type of driver, i'm glad a young driver with not much money has been given a chance based almost entirely on his talent.

Also, Williams get a big :up: from me. They, unlike one top team who clearly settled for a driver because of the "commercial opportunities" he presents :rolleyes:, went for talent.


I think he is still bringing somewhere around 10 million if the 3/4 the amount Bruno brought claim is accurate. So it's not as if he comes with not much money.

But regardless, what he brings is enough, and hopefully his talent can convince sponsors that backing Williams F1 is a worthy endeavor.

#163 Risil

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 18:59

Also, Williams get a big :up: from me. They, unlike one top team who clearly settled for a driver because of the "commercial opportunities" he presents :rolleyes:, went for talent.


Your statement there's got a Venezuelan giant sloth in the room.

BK: Really? Bottas bringing £10m in sponsorship? Joe Saward and Edd Straw (warning, Autosport paywall) both suggest in their reports that Bottas is bringing little money with him.

#164 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:05

Though there's a bit of an issue when one of the senior management gets a % of his earnings.

#165 darkkis

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:07

Though there's a bit of an issue when one of the senior management gets a % of his earnings.

I guess it's pretty much the same thing at Lotus (with Grosjean). Except that the one to earn is the team manager. :lol:

Edited by darkkis, 28 November 2012 - 19:07.


#166 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:11

That's a little different because Gravity is sort of the driver development program of Lotus F1. Bottas is probably better than Senna and the in-car experience he's had will help a lot, but I don't know if he's better than 10% of their budget?

But I'd much rather have Bottas-level conflict of interest than the Susie Stoddart/Wolff nonsense.


#167 Anderis

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:30

BK: Really? Bottas bringing £10m in sponsorship? Joe Saward and Edd Straw (warning, Autosport paywall) both suggest in their reports that Bottas is bringing little money with him.

Bottas doesn't bring £10m, but he is likely to bring around $10m.

This says Bottas managed to get a sponsorship package which equals to about 3/4 of what Bruno Senna brings. Bruno is believed to bring around $12-15 million per year.

And Toto confirms there are some Finnish sponsors coming:

"I think we are all aware that operations have to be financed: finance plays an important role. In that case for us important to have best possible package," Wolff explained.

"Valtteri has partners committed to follow him into F1. We have an omnipresent commercial reality, [so] I'm happy to say [Valtteri] did a great job on and off the track. He was quite successful in Finland securing backing."

source

#168 autosportfan

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:51

I think he is still bringing somewhere around 10 million if the 3/4 the amount Bruno brought claim is accurate. So it's not as if he comes with not much money.

But regardless, what he brings is enough, and hopefully his talent can convince sponsors that backing Williams F1 is a worthy endeavor.


Finland has 5 million people vs Brazil's 193 million. There is no way Bottas could manage 10 m. Senna also has his famous name...


#169 Risil

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 19:54

Bottas doesn't bring £10m, but he is likely to bring around $10m.

This says Bottas managed to get a sponsorship package which equals to about 3/4 of what Bruno Senna brings. Bruno is believed to bring around $12-15 million per year.


Very interesting, thanks. I suppose a driver who's as nailed-on for a good F1 seat as Bottas was would find it a little easier to raise the backing. But still, really promising. :up:

#170 Anderis

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:02

Finland has 5 million people vs Brazil's 193 million. There is no way Bottas could manage 10 m. Senna also has his famous name...

Well, Venezuela is neither the biggest nor the richest country around there, but Maldonado is the one who has much larger backing than any racing driver nowadays.

Finland has a small population but it's much richer than Brazil.

It's about finding people or companies who want to invest in you. I think Bottas had to gather around $10 m because there would be nothing to talk about otherwise. Toto clearly suggested Bottas did well in finding sponsorship backing. I'm sure he wouldn't say that if what Bottas managed to gather is not a large part of what Bruno brings.

#171 Eff One 2002

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:33

The writing was on the wall really. Senna underperformed at Williams and this is the consequence. If the above post is true about what Bottas brings it's also clear it's not because Bottas was more attractive sponsorship-wise either if he brings less bucks with him.

#172 race addicted

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:37

Finland has some serious forest-industry, Nokia, and Valmet/Valtra, owned by Agco, but I guess they could still sponsor a finnish driver.

#173 GustavoB

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:51

Ok it's deal done, and the hype now it's huge....
let's see if he is the next Kimi Raikkonen, or next Kovalainen? or ever worst the next Pizzonia!!
I remember FW praising so much Pizzonia. A lot of people saying that he was better and more agressive than Montoya.
One year after that he was pure rubbish.
So people, don't let your expectations be so high!!





#174 Szoelloe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 20:51

Well, Venezuela is neither the biggest nor the richest country around there, but Maldonado is the one who has much larger backing than any racing driver nowadays.

Finland has a small population but it's much richer than Brazil.

It's about finding people or companies who want to invest in you. I think Bottas had to gather around $10 m because there would be nothing to talk about otherwise. Toto clearly suggested Bottas did well in finding sponsorship backing. I'm sure he wouldn't say that if what Bottas managed to gather is not a large part of what Bruno brings.



He is 'chavez' backed. Quite disgusting. Wouldn't be surprised if he would turn up with a red star on his chest next season. That Bottas could raise that kind of backing suggests his talent has been noticed, and considered to be a profitable to invest in. Nowadys, that's a feat.

#175 motorhead

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:06

Well, Venezuela is neither the biggest nor the richest country around there, but Maldonado is the one who has much larger backing than any racing driver nowadays.

Finland has a small population but it's much richer than Brazil.

It's about finding people or companies who want to invest in you. I think Bottas had to gather around $10 m because there would be nothing to talk about otherwise. Toto clearly suggested Bottas did well in finding sponsorship backing. I'm sure he wouldn't say that if what Bottas managed to gather is not a large part of what Bruno brings.


Have you ever studied how that Chelsea F.C owner got so rich in russia, that is not possible in a normal democratic country. These countries where the power and the money is concentrated to few everything seems to be possible, even if normal workin people struggle for food

"Roman Abramovich has been alleged to be involved in various wrongdoings. The Times[30][40] said that Abramovich "famously emerged triumphant after the “aluminium wars”, in which more than 100 people are believed to have been killed in gangland feuds over control of the lucrative smelters. He avoided the fate of a rival oligarch who annoyed the Kremlin and ended up being transported to jail in Siberia for ten years," and "Numerous officials and executives are said to have lost their lives". Nonetheless, many of the allegations against Abramovich are unproven and he has never been convicted of any crime in any world court."

BBC reporter John Sweeney asked a Russian editor: “Is Mr Abramovich more powerful than the gangsters?” The Russian paused, then smiled: “Good observation
from Wikipedia


#176 Garagiste

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:15

I can't help feeling a bit sorry for Senna, though I'm not entirely certain why - hardly unfair to say he didn't make the most of the opportunity.
Ah well, good luck with finding another seat, and Bottas, if you're as good as Sir Frank seems to think then you are more than welcome to the fold!

#177 Andrew Hope

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:18

You know what my problem with Bottas is? There's been an influx of idiots allowed onto the grid who have not enough experience to properly drive in Formula 1. Grosjean and Maldonado were the two worst offenders of the 2012 season. Remember, everyone says both of them are fast...sort of like Bottas. I don't feel like seeing another young driver who has spatial awareness problems.


Posted Image

Edited by Andrew Hope, 28 November 2012 - 21:19.


#178 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:20

Saying Grosjean and Maldonado didn't have enough experience makes me think you don't follow any racing outside of F1.

#179 Risil

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:20

Posted Image


:up:

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#180 kpchelsea

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:22

Senna showed he's not good enough for a good car, i mean is Maldonado really that quick, his backing may find him a seat in a slower car, i think Bottas will be far more competitve

#181 tarmac

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:25

Maldonado is backed by socialist governments oil company. $35m basically taken from the people of venezuela

#182 BoschKurve

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:26

Posted Image


Yes, and Frank Williams happened to be turning 70 years old that weekend.

The Pirelli Tire Lottery Sweepstakes was in full swing back then.

#183 BoschKurve

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:29

Saying Grosjean and Maldonado didn't have enough experience makes me think you don't follow any racing outside of F1.


They don't have enough experience in how to drive fast, and to stay out of trouble in race situations.

Maldonado had the lifetime ban at Monaco for nearly killing a marshal that got overturned due to his benefactor.

Grosjean had the first race ban in F1 in what, 18 years?

#184 Sammyosammy

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:36

There is no way Bottas could manage 10 m.


This.

And if could, still would not. He won't be joining the grid because of money. Those companies mentioned would never pay that kind of amounts. He'll be there for another sort of reason. Get used with it.


#185 rubbersoul

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:36


I remember how Kimi 2001 came formula 1 and astonished all. If Bottas to the same kind of attitude and determination, as Kimi immediately at the beginning of the season, he is a winner type. This is how I think.

#186 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:49

Maldonado is backed by socialist governments oil company. $35m basically taken from the people of venezuela


Uh, do you know how private oil companies work? They certainly don't reimburse that money to the citizens...

#187 Szoelloe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:52

Uh, do you know how private oil companies work? They certainly don't reimburse that money to the citizens...


With all due respect Ross, do you know how socialist governments work? ^^^ that' says you're pretty naive.

#188 BoschKurve

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:54

Uh, do you know how private oil companies work? They certainly don't reimburse that money to the citizens...


PDVSA is state-owned. It's not a privately held company.

#189 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:55

If PDVSA was privately owned, or on the stock market, how would it be different? The profits would be distributed all over the world to shareholders. I doubt they'd even do F1.

#190 Sammyosammy

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 21:56

Just about report some posts. Isn't there some politics thread to continue in...?

:rolleyes:

Edited by Sammyosammy, 28 November 2012 - 21:58.


#191 Szoelloe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 22:12

Just about report some posts. Isn't there some politics thread to continue in...?

:rolleyes:


NOT seriously derailed, but off topic, yes, sorry. Might as well move the posts to a separate thread, as you say, would deserve one.

#192 Rosberg

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 22:33

Hopefully, Williams can produce a good car which can be in the same position as this season or better and if they can, I believe they will go further than this season.

#193 BRG

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 22:34

So Bottas is just yet another pay driver buying a seat in F1? And he doesn't even have the merit of being a GP2 champion. I trust he will be treated with the same level of disdain as other pay-drivers.

Edited by BRG, 28 November 2012 - 22:35.


#194 Szoelloe

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 22:38

So Bottas is just yet another pay driver buying a seat in F1? And he doesn't even have the merit of being a GP2 champion. I trust he will be treated with the same level of disdain as other pay-drivers.


? How did you come to that conclusion?

#195 TT6

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:19

? How did you come to that conclusion?


Fennophobia I guess... :drunk:


#196 skinnylizard

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:20

i feel bad for Senna, his last name is a double edged sword to begin with. Bottas seems to be Wolf's boy and Maldo was a winner as well as has hefty sponsors.

His results this year have not been that bad.. he has been in the points for half the races or so. He is a little far off in the points but not that much although Maldonado got pole and the win.I hope he lucks into a seat with Force India or something.

Edited by skinnylizard, 29 November 2012 - 08:22.


#197 Sammyosammy

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:24

i feel bad for Senna, his last name is a double edged sword to begin with.


Think he himself is the one who chose to use the name?

#198 skinnylizard

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:25

I think it's a sad day when Williams F1 takes a guy based on him bringing money with sponsors. Runs in stark contrast with the way Frank used to run the team.


didnt SFW once choose to give up Honda engines coz he did not want Nakajima as a driver?

Edited by skinnylizard, 29 November 2012 - 08:26.


#199 The Kanisteri

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:39

So Bottas is just yet another pay driver buying a seat in F1? And he doesn't even have the merit of being a GP2 champion. I trust he will be treated with the same level of disdain as other pay-drivers.


I real while Senna and about ten million dollars to back him and Bottas is paid one million. I also read claims sponsor deals Bottas have, brings team 3/4 of amount Senna would have.
I don't believe last bit. Valtteri has few finnish sponsor to bring in F1, but no way they would pay together - for example - 7.5 million dollars . They are way too small business for it.


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#200 skinnylizard

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 08:47

Think he himself is the one who chose to use the name?



i am sure he did.. it makes motorsport doors easier to open im sure but immediately requires results too !