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Ferrari boss: Vettel over Hamilton


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#101 George Costanza

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 05:29

Ruthless and obsessed arguably not. Steely determined, completely focused and very hard working yes.



I agree.

Ruthless would describe Ayrton.

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#102 redbarron

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 06:12

If Ferrari are firing warning shots at Alonso to pick up his game, then I think he should leave. He had an enormous season in 2012, and has hardly put a step wrong. I can't see any reason why they would pick Vettel over Alonso at this stage of their careers! Ferrari need to get that extra step or two and give their drivers the best cars, not close to the best!!

#103 swerved

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 07:47


If someone has tried to perpetuate the myth that lewis is TDG, and that absolutely any and every team would want him then it must have come as a bit of a shock when Red Bull shut the door, and now Ferrari publicly say they'd prefer the younger and more successful Vettel it probably makes the realisation even more undeniable.


Vettel was the youngest WDC, and he's won every one since he won his first one, its really litttle surprise that he's probably the driver that any and every team would want.

As for Fernando, Luca's comments may well be a shot across his bows, Ferrari were convinced he would lead the team to victory it seems, that hasn't happened, perhaps its only natural that Luca might be wondering whether Vettel might have got the job done.

#104 stanga

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 07:54

But things can change, it only takes a Brawn rocket to give a very healthy push to ones career.
Right Jenson ;)


Or a Newey rocket to define one's career.

#105 SmokeScreen

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 08:32

Seems that every other F1 article references Hamilton even though he dropped out of the title race way before Kimi( who by dint of being “the man” keeps right out of it), didn’t even finish his last race for Mclaren and is in the no-man’s land of inbetween teams! perhaps it’s that last one that explains all the pot shots.

and to think that he is the one person not out in public giving his own ‘sound bites’- i’ve never bought into the Hamilton should change “to fit my ideal F1 driver “school (similar syndrome to a woman marrying a man and then trying to change him – didn’t you know what you were getting yourself in to from the start?) but if I were to indulge (as one should every now and then) I would hope that he takes a leaf from Kimi’s book of ‘leave me alone’ & continues to ignore the running commentaries from the autosports, stewarts, buttons, warnocks, vettels, montis, planet f1s, Crash, BBC F1 and general internet riff raff.

-feel a bit sorry for some of us fans and non-fans, he will definitely be one of the talking points next season it would have been nice to enjoy a ‘no Hamilton news’ lull in advance of that but looks like it is not meant to be.


#106 Kelateboy

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:04

At least by stealing Seb, Ferrari would probably weaken RBR a little too as well as geting an overall superior driver than Massa.

I doubt that snatching Vettel alone from RBR would weaken the team. Ferrari needs more key players from RBR to make the switch favorable to them.

If there is a slot open at RBR with Vettel leaving for Ferrari or any team, I won't be surprised if Hamilton and Alonso willing to drive for RBR for free.

#107 apoka

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:27

If there is a slot open at RBR with Vettel leaving for Ferrari or any team, I won't be surprised if Hamilton and Alonso willing to drive for RBR for free.

I would be surprised. The car differences likely won't be huge in the mid term and they have high salaries.


#108 undersquare

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:27

I have seen Senna being even more animated once, and no one called him an idiot because of that. Comments on Vettel are not always based on comparative standards, and that's fine, I say, learn to live with it if you don't like it, it's your problem only.

Well nobody would have said 'I want Senna to drive for me because he's not arrogant', would they? :drunk:

It's not a problem for me at all, I'd love Sebi to go to Ferrari. Anyway it's just a great example of Monty being a self-important clown who's great for Ferrari's competitors.

#109 H2H

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:30

Apart form the obviously bitter fans of drivers who lost, lost and lost again in the WDC fight and are grasping for straws which are no longer there some points are pretty interesting. Replying to such stupidities would be rather pointless so I won't do it. I really have just to laugh after such idiocy. :p

Keep in in mind that Luca might be arguably biased a bit by having more of the Fernando side of the story when it comes to his McLaren days. It is also obvious that the language bit favours Seb as he already speaks some Italian ( with a clear German accent ;) ) and knows the Italian mentality well after having worked for an Italian team, going along very well indeed with the true Italian. For a person which does not speak a second language it will be very hard to better a guy speaking a second one extremely well and having already a decent handling on a third and a fourth. From this perspective the advantage of Seb is obvious indeed.

Edited by H2H, 22 December 2012 - 10:31.


#110 rasul

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:39

For a person which does not speak a second language it will be very hard to better a guy speaking a second one extremely well and having already a decent handling on a third and a fourth.


English, German, a bit of Italian, and? What's fourth?

#111 H2H

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:43

English, German, a bit of Italian, and? What's fourth?


French. In the end he is German and not too far away from the French border. Spanish is on the rise in Germany though. In general Germans are quite handy with foreign languages: better then the Italians, much better then the French and we won't even mention the British...

Of course some Europeans are still a much better on average.

Edited by H2H, 22 December 2012 - 10:46.


#112 rasul

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:46

French.


I thought he spoke Finnish.

#113 H2H

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:48

I thought he spoke Finnish.


Just words and prelearned sentences. Actually he cursed in Finnish speaking to Kimi before they go on the podium in Abu Dhabi. Not that anybody not Finnish got that quickly.

Finnish is also not Indoeuropean.

Edited by H2H, 22 December 2012 - 10:50.


#114 undersquare

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 10:51

Oh dear, oh dear that's not even Paul Hembery you numpty but Mario Isola
Clueless much??

Anything to deflect the fact that de Montezemolo would chose Vettel over your boy.
What's next, Luca is a racist?

It makes no difference which supplier's rep it was. Vettel was quite obviously behaving VERY arrogantly when he didn't think there was a camera on him.

Taking advantage of his status in F1 to behave so disrespectfully and avoid the consequences that would normally follow. The only driver who would behave like that I think. I can't imagine how that will go down in Maranello...

#115 Group B

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 11:22

It makes no difference which supplier's rep it was. Vettel was quite obviously behaving VERY arrogantly when he didn't think there was a camera on him.

Taking advantage of his status in F1 to behave so disrespectfully and avoid the consequences that would normally follow. The only driver who would behave like that I think. I can't imagine how that will go down in Maranello...

:lol:
Vettel has undeniably had petulent/arrogant outbursts, but to single him out from a field that includes Lewis 'monkeys at the back' Hamilton is stupifyingly obtuse.

#116 Cult

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 11:24

It makes no difference which supplier's rep it was. Vettel was quite obviously behaving VERY arrogantly when he didn't think there was a camera on him.

Taking advantage of his status in F1 to behave so disrespectfully and avoid the consequences that would normally follow. The only driver who would behave like that I think. I can't imagine how that will go down in Maranello...


They'd absolutely love it, Ferrari care so much about winning. The means are sometimes irrelevant and I'm not saying this as a criticism.

#117 bub

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 11:46

Decent article. I can see LdM's reasoning but I think Vettel is all about winning and unless Ferrari improve and/or Red Bull regress, I can't see Vettel wanting to go to Ferrari.

#118 BenettonB192

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 13:03

It makes no difference which supplier's rep it was. Vettel was quite obviously behaving VERY arrogantly when he didn't think there was a camera on him.

Taking advantage of his status in F1 to behave so disrespectfully and avoid the consequences that would normally follow. The only driver who would behave like that I think. I can't imagine how that will go down in Maranello...


Man you're going on and on about an indicident in a race where there were genuine safety concerns on side of RBR and Vettel.
Not to mention your cultural bias in misinterpreting the severety of the scene as others have already pointed out.

#119 2ms

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 13:09

Is it possible at all for Ferrari to change drivers? I really don't seem them getting another sponsor like Santander. Does anyone else? if not, this all seems rather academic.

Edited by 2ms, 22 December 2012 - 13:09.


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#120 robefc

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 13:51

French. In the end he is German and not too far away from the French border. Spanish is on the rise in Germany though. In general Germans are quite handy with foreign languages: better then the Italians, much better then the French and we won't even mention the British...

Of course some Europeans are still a much better on average.


:D

#121 undersquare

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 14:08

Man you're going on and on about an indicident in a race where there were genuine safety concerns on side of RBR and Vettel.
Not to mention your cultural bias in misinterpreting the severety of the scene as others have already pointed out.

No it's Vettel fans and Hammy bashboys going on and on arguing that Sebi can't possibly be arrogant. But he obviously is, as we also hear on the radio quite regularly. Cultural bias lol, there's nowhere that being in somebody's face like that isn't grossly disrespectful. Anyway my point was about Monty, but various members defending Vettel.

The safety concerns were Vettel's team putting too much camber on and Pirelli quite rightly advising less. Sebi though deciding to pick on an easier victim than Adrian Newey.

If Monty had said 'not boastful' I'd have agreed, but he said 'not arrogant' and IMO he's quite mistaken. Though the main thing seems to be age. Bring it on anyway: Sebi vs Nando and Lewis with Newey :up: .

#122 jjcale

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 14:33

Just words and prelearned sentences. Actually he cursed in Finnish speaking to Kimi before they go on the podium in Abu Dhabi. Not that anybody not Finnish got that quickly.

Finnish is also not Indoeuropean.


[OT]

Finnish is an Indoeuropean language.... it is just not in the same family as the German or latin based languages or the slavic languages to cover most of Europe .... the closest is Hungarian which is in the same Uralic language family.

[/OT]

SV is very bright ... he can learn anything he wants to IMO.... just like most of the other drivers.

#123 SpaMaster

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 14:35

No it's Vettel fans and Hammy bashboys going on and on arguing that Sebi can't possibly be arrogant. ..

I haven't seen anything like it.

#124 tkulla

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 15:26

As much as I despise the idea of agreeing with LdM, I would go with Vettel over Hamilton. In fact, I would go with Vettel over Alonso as well.

That's not to say that I think Seb is faster or better than Fernando or Lewis. If I was picking based on pure speed on the track I'd go with Lewis, who I think is as quick (or quicker) than Vettel in qualifying (and quicker than Alonso). They all have great race pace and consistency, but I'd say Lewis is a bit better than Seb when things aren't going great (the German's impressive recovery drive in Brazil notwithstanding).

So why pick Vettel? Simple - he's the one that would be easiest to live with, which is to say he'd generate the least amount of drama by far.

I'm fascinated by how Ferrari handle Alonso. They go out of their way to support his personal PR efforts designed to big himself up (and talking the car down) and make sure his teammate is absolutely no threat (not claiming sabotage but selection of teammate and operational structure make it difficult for the #2 to compete, just as in Michael's days). This kid gloves treatment is surprising from a team that once fired Alain Prost for (rightly) claiming that his Ferrari was awful (and actually bad, not just a couple of tenths off the pace).

Lewis brings a circus wherever he goes. The guy is just fascinating to people and that means media madness. It's going to be very interesting at MercedesGP next year because there will be tons of coverage of what they're doing. Since Ferrari is already this kind of a circus, the combination could be explosive. Lewis is also prone to "-gates" and I shudder to think how LdM would respond to something like tweet-gate.

So I'd opt for Seb. All three guys can win the championship if the car is there or thereabouts, so I'd take the guy who makes the sailing the smoothest. He wouldn't care who his teammate is and doesn't need his ego stroked continuously, and for a 3x WDC flies under the radar pretty well.

Edited by tkulla, 22 December 2012 - 16:50.


#125 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 15:56

No it's Vettel fans and Hammy bashboys going on and on arguing that Sebi can't possibly be arrogant. But he obviously is, as we also hear on the radio quite regularly. Cultural bias lol, there's nowhere that being in somebody's face like that isn't grossly disrespectful. Anyway my point was about Monty, but various members defending Vettel.

The safety concerns were Vettel's team putting too much camber on and Pirelli quite rightly advising less. Sebi though deciding to pick on an easier victim than Adrian Newey.

If Monty had said 'not boastful' I'd have agreed, but he said 'not arrogant' and IMO he's quite mistaken. Though the main thing seems to be age. Bring it on anyway: Sebi vs Nando and Lewis with Newey :up: .



Red Bull doesn't want Lewis though so this isn't going to happen.

Seems that none of the top teams want Lewis, McLaren - Red Bull - Ferrari are all moving forward with other plans. Hamilton was a bit over-rated anyway imo and perhaps he is best matched as a driver with a second tier team such as Mercedes.

It is an opportunity for him to lead a rebuilding of Mercedes, if he can do it then maybe a team like Ferrari will change their opinion of Lewis vs Seb. If not though then I expect that Hamilton will finish his F1 career with Mercedes and then move to greener pastures in America.

Edited by halifaxf1fan, 22 December 2012 - 16:01.


#126 boldhakka

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 16:01

As much as I despise the idea of agreeing with LdM, I would go with Vettel over Hamilton. In fact, I would go with Vettel over Alonso as well.

That's not to say that I think Seb is faster or better than Fernando or Lewis. If I was picking based on pure speed on the track I'd go with Lewis, who I think is as quick (or quicker) than Vettel in qualifying (and quicker than Alonso). They all have great race pace and consistency, but I'd say Lewis is a bit better than Seb when things aren't going great (the German's impressive recovery drive in Brazil notwithstanding).

So why pick Vettel? Simple - he's the one that would be easiest to live with, which is to say he'd generate the least amount of drama by far.

I'm fascinated by how Ferrari handle Alonso. They go out of their way to support his personal PR efforts designed to big himself up (and talking the car down) and make sure his teammate is absolutely no threat (not claiming sabotage but selection of teammate and operational structure make it difficult for the #2 to compete, just as in Michael's days). This kid gloves treatment is surprising from a team that once fired Alain Prost for (rightly) claiming that his Ferrari was awful (and actually bad, not just a couple of tenths off the pace).

Lewis brings a circus wherever he goes. The guy is just fascinating to people and that means media madness. It's going to be very interesting at MercedesGP next year because there will be tons of coverage of what they're doing. Since Ferrari is already this kind of a circus, the combination could be explosive. Lewis is also prone to "-gates" and I shudder to think how LdM would respond to something like tweet-gate.

So I'd opt for Seb. All three guys can win the championship if the car is there or thereabouts, so I'd take the guy who makes the sailing the smoothest. He wouldn't car who his teammate is and doesn't need his ego stroked continuously, and for a 3x WDC flies under the radar pretty well.


:up: Top post, agree with almost everything. I do think that there are teams and team management that can handle a little drama as long as it comes with wins, and Ferrari is such a team. But your point is well taken.

#127 PassWind

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 17:33

If someone has tried to perpetuate the myth that lewis is TDG, and that absolutely any and every team would want him then it must have come as a bit of a shock when Red Bull shut the door, and now Ferrari publicly say they'd prefer the younger and more successful Vettel it probably makes the realisation even more undeniable.


Vettel was the youngest WDC, and he's won every one since he won his first one, its really litttle surprise that he's probably the driver that any and every team would want.

As for Fernando, Luca's comments may well be a shot across his bows, Ferrari were convinced he would lead the team to victory it seems, that hasn't happened, perhaps its only natural that Luca might be wondering whether Vettel might have got the job done.



I agree with the summation on Vettel and Hamilton however I do not think the commentary was a shot over the bow of Alonso if anything he reinforced his faith in him and his outstanding season, and that Ferrari think he is the best driver on the grid right now, I thought it was pretty clear Alonso now and preferably Vettel later when Alonso hangs them up, I don't think Alonso is going to hang around for ever in the sport and right now he is in magnificent form, with a slightly better package he will win another WDC.

The wild card in the whole scheme of things is Lotus and Kimi, if they produce a great car it will be on for literally young and old next year but will not sway Ferrari's long term driver situation or any other teams for that matter.

#128 Lone

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 18:06

As much as I despise the idea of agreeing with LdM, I would go with Vettel over Hamilton. In fact, I would go with Vettel over Alonso as well.

That's not to say that I think Seb is faster or better than Fernando or Lewis. If I was picking based on pure speed on the track I'd go with Lewis, who I think is as quick (or quicker) than Vettel in qualifying (and quicker than Alonso). They all have great race pace and consistency, but I'd say Lewis is a bit better than Seb when things aren't going great (the German's impressive recovery drive in Brazil notwithstanding).

So why pick Vettel? Simple - he's the one that would be easiest to live with, which is to say he'd generate the least amount of drama by far.

I'm fascinated by how Ferrari handle Alonso. They go out of their way to support his personal PR efforts designed to big himself up (and talking the car down) and make sure his teammate is absolutely no threat (not claiming sabotage but selection of teammate and operational structure make it difficult for the #2 to compete, just as in Michael's days). This kid gloves treatment is surprising from a team that once fired Alain Prost for (rightly) claiming that his Ferrari was awful (and actually bad, not just a couple of tenths off the pace).

Lewis brings a circus wherever he goes. The guy is just fascinating to people and that means media madness. It's going to be very interesting at MercedesGP next year because there will be tons of coverage of what they're doing. Since Ferrari is already this kind of a circus, the combination could be explosive. Lewis is also prone to "-gates" and I shudder to think how LdM would respond to something like tweet-gate.

So I'd opt for Seb. All three guys can win the championship if the car is there or thereabouts, so I'd take the guy who makes the sailing the smoothest. He wouldn't care who his teammate is and doesn't need his ego stroked continuously, and for a 3x WDC flies under the radar pretty well.


I have to agree with you. What, in my opinion, separates Vettel from Hamilton is that he's a more complete driver, like Alonso. Hamilton only impresses me with his speed, that's it. What separates Vettel from Alonso is that the team has a greater possibility to also win the WCC since I believe Vettel doesn't have the same demands as Alonso. But as long as Alonso is available I wouldn't take any of the two mentioned since I believe Alonso has the strongest will to win, and that's what makes him stand above any driver in F1 today, even if Vettel comes close.


#129 Skinnyguy

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 18:15

No surprise, Vettel is as good as anyone. Of course people would like him to drive their cars. I wouldn´t dare saying who I´d prefer to drive my cars from the top 4 guys in F1 right now, every choice would make sense.

#130 Group B

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 18:16

One of Vettel's better attributes is not sulking; he might have a brief petulent paddy when things go wrong, but he generally clears his head pretty quickly, gets calm and focused and finds a way to eliminate/minimise the problem.

#131 Skinnyguy

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 18:18

One of Vettel's better attributes is not sulking; he might have a brief petulent paddy when things go wrong, but he generally clears his head pretty quickly, gets calm and focused and finds a way to eliminate/minimise the problem.


:up: :up:

He´s a hot head inside the cockpit when things get ugly, as pretty much everyone in the grid. But once the heat dissipates he´s much smarter, honest and straight forward than Lewis and Alonso.

#132 fabr68

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 22:22

I'm fascinated by how Ferrari handle Alonso. They go out of their way to support his personal PR efforts designed to big himself up (and talking the car down) and make sure his teammate is absolutely no threat (not claiming sabotage but selection of teammate and operational structure make it difficult for the #2 to compete, just as in Michael's days). This kid gloves treatment is surprising from a team that once fired Alain Prost for (rightly) claiming that his Ferrari was awful (and actually bad, not just a couple of tenths off the pace).


You must be even more fascinated on how Fry and Ferrari themselves came out at the end of pre-season testing and said the car was bad. All the media said the car was bad and even Luca himself said the car was bad. How dare Ferrari didnt fire Alonso for saying the same damn thing.

Massa scoring 25 points in the first 10 races was also Alonso's fault.

You may keep on dreaming but what Luca is really saying is that neither Hamilton or Vettel will be paired with Alonso until his exit. Letting Alonso go to Red Bull so Vettel can confirm their car still have issues could be too much of an embarrassment.


#133 robefc

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 00:09

Red Bull doesn't want Lewis though so this isn't going to happen.

Seems that none of the top teams want Lewis, McLaren - Red Bull - Ferrari are all moving forward with other plans. Hamilton was a bit over-rated anyway imo and perhaps he is best matched as a driver with a second tier team such as Mercedes.

It is an opportunity for him to lead a rebuilding of Mercedes, if he can do it then maybe a team like Ferrari will change their opinion of Lewis vs Seb. If not though then I expect that Hamilton will finish his F1 career with Mercedes and then move to greener pastures in America.


a) I'll think you'll find macca did
b) I think RB's decision re: wanting Lewis might change if they lost vettel

#134 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 02:12

Is it possible at all for Ferrari to change drivers? I really don't seem them getting another sponsor like Santander. Does anyone else? if not, this all seems rather academic.

Alonso and Vettel

Why do you assume Alonso must go?

For Ferrari WCC is also important, even if not so much as with McLaren team.

#135 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 02:14

You may keep on dreaming but what Luca is really saying is that neither Hamilton or Vettel will be paired with Alonso until his exit.

Why not?

Ferrari can afford to have two good drivers. :up:

Citroen had Loeb AND McRae AND Sainz . :up: :up:

If Citroen can manage to keep three superstars togehter, I am pretty sure Ferrari can deal with just two.

#136 Velocifer

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 03:03

Think I agree with LdM. Honestly, I think Vettel is just a better driver than Hamilton

Imo the interesting bit in Montezemolo's statements is that it's as much about personality than driving. This obviously mean it's something that comes back to ultimate performance in getting the team motivated and so on, and LdM can no doubt see it working extremely well at RBR where Horner and Newey makes no secret how they really like Vettel, and likewise not so well with the moods and 'gates' with Hamilton at McLaren. Maybe RBR turning down Hamilton was for the same reasons what LdM says about the importance of having the driver in "a good environment without peer troubles", so could be that teams know there is a risk of disharmony with Hamilton and best not take the chance.

#137 mattferg

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 03:26

Red Bull doesn't want Lewis though so this isn't going to happen.

Seems that none of the top teams want Lewis, McLaren - Red Bull - Ferrari are all moving forward with other plans. Hamilton was a bit over-rated anyway imo and perhaps he is best matched as a driver with a second tier team such as Mercedes.

It is an opportunity for him to lead a rebuilding of Mercedes, if he can do it then maybe a team like Ferrari will change their opinion of Lewis vs Seb. If not though then I expect that Hamilton will finish his F1 career with Mercedes and then move to greener pastures in America.


Remember: RBR didn't want Lewis to replace Webber, and Ferrari didn't want Lewis to replace Massa, not Alonso or Vettel. It has nothing to do with Lewis's gaffes or media circus, and has everything to do with reducing driver conflict. Alonso, Vettel and Hamilton are the top three drivers on the grid and to say to one of them that the other has number one status or any form of unequal advantage would create havoc. RBR don't have a firm one driver policy like Ferrari - if Webber's gonna win a race they'll let him win it, but they'd never approve of two WDCs causing havoc in the team - remember 2007.

#138 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 03:41

a) I'll think you'll find macca did
b) I think RB's decision re: wanting Lewis might change if they lost vettel


Macca said they were interested in keeping Hamilton but their negotiating stance (Dennis saying a pay reduction was on the table) and the speed in which they announced Perez, even before Merc could announce their signing of Hamilton, indicated otherwise to me.

In this article Horner puts their young driver program as the main reason that Hamilton wasn't a consideration for them,
http://www1.skysport...t-want-Hamilton.

But who knows what the future holds, they may want him in three years time if Vettel is leaving and their young driver program doesn't produce a good candidate.



#139 slmk

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 04:37

Macca said they were interested in keeping Hamilton but their negotiating stance (Dennis saying a pay reduction was on the table) and the speed in which they announced Perez, even before Merc could announce their signing of Hamilton, indicated otherwise to me.

In this article Horner puts their young driver program as the main reason that Hamilton wasn't a consideration for them,
http://www1.skysport...t-want-Hamilton.

But who knows what the future holds, they may want him in three years time if Vettel is leaving and their young driver program doesn't produce a good candidate.


Me thinks that their reactions (Michael, Whitmarsh, Dennis) when Lewis won in Italy, Abu Dhabi and got commanding poles at many tracks at the end of the season, comfortably ahead of his teammate say enough... it definitely looks like he turned down their offers...

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#140 gerry nassar

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 04:52

Vettel would be less of a hassle for Alonso if he were to join than if Lewis was to re-team with him. The comments also mean its very likely Vettel will be there sooner rather than later.



#141 tkulla

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 12:40

Macca said they were interested in keeping Hamilton but their negotiating stance (Dennis saying a pay reduction was on the table) and the speed in which they announced Perez, even before Merc could announce their signing of Hamilton, indicated otherwise to me.

In this article Horner puts their young driver program as the main reason that Hamilton wasn't a consideration for them,
http://www1.skysport...t-want-Hamilton.

But who knows what the future holds, they may want him in three years time if Vettel is leaving and their young driver program doesn't produce a good candidate.



Antonio Felix da Costa will be the one to replace Vettel when he trots off to wear red. The kid is special.



#142 tkulla

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 12:41

Vettel would be less of a hassle for Alonso if he were to join than if Lewis was to re-team with him. The comments also mean its very likely Vettel will be there sooner rather than later.


No way does a Alonso/Vettel combination happen - Fernando is far too concerned with his legacy to risk being beaten by Sebastian.


#143 BenettonB192

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 14:12

No way does a Alonso/Vettel combination happen - Fernando is far too concerned with his legacy to risk being beaten by Sebastian.


Thing is this can be out of his sphere of influence quickly if Vettel continues to win wdc's and he doesn't. Imagine Vettel wins another one next year, which i think is a real possibility. Then he has as many titles as Prost while still a few years off from his peak as a driver. A team like Ferrari will have a strong interest to secure his service while he's nearing and on top of his peak even if it means to hurt Alonso's sensibilities.

#144 H2H

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 14:59

Vettel would be less of a hassle for Alonso if he were to join than if Lewis was to re-team with him. The comments also mean its very likely Vettel will be there sooner rather than later.


Less of a hassle - more of a problem...

#145 joshb

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 15:12

After all the crap Ferrari were spouting in the final third of the year and beyond, Vettel might think the best way to avoid being the victim of the politics is to go there and join the team who is spreading the politics.



#146 Seanspeed

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 16:07

No way does a Alonso/Vettel combination happen - Fernando is far too concerned with his legacy to risk being beaten by Sebastian.

Alonso doesn't call the shots at Ferrari.

After all the crap Ferrari were spouting in the final third of the year and beyond, Vettel might think the best way to avoid being the victim of the politics is to go there and join the team who is spreading the politics.

Red Bull dont play the 'politics' game just as much? C'mon now.

Edited by Seanspeed, 23 December 2012 - 16:08.


#147 Skinnyguy

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 16:22

Red Bull dont play the 'politics' game just as much? C'mon now.


If we talk about politics as their drivers management, they try to make their other driver help when he´s out of it -same as Ferrari-, but Webber can ignore them and keep doing whatever he feels. Felipe can´t. Ferrari gets more out of this aspect of "politics".

And if we talk about "politics" as rule changes and FIA influence, RB is simply the target right now. No one cared about exhaust gasses helping aerodynamic performance for ages, but as soon as they got a big performance advantage in that area, it suddenly turned out to be something bad and it got banned/limited. But hey, that´s not because they´re RB, that´s because they´re winning, that happens with everyone. Ferrari was target of stupid rule changes last decade.

So no, RB is not getting any advantage from politic games right now.

#148 Seanspeed

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 16:29

If we talk about politics as their drivers management, they try to make their other driver help when he´s out of it -same as Ferrari-, but Webber can ignore them and keep doing whatever he feels. Felipe can´t. Ferrari gets more out of this aspect of "politics".

And if we talk about "politics" as rule changes and FIA influence, RB is simply the target right now. No one cared about exhaust gasses helping aerodynamic performance for ages, but as soon as they got a big performance advantage in that area, it suddenly turned out to be something bad and it got banned/limited. But hey, that´s not because they´re RB, that´s because they´re winning, that happens with everyone. Ferrari was target of stupid rule changes last decade.

So no, RB is not getting any advantage from politic games right now.

Its not about who is getting an advantage or not, its about the fact that they do play that game. Suggesting that Vettel leave to avoid being a 'victim' of politics is hilarious. Its just the stereotypical 'evil Ferrari' nonsense.

#149 Skinnyguy

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 16:39

Its not about who is getting an advantage or not, its about the fact that they do play that game.



They do, but they get no profit at all. If anything, they sometimes managed to not get too heavily damaged (2011 mid season rule changes about EBD aborted). Of course RB will try to make things go their way regarding areas like rule changes, but right now they´re not in a position to make anything happen for them.

Suggesting that Vettel leave to avoid being a 'victim' of politics is hilarious. Its just the stereotypical 'evil Ferrari' nonsense.


True. If Ferrari wants him, it´s not to screw him, it´s to race for them. How things go once in there is just another matter. But there´s no point on expecting anything fishy to happen beforehand. That´s nonsense.

It´s like that Montoya fanboys story: McLaren paid big money for him to screw him. Well, no, they paid him to drive their cars, but it didn´t go well. Or like that Räikkönen fanboys story about Ferrari trying to screw him. No, they paid him to drive their cars but things didn´t go as expected. Or that Alonso fanboys story about McLaren paying big bucks for him to then sabotage him. No, they paid him to drive their cars, and it didn´t go well. How Vettel+Ferrari will go is a mystery, but one thing is for sure: they won´t pay to get him and screw him.

#150 Seanspeed

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 16:50

I think we might actually agree on something here. :)