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Mercedes-AMG 2013 W04


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#1001 kankshitbharos

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 02:41

Degradation looks definitely worse than the top cars. I think as of right now they are at about the level they were at in early 2010 - easy Q3, but don't have the race pace of Lotus, Red Bull and McLaren.


Been looking at the data, it showed no sign of being worse than other top team in term of tyre degradation and race pace. I don't get it why you guys kept slamming the team and give all credit to Lewis. They been working hard and recovered well from the setback.

In fact, Force India has the most impressive tyre wear throughout the whole grid.



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#1002 dhill39

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 02:59

Ted thinks Mercedes might be learning Lewis is hard on the car?! (3-4 minutes before the end)

http://www1.skysport...o/12870/8482681


I thought once Lewis move on from Jenson,that it would stop,it looks like bad press will never end with Lewis.

#1003 kankshitbharos

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 03:27

I thought once Lewis move on from Jenson,that it would stop,it looks like bad press will never end with Lewis.



how is that bad press?? driver tries different stuff in testing and get used to the tyre with different driving style.

Lewis might be pushing to see how far he could go for the new tyres, Ted might be observing during that particular period.

The press media should kept on praising Lewis as perfect in order to silence the critic.

#1004 Juggles

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 03:28

I assume this was posted but I only just listened to it, so for the benefit of anyone who didn't:

Hamilton 5 Live interview 25 Jan

It sounds like the Mercedes shifts at the top aren't concerning him too much. He's doing what he should and focussing on the driving. I'm looking forward to Barcelona.

#1005 BigCHrome

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 04:32

Been looking at the data, it showed no sign of being worse than other top team in term of tyre degradation and race pace. I don't get it why you guys kept slamming the team and give all credit to Lewis. They been working hard and recovered well from the setback.

In fact, Force India has the most impressive tyre wear throughout the whole grid.


I haven't said anything about Hamilton's driving all thread long. However from what I'm seeing, Merc can barely do 4 consecutive laps within the same second, while RB9 could string 6-7 with no problems.

I assume this was posted but I only just listened to it, so for the benefit of anyone who didn't:

Hamilton 5 Live interview 25 Jan

It sounds like the Mercedes shifts at the top aren't concerning him too much. He's doing what he should and focussing on the driving. I'm looking forward to Barcelona.


I agree, it's good that he's not trying to run the team, leave that to the people who specialize in that.

#1006 F1ultimate

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 10:23

I thought once Lewis move on from Jenson,that it would stop,it looks like bad press will never end with Lewis.


It's not bad press. Besides it's testing and if you hiring a top driver, as a team you would want to find know whether the car is durable enough when a driver needs to compensate for a car's lack of pace by driving it at the very limit. We are only in the infancy of the season so there is much more stress that the W04 will be put through and hopefully it will be able to handle it given that the car will genuinely be slower than a few rivals.

#1007 femi

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 11:21

I haven't said anything about Hamilton's driving all thread long. However from what I'm seeing, Merc can barely do 4 consecutive laps within the same second, while RB9 could string 6-7 with no problems.

I agree, it's good that he's not trying to run the team, leave that to the people who specialize in that.



What gave the idea the LH tends to want to run a team? That is more JB's territory don't you think?

#1008 olliek88

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 12:58

What gave the idea the LH tends to want to run a team? That is more JB's territory don't you think?


No.

As Brawn put quiet nicely you're either part of the solution or part of the problem. No driver is the solution, only part of it, the same way they are part of a team, pretty much every good driver worth his salt understands this, including JB.

#1009 revlec

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 13:42

Please this is the Mercedes car(team) thread!!!

#1010 revlec

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 13:46

And Schumacher was a noob?
Don't get me wrong, I do think Hamilton cán develop a car, but I'm not so sure if that's enough...


You clearly missed the point.

Hamilton input as of today will me more valuable than an input from MSC.
MSC has retired in 2006, where testing, regulations, tyres, simulator, development methods where all different.
It has nothing to do with the titles.
_
Hamilton was driving a McLaren just months ago. Rosberg and Schumacher have not been part of this kind of team in the last years.

#1011 ivand911

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 14:24

You clearly missed the point.

Hamilton input as of today will me more valuable than an input from MSC.
MSC has retired in 2006, where testing, regulations, tyres, simulator, development methods where all different.
It has nothing to do with the titles.
_
Hamilton was driving a McLaren just months ago. Rosberg and Schumacher have not been part of this kind of team in the last years.

We clearly know nothing about what input drivers give. Brawn is not feeling secure(his position) and is kissing Lewis ass now. Simple. Lewis can make comparison with McLaren car. It is not like MS and Nico didn't wanted more downforce in the car. True is team is changed a lot. Different aero team and design team. It is not driver fault that team used the same failed aero designer for last 3 years. But Lewis and his DF demands are just funny. Everyone know that more DF is better, so he can shut up. If driver words ,can produce more DF, his W04 would have the most of it. Now they just simulate work. I don't know how McLaren will manage without the second coming. When there is nobody to push them for more aero(DF). :drunk:


#1012 KiloWatt

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 15:18

We clearly know nothing about what input drivers give. Brawn is not feeling secure(his position) and is kissing Lewis ass now. Simple. Lewis can make comparison with McLaren car. It is not like MS and Nico didn't wanted more downforce in the car. True is team is changed a lot. Different aero team and design team. It is not driver fault that team used the same failed aero designer for last 3 years. But Lewis and his DF demands are just funny. Everyone know that more DF is better, so he can shut up. If driver words ,can produce more DF, his W04 would have the most of it. Now they just simulate work. I don't know how McLaren will manage without the second coming. When there is nobody to push them for more aero(DF). :drunk:


I thought MS fans wanted him to leave the team, why are some of you so sour now that he's gone?

#1013 pinkypants

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 15:34

http://www.formula1....13/2/14261.html

"Q: Your memory must still be fresh of how the McLaren felt - a car that won seven races last season? How does the F1 W04 compare?
LH: Well, on the first day I basically did only installation laps and then I suffered a crash. My second day was pretty promising. The aim was to do as much mileage as possible - and we did 145 laps. That is not bad for a day’s work. As the track is very abrasive, we basically ran hard and medium tyres so you are not looking massively at lap times. Very clearly the car is at an early stage. And as I have no comparison to Mercedes’ 2012 car I have to get acquainted from zero - and that takes time. Overall the feeling is positive and comparing with the past is not my thing."


#1014 senna da silva

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 15:59

http://www.formula1....13/2/14261.html

"Q: Your memory must still be fresh of how the McLaren felt - a car that won seven races last season? How does the F1 W04 compare?
LH: Well, on the first day I basically did only installation laps and then I suffered a crash. My second day was pretty promising. The aim was to do as much mileage as possible - and we did 145 laps. That is not bad for a day’s work. As the track is very abrasive, we basically ran hard and medium tyres so you are not looking massively at lap times. Very clearly the car is at an early stage. And as I have no comparison to Mercedes’ 2012 car I have to get acquainted from zero - and that takes time. Overall the feeling is positive and comparing with the past is not my thing."


No kiss and tell. Lol.

#1015 ivand911

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:15

I thought MS fans wanted him to leave the team, why are some of you so sour now that he's gone?

Where did you read that? I am sorry he is not in F1, but sour? MGP is not F1. I was talking about some comments. About DF. Because surprise, surprise nobody from MGP knew what DF means before Lewis join them. :p

"I think we’ve made it very clear to Lewis that he’s part of the solution," Brawn told reporters at Jerez. "You have a choice in a team; are you the problem, or are you the solution? He’s part of the solution to get us where we want to be. I think he knows that and understands that, and I think he’s relishing it.
"It’s correct that he gives us reference points and helps us understand what we have to focus on. I think some of it we already knew, and that’s why we restructured the aerodynamic group. I welcome that approach. It needs to be positive and it needs to be constructive. Criticism of the right sort is always helpful to drive a team forward."

http://www.gpupdate....solution-brawn/

What this mean? MS was the problem? So much BS in one sentence. When Brawn is responsible for the last 3 years , and he is the problem. If this all don't work out well, then we can accept that the great "solution" didn't help much. He is putting to much responsibilities in the driver. I guess Nico is not part of the solution?

Edited by ivand911, 09 February 2013 - 16:36.


#1016 Clatter

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:20

http://www.formula1....13/2/14261.html

"Q: Your memory must still be fresh of how the McLaren felt - a car that won seven races last season? How does the F1 W04 compare?
LH: Well, on the first day I basically did only installation laps and then I suffered a crash. My second day was pretty promising. The aim was to do as much mileage as possible - and we did 145 laps. That is not bad for a day’s work. As the track is very abrasive, we basically ran hard and medium tyres so you are not looking massively at lap times. Very clearly the car is at an early stage. And as I have no comparison to Mercedes’ 2012 car I have to get acquainted from zero - and that takes time. Overall the feeling is positive and comparing with the past is not my thing."


That sounds like a politicians answer, completely avoids the original question.

#1017 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:25

That sounds like a politicians answer, completely avoids the original question.


Which he obviously should. Since he left Mc he seems to be somewhat more mature in terms of how, when and what he communicates. He was asked that question by every other reporter, I assume he is fed up with it. Plus, he has answered it, and everybody knows that. Good on him.


#1018 teejay

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:26

Of course it is, and of course it ALWAYS will be.

Anything said will be twisted by the media.

Its a fight he doesnt need, and could unintentionally damage his relationship with Merc.

#1019 F1ultimate

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:28

That sounds like a politicians answer, completely avoids the original question.


And I think it's great. He has moved on and it's about time journalists move on too and stop asking him questions about Mclaren. He's been polite the past weeks and reflected back on his previous team, but he's now a Mercedes driver who shouldn't have to answer every question with a reference point to Mclaren.

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#1020 BernieEc

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:33

Niki Lauda has his say


http://www.gptoday.c..._three_in_2013/

but Mercedes can be a top-three contender in 2013. That is the claim of Niki Lauda, the triple world champion who is also the straight-talking expert pundit for German television RTL.
But he is also now Mercedes’ 10 per cent shareholder and board chairman, and despite an up-and-down Jerez debut for the new Brackley-built W04, Lauda sounded optimistic about the future.
“My big joy is that the Mercedes can now compete with the top three teams,” he told Bild newspaper.
But Lauda acknowledged that world champion Vettel, who drives for Red Bull, is still in front.
Asked to assess the opening four test days of the 2013 pre-season, he said: “The cars are relatively close together.
“In my judgement Vettel is the fastest at the moment. The car works well; looks reliable, and right now he is a bit faster than the rest.”



#1021 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:36

Niki Lauda has his say


http://www.gptoday.c..._three_in_2013/


Yep. We have a Marko clone all to ourselves.


#1022 Markn93

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:38

Well I hope he's right about being in the fight. That's all I ask for, for the time being. Then let the drivers do their thing.

#1023 Shiroo

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:49

Yep. We have a Marko clone all to ourselves.

but Mercedes isnt a Red Bull

#1024 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:52

but Mercedes isnt a Red Bull


you don't say...


#1025 KiloWatt

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 16:58

Where did you read that? I am sorry he is not in F1, but sour? MGP is not F1. I was talking about some comments. About DF. Because surprise, surprise nobody from MGP knew what DF means before Lewis join them. :p


Thank you for proving my point.


#1026 techspeed

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 17:04

Where did you read that? I am sorry he is not in F1, but sour? MGP is not F1. I was talking about some comments. About DF. Because surprise, surprise nobody from MGP knew what DF means before Lewis join them. :p


http://www.gpupdate....solution-brawn/

What this mean? MS was the problem? So much BS in one sentence. When Brawn is responsible for the last 3 years , and he is the problem. If this all don't work out well, then we can accept that the great "solution" didn't help much. He is putting to much responsibilities in the driver. I guess Nico is not part of the solution?

Because Hamilton gives them good reference points. He can compare the W04 with recent McLarens so Mercedes can learn where they have shortcomings in car design, aerodynamics, race procedures, engineering, etc.
Having someone who has recently won many races will be able to show you where a top team is better than you currently are. If you don't have a recent driver from a top team you don't know exactly where they are making more speed than you are and exactly where you need to improve..

#1027 Clatter

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 18:08

Because Hamilton gives them good reference points. He can compare the W04 with recent McLarens so Mercedes can learn where they have shortcomings in car design, aerodynamics, race procedures, engineering, etc.
Having someone who has recently won many races will be able to show you where a top team is better than you currently are. If you don't have a recent driver from a top team you don't know exactly where they are making more speed than you are and exactly where you need to improve..


You don't need a driver to tell you that. They know exactly where they are deficient, making the corrections is a another matter.

#1028 jjcale

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 18:43

Niki Lauda has his say


http://www.gptoday.c..._three_in_2013/


Seems about right ...

#1029 BernieEc

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 18:52

Seems about right ...


I would like to agree with you but the thing is I am yet to hear or see any other journalist or trackside observer mention Merc in the same breath as the top 3, but I guess Lauda knows more than me. So for now I keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best

#1030 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:27

I would like to agree with you but the thing is I am yet to hear or see any other journalist or trackside observer mention Merc in the same breath as the top 3, but I guess Lauda knows more than me. So for now I keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best


+1

Personally, I find Jerez with the ups and downs to be very promising. They found themselves on the wrong end of the stick on the first two days, and then they came back in style. They have shown some stamina, which I think is very important. They had developed the car in two days, and showed signs of a pretty strong track team, working flawlessly. That really is, as I said before a huge development. All that though, positive as it is, does not really shed any light on the performance of the W04 yet. As a design, it is clear that it is way more complex than for instance GA has given it credit for. There are some features on the car that seem to induce some head-scratching. So, if they keep this up in Barcelona, maybe we can see this car evolving bit by bit on the next two test sessions. For now, I don't care what Lauda says.

So, fingers crossed, yes.


#1031 Nigol

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:29

Melbourne Q3 and I will be happy.

#1032 JRizzle86

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:31

I think Lauda may be ambitious to say he is aiming for third. To be third they have to remove either Red Bull, Ferrari or McLaren from the top three. Not to mention a fast charging Lotus.

#1033 jjcale

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:32

I would like to agree with you but the thing is I am yet to hear or see any other journalist or trackside observer mention Merc in the same breath as the top 3, but I guess Lauda knows more than me. So for now I keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best


Yeah. They been downbeat ... but I am going to stick with what I heard (until I see for myself otherwise) ... that its a good car.

#1034 EvanRainer

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:40

Doesn't matter how good they do, there are too many other teams right now who are even better. So moving up the pecking order is not that easy.

What Mercedes needs to be focusing on is the GAP to the front.

#1035 study

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:41

I think Lauda may be ambitious to say he is aiming for third. To be third they have to remove either Red Bull, Ferrari or McLaren from the top three. Not to mention a fast charging Lotus.


He didn't say that though..........

He said compete with the top 3, nothing about displacing them.

#1036 study

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:42

Doesn't matter how good they do, there are too many other teams right now who are even better. So moving up the pecking order is not that easy.

What Mercedes needs to be focusing on is the GAP to the front.


Can you list these better teams?

I'd probably agree with you but to say what the order is at this moment is a bit unwise (being polite)

#1037 study

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:43

Yeah. They been downbeat ... but I am going to stick with what I heard (until I see for myself otherwise) ... that its a good car.


why what have you heard?

Times from testing don't have much bearing, I'm hopefull they can improve where they finished last year and also bring improvements. The only worry I've heard about is the lose backend.

#1038 BernieEc

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:44

some nice footage from jerez day 4. at 3.05 we can see footage of the merc through a corner and compare with some other cars and try and see how stable/unstable the car is



#1039 study

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:47

Cant say it was anyworse then the mclaren from my untrained eye.

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#1040 rhukkas

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:50

Looks like fair chunk of understeer. but hard to gauge anything from one comparison video.

what looks like some high fuel runs nothing amazing

Edited by rhukkas, 09 February 2013 - 19:53.


#1041 PedroBR

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 19:52

Crazy people! Martin Hindsight orphans?

I hope Hamilton kicks the door, punches the table and throw the toys out the pram demanding everything he needs to win!

Exactly how that Senna guy, that Schumacher guy, (name another winner here) used to do...



#1042 F1ultimate

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 20:17

A cool photo of the car:

http://www.f1fanatic...t-150-pictures/
Posted Image

#1043 jjcale

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 21:14

Looks like fair chunk of understeer. but hard to gauge anything from one comparison video.

what looks like some high fuel runs nothing amazing


Nice ... at least it still sounds like him ... with the trademark machine gun downshifts

#1044 Vesuvius

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 21:51

According to Turun Sanomat, the calculations from inside mercedes gp say Nico Rosberg was three tenths quicker/lap on equal fuel/program than new team mate Hamilton and also good news for mercedes was that they calculated that they were quicker than Ferrari on thirsday by half a second/lap.

#1045 LarsB

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:06

According to Turun Sanomat, the calculations from inside mercedes gp say Nico Rosberg was three tenths quicker/lap on equal fuel/program than new team mate Hamilton and also good news for mercedes was that they calculated that they were quicker than Ferrari on thirsday by half a second/lap.


And then the alarm rang.


#1046 BernieEc

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:10

According to Turun Sanomat, the calculations from inside mercedes gp say Nico Rosberg was three tenths quicker/lap on equal fuel/program than new team mate Hamilton and also good news for mercedes was that they calculated that they were quicker than Ferrari on thirsday by half a second/lap.


who is Turun Samonat ?

#1047 Markn93

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:25

who is Turun Samonat ?

Some bloke on the internet.

I jest of course, I have no idea. Interesting if true. Particularly as Im prepared to bet Lewis isn't 3ths behind Nico in Aus.

#1048 Skinnyguy

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:28

Some bloke on the internet.


:confused: Isn´t it a newspaper?

#1049 race addicted

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:34

:lol: Yes it is, a very (atleast on things F1) well-respected finnish newspaper, with a certain journalist who's friendly with everyone up and down the paddock.

#1050 CrossF1

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 22:36

:confused: Isn´t it a newspaper?



Turun Sanomat is a Finnish newspaper, yes.

Edited by CrossF1, 09 February 2013 - 22:36.