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Mercedes-AMG 2013 W04


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#3101 Timstr11

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:00

I kind of a agree with seanspeed that they maybe should have foregone qualifying simulations but at the same time I can imagine they needed confirmation of how the car handles on low fuel with new tyres instead of waiting till Melbourne. The fact that e.g. Redbull did not do it is I think because they were mired in solving their balance problems. As a result they could not "tick all the boxes'' as Vettel said.


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#3102 Wingnut

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:28

It's Melbourne, and 6 days away; it could be 46 degrees, could piss down at 13 degrees all through the race, and you'll not really know until the morning. Strangest place for weather I have ever been to.


Didn't Melbourne inspire 'Four seasons in one day' by Crowded House? I guess we'll see at the weekend.

#3103 Shiroo

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:33

Oh man, I still recall how people here would be happy with qualying in Top 10 and ending there races before tests. THen in jerez it became like must-have. And now after Barcelona people imagine locking front row and winning races right from the bat.

Guys, Mercedes was 1,5sec off in Brasil 2012. THey would need to find like 2sec and hope that for example RBR was slacking their ass off.

You should keep your expectations low, so you won't fall down from the sky. when for example, mercedes will be 1 lap wonder with shitty race pace, or it will appear that it is average car and 4-5 teams will be better.

Just saying, though, I would like to see Hamilton in at least decent car.

#3104 bauss

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:38

Oh man, I still recall how people here would be happy with qualying in Top 10 and ending there races before tests. THen in jerez it became like must-have. And now after Barcelona people imagine locking front row and winning races right from the bat.

Guys, Mercedes was 1,5sec off in Brasil 2012. THey would need to find like 2sec and hope that for example RBR was slacking their ass off.

You should keep your expectations low, so you won't fall down from the sky. when for example, mercedes will be 1 lap wonder with shitty race pace, or it will appear that it is average car and 4-5 teams will be better.

Just saying, though, I would like to see Hamilton in at least decent car.


1 second

#3105 CookinFlatSix

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:43

To be fair, they did go out and put in the fastest time during testing two days in a row at the end there. I'm not trying to criticize them for that, but if they didn't want people getting excited about them, that probably wasn't the best idea in the world, was it? ;)


hahaha, so a team that is trying to make yup a deficit of 3 seconds should try not to use tests properly, and should sandbag just because its fashionable amongst the top runners?
They should have known that they were quicker than the others although the top teams sandbag and everyone knows you cant read too much into testing, and then they should have held back from going too fast?

This is truly amazing, its like no matter what Lewis does, there is gonna be something to attack him about, he seems to have brought this baggage over to Mercedes

(unless you are truly being ironic ofcourse)

#3106 bub

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:46

Over-doing expectations so that Mercs turnaround won't feel positive if it's not at the top, even though being 4th fastest would be great.


Probably.

#3107 SR388

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 13:49

Wow, the Merc thread seems to have imploded on itself. I am looking forward to Final practice and qualifying so we can se who has what. I hope the pace shown in testing wasn't fools gold.

#3108 teejay

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 14:04

I doubt they were trying, I reckon they had 60 kgs on board and assumed all teams would be setting faster times then them. Not to get people on this boards hopes up too much but that's definitely what happened.


Definitely?

Strong word.

Could of been 60kg underweight.

Fri will begin to paint the real picture.

#3109 Asterion

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 14:12

Can't wait to see what HAM can do with this car.

Edited by Asterion, 12 March 2013 - 14:13.


#3110 Wingnut

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 14:27

Definitely?

Strong word.

Could of been 60kg underweight.

Fri will begin to paint the real picture.


I was thinking the same thing, unless you're part of the team and know exactly how much fuel went in, there's nothing 'definite' about it. Would Mercedes want to run underweight though? I think they need to know where they stand against their rivals as they're playing catch-up, but everything is pure speculation until Friday.

#3111 bonjon1979a

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 14:31

I was thinking the same thing, unless you're part of the team and know exactly how much fuel went in, there's nothing 'definite' about it. Would Mercedes want to run underweight though? I think they need to know where they stand against their rivals as they're playing catch-up, but everything is pure speculation until Friday.


I wasn't being serious. Just sending up those who speak in absolute terms regarding matters that no one really knows about.

Really wouldn't be surprised to see a merc on the front row, but ros rather than ham who I don't think will be up to speed with the car until European races.

#3112 Seanspeed

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 14:57

This is truly amazing, its like no matter what Lewis does, there is gonna be something to attack him about, he seems to have brought this baggage over to Mercedes

What the flying hell are you talking about Lewis for? Never mentioned anything about him. :lol: Persecution complexes are getting ridiculous here.

I dont think any of you guys really understood what I was saying, either. I never meant that Mercedes shouldn't have done low fuel testing(which it was). I was just pointing out that it was inevitable that people would get optimistic about them if they were going to go and do fast times.

#3113 Wingnut

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 15:45

I wasn't being serious. Just sending up those who speak in absolute terms regarding matters that no one really knows about.

Really wouldn't be surprised to see a merc on the front row, but ros rather than ham who I don't think will be up to speed with the car until European races.


Ok, sorry, misinterpreted it.

I agree with you with Ham not being up to speed. The Merc has always seemed a bit more 'interactive' than other cars with Rosberg and Schumacher seemingly adjusting the brake bias level (?) by their left leg constantly. I'd be pretty surprised if he could step straight into the car and match Nico, but I suspect these board will light up if Nico beats him.

#3114 CarbonF

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 15:56

Ok, sorry, misinterpreted it.

I agree with you with Ham not being up to speed. The Merc has always seemed a bit more 'interactive' than other cars with Rosberg and Schumacher seemingly adjusting the brake bias level (?) by their left leg constantly. I'd be pretty surprised if he could step straight into the car and match Nico, but I suspect these board will light up if Nico beats him.

Very true! Hamilton mentioned in sky that there are like ten different settings in mercedes, when all he ever had in other cars was three!

#3115 Masenco

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:00

Very true! Hamilton mentioned in sky that there are like ten different settings in mercedes, when all he ever had in other cars was three!


I believe in regards to qualli that's a good thing- the more settings there are the more perfectly setup the driver can be for each corner.


#3116 bonjon1979a

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:21

I believe in regards to qualli that's a good thing- the more settings there are the more perfectly setup the driver can be for each corner.

The greater the chance he'll select the wrong one.

#3117 kedia990

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:27

I believe in regards to qualli that's a good thing- the more settings there are the more perfectly setup the driver can be for each corner.


Or, the more settings there are the more things to possibly f*** up his qualy lap :drunk:
Seriously, I doubt Hamilton is the kind of driver who likes (needs?) that kind of setup flexibility on-the-fly. His first technical contribution to Mercedes, methinks, was to simplify the steering wheel and get rid of excessive buttons.
For that matter, I don't think any driver likes twaddling around with buttons and levers, and would rather concentrate on driving and what's coming up. I know they're incredibly talented and capable of handling anything short of a flight guidance computer while driving, but it doesn't mean they'd want to.
Ah well, that was just my 2 cents. From my bitter experience of locking up in Abu Dhabi in Codemasters F1 2012 game after accidentally leaving the brake bias to front for sector 3 :lol: .

#3118 jannyg

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:29

Tony Jardine also backing Lewis for the win. Surprisingly has Rosberg as nowhere.

Would love Mercedes to be competitive from the start but cannot help but think all these pundits are jumping too much on the testing bandwagon.

Anyways I hope the optimism is confirmed this weekend!


http://www1.skysport...lian-gp-preview

#3119 Arion

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:51

Oh man, I still recall how people here would be happy with qualying in Top 10 and ending there races before tests. THen in jerez it became like must-have. And now after Barcelona people imagine locking front row and winning races right from the bat.

Guys, Mercedes was 1,5sec off in Brasil 2012. THey would need to find like 2sec and hope that for example RBR was slacking their ass off.

You should keep your expectations low, so you won't fall down from the sky. when for example, mercedes will be 1 lap wonder with shitty race pace, or it will appear that it is average car and 4-5 teams will be better.

Just saying, though, I would like to see Hamilton in at least decent car.


+1. some of you need to see the old Merc threads, how the schumacher fans were bitterly disappointed with the team, I think they've improved, but it's better to be pleasantly surprised than disappointed.



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#3120 mlsnoopy

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:52

I believe in regards to qualli that's a good thing- the more settings there are the more perfectly setup the driver can be for each corner.


KISS

#3121 bauss

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:56

man with all this hype...would be messed up if one or more of RB, Lotus, Ferrari or Mac show up and are comfortably half a second clear...

too many cars look in the mix to be confident, but I hope we are right.

#3122 jrg19

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 16:57

Tony Jardine also backing Lewis for the win. Surprisingly has Rosberg as nowhere.

Would love Mercedes to be competitive from the start but cannot help but think all these pundits are jumping too much on the testing bandwagon.

Anyways I hope the optimism is confirmed this weekend!


http://www1.skysport...lian-gp-preview


You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?

#3123 Seanspeed

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:10

You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?

It happens every year.

#3124 maverick69

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:11

You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?


Something's going on...........

#3125 jrg19

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:15

It happens every year.


Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.

#3126 Timstr11

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:19

You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?

Experts?

They are often pundits/commentators looking on from the outside just like we are.

#3127 jannyg

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:20

You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?


Yeah I get what you mean, I wasn't trying to suggest its not true.

I'm just being extra skeptical because this would be a huge jump from where they was last year.

But anyways I shouldn't be complaining, lets see Lewis bring it home! With Rosberg rear-gunning <-- No disrespect

#3128 SR388

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:25

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.


Man, it's kind of a toss-up.

It seems like some here would almost prefer that the Merc was a dog during testing so that they would not have reason to get their hopes up. Maybe things are almost as simple as they seem. Perhaps they have built a fast car, I know these journalists are often just making informed guesses. I would rather enter this season with a lot of excitement and then under perform than come in the season with no excitement and then under perform.

Perhaps they don't have any secret inside info, and they are simply not jaded pessimists.

#3129 Seanspeed

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 17:29

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.

No one is saying thats going to happen.

I'm just pointing out that experts/pundits/journalists get it wrong all the time.

#3130 FSLIV

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 18:37

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.



LMAO . . . OMG . . I will be gutted!!!! lol lol I would have bee cool with it if it wasn't for all the hype!!

#3131 Coral

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 18:47

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.


I doubt very much that that will happen. Lewis was the only driver to make Q3 in every race last year...I have every confidence that he can do the same this year. I don't see the Mercedes being that bad.

#3132 Kvothe

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 18:48

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.


I agree, I remember when the experts were hyping up Red Bull at the beginning of the last season when boom Hamilton went 7 tenths faster than the nearest non McLaren, getting in to Q3 would be an achievement with such a close field, anything higher is a bonus.

#3133 BigCHrome

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:07

Oh man, I still recall how people here would be happy with qualying in Top 10 and ending there races before tests. THen in jerez it became like must-have. And now after Barcelona people imagine locking front row and winning races right from the bat.

Guys, Mercedes was 1,5sec off in Brasil 2012. THey would need to find like 2sec and hope that for example RBR was slacking their ass off.

You should keep your expectations low, so you won't fall down from the sky. when for example, mercedes will be 1 lap wonder with shitty race pace, or it will appear that it is average car and 4-5 teams will be better.

Just saying, though, I would like to see Hamilton in at least decent car.


Once again - the W03 in Brazil hadn't been upgraded in quite a while, the focus had been shifted to the W04 for a while.

The gap from Brazil is almost completely irrelevant.

#3134 1Devil1

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:16

I doubt very much that that will happen. Lewis was the only driver to make Q3 in every race last year...I have every confidence that he can do the same this year. I don't see the Mercedes being that bad.


He drove a freaking McLaren last year the fastest car over the whole season not a Mercedes which was 1,5 sec of the pace at the end of the year. Lewis is good, but if the car is not good enough Lewis and Rosberg - as superb qualifier - will not make it into q3.

#3135 BernieEc

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:24

He drove a freaking McLaren last year the fastest car over the whole season not a Mercedes which was 1,5 sec of the pace at the end of the year. Lewis is good, but if the car is not good enough Lewis and Rosberg - as superb qualifier - will not make it into q3.


Button drove the same McLaren !!

Edited by BernieEc, 12 March 2013 - 19:24.


#3136 1Devil1

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:27

Button drove the same McLaren !!


this comment was not about button who is know for not being the best qualifier. my point was last year lewis had a really good car, if the mercedes is bad as last year it's very unlikely he will reach q3 in every race as a user claimed I quoted

#3137 Arion

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:30

hmm...both Nico and Lewis are good qualifiers, and the car seems to have good one lap pace, if they don't make it to Q3, it means the car is a dog

#3138 Alx09

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:34

I'm not particularly concerned about qualy pace - I'm more interested in what race pace and tyre deg during hot temps will be like for Merc compared to others.

Mercs stable deg in a cold Barcelona doesn't necessarily mean it will be balanced in hot Bahrain, I'd say.

Edited by Alx09, 12 March 2013 - 19:35.


#3139 undersquare

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:34

this comment was not about button who is know for not being the best qualifier. my point was last year lewis had a really good car, if the mercedes is bad as last year it's very unlikely he will reach q3 in every race as a user claimed I quoted


Yeah thanks for the insight :lol: .

IF it's the fastest car Lewis could be on pole all the time. Or IF it's the worst car he won't be.

Meanwhile in reality the Merc is quite unlikely to be as bad as at the end of last year.

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#3140 BernieEc

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:34

this comment was not about button who is know for not being the best qualifier. my point was last year lewis had a really good car, if the mercedes is bad as last year it's very unlikely he will reach q3 in every race as a user claimed I quoted


Am not sure the original poster was basing his assessment on the Merc being as bad as last year. I think he meant if the Merc is as half decent as it has shown in testing (hence the caveat of "the merc can't be that bad") the last year Merc was a given and everyone knew how bad it was and I don't see any reference to that, or did you?



#3141 study

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:37

I don't like this hype cause anything less then pole is going to be greeted by disappointment and derision.


#3142 BernieEc

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:40

I don't like this hype cause anything less then pole is going to be greeted by disappointment and derision.


I agree and part of the reason has to do with most teams not really doing low fuel runs (Bar Ferrari) and that has fuelled speculation. Realistically though if both driver were in the top 5/6 I will be elated

#3143 bub

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:42

I'm not particularly concerned about qualy pace - I'm more interested in what race pace and tyre deg during hot temps will be like for Merc compared to others.

Mercs stable deg in a cold Barcelona doesn't necessarily mean it will be balanced in hot Bahrain, I'd say.


+1. Hopefully the lessons have been learned.

#3144 undersquare

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:46

Well this is a better start than I was expecting so I'm making the most of it. If they're not in contention I was going to be disappointed anyway, but it seems obvious to me it's not going to be like last year's car. It'll be a better car, driven better. IMO we just need Red Bull to have a few problems and anything is possible.

#3145 OoxLox

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 19:53

Posted Image

:wave:

Edited by OoxLox, 12 March 2013 - 19:55.


#3146 surbjits

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 22:32

You can only assume they have some inside information, why would all these experts purposely make them selfs look stupid?


:lol:



#3147 surbjits

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 22:33

IF it's the fastest car Lewis could be on pole all the time.


Why? I think a lot of you are writing off Nico.

#3148 Spoch

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 22:43

There is obviously something I am still not getting with all the tyre deg argument. So let me get this, last season, Merc were notorious for high tyre wear in hot races and the reason they won in China was cos of the cool weather right? Ok so fast forward to the test this year in Barcelona and according to JA on F1 (http://www.jamesalle...celona-f1-test/) the tyre deg on the merc is similar to that of the ferrari. So if merc wasn't worse off from other teams in cold barcelona, then why would it be in hotter weather? Logically if Merc was tyre deg was worse than other teams in Barcelona then it gives room for fear of a higher deg rate in hotter races but this wasn't the case? I know my argument might be bollocks but apart from last season's stats, I'd like to know what else is informing the suspicion of high tyre deg. If we are going by the logic of last season then why even bother watching Oz this weekend

#3149 BigCHrome

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 23:01

There is obviously something I am still not getting with all the tyre deg argument. So let me get this, last season, Merc were notorious for high tyre wear in hot races and the reason they won in China was cos of the cool weather right? Ok so fast forward to the test this year in Barcelona and according to JA on F1 (http://www.jamesalle...celona-f1-test/) the tyre deg on the merc is similar to that of the ferrari. So if merc wasn't worse off from other teams in cold barcelona, then why would it be in hotter weather? Logically if Merc was tyre deg was worse than other teams in Barcelona then it gives room for fear of a higher deg rate in hotter races but this wasn't the case? I know my argument might be bollocks but apart from last season's stats, I'd like to know what else is informing the suspicion of high tyre deg. If we are going by the logic of last season then why even bother watching Oz this weekend


Because it's a different car....?

#3150 alframsey

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 23:17

Yeah its going to be a shock to the system for some people when the Merc fails to make Q3.

People are just getting too excited right now, I was guilty of it at one point as well but have brought myself back down to earth. I just hope Lewis can be there or thereabouts to see the team I support (Macca) and the driver I love (Lewis) together on track regularly, not sure how I will handle that but it'll be as exciting as hell!