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Robert Kubica's road to recovery


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#401 IraM

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:10

What so strange in that? I already knew that. Everyone who is following Kubica knows that.
Kubica will be in F1 soon. Everyon who is thinking otherwise is deluded or uninformed :)


"It is sad, but I think that Kubica will never drive F1. Now he rejected offer from DTM BMW Team. So it seems he is nto interested in racing. WRC is not an option for next year too.
Soon people will forget about Kubica frown.gif Only his hard fans will be remember frown.gif"

"Good bye, Formula 1.

Mark my words."

Is this not yours words by any means Infected Pumpkin?

Edited by IraM, 22 June 2013 - 00:07.


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#402 alecc

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:23

Malecki quotes Robert (sorry for poor translation :p)

"I cant say when was the last time i was driving in simulator but im very happy about the progress i have made.
When i was in F1 i never used simulator because my teams didnt have one.
Ofc simulator dont give you real experience like g forces, but you need the same strength on the wheel and pedals and i ddnt need any additional help to handle it.
I dont plan any simulator drives now because i wouldnt be able to keep them in secret. Im joking of caurse.
But im not interested now in just testing. I need proper challenge in perspective. To be comepletly honest at the moment i could allready drive at 80% of the circuits.
Mercedes car is kinda more friendly to me because it has a bit more space where i need it.
If i recieve proper signal i can lose weight and be ready in few months"

What the... :eek:

Edit. Seems Malecki was quoting interview by Autosprint.


From when was that interview by Autosprint?

#403 Hezz

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:36

Malecki quotes Robert (sorry for poor translation :p)

"I cant say when was the last time i was driving in simulator but im very happy about the progress i have made.
When i was in F1 i never used simulator because my teams didnt have one.
Ofc simulator dont give you real experience like g forces, but you need the same strength on the wheel and pedals and i ddnt need any additional help to handle it.
I dont plan any simulator drives now because i wouldnt be able to keep them in secret. Im joking of caurse.
But im not interested now in just testing. I need proper challenge in perspective. To be comepletly honest at the moment i could allready drive at 80% of the circuits.
Mercedes car is kinda more friendly to me because it has a bit more space where i need it.
If i recieve proper signal i can lose weight and be ready in few months"

What the... :eek:

Edit. Seems Malecki was quoting interview by Autosprint.



What so strange in that? I already knew that. Everyone who is following Kubica knows that.
Kubica will be in F1 soon. Everyon who is thinking otherwise is deluded or uninformed :)


Soon or later man you will die, like every one :rotfl:
F1 is a past for him
Over



#404 alecc

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 23:42

Comment "F1 is over for him", and those "He will be in F1" are so silly, that they are disturb the discussion. Please, stop.

#405 HaydenFan

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 01:36

His road to recovery is pretty much complete. Doesn't seem like he has any more surgeries that are related to his injury upcoming, and he shows he is back up to pace, at least when it comes to rally. Going back to F1 is, IMO, not his decision. It is all up to a team willing to take a risk (which he has now become).

I would say, that if he wants to show the F1 community he wants to get back in a car, and can actually do it due to restrictions from his injuries, he should arrange a test in a GP2 or WSR car, or even getting a run in an older F1 car (could become all the rage after the Merc/Pirelli decision).

But never mind going back to F1. Outside the money, if he can keep himself out of the ditch, he could be a front runner in WRC, which could make F1 less appealing.

#406 Shiroo

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 01:39

Comment "F1 is over for him", and those "He will be in F1" are so silly, that they are disturb the discussion. Please, stop.

who knows mate, maybe one of them has crystal ball and he is right? :rotfl:
but on serious note, yes they are silly as ****. But you cant help that. people every few weeks talk like that about Kubica HE WILL BE BACk, HE IS DONE FOR etc. So simply get used to that :)

#407 InfectedPumpkin

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 05:29

"It is sad, but I think that Kubica will never drive F1. Now he rejected offer from DTM BMW Team. So it seems he is nto interested in racing. WRC is not an option for next year too.
Soon people will forget about Kubica frown.gif Only his hard fans will be remember frown.gif"

"Good bye, Formula 1.

Mark my words."

Is this not yours words by any means Infected Pumpkin?


No, that was other InfectedPumpkin :D
But seriously, I never believed he could things he is doing right now. Things are changing so fast :)

#408 MaGiK

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 06:26

From when was that interview by Autosprint?

Yesterday at rally :)
Full story here http://www.auto.it/a..._medium=twitter

Any Italians here for proper translation?

#409 Muppetmad

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 06:45

Wow, that's very optimistic indeed :up: . I wonder when we'll see a test.

#410 DrProzac

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 10:35

Comment "F1 is over for him", and those "He will be in F1" are so silly, that they are disturb the discussion. Please, stop.

:up:

#411 wingwalker

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Posted 22 June 2013 - 10:38

His words are really interesting as it's the first time I hear him saying something suggesting F1 comeback could be a real option, not just "maybe in the future". But I'd still like to hear the actual interview.

Driving at F1 speed aside, he needs to regain a lot of movement range to be able to get in and out F1 car in a time required for an F1 driver.

#412 Buttoneer

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 15:25

Rally 2013 Thread http://forums.autosp...howtopic=178306

Contrary to what some of the deleted posts said, this is not a thread for discussing rallying in general or even Kubica's rally adventures, it is for discussing his general health and hopeful return to high level motorsport including F1. The thread linked to above should be about discussing his rallying career.

Please report those who try to take this off topic again.

#413 DrProzac

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 19:44

Ok guys, I had a brief chat with Buttoneer and I think we need more discipline.

Firstly, I think we need a clear definition of what this thread is about and what is outside it's scope. So our understanding and that of the moderator team isn't different. We also need some rules to follow, so the thread (and possibly other ones as well) won't get locked.

My proposal of simple rules:
1. We stick to the topic. If something is clearly outside of it's scope, we create a new one.
2. If someone goes off topic, we try to stop it by pointing it out and not engaging in the discussion. If this doesn't help, we report the post. This way the moderators will know that there is will to keep the discussion on topic and will have the opportunity to react in a different way than locking the thread.
3. When posting in the rally thread, let's remember that it's a place for all rallying fans :)

They are really simple, and if the people who are most interested in RK related discussion follow them we won't have such problems imho.

My vision of the recovery discussion topics:
- Will he be able to return to F1? Will he stick to rallying, or maybe some other racing series? Which choice will be good for him? etc
- Any tests and similar activities he participates in
- Rumors about his health, career opportunities etc.
I think all this revolves around Robert's post accident recovery, his return to the sport. And all these threads will pop up constantly. Even people from outside the usual suspects jump in from time to time and initiate discussion about it. A topic strictly about his F1 chances will be imho a bit too narrow.

Not:
- Was/is RK better than his team mates (or any other driver), or not.
- How good rally driver Robert is? Is his car and advantage or not?
- Was rallying before the accident a good decision, or not?
- Rally discussion not related directly to his recovery process. So discussion about whether rallying is good for his mobility or is more/less demanding that other motorsports is OK, but discussion about ongoing rallying events, the WRC/ERC championship etc should go to the Rally thread.

It's only my idea, I don't know what Buttoneer thinks about it.
Perhaps we need two threads?

Edited by DrProzac, 23 June 2013 - 19:50.


#414 alecc

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Posted 23 June 2013 - 23:35

But a short note about his last rally events IMHO isn't off topic. Because it's now the greatest indicator of his road to recovery. And his last statement for autosprint is really optimistic, I didn't heard from him such optimistic words since the accident, so fingers crossed. :wave:

And please don't forget, that RK itself called his rally adventure as the best possible recovery method. So dunno if it is an offtopic at all...

Edited by alecc, 23 June 2013 - 23:36.


#415 Myrvold

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 02:09

But a short note about his last rally events IMHO isn't off topic. Because it's now the greatest indicator of his road to recovery. And his last statement for autosprint is really optimistic, I didn't heard from him such optimistic words since the accident, so fingers crossed. :wave:

And please don't forget, that RK itself called his rally adventure as the best possible recovery method. So dunno if it is an offtopic at all...


Problem is that is can easily expand into a pure rally discussion, like it did during the last rally. And that fits better in the Rally thread.

#416 noikeee

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 02:49

My fault for straying off-topic beforehand but it's really very easy for the discussion to go in that direction without remotely trying on purpose. Don't think it's right that all rallying performance discussion should be limited to a single thread neither, when clearly the performance of this particular driver attracts a hell of a lot more attention in here than even the front-runners. Indeed we've even had a few spats in that thread as regular rallying fans get pissed off at the disproportionate attention Kubica gets.

It seems pretty unnecessary to watch moderation being imposed when the discussion is benign, but I do understand why the rules are the way they are - this forum doesn't take much for all hell to break loose. :well:

#417 Muppetmad

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 07:53

You've all taken the words from my mouth (which I'm very thankful for!), but I will reiterate a few points just to clear the air.

When I created this thread, Robert had not yet signed his contract with Citroen - he did so only a few days later. The logical progression therefore seemed to me to be discussion of his rally activities because - as alecc has eloquently remarked - Robert himself is emphasising the role of rallying in his recovery. The two are inextricably linked - to try and separate them can only be partially successful, because then some posts will lie between the two and will therefore fit uncomfortably in either the recovery thread or the rally thread.

Saying that, however, I understand the concerns of the moderation team and I am personally willing to post in the rally thread. However, I only wish to make sure that we don't alienate the regulars who normally post there - ever since Tour de Corse, activity there has ground to a halt, which is a shame because I know none of us were intentionally trying to turn it into a Kubica thread, but were integrating it into a general discussion. Yet, it did seem to upset the balance.

DrProzac is certainly correct when he says we need to delineate the scope of this thread. I don't mind how we do that, I will edit the OP accordingly to accommodate it and make it clear what this thread is for.

#418 DrProzac

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 16:04

I think the problems began only recently, when we had a pure rally event discussion here. I may be wrong (please correct me if so, Buttoneer) but I think the rally themed discussion related to Robert's new career path and it's impact on his rehabilitation was OK. It wasn't when we started to post live coverage of his results, stage per stage and speculation about how good Robert is compared to other drivers :)

Edited by DrProzac, 24 June 2013 - 16:05.


#419 st99

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 16:26

Yesterday, in an interview for a Spanish radio, Dani Sordo (WRC driver) said that what Robert is doing in the rallies is impressive considering the state of his right hand, but when they asked him about the chances he thought Robert had to return to F1, he wasn't too optimistic :cry: :(

I really wish he can make it one day, he was (is) one of my favourite drivers.

Edited by st99, 24 June 2013 - 16:27.


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#420 Myrvold

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 16:54

However, I only wish to make sure that we don't alienate the regulars who normally post there - ever since Tour de Corse, activity there has ground to a halt, which is a shame because I know none of us were intentionally trying to turn it into a Kubica thread, but were integrating it into a general discussion. Yet, it did seem to upset the balance.


A do think some of the problem is, that there of course are Kubica fans that don't know much about rallying, but that looks like they, instead of wanting to learn a bit, and understand. They just look at the results, and hype up Kubica as the new Loeb (I'm taking it a bit to far, but just to show my point). It didn't take many rallies before there was some, but very few posts, suggesting that Kubica should replace Latvala at VW.
I think those things are what's making it a bit too much for the regular rally thread guys.

It is some of the same when Villeneuve does his NASCAR races, and when Raikkonen did his NASCAR races. People who don't watch it, suddenly want to watch their favorite driver, but there is always a number of people, low or high, that doesn't want to learn or know about the new sport.

Anyway, I think this discussion shows that there shouldn't be any problems. It's just that with the odd Petter Solberg fan, there hasn't really been any particular driver-specific fanbase in the rally threads for years.

#421 MadYarpen

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 19:01

yeah, but discussing RK fans after discussion what is on topic here can make this thread closed again. And please, don't generalise.

#422 Shiroo

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 19:44

Are you guys aware that instead of discussing about Rober, you are discussing about what you should talk here? For few posts already

#423 Muppetmad

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 20:08

Right, so we don't drag this discussion on for too long I'll edit the OP with DrProzac's post in mind. Let's keep the pure rallying discussion to the rally thread.

Yesterday, in an interview for a Spanish radio, Dani Sordo (WRC driver) said that what Robert is doing in the rallies is impressive considering the state of his right hand, but when they asked him about the chances he thought Robert had to return to F1, he wasn't too optimistic :cry: :(

I really wish he can make it one day, he was (is) one of my favourite drivers.


I personally wouldn't be too concerned about Sordo's comments, without wishing to dismiss his comments unnecessarily I don't think he is really qualified to make any assessment. All we can take it as is his opinion.

#424 st99

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 21:00

I personally wouldn't be too concerned about Sordo's comments, without wishing to dismiss his comments unnecessarily I don't think he is really qualified to make any assessment. All we can take it as is his opinion.


You're right, I don't know how much Sordo knows about Robert's situation as they're only sort of teammates at citroen :well:

But, anyway, I read in the italian media that Robert can now cover the distance of 3 GPs in only seven hours and that even if the simulator doesn't reproduce the G forces he can handle the steering wheel and the pedals without any help, that's good news.

#425 Myrvold

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Posted 24 June 2013 - 22:58

yeah, but discussing RK fans after discussion what is on topic here can make this thread closed again. And please, don't generalise.


I tried not to generalise. There is an obvious minorty among the people I mentioned, but ye.

Anyhow, back to topic might be a good idea indeed :)

#426 DrProzac

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 17:44

But, anyway, I read in the italian media that Robert can now cover the distance of 3 GPs in only seven hours and that even if the simulator doesn't reproduce the G forces he can handle the steering wheel and the pedals without any help, that's good news.

It does not reproduce the G-Forces, but the steering wheel/pedals resistance is the same. Although it is surely harder to turn the wheel with 4+G of lateral acceleration than with 0,5 G or whatever the hydraulics are capable of.
Still, the problem of limited space still remains unsolved.

#427 alecc

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 19:11

It does not reproduce the G-Forces, but the steering wheel/pedals resistance is the same. Although it is surely harder to turn the wheel with 4+G of lateral acceleration than with 0,5 G or whatever the hydraulics are capable of.
Still, the problem of limited space still remains unsolved.


0,5 G? You mean the simulator is on the moon or something? :D

BTW Cezary Gutowski was on the last rally, and asked Robert, why he doesn't say, that he fights for the WRC2 title. Robert answered, that he isn't in 100% shape, and that when he will have the needed shape, he want to come back to F1. Rally is for him only a way for recovery of the hand, and that is far more important for him than the results in WRC2. (translation from gazeta.pl)

Edited by alecc, 25 June 2013 - 19:40.


#428 Muppetmad

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 19:22

F1 does seem to be a very real and tangible goal now, then. It's certainly looking very positive :) Hopefully Robert will enjoy the successes he does achieve in rallying if that does indeed lead up to his return, because his talent in a rally car is undeniably impressive.

#429 DrProzac

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 19:23

0.5 G (or whatever) lateral.

#430 alecc

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Posted 25 June 2013 - 19:40

0.5 G (or whatever) lateral.


mea culpa :wave:

#431 Buttoneer

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 11:29

Discussion about how the forum is moderated is not encouraged here - in face we prefer for these things to be done by PM, but in view of the fact that the discussion, although off topic, has been relatively benign I am happy to clarify that I endorse this comment by DrProzac;

I think the problems began only recently, when we had a pure rally event discussion here. I may be wrong (please correct me if so, Buttoneer) but I think the rally themed discussion related to Robert's new career path and it's impact on his rehabilitation was OK. It wasn't when we started to post live coverage of his results, stage per stage and speculation about how good Robert is compared to other drivers :)


If you want to discuss how the rallying might help his progression, or compare how the rallying differs from F1 in terms of his dexterity etc then I think you're on good ground. I think that if he wins a rally then, as a sign of his good health, that is worthy of comment here.

What we don't want to end up with is a big thread where all the RK fans pat each other on the back about what an awesome job Kubica is doing in rally x y or z. People should be coming to this thread to find out how the guys health is improving and what his results might mean in that regard. That is the remit of the thread and it is reasonable for any member to come here and expect to see that discussion ongoing.

If you wish to celebrate wins, compare his performances with other drivers and generally discuss/follow/learn about rally then please go to one of the threads set up for that purpose.

It's really not about restricting what you say about a driver, only where it is said, and I don't think it is hard to bear that in mind when posting here. Please exercise a little self discipline and the thread can remain open for as long as is required. If there are people who clearly lack that ability, reporting them promptly will help keep the thread open too.

Please don't discuss this further in the thread - if you have issues, concerns or suggestions please PM me or one of the other members of the team.

#432 thiscocks

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 11:36

Rally 2013 Thread http://forums.autosp...howtopic=178306

Contrary to what some of the deleted posts said, this is not a thread for discussing rallying in general or even Kubica's rally adventures, it is for discussing his general health and hopeful return to high level motorsport including F1. The thread linked to above should be about discussing his rallying career.

Please report those who try to take this off topic again.


So WRC isn't high level motorsport?

#433 MaGiK

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 11:41

So guys, how are you reading his interview on Autosprint?
First hes saying that he would be able to drive at 80% of circuits...so not enough.
But in the other hand he implicates that hes waiting for "sign" from teams so he can start losing weight and get ready for a drive.

#434 Muppetmad

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 12:19

I think it's a positive step - given his previous comments about the difficulties he would face at, say, Monaco, I would interpret it as Robert being able to drive on any circuits bar those with particularly tight corners (which would therefore require better arm mobility). What circuits are included in that 20%, other than Monaco, of course is hard to say. Since he's waiting for the advances of a team, I would suggest it won't be too long before he can tackle those circuits as well.

Edited by Muppetmad, 26 June 2013 - 12:19.


#435 rosscamero

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 12:28

If he really can race on 80% of the circuits surely it is a no brainer for one of the back marker teams to give him a race he thinks he can do at the end of the season. If he can compete to anything close to his old self then they are laughting. If he does not perform it is a great PR coup and nothing will be lost.

#436 pdac

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 12:50

If he really can race on 80% of the circuits surely it is a no brainer for one of the back marker teams to give him a race he thinks he can do at the end of the season. If he can compete to anything close to his old self then they are laughting. If he does not perform it is a great PR coup and nothing will be lost.

Surely a back marker team would only give him a race if he brought a bag of money with him. That's the state of the back markers at the moment.

F1 is a commercial world. At the end of the day, not many are going to consider helping him back into F1 if there is no money in it for them (either directly or indirectly).

#437 Walsingham

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 13:52

Surely a back marker team would only give him a race if he brought a bag of money with him. That's the state of the back markers at the moment.

F1 is a commercial world. At the end of the day, not many are going to consider helping him back into F1 if there is no money in it for them (either directly or indirectly).



I dont think he'll go for it unless he feels he is ready to compete on 100% tracks. He doesnt do anything half hearted. Either he feels he could be competitive in F1 or he stays in WRC. Nobody would hire him to drive on 80% of the tracks, and even if there was a team to propose it he wouldnt go for it.



#438 Muppetmad

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 14:13

Perhaps a few free practice sessions at the end of the year, maybe? We'll have to see, I think.

#439 Clatter

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 14:53

If he really can race on 80% of the circuits surely it is a no brainer for one of the back marker teams to give him a race he thinks he can do at the end of the season. If he can compete to anything close to his old self then they are laughting. If he does not perform it is a great PR coup and nothing will be lost.


It's a no brainer to not waste a seat on someone who is so far from what is required to race in F1. People need to put their emotions to one side.

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#440 seahawk

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 15:03

Being unable to drive 20% of the races means you are 100% not ready for F1.

#441 DrProzac

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 18:32

But in the other hand he implicates that hes waiting for "sign" from teams so he can start losing weight and get ready for a drive.

He didn't say that he wait's for a sign. He said that if he will be able to drive, he can loose weight and gain strength in a few months.

So WRC isn't high level motorsport?

WRC is, WRC2 is not. But still Robert's rallying is quite impressive.

#442 GodHimself

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 18:45

WRC is, WRC2 is not. But still Robert's rallying is quite impressive.


I don't think I can agree with that, as it implies that the only rallying series that can be regarded as high level motorsport is WRC. Regional rallies are not high level of motorsport, WRC2/ERC is.

As for the Autosprint interview, it depends which translation you read. Some are very positive sounding, some are slightly less. Would be nice if some native speaker could shed some light on the interview and say if it really sounds as optimistic.


#443 DrProzac

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Posted 26 June 2013 - 18:49

Sorry, I've read "highest" :)

#444 zdzisio

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 06:05

As for the Autosprint interview, it depends which translation you read


First off, I don't believe there was an autosprint interview. There was an official Q&A with Kubica and Baran after the rally and was done in English and covered by some English language media. Then I believe it was translated into Italian, cut into pieces and stitched back together to sound a little more like an interview, which seems standard practice nowadays. Google-translated back into English it might sound a bit different than the original Q&A but I believe it's the same thing.

Edited by zdzisio, 27 June 2013 - 06:08.


#445 Muppetmad

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 06:15

First off, I don't believe there was an autosprint interview. There was an official Q&A with Kubica and Baran after the rally and was done in English and covered by some English language media. Then I believe it was translated into Italian, cut into pieces and stitched back together to sound a little more like an interview, which seems standard practice nowadays. Google-translated back into English it might sound a bit different than the original Q&A but I believe it's the same thing.


Really? Do you have any links to the English original? I didn't realise the interview was conducted in English.

#446 tanechka

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 06:37

First off, I don't believe there was an autosprint interview. There was an official Q&A with Kubica and Baran after the rally and was done in English and covered by some English language media. Then I believe it was translated into Italian, cut into pieces and stitched back together to sound a little more like an interview, which seems standard practice nowadays. Google-translated back into English it might sound a bit different than the original Q&A but I believe it's the same thing.

Well, the autosprint interview appeared already on Friday, not after the rally.

#447 Sarhan

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 09:36

I think you should have posted it in the general rallying thread... We were supposed to keep only recovery stuff here I think.


ok. I'm deleting it. Im not posting it in the general rally thread either as i read too much on Kubica is there.


#448 thuGG

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 09:55

ok. I'm deleting it. Im not posting it in the general rally thread either as i read too much on Kubica is there.


Why not use this thread: http://forums.autosp...w...999&hl=wrc2

It's about Kubica and WRC2.

#449 Music Lover

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 10:30

Being unable to drive 20% of the races means you are 100% not ready for F1.

Sorry for not read all posts but can you elaborate please?
Is this a fact, do you have a link or is it speculation?
And what exactly is the issues he have making the 20% impossible to drive? Limited ability to move his arm, hand, wrist or is it a strength issue?

If correct, I agree - Not ready for F1. Sadly.
On the other hand, looking at videos Roberts arm is not in good shape so I'm not surprised.



#450 seahawk

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 10:59

As I understood the forum posts, he said in an interview that he could drive roughly 80% of the races at the moment. I do not want to speculate on how he got to this number.