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Schumacher hitting the rev limiter


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#1 Nigol

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 23:32

I haven't found another topic like this and the Schumacher thread is closed, so I decided to create a new one.

Coulthard mentioned it in 2010 I think, but I didn't really bother too much.
But after watching this:



I mean he had an awful lot of fighting with grip, but he has hit the limiter so many times, it's not even funny.

2:45 (big time)
3:39 (twice)
3:46
4:03
4:09
4:16
4:23 (big time)
5:02
5:54
6:24
6:27
6:49
6:53 (big time)
7:10
7:29
7:45

Thoughts? Are there more examples?

Edited by Nigol, 07 January 2013 - 19:24.


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#2 BigCHrome

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 01:04

I'm not really seeing/hearing it. Just because the blue lights are turned on doesn't mean he's at the actual rev limiter. There are a few times when it happens at low speed/gear but that's just a flaw with the engine, driver can't do anything about it.

#3 Nigol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 09:32

Actually it's pretty obvious. Maybe you have to listen closer, it happens quite often. For example in turn 2 in lap 1.

#4 Jejking

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 12:05

I wasn't going to reply but the stupidity is going into overdrive. No shit he is bouncing off the rev limiter when tyres are still cold and the car is full with fuel, making wheelspin inevitable especially when trying to outdrag Alonso. It's true that Schumacher sometimes hits the limiter and more compared to his first carreer, but still.

#5 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 13:16

he had no grip there at all.

#6 Jon83

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 14:33

What's your point caller?

#7 Juan Kerr

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 14:51

I haven't found another topic like this and the Schumacher thread is closed, so I decided to create a new one.

Coulthard mentioned it in 2010 I think, but I didn't really bother too much.
But after watching this:



I mean he had an awful lot of fighting with grip, but he has hit the limiter so many times, it's not even funny.
Thoughts? Are there more examples?

Horrible to watch, what has this sport come to? :(

#8 gm914

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 14:58

What's your point caller?

:lol:

#9 Skinnyguy

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 15:09

Oh c´mon, it´s just wheelspin, except for the moment he engages 7th too late on the main straight starting lap 2 alongside the FI. And wanting to fully exploit 6th just before engaging the longest gear in a heavy car that won´t be exactly flying on a straight -especially not on a stiff uphill section- is not exactly a bizarre mistake. :rolleyes:

BTW, what a SHIT car he was driving. Maybe all of them struggled a bit starting the race, but surely not that much, they´re flying past him. He´s having to counter in mid-high speed corners with quite some downforce in, it´s terrible.

Edited by Skinnyguy, 07 January 2013 - 15:10.


#10 DutchCruijff

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 16:00

Sweet Jesus that was a shit car, look at it slippin' and slidin' all over the place.

#11 Juan Kerr

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 16:25

Sweet Jesus that was a shit car, look at it slippin' and slidin' all over the place.

Well its full of fuel and cold tyres but still Schumacher was always and still is a driver with a perfect lovely to watch driving style, anyone in fact at that level are usually a joy to watch but even with that all taken into account it STILL look awful. I mean he obviously purposely missed some of the apexes because its much faster to do so but the general reactions of the car are more rally style than F1. They gotta sort out the front end of these F1 cars they can't keep on steering them from the rear wheels like that.

#12 goldenboy

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 16:43

that was a really enjoyable video, I wouldn't mind watching half or even a full race like that with just the engine sounds.

#13 Ragingjamaican

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 16:45

There's a video posted on another forum, it was the full race, but just onboards, even the warm up lap, I only managed to watch 20 minutes of it, but it was quite fasincating, it switched drivers and wasn't only focused on one.

I'll try and find it.

#14 Nigol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:24

Ok guys, here we go:

2:45 (big time)
3:39 (twice)
3:46
4:03
4:09
4:16
4:23 (big time)
5:02
5:54
6:24
6:27
6:49
6:53 (big time)
7:10
7:29
7:45

#15 MajorRichard

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:28

Soooo frustrating to see him in that POS for the last races. He would have ripped it up this year in something good.

I think i remember an interview with Michael around the start of 2011, which he said the reason he now hits the limiter a bit more is he's waiting for the power (in comparison to the older cars).

#16 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:30

I don't think most of those are rev limits. When he actually hits the limiter it sounds different.

#17 Nigol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:36

I don't think most of those are rev limits. When he actually hits the limiter it sounds different.

Keep in mind he is just hitting the limiter for a short time (well, most of the time...).
About which ones are you talking about in particular?

#18 Szoelloe

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:41

There's a video posted on another forum, it was the full race, but just onboards, even the warm up lap, I only managed to watch 20 minutes of it, but it was quite fasincating, it switched drivers and wasn't only focused on one.

I'll try and find it.


Seriously, you'd make my day. I am busy in my free-time watching the seasons from '91 onwards, but I'd put that on hold for a full race with onboards. please? :)

Edited by Szoelloe, 07 January 2013 - 17:42.


#19 goldenboy

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 17:51

Seriously, you'd make my day. I am busy in my free-time watching the seasons from '91 onwards, but I'd put that on hold for a full race with onboards. please? :)

:up: yes please

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#20 Ragingjamaican

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 18:38

Well I tried looking for it again, I found it.

But unfortunately it was taken off by FOM :|

Edit: Ah ha! Found it!

Edited by Ragingjamaican, 07 January 2013 - 18:39.


#21 Szoelloe

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 18:42

Well I tried looking for it again, I found it.

But unfortunately it was taken off by FOM :|


Thanks for trying anyway. I will not give up on this, if I have any success, I will wave the flag. I didn't know this was available at all.


#22 Nemo1965

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 19:01

I don't think most of those are rev limits. When he actually hits the limiter it sounds different.


I agree. Furthermore, I recently talked to someone who works with racing engines (bikes) and the told me - in an astonished way - that he always had been taught that you should change gears just before the revs redline (or blueline, in this case). So, dictum: change gears before you hit the limit in the gears. But he learned that the race-engineers advised THEIR drivers to hold changing gears untill the car really, really has hit the limit: it produces more power that way,

Ofcourse, this is Formula 1 and not bikes, but perhaps the advise change there too.


#23 pingu666

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 19:30

wouldnt that kill your forward momentum/acceloration?

mind it aprently worked for stoner :D

#24 Nigol

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 20:30

wouldnt that kill your forward momentum/acceloration?

mind it aprently worked for stoner :D

It does indeed. Just watch MSC's head, especially at 2:45, 4:23, 6:53.

#25 Ragingjamaican

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 22:06

Thanks for trying anyway. I will not give up on this, if I have any success, I will wave the flag. I didn't know this was available at all.


I found it.



#26 Szoelloe

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 22:54

I found it.


THANK YOU!!!!


#27 Ferras

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 23:14

Well I tried looking for it again, I found it.

But unfortunately it was taken off by FOM :|

Edit: Ah ha! Found it!

Austin

#28 DanardiF1

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 23:32

I don't think most of those are rev limits. When he actually hits the limiter it sounds different.


It's more likely the 'soft' limiter rather than the 18000rpm hard limiter the engine has, in which case Michael has no issues as it's just a case of what rpm the ECU is set to engage the soft limiter at.

#29 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 23:40

If that was the soft limiter he shouldn't ever be hitting the hard-limit under acceleration, which he does a few times. Since Nigol has the interest, he should check whether they're happening in the same gears. It may have to do with mapping and the attempts to blow the diffusers.

#30 boldhakka

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 02:35

I'm not really seeing/hearing it. Just because the blue lights are turned on doesn't mean he's at the actual rev limiter. There are a few times when it happens at low speed/gear but that's just a flaw with the engine, driver can't do anything about it.


:rolleyes: Anyway ...

Raikkonen was also hitting the limiter often in the first GP of 2012 as well, based on what his race engineer said.

A similar onboard for Nico will tel us if this was a peculiarity of their EBD implementation or something like that.

Edited by boldhakka, 08 January 2013 - 02:36.


#31 Baddoer

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 17:27

Watch Monza race, Alonso was like 5 seconds on limiter in 6th gear before Ascari while battling Vettel

#32 ivand911

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 08:24

Sekret Tageblog:
http://www.planetf1....This-Is-The-End
http://www.planetf1....mi-s-2013-Plans

#33 f1fan1998

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:51

As far as I can tell he only hit the limiter once. This is when Hulk passed him into turn one and he didn't want to pull 7th because probably he was concentrating in not being passed and also the short distance he would have been in 7th for.

More concerning is that Schumacher was the old retiring driver in the team and he was hustling his car well in Austin. Where was Nico? Back down in 17th or something like that.

Also the sheer lack of grip mechanical and aero is highly visible as others have suggested. The balance looked acceptable though.

Poor Ol' Lewis. All the gym training and cross country skiing in the World won't help a jot if he has a car similar to the 2012 one.

#34 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 11:39

At the risk of derailing the thread, I'm really curious to see if he can keep his head in that situation.

#35 DS27

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 11:41

That's essential watching for Lewis.