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WDC titles by end of F1 career


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#1 Lone

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 19:38

How many WDC titles would you like the drivers in the current field to have by the end of their career? I have only added the confirmed drivers (with the exception of Paul di Resta)

This is not about how many titles they deserve. Choose your own criteria of why they should have x amount of titles. Don't mind if it's logical or even possible since this an imaginary scenario.

You can choose to tell why, or not.

My list:

Vettel - 5
Webber - 0
Alonso - 3
Massa - 1
Button - 1
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 3
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 2
Hamilton - 2
Hulkenberg - 2
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 2
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 1
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

Edited by Lone, 19 January 2013 - 19:42.


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#2 garoidb

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 20:48

By my count, you ave awarded 12 more world championships to drivers currently on the grid. I think that may be too many, and I would imagine that some new talents will emerge over the next 12+ years to take a few, if not more, of the available titles.

Of your choices, I don't see Kimi getting two more (maximum of one, and even that is optimistic). I don't see Rosberg getting any. If Massa gets one, it will be next year (but I doubt it). Vettel could go higher than 5, and I also see Alonso getting another one. Lewis should get another one too. It is too early to say about Hulkenberg, and beyond that it could be any up and coming driver.

What I would like to see is for Alonso to take the fight to Vettel for more titles, and to get some of them. They could become epic rivals in the history of F1.





#3 Lone

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 21:11

By my count, you ave awarded 12 more world championships to drivers currently on the grid. I think that may be too many, and I would imagine that some new talents will emerge over the next 12+ years to take a few, if not more, of the available titles.

Of your choices, I don't see Kimi getting two more (maximum of one, and even that is optimistic). I don't see Rosberg getting any. If Massa gets one, it will be next year (but I doubt it). Vettel could go higher than 5, and I also see Alonso getting another one. Lewis should get another one too. It is too early to say about Hulkenberg, and beyond that it could be any up and coming driver.

What I would like to see is for Alonso to take the fight to Vettel for more titles, and to get some of them. They could become epic rivals in the history of F1.


As I mentioned it's not about logic or possibilty, nor a prediction of how many titles they will in actual fact win. It's about how many titles you would like them to win, irrespective of each other and the era they're in. It's all imaginary!

#4 garoidb

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 23:22

As I mentioned it's not about logic or possibilty, nor a prediction of how many titles they will in actual fact win. It's about how many titles you would like them to win, irrespective of each other and the era they're in. It's all imaginary!


Sure, but the purpose of these boards is discussion :) . I've given a sense of how I would like things to go too, just not with the same level of detail.

Edited by garoidb, 19 January 2013 - 23:22.


#5 KavB

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 00:01

I would love to see Kimi and Alonso getting at least one more. Kimi especially. I know he screwed up massively in 2008 but he is a special talent and I don't think his stats show the complete story of his career.

Hamilton also deserves at least one more (I don't like him but he's a huge talent). I'd also like Massa to get one after 2008 but I doubt that will ever happen.

#6 ryan86

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 00:53

I'm in the "I'd like to see Massa win one" camp as well. As much as I like Vettel, I hope he stays at 3 for a couple of seasons!

#7 Absulute

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 01:00

Vettel - 3
Webber - 0
Alonso - 2
Massa - 0
Button - 2
Perez - 8
Räikkonen - 1
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 7
Hulkenberg - 0
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

#8 bourbon

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 01:35

The driver with the most points at the end of the season - that is who I think should get the cups. How it pans out count wise is unimportant.

#9 Cool Beans

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 03:58

Vettel - 3
Webber - 0
Alonso - 3
Massa - 1
Button - 2
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 3
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 1
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 0
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 1
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

Then I would like a couple of new super talents to come in and challenge the current champions.

Edited by beancounter, 20 January 2013 - 04:09.


#10 Juggles

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 04:19

Just on the current world champions, with a mixture of reality and desire:

Vettel - 4
Alonso - 3
Hamilton - 3
Raikkonen - 2
Button - 1

I think that would be a reasonable split, and it's not too unlikely that five more championships could be shared between those five drivers. My main worry is that Vettel would take a much larger haul than one of those five championships, and Hamilton two less than two more. I just don't think, say, six championships for Vettel and one for Hamilton would be a fair reflection of their ability as drivers.

Of the others in the current grid I think only Hulkenberg has the potential to win a title, and even he is pretty uncut. I don't know enough about Bottas.

#11 Kingshark

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 05:34

Vettel - 5
Alonso - 3
Hamilton 2
Perez - 2
Hulkenburg - 1

Just my humble opinion.

#12 Jimisgod

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 06:26

Vettel - 4
Alonso - 3
Button - 1
Perez - 2
Räikkonen - 1
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 2
Bottas - 2
Ricciardo - 1

So that means: Alonso +1, Vettel +1, Hamilton +2, Perez +2, Hulkenberg +2, Bottas +2, Ricciardo +1.

Edited by Jimisgod, 20 January 2013 - 06:35.


#13 gillesthegenius

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 06:39

Just my wish...

Vettel - 10
Raikkonen - 3
Hulkenberg - 3
Alonso - 2
Hamilton - 1
Button - 1

... and I hope God makes it a reality. :D

#14 goldenboy

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 07:00

I think Ham and alonso are of course worthy of 3 each. Kimi too but as he is a bit older probably one more.

It would be awesome to see webber and/or massa pinch one.

Of the new crop hulk and perez have that little bit of bastard needed to go with speed. Romain definately if gets it together, Ricciardo has skills but can't see him being agressive enough. Don't see how we can rate bottas yet as he hasn't even had a single race.

2013 - Massa/web - 1
2014 - Alo - 1 more
2015 - Kimi - 1 more
2016/17 - Ham - 2 more
Vettel ???
Then the rookie battle after next 5+ years - 1

Edited by goldenboy, 20 January 2013 - 07:04.


#15 AM14

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 11:51

Vettel - 5
Webber -0
Alonso -3
Massa - 0
Button - 1
Perez - 2
Raikkonen - 1
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 2
Gutierrez - 0
di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 1
Ricciardo - 1
Vergne - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

Other drivers who I think could be world champions are:
Antonio Felix da Costa
Robert Frijns
Mitch Evans

#16 Skinnyguy

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 12:07

I don´t care about the rest: Alonso and Räikkönen MUST win more titles. They just deserve it after all these years of brilliant driving, and after so much close calls on titles.

I still have to rub my eyes to belive that Lewis and Sebastian are already with them stat wise, despite having spend way less time being brilliant. That´s how it goes sometimes.

#17 SealTheDiffuser

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 12:07

Vettel - 5
Webber - 0
Alonso - 4
Button - 1
Perez - 1
Räikkonen - 1
Grosjean - 1
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 2
Hulkenberg - 1
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 1
Bottas - 1
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 2
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

#18 Brandz07

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 12:09

Vettel - 3
Alonso - 3
Hamilton - 4
Ricciardo - 1
Felix da Costa - 2
Calado - 1



#19 joshb

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 12:18

I'd like to see
Vettel 17 (then he may overtake Phil Taylor of sportsman with most world titles)
and any future British drivers who I get to like getting a couple, depending how old Vettel is when he retires.

That's being greedy though

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#20 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 13:03

Vettel 17 (then he may overtake Phil Taylor of sportsman with most world titles)

He'd need 18 at least, as Federer has 17 and he's still going . . . :p

Edited by TheUltimateWorrier, 20 January 2013 - 13:03.


#21 Fulcrum

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 13:04

Vettel - 3
Webber - 0
Alonso - 4
Massa - 1
Button - 1
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 0
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 0
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 2
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0

#22 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 13:07

Sebastian Vettel: 7 titles. If he stays at Red Bull and Newey stays as well, I don't see why he won't win at least four more titles. He will be probably win this year's title. Only thing preventing this is the regulations changes for 2014 and Seb's possible desire to move teams.

Mark Webber: 0 titles. He won't win a title anymore. His big chance was 2010, he's too old now and I don't see him staying in F1 much longer.

Fernando Alonso: 3 titles. His contract ends after 2016, I think he'll retire after that, so he's got four chances. I can see him snatching one more title, if Ferrari make a good car in 2014 with new regulations. Otherwise, I don't think he will anymore.

Felipe Massa: 0 titles. Same as Webber, he's had his big chance in 2008. He came back strong last season, but with Fernando alongside him I don't believe he's got the willpower to beat him and win a title.

Jenson Button: 1 title. Button's best days are behind him. McLaren is losing ground now that they have to pay Mercedes for engines. Button will only win a title if the car is dominant and everything goes his way. Perhaps a link up with Honda in 2014 could change this, but I don't see that happening.

Sergio Pérez: 0 titles. I think he will be another Massa and Montoya. Latino driver who can be quick on his day, but not good enough to win a title. Will be a solid second driver in his F1 career.

Kimi Raikkonen: 1 title. Too bad, but I don't believe Kimi will win another title. His best days are behind him and Lotus isn't strong enough to mount a serious title challenge. I can even see Kimi retiring again after this season because he wants something else.

Romain Grosjean: 0 titles. Don't see him winning any titles. Lotus will probably be his only front running employer. If they drop him, Romain's gone as well.

Nico Rosberg: 1 title. I think he can win one title if he gets a reliable fast car for a whole season. Perhaps not at Mercedes which will be built around Hamilton, but maybe at Ferrari, McLaren or Red Bull.

Lewis Hamilton: 3 titles. I can see Lewis winning two more titles. If Mercedes has enough patience, he can win them both with the silver team. Otherwise, things will be tough. Though, Hamilton is far too good not to win another title. If not with Mercedes then surely with Red Bull or Ferrari.

Nico Hülkenberg: 2 titles. I think he can be a double world champion when he finally moves into a bigger team. It all depends on which team that will be.

Other drivers on the current grid, I don't really see snatching a world title. Perhaps Valtteri Bottas or Jean-Eric Vergne can if they get the right chance at the right time.

#23 Galko877

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 13:16

Vettel - 5
Webber - 0
Alonso - 4
Massa - 0
Button - 2
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 1
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 2
Hulkenberg - 0
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

#24 tkulla

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 13:33

Just thinking about the next 5 years I come up with...

Vettel 3 - That's right, it's the end of the road for this dynasty. Still a great driver but doesn't get all the ducks aligned again.
Alonso 4 - Gets two more in the turbo era as Ferrari produces a great engine/car for him.
Button 2 - Takes advantage of being the McLaren #1 and wins a decisive 2nd WDC, then loses motivation and retires.
Kimi 2 - Comes back to McLaren after Button's early retirement and they finally win one together.
Hamilton 2 - Wastes a few years in the wilderness before joining Ferrari alongside Vettel and finally wins his second.

Now that would make for an exciting half-decade.

#25 rasul

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 14:17

What I would like:
Hamilton - 7
Alonso - 2
Vettel - 4
Kimi - 3
Button - 1

What I think will happen:
Hamilton - 2
Alonso - 3
Vettel - 6
Kimi - 1
Button - 2

#26 garoidb

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 14:45

Just thinking about the next 5 years I come up with...

Vettel 3 - That's right, it's the end of the road for this dynasty. Still a great driver but doesn't get all the ducks aligned again.


While I suspect he will win more, it is possible that he will have a lean spell, without things even changing too much. The 2010 and 2012 titles could have slipped from him at the last races, and he could easily lose a few of those before he wins another one. Effectively, this has happened to Alonso. He won the first two in which he was a serious contender, and at that time it looked like he could quickly add more. He has been in three deciders since then, with reasonable prospects in all cases, but has not come up trumps. It can happen when the WDC standings are close.

Alonso 4 - Gets two more in the turbo era as Ferrari produces a great engine/car for him.
Button 2 - Takes advantage of being the McLaren #1 and wins a decisive 2nd WDC, then loses motivation and retires.


I don't know about Alonso getting two. As a fan, I'd be happy with one more, frankly. I can't foresee any period of dominance from Ferrari in the next few years, and 2016 sounds like the most likely retirement date for Fernando.
I could see Jenson getting another one, with his best chance possibly being 2013.

Kimi 2 - Comes back to McLaren after Button's early retirement and they finally win one together.
Hamilton 2 - Wastes a few years in the wilderness before joining Ferrari alongside Vettel and finally wins his second.


How many more years had Kimi got? He might need to change team. Lewis should get another at some stage. The thing is, if Mercedes do not deliver, there may be an abundance of new talents on the scene by the time he looks for a new team. The years could slip away.

#27 ryan86

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 15:06

He'd need 18 at least, as Federer has 17 and he's still going . . . :p


Yeah, but Federer gets 3 chances a year to win. If there was a World Championship in tennis, I guess it probably would be the tour finals.

#28 Jimisgod

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 15:25

Yeah, but Federer gets 3 chances a year to win. If there was a World Championship in tennis, I guess it probably would be the tour finals.


4 chances.

And they play 7 matches to win a "grand slam", so I guess you could say roughly 2 slams = 1 WDC.


Anyway (chance of another wdc in brackets):


Räikkönen - 33 - Not really in a "top" car in 2012, though it did win. Lotus seems to want him longer term, but I'm not sure Kimi will commit to more than another 3 or 4 years in F1. (35%)

Button - 33 - This last stretch in McLaren is likely his last in a good car. So he will probably have 3 more chances before retirement. (50%)

Alonso - 31 - He has 3 more years in the Ferrari guaranteed. As a better driver than Button, it is possible he could ring out 2 more seasons at at top team 2016 onwards. (65%)

Hamilton - 28 - 3 years at Mercedes are completely up in the air. Could be a good car. Could suck. After that he will be Alonso's current age, so he could be in the running for other top rides for at least 4 years. (75%)

Maldonado - 27 - Sitting at a midfield Williams, will be in his 30s by 2016 when big moves are likely happening in top teams. Hasn't done enough to be front of mind for a 2014 move. Not yet anyway. (20%)

Rosberg - 27 - 2013 is make or break. He showed up Schumacher, but his star could go out before he gets a good drive if the Merc is poor and Lewis beats him. (20%)

Vettel - 25 - Has Newey in hand and will be at RBR until 2016. At that time he will be the current age of Hamilton. I'd say 10 years more in top teams barring injury or a loss of motivation. (90%)

Hülkenberg - 25 - Impressive in 2012 and was good on occasion in 2010. Needs a top team seat, but Massa and Webber are looking spent so it is there for the taking. Good words spoken about him. Has 5+ years in F1 to do it, and possibly up to 10 if he finds a top team. (70%)

Ricciardo - 23 - Showed up Vergne despite the points saying otherwise. Helmut can be classified somewhere between a fickle asshole and a bag of dicks, so it is no guarantee Dan will land in the RBR seat. However I think he looks good enough for a punt when Massa and Webber depart. Could have a full decade to win. (30%)

Perez - 22 - In McLaren at such a young age, he has at least a decade to convert. His consistency is unknown but he looks fast and has a team behind him, unlike Heikki. (85%)

Edited by Jimisgod, 20 January 2013 - 15:51.


#29 CrashPad

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 17:57

Alonso, Hamilton and Raikkonen should each win at least one more, though in the end I expect Alonso and Lewis to get two more while Kimi gets none. I'd also like to see Massa get one as well, since he came so close in -08, but it's hard to see that happening.
Vettel will propably score one or two more also, though I'd be ok with it even if he didn't.
Rosberg is talented enough to get one, but it will be a high mountain to climb.
Don't really know about Hulk, Perez etc, they will propably have hard time in the future with Bottas, Da Costa, Frijns and the bunch.

Edited by CrashPad, 20 January 2013 - 17:59.


#30 Zoetrope

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 19:01

To be honest I can only be sure about Vettel and Hamilton getting at least one more.

I'd say Button, Alonso and Raikkonen got big chances, but nothing is certain. I don't see either Rosberg or Perez getting WDC. More likely Bottas or Hulkenberg. Expecting some young stars to come into play in next 3 years.

#31 jjcale

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 19:09

Just thinking about the next 5 years I come up with...

Vettel 3 - That's right, it's the end of the road for this dynasty. Still a great driver but doesn't get all the ducks aligned again.
Alonso 4 - Gets two more in the turbo era as Ferrari produces a great engine/car for him.
Button 2 - Takes advantage of being the McLaren #1 and wins a decisive 2nd WDC, then loses motivation and retires.
Kimi 2 - Comes back to McLaren after Button's early retirement and they finally win one together.
Hamilton 2 - Wastes a few years in the wilderness before joining Ferrari alongside Vettel and finally wins his second.

Now that would make for an exciting half-decade.


Most realistic scenario so far...

#32 ryan86

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 20:57

4 chances.

And they play 7 matches to win a "grand slam", so I guess you could say roughly 2 slams = 1 WDC.


I know, it was joke made of the fact that no one apart from Nadal appears to have much chance at RG.

#33 leojagpreet

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 20:59

My list:

Vettel - 7
Webber - 0
Alonso - 2
Massa - 1
Button - 1
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 2
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 1
Hulkenberg - 1
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

#34 PoleMan

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 21:24

Knowing how these things can go in binges, I think if Ferrari get it right this year, and with engines becoming a bigger factor starting in 2014, this is how I see the WDC's shaping up over the next 5 years.

I think Alonso bags the 2013 WDC, then the following two, as Ferrari hit their stride after all their personnel/equipment investments start paying off. I know 3 in a row is VERY RARE, but a lot easier if you have Best Car and Driver.
Then I see Hamilton's sublime blend of speed and maturity really gelling at Mercedes, allowing him to grab the next two. Will his domination continue? Has Vettel left Red Bull? Is Red Bull still in F1?

The crystal ball goes hazy, so I can't answer. :lol:

Vettel - 3
Webber - 0
Alonso - 5
Massa - 0
Button - 1
Perez - 1
Räikkonen - 1
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 0
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Chilton - 0

#35 lustigson

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 09:47

I have a soft spot for several drivers:

I'd like Alonso to win at least one more.
If Massa were to be WDC, that'd be fabulous.
Button winning another championship with McLaren would be cool.
Räikkönen another win as well.
Webber, I believe, is a bit too far fetched with the Second Coming of the German Wunderkind.;)
And lastly a title for Rosberg, I'd like that, too.

But that's about it. Hülkenberg could do it, Hamilton, as well, of course, although I'm no fan of his, and I guess Pérez, too. Vettel may very well take one or several more championships, but I hope that'll take some more time. :)

#36 aditya-now

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 10:17

Vettel - 3
Webber - 1
Alonso - 5
Massa - 1
Button - 1
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 3
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 3
Hulkenberg - 1
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 2
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

I know that time does not suffice for those numbers, though. As a wish list this provokes some thought.

#37 Jimisgod

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:30

So Kimi is 33 and everyone is like "oh he's like guaranteed to win another one, despite being in the 3rd/4th best car."

But Perez is 22 and everyone is like "oh in that potential full decade of driving, 3 years of which will be in a McLaren, he has no hope."

Hmm. Right.

You'd be foolish to think Perez won't be at McLaren long term if 2013 works out.

Kimi: 02 - 06 - 5 years
Senna: 88 - 93 - 5 years
Lewis: 07 - 12 - 6 years
Prost: 84 - 89 - 6 years

Edited by Jimisgod, 21 January 2013 - 12:45.


#38 Jovanotti

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:44

So Kimi is 33 and everyone is like "oh he's like guaranteed to win another one, despite being in the 3rd/4th best car."

But Perez is 22 and everyone is like "oh in that potential full decade of driving, 3 years of which will be in a McLaren, he has no hope."

Hmm. Right.

Perez is not KR format, simple as that (and I'll be happily proven wrong).

#39 Jimisgod

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 12:47

Perez is not KR format, simple as that (and I'll be happily proven wrong).


Kimi: 2 Seasons - 4 podiums.
Perez: 2 Seasons - 3 podiums.

Kimi lost a possible win in France due to oil on the road, Perez lost his chance in Malaysia due to an error in hard onditions.

And Perez wasn't in a race winning car, as Kimi was in 2002.

Edited by Jimisgod, 21 January 2013 - 12:49.


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#40 Jovanotti

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 13:03

As I said, I'll happily admit I was wrong if Perez showes something special next year. He had very good races when the strategy played into his and the cars strenghts, I just don't see the magic about Sergio yet. But obviously McLaren will have had their reasons for signing him, let's wait and see.

#41 Skinnyguy

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 14:59

And Perez wasn't in a race winning car, as Kimi was in 2002.


I do have faith in Perez becoming a future superstar too, I share your opinion about that and I do share too that he has more chances than Räikkönen to win a WDC before their career ends, but this needs correction.

2002 McLaren being labelled as "race winning", but denying it to 2012 Sauber then is a joke:

Räikkönen was on his way to win France because Montoya held the pack together early on, and because Michael Schumacher made a rookie mistake on a pit exit when he was about to take the lead and scamper into the distance. Coulthard won Monaco because Montoya messed the start badly, and then you can´t pass around there even if you´re a second faster. That car needed a serious mess to contend for a race win, if you think that must be considered a "race winning" car, then this year´s Sauber must hold that status too. Your sentence is factually right, McLaren DID win a race and Sauber did not, but both cars needed similar levels of chaos and mistakes to contend for a race win, and both came close to it in a couple of places.

#42 Jimisgod

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 17:20

I do have faith in Perez becoming a future superstar too, I share your opinion about that and I do share too that he has more chances than Räikkönen to win a WDC before their career ends, but this needs correction.

2002 McLaren being labelled as "race winning", but denying it to 2012 Sauber then is a joke:

Räikkönen was on his way to win France because Montoya held the pack together early on, and because Michael Schumacher made a rookie mistake on a pit exit when he was about to take the lead and scamper into the distance. Coulthard won Monaco because Montoya messed the start badly, and then you can´t pass around there even if you´re a second faster. That car needed a serious mess to contend for a race win, if you think that must be considered a "race winning" car, then this year´s Sauber must hold that status too. Your sentence is factually right, McLaren DID win a race and Sauber did not, but both cars needed similar levels of chaos and mistakes to contend for a race win, and both came close to it in a couple of places.


I'd have to agree. The win required special circumstances, but the McLaren was more consistent in the hands of both drivers. Kimi probably also had to settle in to smoother driving with the temperamental Mercedes engines, hence the many failures.

The McLaren of 2002 was more like the Lotus of 2012 than the Sauber. It had an average finish of 4.45 with DNFs removed (so, 20 races).

To be fair I removed all but the 20 highest scoring positions from Sauber in 2012 and got an average finish of 7.75. The Sauber was either on it, or very far off it - depending on tyres, track and temperature (as were all 2012 cars).

#43 Rinehart

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 17:38

I predict the WDC's will be shared between the existing active WDC's (Vettel, Alonso, Hamilton, Button, Kimi) for a good while yet. I don't think anyone will break into that group for a number of years. Roughly I could see Vettel and Alonso winning another couple or 3 each, Hamilton, Button, Kimi 1 each.

#44 MarileneRiddle

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 19:41

Yay random predictions! :kiss:

Vettel - 9 (Yes I believe Seb = 9 times in a row :lol: )
Webber - 0
Alonso - 2
Massa - 1 (in a super-fast Ferrari, right before he retires)
Button - 1
Perez - 0
Räikkonen - 1 (I'd love to give 2 but *points at Seb's tally)
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 1
Hulkenberg - 3 (I believe he'll kick-start the 'generation after Vettel')
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 0
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

#45 rasul

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 20:13

Yay random predictions! :kiss:

Vettel - 9 (Yes I believe Seb = 9 times in a row :lol: )
Hulkenberg - 3 (I believe he'll kick-start the 'generation after Vettel')


Er, what? Hulkenberg is the same age as Vettel. They belong to the same generation and would retire around the same time.

#46 MarileneRiddle

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 20:48

Er, what? Hulkenberg is the same age as Vettel. They belong to the same generation and would retire around the same time.


They are the same age but different 'racing generations'. Sebastian came into F1 with Hamilton, post-Schumacher generation. Because Sebastian has won 9-in-a-row, he has his own 'era' of sorts. Then Hulkenberg breaks Sebastian streak, starting the 'next generation' where Sebastian, though still a front-runner, no longer dominates. (Or maybe he retires. Haven't decided on that yet. :p)

#47 Mc_Silver

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 00:47

Vettel - 6
Webber - 0
Alonso - 3
Massa - 0
Button - 2
Perez - 2
Räikkonen - 2
Grosjean - 0
Rosberg - 0
Hamilton - 4
Hulkenberg - 1
Gutierrez - 0
Paul di Resta - 0
Maldonado - 0
Bottas - 1
Vergne - 0
Ricciardo - 0
Pic - 0
Glock - 0
Chilton - 0

Edited by Mc_Silver, 25 January 2013 - 00:47.


#48 Jimisgod

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Posted 25 January 2013 - 12:58

They are the same age but different 'racing generations'. Sebastian came into F1 with Hamilton, post-Schumacher generation. Because Sebastian has won 9-in-a-row, he has his own 'era' of sorts. Then Hulkenberg breaks Sebastian streak, starting the 'next generation' where Sebastian, though still a front-runner, no longer dominates. (Or maybe he retires. Haven't decided on that yet. :p)


I don't think Bernie will ever allow more than 5 in a row, at least not in one team. We all lived through Schumacher.

Vettel has to be favorite for 2013, but I expect them to change cars enough in 2014 for RBR to start about equal with Fez and Macca, if not Lotus and Merc.