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Lotus E21


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#451 IMO

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 17:51

well if u look at Lotus nose, u can clearly see that they made kind of tunnel to provide air thru middle of nose (where Lotus name is)


cooling purpose. most gain would be under the nose.

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#452 Shiroo

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 17:55

cooling purpose. most gain would be under the nose.

well, modesty panel gives some aero advantage so it gives a bit as well I assume:p

#453 MaxisOne

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 18:06

lotus need to rethink these...step nose will create unnecessary drag.......

Mclaren also held low opinion of Lotus's passive DRS.

They had the best simulator and measuring tools on such device...if they said so, then it must be true.





I think you are overlooking the fact that all these stepped noses are designed differently. There is a very high possibility that the stepped nose on the lotus has a less acute gradient which mitigates the drag.. Unlike some other teams which have a more acute angle on the step gradient and has more of an effect on airflow which makes the use of modesty panel look more attractive in reducing drag from the step.... ( A La Ferrari).

McLaren is a completely different situation .. they fundamentally changed their tub to the completely high version from the low version last year to enable more air to flow under the chassis.. which resulted in a step.. they decided to use the modesty panel instead of fiddling with gradients on the step.

Modesty panels may not help everyone.

Edited by MaxisOne, 01 February 2013 - 18:07.


#454 Topsu

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 18:24

Qualcomm is a money machine, maybe they could be made interested in joining F1.

#455 chumma

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 22:37

Qualcomm is a money machine, maybe they could be made interested in joining F1.

I don't think so, Formula 1 isn't really Qualcomm's market, maybe once they start making SoC's for desktop computers/laptops etc then maybe, but right now Qualcomm is heavily invested in mobile technology and well, smart phones and tablets aren't really that big within Formula 1 teams needs.

#456 g1n

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 22:44

http://youtu.be/2SioY0N69zk?t=2m28s

Vanity thing from someone who knows something...

Not a deal breaker.


yeah, since Scarbs does these things now, there is no point even reading what armchair aerodynamicists on here think, they are always wrong anyway.

#457 IMO

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 08:44

regarding the sponsors issue.

I assume they were having talks during the launch and Lotus tried to poach Honeywell further by showcasing how the car looks like with their logo presence, hence the red colour scheme portion.

Lets hope we heard some good news on Jerez test or melbourne 2013 debut.

#458 IMO

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 11:37

Sauber that previously followed rbr 's tunnel solution has launch its new car with semi coanda solution that was opt by majority of the team.


Lotus seems to be lone ranger. Remain to be seen whether Rbr will follow suit of retain their solution.

#459 Zava

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 11:47

Sauber that previously followed rbr 's tunnel solution has launch its new car with semi coanda solution that was opt by majority of the team.


Lotus seems to be lone ranger. Remain to be seen whether Rbr will follow suit of retain their solution.

no they didn't.

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#460 Shiroo

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 17:02



love the guy. totally top block, love interviews with him and he seems totally on earth guy

#461 pUs

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 18:21

http://www.scribd.co...1-E21-Press-Kit

Team 's press kit for E21!!


Surprisingly good! Well worth reading. Thanks! :)

#462 swiniodzik

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 10:03

no they didn't.


While Sauber didn't run the tunnel last year, had they continued with the ramp the tunnel would have to be a natural development of that path to minimalize the crossing-over effect of the undercut and exhaust flows and Red Bull struggled with it a lot last year, so maybe Sauber just thought better of that. Interestingly, Lotus went in the opposite direction and traded the bulge for the ramp/tunnel.

While the bulge seems better suited for the airflow coming from the sidepod undercut to the back of the car, the ramp/tunnel should direct the exhaust flow to the side of the diffuser more accurately. Which solution is better overall could even depend on the general concept of a given car but in general I'd guess the performance gains the ramp provides are more peaky but less consistent than what the bulge gives.

#463 Alburaq

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 12:49

If they want to copy RBR, they ought to copy them well; RB8 has not only two tunnels but actually 4. Two of them are blowing the motor starter hole and the central part of the diffuser's gurneys and the two others are channeling air much higher a bit like R30's double diffuser...

#464 Shiroo

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 12:52

Enstone develepment team aint stupid, they surely know what they are doing

#465 Shiroo

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 13:22

are we the team so far with biggest sidepods?

#466 tarmac

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 13:37

Newey approves this nose

#467 Anja

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 13:38

are we the team so far with biggest sidepods?

We won't really know until tuesday.

#468 IMO

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 13:51

we had serious kers issues last year...the cooling issues may forbid smaller sidepod.....

#469 ApexMouse

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 16:57

are we the team so far with biggest sidepods?


Ferrari's are very large, inlet area wise.

#470 race addicted

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 19:36

...only now I noticed that Lotus has lost TW Steel to Force India.

#471 chumma

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 19:44

...only now I noticed that Lotus has lost TW Steel to Force India.

I noticed that too on the screens behind the engineer being interviewed by Scarbs at the launch but I thought Lotus lost TW Steel after 2011?

Edited by chumma, 03 February 2013 - 19:45.


#472 Shiroo

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 19:47

I noticed that too on the screens behind the engineer being interviewed by Scarbs at the launch but I thought Lotus lost TW Steel after 2011?

They still had them in 2012.

#473 chumma

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 19:51

They still had them in 2012.

Thanks for that.

#474 race addicted

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 19:53

Yep, it was on the barge boards.

#475 Lord_Shaitan

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 20:02

On the nose as well:
Posted Image

#476 SRK

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 20:11

TW really tighten their belts so they had to go. Expect to see other watch manufacturer.

Edited by SRK, 03 February 2013 - 20:11.


#477 Alburaq

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 20:59

And trinasolar

#478 IMO

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 09:03

Redbull, Sauber and it seems merc are all opting for narrower sidepod.

Benefit may include lesser drag, increased surface area to smoothen more airflow towards the rear diffuser etc.

It would be interesting how it turns out.

With DRS limited in qualifying, RBR cant afford to run max downforce and hoping for DRS aid in shedding drag as much as possible.

I believe the narrower sidepod offer advantage on reducing drag of the car.

#479 Shiroo

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 09:10

Redbull, Sauber and it seems merc are all opting for narrower sidepod.

Benefit may include lesser drag, increased surface area to smoothen more airflow towards the rear diffuser etc.

It would be interesting how it turns out.

With DRS limited in qualifying, RBR cant afford to run max downforce and hoping for DRS aid in shedding drag as much as possible.

I believe the narrower sidepod offer advantage on reducing drag of the car.

But doesn't it decrease the place where you can gain downforce advantage? I always thought that more body gives more place where you can gain a bit downforce (though definetly less body reduces drag)

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#480 IMO

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 09:19

But doesn't it decrease the place where you can gain downforce advantage? I always thought that more body gives more place where you can gain a bit downforce (though definetly less body reduces drag)


Clearly, most significant downforce gain would be on the rear.

#481 MadYarpen

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 09:45

I believe the narrower sidepod offer advantage on reducing drag of the car.


I think most of the advantage of small sidepods is that more clean air gets to the rear and generates more downforce

Edited by MadYarpen, 04 February 2013 - 09:55.


#482 Jovanotti

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:01

Already last year, Lotus had comparatively big sidepods and it didn't harm their cars performance. Surely if sidepod size was the best solution to gain more downforce at the rear, Sauber wouldn't have been the first team to come up with a radical solution as they have at this years car.

#483 boldhakka

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:24

If there were going to be any new sponsors, they would have announced them by now. This is a great time to announce new sponsors, before the news cycle starts focussing on testing, performance, and the start of racing.

Not good.

Upper midfield to begin with. We'll lose some oomph at around Spa, as the top 4 shift to a higher gear and invest into mid-season development more than Lotus.

The DDRS better work out of the box this time.

#484 SRK

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 10:30

Flow quality around and behind sidepods is the most important thing, not their size. Cars with biggest sidepods in last year- McLaren, Williams and Lotus. They weren't very slow.

If there were going to be any new sponsors, they would have announced them by now. This is a great time to announce new sponsors, before the news cycle starts focussing on testing, performance, and the start of racing.

Not good.

The best time to announce new sponsors is after finish negotiations and signing agreement :stoned:

Edited by SRK, 04 February 2013 - 11:04.


#485 Alburaq

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 11:30

Already last year, Lotus had comparatively big sidepods and it didn't harm their cars performance.

You dont know that.

Surely if sidepod size was the best solution to gain more downforce at the rear, Sauber wouldn't have been the first team to come up with a radical solution as they have at this years car.


Sauber is inspiring many teams since last year with their original aero solutions. RedBull copied their slot behind the nosestep after dropping their own solution and copied they ramp coanda exhauts and enhanced them. Mclaren copied their sidepod horizontal winglets.
Sauber discovered a 'trick' that helps them tighten up the sidepods after Perez's crash in Monaco...

Edited by Alburaq, 04 February 2013 - 13:05.


#486 swiniodzik

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Posted 04 February 2013 - 23:38

Flow quality around and behind sidepods is the most important thing, not their size. Cars with biggest sidepods in last year- McLaren, Williams and Lotus. They weren't very slow.


The quality of the flow around the sidepods is determined by their size, as far as the requirements of the downforce-producing devices, like the rear or beam wing, are concerned. Since the sidepods are disrupting blocks for those, I'd surprised if there's a team that isn't constantly looking to make theirs as small as the packaging and cooling requirements allow for. The fact that Lotus was competitive last year with big sidepods doesn't mean anything indeed. McLaren started last season with a low nose and the fastest car yet soon changed it to a higher one following the trend of their slower rivals.

#487 Mauseri

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 02:54

The quality of the flow around the sidepods is determined by their size, as far as the requirements of the downforce-producing devices, like the rear or beam wing, are concerned. Since the sidepods are disrupting blocks for those, I'd surprised if there's a team that isn't constantly looking to make theirs as small as the packaging and cooling requirements allow for.

It's not only size that matters. Shape is equally important, and when we are talking about creating good condition for downforce as well...

If making the side pods as small as possible was number 1 priority, we would have seen much smaller for a long time. But in many years it has been those cars with larger sidepods that have better downforce values, while small sidepod cars have a tendency to enjoy on straight lines.

Edited by Mauseri, 05 February 2013 - 02:56.


#488 Jovanotti

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:37

If making the side pods as small as possible was number 1 priority, we would have seen much smaller for a long time. But in many years it has been those cars with larger sidepods that have better downforce values, while small sidepod cars have a tendency to enjoy on straight lines.

That's the point I was trying to make basically. I stand by my opinion that sidepod size won't be an big matter of discussion this season, as it wasn't last year or the years before.

#489 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 05:57

That's the point I was trying to make basically. I stand by my opinion that sidepod size won't be an big matter of discussion this season, as it wasn't last year or the years before.

Unless Sauber takes 1-2 in Melbourne. It might be a hot topic then. :)

#490 Jovanotti

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 06:22

Unless Sauber takes 1-2 in Melbourne. It might be a hot topic then. :)

True. I wouldn't mind actually as I like Sauber very much.

Back on topic, off-season is over and I'm really interested what the "real" E21 will look like today.

Edited by Jovanotti, 05 February 2013 - 06:22.


#491 Zava

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 09:05

Posted Image
DRD openings (as expected from the first test) closed, but there. the weird sidepod winglet from the car reveal is not, though.

#492 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 10:48

Posts deleted

This thread is for discussing the car, there is a thread for discussing testing and live coverage of the test on http://live.autosport.com/

#493 Alburaq

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 13:41

Decent photos are rare, but here some comparisons. 'The devil is in the details'

http://www10.pic-upl...zi9iry3mqh1.jpg
http://i16.servimg.c...26/lotu-r10.jpg
http://i16.servimg.c...26/racepi10.jpg

Edited by Alburaq, 05 February 2013 - 15:35.


#494 Wander

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 15:03

Great pics, thanks. Looks 95% the same, but I guess in F1 5% being different is pretty huge these days.

#495 Vesuvius

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 15:27

I think the car looks great but the nose has been changed from last year, step looks more visible and uglier but still the car looks good and seems as fast as last year at this point :)

#496 thiscocks

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 15:43

I like the return to the large driver name prints. 70's style

#497 Mauseri

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 17:19

I like the return to the large driver name prints. 70's style

Total prints are reduced, or maybe they paid Romain in the car.

Just kidding.

#498 Puhoon

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 17:22

With DRS limited in qualifying, RBR cant afford to run max downforce and hoping for DRS aid in shedding drag as much as possible.


Everybody runs max downforce in most of the tracks.

Edited by Puhoon, 05 February 2013 - 17:22.


#499 Cyanide

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 18:45

Were Lotus running the DDRS today? Are there any reports on that?

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#500 Disgrace

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Posted 05 February 2013 - 18:50

I wonder why they keep going back and forward with those additional air intakes on the top of the engine cover. They first appeared mid-season on the R30, before disappearing until mid-season again on the R31. They didn't make an appearance on the E20 but now they're back again on the E21.