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When will chrome end in McLaren cars?


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#51 Tombstone

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 17:59

Why did Mclaren ever use orange? I love it - and it seems to return in many of their cars. Any special reason?


Teddy Mayer, unhappy with the team's previous colour schemes, had seen a yellow Lola T70 and opted for something similar which, it was felt "would show up like a beacon on TV."

Source: McLaren - The Cars 1964-2008, McLaren M6A (page 40)

Edited by Tombstone, 31 January 2013 - 18:06.


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#52 Anonymous

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:07

But now with Mercedes having their own team there's no reason to continue with the chrome.


Mercedes has nothing to do with chrome livery.

#53 RealRacing

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:23

Mercedes has nothing to do with chrome livery.


You mean Mercedes has nothing to do with chrome livery at McLaren? How come is it there then? I know silver at West McLaren Mercedes definitely had to do with the silver arrows (as someone has pointed out, West has nothing to do with silver). So what is the chrome related to?

Edited by RealRacing, 31 January 2013 - 18:24.


#54 Anonymous

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:28

You mean Mercedes has nothing to do with chrome livery at McLaren? How come is it there then?


They chose chrome livery, but that wasn't because of Mercedes.

#55 Moore

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:37

I'd love if they went back to Red and white, but I doubt they would.

Orange would be a beautiful colour. I just think the chrome is rather boring now, but the cars are still beautiful nonetheless.

#56 charly0418

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:37

Well there's rumors about Telmex joining next year and maybe taking over for Vodafone. So who knows

#57 motorhead

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:39

I think it was the "silver arrow" semantics which made they choose that livery. I like it, I hope that teams stick to their colors. Of course the tones can change.

#58 August

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:41

For the hundredth time - CHROME IS McLAREN.


I think Macca already thinks ORANGE IS McLAREN. Checo came with an orange McLaren to the launch, and Macca's road car business's website was mainly orange, at least the last time I visited there.

So, I wouldn't be too surprised to see an orange McLaren in F1 in the future. I assume they will ditch chrome once Merc isn't anymore in the official team name. Actually, it's a bit surprising that the team is still Vodafone McLaren Mercedes, despite being only Merc's customers.

And once they ditch chrome, I believe they'll have orange, unless a sponsor pays enough to get the whole car plainted in their colours.

#59 RealRacing

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 18:57

They chose chrome livery, but that wasn't because of Mercedes.



Oh ok, do you know why it was then? As said, I thought they just decided to modify the (at that time) existing silver a little bit to make it more shiny.

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#60 Amphicar

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 20:26

I don't know why some people seem to think that orange is McLaren's traditional colour. Possibly because that (well actually Papaya, which is more of an egg-yolk yellow) was the colour that the cars were when the music stopped for Bruce McLaren. In reality, F1 McLarens were only orange-y for four seasons: 1968, 1969, 1970 and 1971 (though it continued in Can-Am for longer). For 1972 it was mostly replaced by Yardley white, black and brown and when Marlboro took over as main sponsor the orange went completely.

Before 1968 F1 McLarens were turned out in various colours. The first McLaren F1 car to race, the M2b in 1966 was white with a dark blueish green stripe. That was followed in 1967 by the F2-based M4B, which was red with a white nose. The 4B was then superseded by the M5A, which was red with a dark blue stripe.

If you go back to the first racing car McLaren produced, the Group 7 M1a, that was black with a broad silver stripe, reflecting the New Zealand sporting colours used in rugby, soccer etc:

Posted Image

When national motor racing colours were first created, former British colonies were generally allocated British green plus another distinguishing colour - hence the green and gold of Brabham. New Zealand's distinguishing colour was silver. The silver fern is also the national emblem worn by New Zealanders representing their country in sport. So there is a good argument that if McLaren has a traditional colour it would be silver/chrome.


#61 chumma

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 20:41

The same time Ferrari stop using Red. Personally on a more serious note though, I don't think the chrome does the cars justice, it hides a lot of its curves and makes them look big and flat, still by far my favourite livery was the West liveries most notably 2005 once they stopped messing about with painting the sidepod vents white then black then white then finally leaving them alone and having them black. Had West been plastered on the rear wings that season it would have made it even better, that being side, Chrome is McLaren's corporate colours and they won't be going anywhere fast unless they land some extraordinary landmark deal with a company who's colours are in stark contrast to the chrome and do not want McLaren to use the chrome, the good thing with the chrome is any colour can go with it, i'd love a black McLaren though...I wouldn't be surprised if, like in 86 with Keke, McLaren for a certain race, change the red around the Vodafone to an orange (I know Keke's was yellow because of Portuguese Marlboro packets), for one race or something, Silverstone? Of course Vodafone would have to agree first or we'd end up with the Minardi fiasco all over again.

Edited by chumma, 31 January 2013 - 20:47.


#62 Skinnyguy

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 21:21

The same time Ferrari stop using Red.

Ferrari has hystoric reasons for that, they´ll probably never change it. McLaren will when sponsors change.

Personally on a more serious note though, I don't think the chrome does the cars justice, it hides a lot of its curves and makes them look big and flat

So true!!

by far my favourite livery was the West liveries most notably 2005 once they stopped messing about with painting the sidepod vents white then black then white then finally leaving them alone and having them black

That was great looking. And it was curious, they never stopped messing with it, they had black wings, dark grey ones, nearly white ones... and it all worked visually.

that being side, Chrome is McLaren's corporate colours and they won't be going anywhere fast unless they land some extraordinary landmark deal with a company who's colours are in stark contrast to the chrome and do not want McLaren to use the chrome, the good thing with the chrome is any colour can go with it, i'd love a black McLaren though...

No, they don´t have any history with chrome. It´s just temporary, another paintwork. Good thing is, as you say, even if they keep chrome they can come up with great liveries once Vodafone deal expires.



#63 chumma

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 21:57

No, they don´t have any history with chrome. It´s just temporary, another paintwork. Good thing is, as you say, even if they keep chrome they can come up with great liveries once Vodafone deal expires.

Their history with chrome started in 06, it has been stated by McLaren themselves, Chrome is the colour of McLaren whether we like it or not. We all thought there was going to be a change a few years ago when the new team kit came out in black, there was big debate about a possible change in livery which McLaren poured cold water all over and said chrome is our colour and chrome is staying. I just find it a boring colour, and over the years the chrome has gotten a lot more dull than its shiny mirror like 06 form.

#64 Skinnyguy

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 22:28

Their history with chrome started in 06, it has been stated by McLaren themselves, Chrome is the colour of McLaren whether we like it or not.


A colour is "your colour" when you keep it for decades and decades. This hasn´t any history behind, if they really said that in a transcendental or sentimental way it looks a stupid statement to me.

Chrome is their colour NOW, and that´s it. It won´t be for too long surely (hope so at least).

#65 Boing 2

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 22:39

I'd have thought that if they do their own engine they would move away from chrome as it would be too close to the Mercedes image. Having said that, grey/silver/chrome has always been a Ron Dennis favourite, just look at their HQ.

#66 KingB

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 23:44

I would like if they keep the chrome, but I'm tired of the red. I would appreciate the current design, but with a different color at the Vodafone spot every season. So you need a sponsor, who says...please paint it this year in green, and this year in orange and so on...I would imagine sth like the Benetton company with their multicolored logo...

#67 oetzi

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 23:54

The longest period of time was spent in white and red... so why is McLaren Chrome?

Red and white was for money. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing.

Interestingly, if you look at that timeline of cars, some people might think that the early McLarens looked like low rent Ferraris until a year after Marlboro came on board. Then, all of a sudden, they changed the game and smacked everyone's behinds while sporting a very distinctive livery. Then they changed their livery (for whatever reason), and have won very little until the present day.

Of course, liveries are nothing to do with success.

Edited by oetzi, 01 February 2013 - 01:15.


#68 10e10

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 23:57

I see many people saying the red comes from Vodafone, but it's not entirely true, in the West livery they kept their logos on the car with a red color scheme, as well under the nose of the cars. In 2006 they didn't have Vodafone (and before they had Fly Emirates) and still had red in certain parts of the car. What I mean is, unless a big sponsor imposing a color scheme, the red is to be kept, even if it has to be in a smaller presence.

#69 oetzi

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 00:01

They chose chrome livery, but that wasn't because of Mercedes.

Nope, it was for a far better reason - Ron wanted the team's colour to be the colour of the most highly technological paint they could imagine,at a single point in time to reflect brand values of excellence, progress, cutting edge tech and what have you.

Brand team - how's that workin' for ya?

#70 oetzi

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 00:03

TBH, there's not much of that, even less every year.

So you agree he's right?

Not sure you meant to.

#71 Tombstone

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 00:58

I don't know why some people seem to think that orange is McLaren's traditional colour.


Because McLaren do. And that beats any outsiders' opinion, one way or t'other.

Edited by Tombstone, 01 February 2013 - 01:00.


#72 Mc_Silver

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 01:49

I like chrome a lot. I don't think it is boring. There are much more boring liveries out there.

Edited by Mc_Silver, 01 February 2013 - 02:32.


#73 Rubens Hakkamacher

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 02:19

The chrome is fantastic, F1 *should* have a chrome car, and for McLaren it's completely fitting.

The midsection of the MP4-28, after of the cockpit with the contours is fantastic with the chrome. I can't fathom anyone not liking that....



#74 fer312t

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 02:30

Posted Image

look at this picture and maybe you'll get your answer..



Neat...but could help notice weirdness in that chart....why does 1970 come before 1969? Where is the McLaren M14? Also the McLaren 1990 MP4/5B (which was quite different in appearance to the 4/5) is not on there...

#75 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 06:52

So share your view: Are you sick of this livery already or you still like it? How long it´s supposed to stay (any info on contracts with sponsors?)? What would you like for the future?

Obviously F1 teams rarely change their liveries - look at Red Bull and Toyota - X seasons, each and every one all with the same livery (maybe with a slightly tweaked stripe here or there). Therefore when the casual sports fan watches say 1 or 2 F1 races per season they can still recognize "your" team easily, as the livery is the same as it was for past 5 seasons.

It will be refreshing when McLaren do change it. Hopefully to a works McLaren orange scheme of some sort. :love:

However they do have one of the best liveries and (if only they had more wdc/wcc wins) then it would be considered a classic F1 livery in my book. :up:

Surely JPS livery would not be so famous if it was only used for 1 season, for instance. :)

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 01 February 2013 - 06:53.


#76 chumma

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 06:55

A colour is "your colour" when you keep it for decades and decades. This hasn´t any history behind, if they really said that in a transcendental or sentimental way it looks a stupid statement to me.

Chrome is their colour NOW, and that´s it. It won´t be for too long surely (hope so at least).

How on earth do you expect a team to have a colour for decades if they can't start? Chrome, is McLaren's corporate colour, go look it up. Jonathon Neale has said it, Whitmarsh has said it, McLaren's social media man has said it, they may not have had it for long, but they are going to continue with it for a long time.

Im over it too, but unfortunately for us, McLaren don't care if we like the colour or not.

#77 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 07:00

So, I wouldn't be too surprised to see an orange McLaren in F1 in the future. I assume they will ditch chrome once Merc isn't anymore in the official team name. Actually, it's a bit surprising that the team is still Vodafone McLaren Mercedes, despite being only Merc's customers.

I thought this was the "payment" for McLaren to buy out Mercedes share. (i.e., McLaren give free Mercedes branding) :)
How many years was that "buy back" meant to be over?

#78 V8 Fireworks

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 07:03

How on earth do you expect a team to have a colour for decades if they can't start? Chrome, is McLaren's corporate colour, go look it up. Jonathon Neale has said it, Whitmarsh has said it, McLaren's social media man has said it, they may not have had it for long, but they are going to continue with it for a long time.


If Chrome is their colour then why (a) and (b)? It just doesn't make any sense! I can understand that chrome is not durable enough to sell to customers on road going cars, so then why not go racing in silver and present silver cars to the press if chrome is your official colour?

(a) Posted Image

(b) Posted Image

#79 Rinehart

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 07:57

Lets be realistic if google came along with the biggest deal in f1 history but said the car needs to be white with the multicolour google logo, it would be, no question. I'd even go as far as to say there is probably a point at which Ferrari would cave into their sponsors dollar.

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#80 Talisker

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 08:39

Sponsors aren't an issue. Which of their current sponsors has chrome as a corporate colour? I do feel they're due for a change - chrome is flashy, and flashy dates. And it has.

#81 Tombstone

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 08:41

Neat...but could help notice weirdness in that chart....why does 1970 come before 1969? Where is the McLaren M14? Also the McLaren 1990 MP4/5B (which was quite different in appearance to the 4/5) is not on there...



The reason is very simple: the people who made the chart made mistakes.

It happens on the internet as well as in the real world.

Edited by Tombstone, 01 February 2013 - 08:46.


#82 oetzi

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 08:48

Lets be realistic if google came along with the biggest deal in f1 history but said the car needs to be white with the multicolour google logo, it would be, no question. I'd even go as far as to say there is probably a point at which Ferrari would cave into their sponsors dollar.

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you.


#83 Skinnyguy

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 14:37

How on earth do you expect a team to have a colour for decades if they can't start? Chrome, is McLaren's corporate colour, go look it up. Jonathon Neale has said it, Whitmarsh has said it, McLaren's social media man has said it, they may not have had it for long, but they are going to continue with it for a long time.


We won´t agree on that one mate. If it was "their colour", and the company image revolved around it, it would have been for years already on their cars. To me that just sounds as something they made up at some point, if it´s true they say that. The company had gone for years and years and the colour meant nothing for it.

Of course their decission is what counts, but it looks really stupid trying to sell that "we are chrome" stuff as if it had any history or value.



#84 August

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 15:53

How on earth do you expect a team to have a colour for decades if they can't start? Chrome, is McLaren's corporate colour, go look it up. Jonathon Neale has said it, Whitmarsh has said it, McLaren's social media man has said it, they may not have had it for long, but they are going to continue with it for a long time.

Im over it too, but unfortunately for us, McLaren don't care if we like the colour or not.


Of course they say that. But they are fools if they are going to have different colours for their roadcar division and F1 team.

#85 Rinehart

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 16:53

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you.


Well its already happened, the red of the Ferrari's changed tone in the 90's, it was actually Marlboro Red, not Ferrari Red (much more orange). Essentially had Marlboro packets been blue, so would the car.

#86 Spillage

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 17:03

I like the chrome on McLaren, but the red part is ugly for me.

Agree. I don't mind the chrome, but I've never really thought it matches the red ad have always preferred the chrome-and-black scheme of 2006.

Still, they have a deal with vodafone so I don't suppose it can really be helped.

#87 Zava

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 17:04

How on earth do you expect a team to have a colour for decades if they can't start? Chrome, is McLaren's corporate colour, go look it up. Jonathon Neale has said it, Whitmarsh has said it, McLaren's social media man has said it, they may not have had it for long, but they are going to continue with it for a long time.

Im over it too, but unfortunately for us, McLaren don't care if we like the colour or not.

if they indeed say chrome is their colour (but still roll out the new mclaren cars in orange), that is about the same category as Ron Dennis saying that MP4 always stood for mclaren project 4, even though everyone knows it was marlboro project 4.

#88 oetzi

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 22:55

Well its already happened, the red of the Ferrari's changed tone in the 90's, it was actually Marlboro Red, not Ferrari Red (much more orange). Essentially had Marlboro packets been blue, so would the car.

If my auntie had a...

How much would you like to bet that every one of Ferrari's F1 cars will be predominantly red for each of the next 25 years?

And how much on McLaren's being 'chrome'?

Do you want to include/exclude changes in exact shade of 'chrome' in the wager?

:wave:

Edited by oetzi, 01 February 2013 - 22:58.


#89 jondon

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 22:57

Lets be realistic if google came along with the biggest deal in f1 history but said the car needs to be white with the multicolour google logo, it would be, no question. I'd even go as far as to say there is probably a point at which Ferrari would cave into their sponsors dollar.


Would Google not have a preference for chrome?


#90 oetzi

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 22:59

Would Google not have a preference for chrome?

:up: :lol:

#91 Rockets

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 23:12

i love current livery, i hope not change many years.. its awesome.

#92 beute

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 00:37

in 1998 I started to think how awesome it would be if Mclaren used chrome instead of black and silver.
Then I heard that they're finally gonna do it in 2006, and man was I disappointed.
it looks horrible compared to the west livery.
At least the 2006 car still had black colored sidepods instead of the shitty red vodafone.

Edited by beute, 02 February 2013 - 00:38.


#93 aditya-now

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 08:54

I like it and still like it. Vodafone sponsorship only covers this year (with an option to renew next year). If the title sponsor changes for 2014, then the livery could well be dramatically different. So you may only have one more year of it.


Maybe finally turning back to classic orange again. I just rewatched the 1970 season....


#94 aditya-now

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 09:03

When national motor racing colours were first created, former British colonies were generally allocated British green plus another distinguishing colour - hence the green and gold of Brabham. New Zealand's distinguishing colour was silver. The silver fern is also the national emblem worn by New Zealanders representing their country in sport. So there is a good argument that if McLaren has a traditional colour it would be silver/chrome.


That's a good argument you have there, amphicar!


#95 SunnyENTP

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 11:37

They chose chrome livery, but that wasn't because of Mercedes.


That is not true, I read an article a long time ago in which Stuttgart wanted McLaren to incorporate the Silver after the Honda deal. This is going back as far back as the 90's.

#96 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 11:51

Several pages of waffle. The sponsor dictates the color. It could be pink if a new sponsor dictates. And pays Ron a lot of money.
Ferraris red has been traditional and they are backed by Fiat, so can be a bit choosier. But have had various other colors too, again for sponsors. Marlboro, Shell and others. Though they have only been 'part' sponsors.
The silver and now chrome has been for the sponsors, Vodaphone has a lot of silver/ chrome/ dayglo red out there on umpteen different series.
as do Red Bull with the navy, silver etc schemes.

#97 ElDictatore

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Posted 02 February 2013 - 12:10

Im actually good with the chrome. West was my favorite livery, but I also wouldn't mind the Orange livery. The thing that bugs my about the McLaren livery is the Vodafone rocket red. Too prominent, I like it more before when it was just nuances of red. Also didn't like the Marlboro White/Red

Edited by ElDictatore, 02 February 2013 - 12:10.


#98 oetzi

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 10:09

Several pages of waffle. The sponsor dictates the color. It could be pink if a new sponsor dictates. And pays Ron a lot of money.
Ferraris red has been traditional and they are backed by Fiat, so can be a bit choosier. But have had various other colors too, again for sponsors. Marlboro, Shell and others. Though they have only been 'part' sponsors.
The silver and now chrome has been for the sponsors, Vodaphone has a lot of silver/ chrome/ dayglo red out there on umpteen different series.
as do Red Bull with the navy, silver etc schemes.

That's not 100% true - McLaren are trying to establish the chrome as their permanent livery, and therefore the background against which any sponsor/partner/whatever will be displayed. If the road division of McLaren or the Board chooses to chuck them some money then they may be able to be choosy enough to establish it, otherwise the chances are pretty slim. But it was Ron's project, he's still in charge overall (I believe, even though he's far less visible these days), and if he really wants it done, he'll make the resources available.

We'll see.

Edited by oetzi, 03 February 2013 - 10:10.


#99 JRizzle86

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 10:20

Here's the thing. Chrome looks good on a race car, on a road car, no. It just doesn't and people have tried. In fact there are numerous cars in the middle east attempting it.
It looks ridiculous, probably why when McLaren releases a new road car they tend to use Orange to hark back to the early days of McLaren. They sure as hell ain't gonna use Marlboro red and white.
The chrome works, it attracts attention and looks high tech which in turn attracts high end investment. McLaren need not concern themselves with a small group of fans who wish there to be a livery change every 3 years, if you want that you should probably support Lotus, Sauber, Williams etc.

Edited by JRizzle86, 03 February 2013 - 12:01.


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#100 SCUDmissile

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 10:27

I'm actually fine with chrome. Why not replace the Vodafone red with orange after the sponsorship runs out?
McLaren have their new colour, and their historic colour.
Everybody wins. I think it would look cool.