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Elfin type 600, 600 B, C, D & E


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#101 kym

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 08:11

Last pic I have for this topic.

Phillip Island - the weekend of the Belinda's Terrace sponsored Vee Nationals.
(I'm embarressed to admit I just cannot remember the date.)

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Kym

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#102 Ray Bell

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 10:51

Is it Roach?

Was it 1977?

That '72 Gold Star event was the first time I went to AIR. I had a great time that weekend, Walker was into F500 by then so the pics of him in the 600 will be from some time earlier that year.

It wasn't the opening meeting (January 9) as Ramsay was a runaway winner in a 600 fitted with a TC4V (according to the report...??), Dean Clough being second and Jim Thompson third in a 600FF ahead of Ian Richards' Viper F3

Of note is the fact that the day finished with Ramsay owning the lap record, that would be the only time a 600 has had an outright lap record, wouldn't it? Or did Cooper get it at Mallala with the Repco V8?

There were no F2 cars at the next meeting (the Tasman Cup race, Walker was in F5000 by then) and he's not there in any races later in the year.

That's a bit of a mystery!

#103 Paul Hamilton

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 23:30

It wasn't the opening meeting (January 9) as Ramsay was a runaway winner in a 600 fitted with a TC4V (according to the report...??), Dean Clough being second and Jim Thompson third in a 600FF ahead of Ian Richards' Viper F3

Of note is the fact that the day finished with Ramsay owning the lap record, that would be the only time a 600 has had an outright lap record, wouldn't it? Or did Cooper get it at Mallala with the Repco V8?


Malcolm would have been driving Granton Harrison's 600C (s/n 6908) in what I suspect was his last outing in the car he had been driving for Granton since 1970 mostly with a Repco V8 engine. As with many other 600s 6908 has had a variety of engines fitted starting life with a 2.5 litre Repco V8 before acquiring the Waggott and then, when Roger Harrison started driving it, I think it had pushrod Ford for a while as featured in some of Kym's recent postings. Roger ultimately refitted the Repco engine which grew to 4.4 litres when he started running on the hills. In that form he used it to win the Australian Hillclimb Championship at Mount Cotton in 1983 and I think he was runner up at Huntley the following year again in 6908. Roger then went on to win a further two AHCC titles in more modern machinery.

Garry Campbell also had a Waggott fitted to 7122 at one stage and, as previously noted here, the Glynn Scott car (7016) had a TC4V from day one.

6908 has now been superbly restored to its 2.5 litre Repco powered form and is in the hands of Ian Ross in Sydney. It still appears occasionally at historic meetings but Ian has such an extensive collection of desireable machinery to choose from that the 600C does not see a lot of use these days.

#104 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 05:58

Malcolm would have been driving Granton Harrison's 600C (s/n 6908) in what I suspect was his last outing in the car he had been driving for Granton since 1970 mostly with a Repco V8 engine. As with many other 600s 6908 has had a variety of engines fitted starting life with a 2.5 litre Repco V8 before acquiring the Waggott and then, when Roger Harrison started driving it, I think it had pushrod Ford for a while as featured in some of Kym's recent postings. Roger ultimately refitted the Repco engine which grew to 4.4 litres when he started running on the hills. In that form he used it to win the Australian Hillclimb Championship at Mount Cotton in 1983 and I think he was runner up at Huntley the following year again in 6908. Roger then went on to win a further two AHCC titles in more modern machinery.

Garry Campbell also had a Waggott fitted to 7122 at one stage and, as previously noted here, the Glynn Scott car (7016) had a TC4V from day one.

6908 has now been superbly restored to its 2.5 litre Repco powered form and is in the hands of Ian Ross in Sydney. It still appears occasionally at historic meetings but Ian has such an extensive collection of desireable machinery to choose from that the 600C does not see a lot of use these days.

you answered the question I was about to pose. Was the Harrison 600 the same car as used by Roger at the hills.
I believe though that Repco ended up just over 5 litres. Then went in Alfies x Formula Mundane Tiga. Which then was no longer mundane as I can attest to watching it.

Edited by Lee Nicolle, 20 March 2013 - 05:59.


#105 xj13v12

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Posted 23 July 2013 - 10:59

you answered the question I was about to pose. Was the Harrison 600 the same car as used by Roger at the hills.
I believe though that Repco ended up just over 5 litres. Then went in Alfies x Formula Mundane Tiga. Which then was no longer mundane as I can attest to watching it.


The 5 litre 740 Repco engine is for sale. It is the engine from the car you describe.

#106 Jacer

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Posted 01 August 2013 - 00:18

Hi guys, I know this is off topic for this thread but was hoping some of the more experienced Elfin guys may be of help.
I'm after the name of the original chassis colour for the Elfin 500 vee. I know it was a light grey colour a bit like steel grey but if anyone could help with the proper name I would be thankfull.
DC



#107 SJ Lambert

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Posted 07 August 2013 - 04:53

G'day DC - there's a thread here Elfin Formula Vee Photos where I've posted a picture of my Dad in what I presume to be the original chassis (it's complete with bodywork) - I also put up a couple of colour pics from inside the factory showing a chassis undressed (it may be the original chassis, Bob Mills took the shot and the boys tended to only photograph significant cars) - problem is the chassis only ones don't appear for me on the thread when I open it these days.

I can e-mail them to you if you'd like.

Colours aren't crystal clear - duck egg blue may well be a possibility compared with the grey
....... you can see the roll hoop in the "outside in the sun shot" - I'll ask Dad.

Cheers

James

Edited by SJ Lambert, 07 August 2013 - 05:01.


#108 kaydee

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 11:46

The 600E that Henk Woelders raced ...question.
Was it on fuel injection and if so make?

 

 

 

Henk Woelders and many other ANF2 drivers at that time ran the Globe-Lucas petrol injection system. 

 

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#109 rasimmo

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Posted 19 November 2013 - 04:33

Hullo all, having just stumbled on this excellent forum while googling something else and seeing the discussion of the tragic lakeside meeting, I thought I would post a couple of photos that I took on the day. The first showing Ivan and Glyn during the early laps coming out of the Karousel.

Scan-131117-0001b.jpg

 

 This one of Glyn taken on his last lap, is out of focus but shows clearly that he had lost his goggles, had dropped back a bit and was going hard to catch up.

Scan-131117-0002cc.jpg

Cheers Dick Simpson

 



#110 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 November 2013 - 05:23

Is his helmet undone or what?

 

Something looks wrong there...



#111 lyntonh

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Posted 19 November 2013 - 12:16

I find that last photo quite hard to take in...

#112 rasimmo

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 00:46

Hullo Lynton, may I ask, what it is about the photo that you find so hard to "take in".

Simmo



#113 lyntonh

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 01:37

Hullo Lynton, may I ask, what it is about the photo that you find so hard to "take in".

Simmo

The photo may be the last one taken of someone doing what they love to do, before they die doing it.

 

He's driving with his helmet lifting in the wind stream & in sun glasses, with his goggles gone,

& still bouncing wheels on the edge of the road in his efforts to keep up....unaware of what awaits him so soon.

 

Personally, I find that hard to take in.



#114 rasimmo

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 02:09

Must say you put that into words much better than I could. He was one of my favourite drivers, always neat yet fast, in immaculate cars. We could not see the accident from where we were, just a cloud of dust and we didn`t know how serious it was till we heard the news on the car radio when we were well into our 12 hour drive home. I don`t know if it is relevent but on the Saturday practice standing in the same place we were playing "hand ball"swatting large grasshoppers and talking to one of the locals mentioned how bad they were - he said ├┐ou should have been here last week, we had a plague. I always wondered if he met one of those brutes without goggles on the straight.

Simmo.



#115 SJ Lambert

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 12:10

It certainly is a sobering picture. Still, thanks for showing us such a bittersweet image.

#116 Ray Bell

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 19:50

Not everyone agreed that Scotty was 'always neat but fast'...

 

I recall one front-line journalist who was present at the Rocky Tresise crash who many times blamed Glynn for that incident. And it's also true that his cars got slower as they got older.

 

The reason for this, as explained by another top driver who didn't compete against him, but was often in the same races, was that Scotty tended to take shortcuts in maintenance. Things like squashing the rod ends in a vyce to give them further life would tend to lead to the situation that a car would lose its competitive edge over time.

 

And that was how it was with him, he was fast when he got a new car, then lost pace as the car aged.



#117 rasimmo

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Posted 22 November 2013 - 23:40

Hmm, another long held illusion shattered. I seem to have learned more in the couple of days browsing this forum than in all the years standing in the spectator areas at the Farm or Oran or Catalina Parks or the Mountain.

Thanks Ray, Simmo



#118 Ray Bell

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Posted 23 November 2013 - 10:51

Well...

 

Don't take my word for everything. But it is true that the Scott cars that I saw, from the 27 through to the Bowin, tended to get slower as time went on. Glynn did a lot of racing and the need to be careful with money was bound to come up, so it was no surprise to me when I was told this.

 

The comment about Longford I can't verify. The person who told me this is long since deceased and had some seriously fixed ideas about things and would stick to those ideas right or wrong.

 

I talked to Norm at the Farm meeting before that Lakeside. I think I might have mentioned this previously in this thread, he had not been home in something like six weeks leading up to that event and was looking forward to being home for the Lakeside races. But that doesn't in the slightest explain the visor issue.



#119 The Chasm

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Posted 05 December 2013 - 20:00

I know this probably belongs in another thread, but sadly Coral Scott has passed away - widow of Glyn Scott.



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#120 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 December 2013 - 13:46

Certainly it should be recorded elsewhere...

 

However, at this point in this thread it also belongs here. 

 

Coral didn't simply stop turning out at race meetings on Glynn's death, she was always at Lakeside and helping out in the VIP room with others of similar stature. Of course, Gary went racing later too, so being there to see their son race would have mattered, but her place in the establishment was very firm. 



#121 The Chasm

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Posted 11 December 2013 - 19:57

Please accept my condolences on your recent loss Ray - taken too soon.

 

I have in the past puzzled over the spelling of Glyn, but the family confirmed via the death notice last week that there is only one "n". Other sources have original documents signed by Glyn with only one "n". Motorsport Memorial have done quite a bit of research to clear up the spelling.



#122 Ray Bell

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Posted 12 December 2013 - 00:26

How could I do that, how lazy am I?

 

All I had to do every time I questioned the spelling in my mind was get out the Spetember 1970 issue of RCN. But I didn't do it. My apologies, it is indeed 'Glyn'.



#123 The Chasm

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Posted 12 December 2013 - 11:08

Considering what life has thrown all of us lately, and particularly yourself, it's easy to understand - don't worry about it.



#124 jcurran

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 00:19

Do detailed drawings of the Elfin 600 exist or has anyone ever bothered to measure one up? My guess is there would have been drawings and chassis jigs to build the cars in the first instance, but what about today? If you had a major hit in one and damaged the chassis where would go for dimensions etc? 



#125 SJ Lambert

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 12:17

I think Laurie Bennett had the jig a while back (though I'm not sure about that).


We could check the usual suspects to see if the 600 one is still around! ( I imagine that most of the drawings would have survived as well).

Edited by SJ Lambert, 31 January 2014 - 12:19.


#126 Ray Bell

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 13:52

There were good drawings in RCN back about 1971...

 

I'm sure that kind of stuff would have survived. 

 

If not, just hijack Streak's car and measure it up.



#127 Paul Hamilton

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 22:30

Do detailed drawings of the Elfin 600 exist or has anyone ever bothered to measure one up? My guess is there would have been drawings and chassis jigs to build the cars in the first instance, but what about today? If you had a major hit in one and damaged the chassis where would go for dimensions etc? 

 

I have never seen any detailed engineering drawings of the 600 although, as Ray Bell says there have been good sketch drawings in period magazines such as RCN and Autosportsman.  Bill Hemming has inherited the full surviving range of Elfin patterns and makes them available when needed.  If there are any surviving engineering drawings they would also be in Bill's hands. 

 

Dave Mawer and Elwyn Bickley (probably other people as well) have made up jigs for various suspension components as needed over the years and the ability to make dimensional checks against other cars is also useful when repairs are required.  As there were 44 cars cars built in all it hardly seems likely that we would never be able to find a straight, original car to use as a reference point!!

 

I don't know of a chassis frame jig but the 600 frame is very strong and, although my car has had its share of hits over the 40 years I have owned it, repairs have never been a problem and it remains as straight as the day it left Edwardstown.  The most difficult repair Dave Mawer has ever needed to undertake for me was the replacement of a section of the top frame rail in the cockpit area following an incident at Lakeside in which I was Tboned pretty substantially.  My recollection is that, once the bent tube was cut out, the frame came back into shape relatively easily and one did not need to look very far to find another 600 for a dimensional check.



#128 SJ Lambert

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 23:20

The first of the Repco Brabham V8s

 

scan0001.jpg
 

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#129 SJ Lambert

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Posted 14 November 2014 - 10:51

Mal Ramsay, doing his best Red Bull Gives You Wings impression !

 

 

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