33 replies to this topic

[cdrewett]

Did anyone watch Wheeler Dealers on Discovery Turbo last night? Sad I know. But nearly 12 grand for a tarted up clapped out Mk1 Escort ! Has the world gone crazy or is it me?
Chris

Edited by cdrewett, 01 March 2013 - 18:40.

[Gary C]

it's a crap programme, take it with a pinch of salt...they never include the work that Edd Chyna does on the car in the final bill.

[Allen Brown]

Has the world gone crazy or is it me?

That's what Sky want you to ask. It's how they keep you watching.

[arttidesco]

$800,000 for a barn find condition Lancia Aurelia estimated at $400,000 rather suggests madness maybe the way to go on estimated prices, though remember your talking about a television prog where an overestimation of 66% is the norm required to get us to pay any attention

[alansart]

That's what Sky want you to ask. It's how they keep you watching.

Which is why I don't....

[Hamish Robson]

Due to the huge rise in popularity for "post-historic" rallying the price of strong Mk1 and Mk2 Escorts has gone fairly bananas. Ford, of course, aren't making any more so decent shells ripe for turning in to rally cars are getting more and more scarce and all the preparation companies are scouring Europe for decent 2-door cars to make in to group 2 or 4 machines. For example the "beak-front" RS2000 Mk2s used to sell for around £2K for a reasonable car, now you'll be lucky to find one for £10K. And as for Mk1 Twin Cams or Mk2 RS1800s...
I wish I'd kept my RS2's now.
Also, and quite fittingly for this forum, these cars are becoming "nostalgia" for those who couldn't afford one at the time.

Edited by Hamish Robson, 27 February 2013 - 14:12.

[FredF1]

it's a crap programme, take it with a pinch of salt...they never include the work that Edd Chyna does on the car in the final bill.

There's been a few duds as well. One of the Beemers was sold only for the entire engine falling out thanks to knackered mountings - another car suffered a similar collapse - rear suspension or transmission IIRC. The Jensen Interceptor was nothing but rust underneath yet declared to be 'sound'. I've seen mention that there's a barn somewhere outside London with a lot of the allegedly 'sold' cars sitting in it. The Lotus Elan featured in the opening titles for several series before the actual car made an appearance.

As harmless entertainment it's fine but I wouldn't touch one of their finished results with a bargepole.

[D-Type]

Take all of this sort of programme with a handful-sized pinch of salt.

It's rather like "Homes under the Hammer". The intrepid would-be developers always make a profit apart from the odd token small loss. But they base the 'profit' on a tame estate agent's estimate and leave out things like the developers including the cost of their time. selling fees for estate agents and solicitors, etc.

Where is the magical scrapyard in "Scrapheap Challenge" that has everything needed?

[Alan Cox]

Good grief - What on earth is Sky Turbo?? I'd have thought normally-aspirated Sky would be bad enough

[Gary C]

It's actually Discovery Turbo. Nothing to do with Sky TV, only that it's on their platform.

[f1steveuk]

I went to college with the young Ed, always an oddball, once superglued the broken crankshaft of his Puch Maxi moped to get him home, and it worked! Mind you, once also set the time on a three cylinder 380 GT Suzuki two stroke, 180 degrees out, and it started and ran backwards. The rider was quite shocked when he dumped the clutch!

Ed is actually very very good (see his Wacky Racers at Goodwood, his 12 foot tall, drivable shopping trolley, or his road legal shed, armchair, bath or settee), I wouldn't take what you see in this programme very seriously. For example, the Beach Buggy, done in a week? Took three months. I like Ed, always have done, the other guy? Nah!

[RTH]

Good grief - What on earth is Sky Turbo?? I'd have thought normally-aspirated Sky would be bad enough

Indeed what an idiotic title for a channel

[RTH]

It's actually Discovery Turbo. Nothing to do with Sky TV, only that it's on their platform.

Even worse Gary - sounds like a diesel Land Rover

[Gary C]

LOL!! You're talking about my employers !

[Bloggsworth]

Just saw a Minivan for sale @ £29,995! and a Ford Escort Mk1 in full rally spec for £999,999, which I assumed to be a misprint...

[Paul Parker]

it's a crap programme, take it with a pinch of salt...they never include the work that Edd Chyna does on the car in the final bill.

Very true, the real life labour bill for partially rebuilding/repairing/tidying up such old(er) motors, not forgetting the toing and froing of colllecting said cars, sometimes from Europe or even across the pond would far exceeed their value.

The one that springs to mind is the Morgan that featured recently which required a new chassis and ended up with upgraded rear suspension etc. God knows what a competent garage/mechanic(s) would charge for dismantling much of the car and separating the body from the chassis and then reassembling it, probably thousands, even with high resale values you would be out of pocket. As for 10 year old plus BMWs, the Bentley Turbo etc., that need painting (another huge cost if done professionally for punters), new tyres and refurbed wheels, aircon, electronics and more, run in the other direction and very fast.

It begs the question who does pay the real price for this, presumably the TV company via advertising revenues, or is it the production company, anybody know?

[Gary C]

I would presume the production company pays for the re-build for the car plus whatever other expenses, then the TV company pays the production company for the programme.

Edited by Gary C, 27 February 2013 - 20:55.

[wolseley680]

I think the idea of the programme is that Edd & Mike buy a car, do it up and sell it, the profit is their only labour payment, there is no hourly rate and I remember a KombiVan that Edd "bought", probably because they couldn't sell it. It seems to me that Paul does at least as much spanner work as Edd and, for me, the repairing is the part that I watch the show for. Out here in Oz I am impressed at what Mike can buy cars for, and some of the parts/services outfits he has access to. Don't like the weather though.......

[Lee Nicolle]

Like em or not old Escorts are becoming big bucks, especially 2 doors.world wide. Genuine RS etc are worth too much for a race or rally car. You get a 1100 auto and then feed all the good bits into it.
When the Chinese were paying good money for scrap so many went to scrap, and now all interesting classics arer making way too much.

[Ray Bell]

But is an Escort an 'interesting classic'?

I would hardly think so. But I can understand the Poms thinking they were.

[Dipster]

But is an Escort an 'interesting classic'?

I would hardly think so. But I can understand the Poms thinking they were.

The prices paid are surely down to supply and demand or a buyer seeing a possible investment vehicle (literally) with which a profit might eventually be made.

But what does make an interesting classic?
Is it the type of car's history, rarity, personal recollections and experiences? Perhaps a famous previos owner? Or simply wanting one because that type of car is "in fashion"? Does it have to be road car or a race car or either?

Personally interesting classic goes from Citroen 2cv to Ford GT with dozens of others too. It is down to interesting technology or workmanship or my personal experiences.

And you?

Edited by Dipster, 28 February 2013 - 06:01.

[Ray Bell]

You might read into that it won't be an Escort...

Or a Cortina or a whole raft of Japanese cheapies. I do have a Peugeot 404 I'm going to do a little with, but nobody's going to fight me over it with bundles of cash. My VG Valiant might draw some attention, though.

[BRG]

But is an Escort an 'interesting classic'?

Yes, of course it is. I used to own one. How much more persuading do you need?

It has serious racing and even more serious rallying pedigree. So many of us learnt to drive in them, they were our first cars, we took our first motor-sport steps in them, we did things on the back seat , we went away from our weddings in them, we brought home our first child from the hospital in them, our mothers drove them to the shops, we went to the seaside in them.

Then we grew up and bought a BMW.

They may not have been important in Australia, but in Europe they are definitely a classic.

[LotusElise]

Yes, of course it is. I used to own one. How much more persuading do you need?

It has serious racing and even more serious rallying pedigree. So many of us learnt to drive in them, they were our first cars, we took our first motor-sport steps in them, we did things on the back seat , we went away from our weddings in them, we brought home our first child from the hospital in them, our mothers drove them to the shops, we went to the seaside in them.

Then we grew up and bought a BMW.

They may not have been important in Australia, but in Europe they are definitely a classic.

When well-maintained and finished well, they are also quite a nice-looking car, and combine classic-ness and sporting pedigree with a degree of practicality.

MkII Escorts are what people's dads drove when I was a small girl. Probably some MarkI models too, as there were fewer new cars around in the early 80s. I think this goes some way to explaining my fondness for them.

[GMACKIE]

They may not have been important in Australia, but in Europe they are definitely a classic.

BRG, they were [and still are] important here.

[Lee Nicolle]

You might read into that it won't be an Escort...

Or a Cortina or a whole raft of Japanese cheapies. I do have a Peugeot 404 I'm going to do a little with, but nobody's going to fight me over it with bundles of cash. My VG Valiant might draw some attention, though.

404s are a small volume classic, as you say noone will knock your door down. Though maybe some Pug fan may love it. The VG especially in 2 door form are becoming quite desireable. Or Pacers, nicer Regals etc. Plain cars are worth less but if clean will always find a home for someone to rebuild. The same as 4 door Escorts, not quite as desireable but since 2 doors are too dear and or rusty a 4 door will do a lot of people as a rwest project, or a racecar.
This really describes a lot of cars worldwide, though some buyers are funny. I have a few classics here for sale. But the Ford is a 4 door and nobody wants to pay a reasonable dollar,,, yet they pay half as much for 1/4 the car eg a Falcon 500 6 cyl auto with a bench seat than my Fairmont v8 4 speed with air and steer. Or with the Holden they buy a bogged up piece of crap for 1/2 the price of my immac original low km 6 cyl one because it has a V8,, a very sick 253. And then say that I am too dear. And that is just this year. The rest and maintenance costs way exceed the price difference,, by about 5 times!
If anyone wants said cars contact me.
Sorry no Escorts, though I do have a Torana!

[Lee Nicolle]

Yes, of course it is. I used to own one. How much more persuading do you need?

It has serious racing and even more serious rallying pedigree. So many of us learnt to drive in them, they were our first cars, we took our first motor-sport steps in them, we did things on the back seat , we went away from our weddings in them, we brought home our first child from the hospital in them, our mothers drove them to the shops, we went to the seaside in them.

Then we grew up and bought a BMW.

They may not have been important in Australia, but in Europe they are definitely a classic.

Personally I hate Escorts BUT they are a very good motorsport device,, or just a classic car these days. Though base Mk1 s with cardboard door trims and asthmatic 1100 engines are and were dreadfull poverty machines. Though make a similar Viva even worse!

[sterling49]

Yes, of course it is. I used to own one. How much more persuading do you need?

It has serious racing and even more serious rallying pedigree. So many of us learnt to drive in them, they were our first cars, we took our first motor-sport steps in them, we did things on the back seat , we went away from our weddings in them, we brought home our first child from the hospital in them, our mothers drove them to the shops, we went to the seaside in them.

Then we grew up and bought a BMW.

They may not have been important in Australia, but in Europe they are definitely a classic.

[Dipster]

Personally I hate Escorts BUT they are a very good motorsport device,, or just a classic car these days. Though base Mk1 s with cardboard door trims and asthmatic 1100 engines are and were dreadfull poverty machines. Though make a similar Viva even worse!

One of the almost forgotten cars I had great fun in (No, actually driving it....) was a factory-paint lime green Renault 6. Does anybody remember them? Basically a Renault 4 in drag. 1100 cc, 4 speed umbrella handle type geqr change. No great speed but boy, could it be thrown around. It was a company car, reasonably high mileage so nicely run in. I doubt that I would have ever been tempted to buy it with my money. But I would have been wrong. After this experience I learned to look carefully at all cars, regardless of how unlikely they looked.

I remember one trip I made from Dagenham to Bicester. It was mid-morning and I was late, so pushing on as best I could. Not too far from Bicester I realised that a red Triumph Spitfire had joined me and was happily tagging along. So I pushed a little harder. My surprise was total to see that the Spitfire appeared to be struggling to keep up - really! The driver was obviously game for this and tried very hard. But I reckon his swing-arm rear suspension got the better of him as the last I saw of him was him heading off into a small copse, backwards.

I got to my appointment on time. To my knowledge Renault 6 or 4 ever took part in any serious motor sport! But 4s are slowly gainng a following. Does that make them classics?

[D-Type]

They ran a team of R4s in the Safari to launch the car in East Africa. A single unfortunately shaped transverse gulley caught them out. The gulley was just the wrong width and depth. They hit the gulley at top speed; the wheels got trapped and the whole front suspension got pushed back. I think this bent the steering column. Whatever it was, it did for the whole team.

[LotusElise]

Southern Turkey and the Middle East are awash with rare-here European cars. Many of them are still used as taxis.

[Dipster]

They ran a team of R4s in the Safari to launch the car in East Africa. A single unfortunately shaped transverse gulley caught them out. The gulley was just the wrong width and depth. They hit the gulley at top speed; the wheels got trapped and the whole front suspension got pushed back. I think this bent the steering column. Whatever it was, it did for the whole team.

Ouch! I imagine it probably bent the crew too.

[hillsprint]

Renault restored a couple of R4s for the Monte Historique a few years back, had Ragnotti and the like driving them.

To be honest I enjoy Wheeler Dealers, I know the costs are unrealistic, but it's interesting from time to time to see some of the repairs they do.

It's obvious in the current financial climate they are having difficulty in "making a profit" on the cars, the Morgan was a classic where they bought it of Richard Thorne, did the work , then sold it to a "friend" of Mr Thorne and by the time the programme aired Lo and Behold, there it was up for sale with RT once more. So basically they restored it for him !!

The M5 Beemer they did, suddenly sprouted a new set of tyres which never appeared in the costs, and the Escort which started this thread, must of had to be stripped bare and engine out etc for the colour change respray

However, despite it's faults it still beats that recent Channel 5 debacle with the East End geezer and the Trans Atlantic expert switching MGBs etc

[kayemod]

However, despite it's faults it still beats that recent Channel 5 debacle with the East End geezer and the Trans Atlantic expert switching MGBs etc

True, that C5 series was quite dreadful in every possible way, but apparently people watched it, so don't be surprised if it crawls out from under its stone for a second time.