Jump to content


Photo
* * * - - 4 votes

Drug testers raid Formula One drivers


  • Please log in to reply
204 replies to this topic

#201 Tsarwash

Tsarwash
  • Member

  • 13,725 posts
  • Joined: August 10

Posted 09 March 2013 - 14:51

Everyone knows that in the context of talking about "drug users" we are refuring to the use of illegal drugs. So trying to make some reference to other, over the counter drugs, is quite simply childish and smacks of someone who knows their argument is on shaky ground.

Cannabis is perfectly legal and available over the counter in many states of America and in parts of Europe too. You are taking your own moral code and trying to force it on others lives. If you think my argument is in shaky ground then why not attempt to dispute it point by point, rather than suggest that people who take drugs that you do not agree with have an intrinsically bad argument.

If smoking cannabis over a week before a race weekend is proved to some degree to make drivers likely to be more dangerous then i would be quite happy to see it banned. But my argument is that legal substances can easily be as affecting to a drivers performance, over the same time period. Drugs testing should only cover performance affecting substances. When drugs testing starts to cover recreational drugs that do not affect performance one way or the other, then they are no longer doing it to keep the sport clean of cheaters, but trying to impose their morality onto others.

Edit. for clarity, I happen to despise cocaine as a substance, but if a driver or any other person wants to take it in their home then i don't think it's really any of my business.

Edited by Tsarwash, 09 March 2013 - 14:53.


Advertisement

#202 Clatter

Clatter
  • Member

  • 44,754 posts
  • Joined: February 00

Posted 09 March 2013 - 15:28

Cannabis is perfectly legal and available over the counter in many states of America and in parts of Europe too. You are taking your own moral code and trying to force it on others lives. If you think my argument is in shaky ground then why not attempt to dispute it point by point, rather than suggest that people who take drugs that you do not agree with have an intrinsically bad argument.

If smoking cannabis over a week before a race weekend is proved to some degree to make drivers likely to be more dangerous then i would be quite happy to see it banned. But my argument is that legal substances can easily be as affecting to a drivers performance, over the same time period. Drugs testing should only cover performance affecting substances. When drugs testing starts to cover recreational drugs that do not affect performance one way or the other, then they are no longer doing it to keep the sport clean of cheaters, but trying to impose their morality onto others.

Edit. for clarity, I happen to despise cocaine as a substance, but if a driver or any other person wants to take it in their home then i don't think it's really any of my business.


I'm not trying to force anything on anybodies life, that's something that I cannot possibly do. I do have my own opinion which is obviously at odds with your own, I am also basing some of what I am saying on the laws as they stand in the UK.

As far as using cannabis is concerned, the various sporting bodies have banned it. F1 I am glad to see has followed the code and also banned it. This is something all participants are fully aware of. There is not a single good reason why that ban should be changed and if the drivers don't like it then they can always leave the sport.


#203 Flyhigh

Flyhigh
  • Member

  • 4,223 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 09 March 2013 - 16:18

I've not heard of a short-acting amphetamine. As far as I'm aware, they are all very long lasting.


I know you're joking, but in a lot cases, it actually could be. Your 'awareness' is heightened greatly. The flipside is that it could lead to overconfidence or aggressive driving. It'd be probably balance out in the end.

The real problem with PED's comes with parity and younger generations. I hear a lot of people say we should allow PED's in sports, but this just raises the bar so that everyone feels they need to take them and sportsmen/women shouldn't have to take harmful substances in order to compete with the best. It also means that younger and younger generations feel pressured to start taking them in order to get that edge as just getting up the ranks is possibly the most difficult part of most sports. And the more young competitors do it, the more the rest will feel the need to do it as well to keep up. Its a harmful cycle. On an individual basis, I could care less if somebody takes steroids or amphetamines, as its their body, but the slippery slope of allowing it would be way too dangerous. So I agree fully with banning them and of fairly strict testing standards. Its best to stamp it out as thoroughly as possible.



The thing is Peds are already part of every major sport. Your argument would be valid if there was really efficient methods of curbing Ped usage. Armstrong case illustrates that there really isn't, considering that cycling is the most heavily tested sport and the one that tries the most to regulate it. Imagine Tennis, Football.. that don't have nearly the same effort. Peds have been part of professional sports for decades and are here to stay. And in my view, just as total prohibition doesn't work with recreational drugs even though powerful Governments such as the US have wage "war" on them with some people arguing in the same way you did, well if you allow this lower drug, people will go to the strongest stuff quicker. I think this is a dumbed down argument. I am for allowing certain peds that, when regulated by a competent professionals, have minimal side effects and would allow professional athletes to compete without having to lie all the time and pretend to be on "bread and water" like most mainstream sport do as a PR stunt.

The issue of Ped's risk on health is greatly exaggerated by laymen. Some of the most common drugs such as: Testosterone supplementation, Human growth hormone and substances that increase oxygen in the cells like EPO are natural occurring substances, you have them in your body and professional athletes with Doctors regulate them to get the most benefit out of it. Now you look at a guy like Armstrong well into his 40ties has take Peds for decades, he doesn't look bad to me, in fact he is probably healthier and fitter than most 40 or even 30 year old fit ones and there are countless examples of professional. He regularly still competes at triathlon events as a hobby to this day.

People like to compare Professional athletes as if they have the same body and demands of regular people, "Ah, a regular healthy 25 year old man doesn't need more Testosterone or EPO". It is silly to expect that Athletes in these sports who need to physically train 4-6 hours a day, need to perform for hours non end, recover for the next day, not have serious injuries or be able to recover quickly from them in order to make a living, will just ignore the scientific benefits that some substances have for them with minimal side effects if used correctly, this is purism and wishful thinking. Considering that there are average Joe on you local gyms using them just to look good on the beach, not because it is their tool for work.

I am not for just allowing everything either, but I wished there was a way that athletes could compete in a transparent way without having to lie so much and I believe that allowing some Peds with minimal side effects with medical supervision would be a good way. Take them out of the black market and bring them into light. I don't know about F1 because I'm not sure how they enhance a driver's performance at least compared to other sports, where your body is the main tool while in F1 the car. Yeah I know, you still need to be well fit in order to perform at your best, but the demand doesn't come close to a sports like Tennis, Football, cycling etc. There are no Montoya allowed in there at the high level. But still I would not put my hand in the fire, I could be misinformed.



#204 schuey100

schuey100
  • Member

  • 655 posts
  • Joined: September 04

Posted 10 March 2013 - 06:48

I don't know about F1 because I'm not sure how they enhance a driver's performance at least compared to other sports, where your body is the main tool while in F1 the car. Yeah I know, you still need to be well fit in order to perform at your best, but the demand doesn't come close to a sports like Tennis, Football, cycling etc. There are no Montoya allowed in there at the high level. But still I would not put my hand in the fire, I could be misinformed.


I think PEDs could be massively advantageous in F1. Not necessarily for the race itself (although some might be) but in terms of getting up to fitness, cutting body fat, lean muscle gain etc etc. If I were an F1 driver I'd probably look at using in the off season to get myself into shape.

The one thing about F1 that might negate their use is that the off season is so short and many of these guys are naturally fit and have good genetics anyway. A few obviously aren't in that situation, Montoya is one that springs to mind, perhaps Kimi but Button, Schumacher, Webber are possibly unlikely to need anything to get to F1 required fitness levels.

I do think there are plenty of mind enhancing drugs that would help an awful lot though.

#205 smoothcrim

smoothcrim
  • Member

  • 426 posts
  • Joined: April 12

Posted 10 March 2013 - 08:55

If i was an F1 driver id be worried that anything i took might effect other senses,like feel and judgement.Theres no peds out there that will help Button get better at driving in damp conditions and feeling the grip levels the way he does.

The chances of taking something and loosing your edge in one of your skill sets could be possible,i would want to risk upsetting my natural balance.