319 replies to this topic

[BillBald]

Although it might seem like it sometimes, that there are no strategists at work but it's all left up to the driver and engineer like Perez says can not possibly be true and is an obvious dig at the team since it comes in the same paragraph as expressing his disappointment at being sacked..

 

Well, it's hard to believe since it makes McLaren seem so amateurish, but it does seem to tally with the poor strategies in recent years.

 

Of course Checo is presenting it in a negative light but that doesn't mean it's untrue.

 

What I mean by that is that if his season had gone better (and he wasn't being dumped by the team) he might have said "It's really great at McLaren, you get to make your own strategy instead of being told what to do all the time."

 

Seriously though, it's good for a driver and his engineer to be involved in making the strategy, but if they really do it by themselves with just a lot of computer data in front of them, that is really stupid. Being able to drive a car fast, and being able to come up with a good setup, don't qualify anyone to be a strategist - that's an entirely different discipline.

 

I'm really starting to suspect that the team don't have anyone on the payroll who has an aptitude for suggesting or evaluationg race strategies. It seems as though they possibly just run a race simulation many times to suggest or validate strategies. We are talking about a program which they believe represents an accurate model of the real world, but as we've seen this season, it basically only works at all for a front-running car, and even in that case, not very often...

[coppilcus]

Well, it's hard to believe since it makes McLaren seem so amateurish, but it does seem to tally with the poor strategies in recent years.
 
Of course Checo is presenting it in a negative light but that doesn't mean it's untrue.
 
What I mean by that is that if his season had gone better (and he wasn't being dumped by the team) he might have said "It's really great at McLaren, you get to make your own strategy instead of being told what to do all the time."
 
Seriously though, it's good for a driver and his engineer to be involved in making the strategy, but if they really do it by themselves with just a lot of computer data in front of them, that is really stupid. Being able to drive a car fast, and being able to come up with a good setup, don't qualify anyone to be a strategist - that's an entirely different discipline.
 
I'm really starting to suspect that the team don't have anyone on the payroll who has an aptitude for suggesting or evaluationg race strategies. It seems as though they possibly just run a race simulation many times to suggest or validate strategies. We are talking about a program which they believe represents an accurate model of the real world, but as we've seen this season, it basically only works at all for a front-running car, and even in that case, not very often...

I agree... and he isn't saying that only planning the strategy between you and your engineer it's the worst possible scenario or that is just wrong, he says it takes more time to get that relationship right.

I also think that Sergio's version is a lot more closer to reality than we could observe from the outside... I mean, look at passed seasons, they have f@&?&@ up a huge amount of races on bad strategies, but this year they outperformed themselves, almost every single race they put button and Perez behind traffic, only in two of them they manage to get right the strategy and both drivers got them a 5th place, the beat result for the team in 2013, I thought I could never said that in my lifetime: 5th place, there st result of MCLaren in the season.

[BillBald]

Brazil

 

Last chance to get a decent result.

 

Not quite sure what McLaren are doing, virtually no running for Jenson in FP2 or FP3, a little bit more for Checo. Are they that confident about the setup?

 

In FP3, Checo had a monkey seat, Jenson didn't, and his wing looked fairly skinny. Surely Jenson isn't going for a low downforce setup? I would have thought a wet race (or partially wet race) would be the only chance of a good result.

 

Are they trying to be too clever? Making the same mistake as in Canada? We'll know pretty soon.

[WitnessX]

Brazil

 

Last chance to get a decent result.

 

Not quite sure what McLaren are doing, virtually no running for Jenson in FP2 or FP3, a little bit more for Checo. Are they that confident about the setup?

 

In FP3, Checo had a monkey seat, Jenson didn't, and his wing looked fairly skinny. Surely Jenson isn't going for a low downforce setup? I would have thought a wet race (or partially wet race) would be the only chance of a good result.

 

Are they trying to be too clever? Making the same mistake as in Canada? We'll know pretty soon.

 

Perhaps they are "covering their bases", after all there is not much risk in losing their WCC place an it will be their last attempt to get near the podium. We have seen in the past on drier race day that the wet weather cars flounder on this circuit.

 

Sod it.. take a risk .. might mess up Jensons q. position but its worth the risk.

[BillBald]

Perhaps they are "covering their bases", after all there is not much risk in losing their WCC place an it will be their last attempt to get near the podium. We have seen in the past on drier race day that the wet weather cars flounder on this circuit.

 

Sod it.. take a risk .. might mess up Jensons q. position but its worth the risk.

 

Jenson starting near the back again - what could possibly go wrong?

Edited by BillBald, 23 November 2013 - 14:49.

[Lazy]

Pretty sure they are just keeping as many new tyres as possible.

[BillBald]

As expected, they were running too little downforce for the really wet conditions in Q2.

 

Perhaps they were a little unlucky, it started raining harder before Jenson could do a fast lap on the new inters.

 

Did Checo even stop to change tyres? If so, I didn't see it.

[Disgrace]

Were they both running lower downforce? At least one of those cars should be set up for a wet weather gamble.

[BillBald]

Were they both running lower downforce? At least one of those cars should be set up for a wet weather gamble.

 

I think in FP3 Checo had more downforce, but they might have taken some off, because the idea seems to be that there will most likely be a dry race.

 

Maybe they will be proved right, and in the race the 28s will breeze past the opposition in the 2 DRS zones. Or maybe we will be seeing a rerun of Canada. Having more downforce doesn't just help in the wet.

[BillBald]

Once again I find McLaren's strategy hard to fathom.

 

Why didn't they run very much in FPs? I thought it was maybe because they expected a wet race, and felt they needed to save the tyres.

But if they expected a wet race, why aren't they running more downforce?

 

It's that same lack of clear thinking, once again. If they were gambling on a dry race, it was all the more important to get out in the wet FPs, to ensure that they can have a reasonable quali in a car which is not set up ideally for the conditions. And in that case, putting some mileage on the tyres wouldn't matter so much.

 

In fact, putting mileage on full wet tyres is never really a problem, because they are hardly used much in races, the safety car always comes out if it's that wet.

 

Please, guys, get yourself a strategist!!!!

[BillBald]

OK, 14th and 19th on the grid.

 

You can score good points from there, eg. Paul DiResta in Canada. Whether McLaren will, is another question.

 

They both need to start on primes and go long, like Paul did, but will they?

[krobinson]

OK, 14th and 19th on the grid.

 

You can score good points from there, eg. Paul DiResta in Canada. Whether McLaren will, is another question.

 

They both need to start on primes and go long, like Paul did, but will they?

Depends on what happens during the race - it might rain at any given moment.

[BillBald]

Depends on what happens during the race - it might rain at any given moment.

 

Yes, but if it starts dry, they need to be on primes, so they don't have to pit for new slicks before having to fit inters/wets.

[ElDictatore]

Well at least they were right this time round with 'gambling' on dry. Good setup, good strategy, good execution. Nice way to end the season.

[Lazy]

http://www.planetf1....job-by-the-team

 

"It was an amazing job by everyone," said Button. "It seems that we work better when we don't actually do any practice in the dry..." 

 

[BillBald]

http://www.planetf1....job-by-the-team

 

"It was an amazing job by everyone," said Button. "It seems that we work better when we don't actually do any practice in the dry..." 

 

 

The other teams didn't get to do any practice in the dry - I think that might be what made the difference.

 

Anyway, this seems to indicate that the McLaren simulator now has very good correlation, which can only be good news for the future.

 

I'm still not quite sure why they didn't do any wet running. If they were confident of having a dry race, putting mileage on the inters wouldn't have mattered. Perhaps they were worried that they'd start tinkering too much with the setup, and lose their good dry setup as a result.

 

A puzzling race in many ways. All season, we've seen the 28 overtaking other cars which have very worn tyres. This was the first time we saw overtakes on cars whose tyres were equally fresh. Was it the Interlagos track? Was it because the opposition had less than ideal setup? Did the team know that they'd be able to overtake so easily, or did they just get lucky?

 

Anyway, it's good to see a bold plan work out. Maybe it will encourage the team to do more 'outside the box' thinking in the future.

[Lazy]

http://www.motorspor...lonso-question/

 

Humour or ambition?

 

McLaren driver Jenson Button is not so convinced: "I couldn't say," said the Briton.

"If I was a team boss ... when I am a team boss I will show you who I would sign," Button laughed.

 

After Martins job?  

[WitnessX]

http://www.motorspor...lonso-question/

 

Humour or ambition?

 

McLaren driver Jenson Button is not so convinced: "I couldn't say," said the Briton.

"If I was a team boss ... when I am a team boss I will show you who I would sign," Button laughed.

 

After Martins job?  

 

Avoiding the question nicely. He's been in the business long enough to know that whatever he answers will be mangled by the press.

[WitnessX]

The perfect lap part III:

http://www.mclaren.c...eo-part-3-team/

 

- After FP1/2 they take the data and run  4-5 hours on the simulator trying to find the best set-up ("overnight").

- During the race they make predictions back at  MTC and "recommend" pit stops.

[BillBald]

The perfect lap part III:

http://www.mclaren.c...eo-part-3-team/

 

- After FP1/2 they take the data and run  4-5 hours on the simulator trying to find the best set-up ("overnight").

- During the race they make predictions back at  MTC and "recommend" pit stops.

 

Mark Temple said that there is a team of 3 strategists in the operations room at MTC who recommend what lap they should pit on. The pitwall will accept their recommendations "unless we have any doubts".

 

It sounds OK in theory...