212 replies to this topic

[Freung]

Modern F1

- Races are more *interesting* to watch live for the entire duration
- Highlights aren't so good to watch as cars actually look very slow

Old F1

- Races in general aren't particularly interesting*
- Cars are GREAT to watch on highlights.

By interesting I mean that the result isn't as predictable throughout the GP. Interesting shouldn't be mixed up with exciting or enthralling.

I prefer older F1 because when they raced they were ACTUALLY racing. There was less of it, but it was more valuable. Now modern F1 is in an hyper-inflationary environment. But the QE has been delivered by cheese tyres and DRS. Racing has become valueless and there's hardly any suspense. Like the Wiemar republic F1 is in boom times but when people realise F1 is just like the emperor's new clothes it will crash hard.

It would be impossible to agree more.!!! The quality has most certainly left what was supposed to be the pinnacle of motor-sports.!
Contrived excitement will never stand the test of time. Also,,the arguments of all those in favor of the way things are now,seem to be driven by some kind of weird motive.!

[Skinnyguy]

Fluke weather? May I remind you that was what created the legendary 2005 Japanese Grand Prix? It was the weather conditions at the end which forced the likes of Schumacher, Alonso, Raikkonen and Montoya to start at the back of the pack.

I couldn´t care less. It was not fair. If the best race ever was produced by reversed grids, I would certainly enjoy it, but that wouldn´t make me want that system from then on.
I´m all for fairness given we don´t need random grids now to have decent races anymore.

Different track conditions? The guy who went fastest should be given preferential track conditions, with more rubber laid down on his Q3 lap!

Very cool. I don´t mind fastest guys getting best conditions if they´re previously earned. But if it rains ending the session? If temperature changes big time? If track gets worse because of whatever?

Oil? Meh, rarely if not almost ever happens nowadays.

Plenty of things can make a track get worse as time goes on, oil was only an example. Let´s say the guy before you goes off during his lap and lefts some gravel/dirt/grass in the track.

Positives: At least drivers don't have to worry about blocking, we get to see everyone's lap-time; and mental strength becomes all the more important, as you only have one lap.

Completely agree on the good aspects, you´re spot on. A shame your preferences don´t allow you to consider the bad ones just as wisely.

[SealTheDiffuser]

What we have now is fine. Contrary to people's nostalgia, most of the 60-minute qualifying era wasn't last minute pole duels.

80% of it was boring as first 30min of FP1

[Nobody]

I loved the single 'banzai' lap quali format (forget what year/s) but only on TV

[Morbus]

That''s some special kind of logic

Please read carefully: I didn't say they actually are easy to drive.

The power hasn't changed and the weight has gone up a few kg.

I may be wrong but the V12 and the V10s were more powerful than the V8s... And didn't the minimum weight go up by 30Kg i.e. 5%?

The world changes, the whole POWEEEEERRRR scenario won't work anymore in today's world as the focus is on green and durable these days, and manufacters want to represent that, like it or not, that's marketing. If F1 hadn't changed after 2004, basically in my opinion the last year before very serious restrictions started to kick in, I think F1 would've been in a very bad place now.

That's a valid point, but it doesn't invalidate the argument that F1 races are boring. I'm not actually saying all of them are, because I think the racing itself has been better these last few years, but the cars aren't as exciting as they used to be, and that's where the whole POWEEEERRR thing came from.

What does invalidate your point is that if manufacturers want to look green, they invest in green racing, like formula e or the delta wing or whatever. Powerful cars or not, F1 will ALWAYS be perceived by the general public as a huge waste of gas (when it actually isn't) and stupid mindless drivers going round in circles for no reason. Manufacturers that want to cater to that public won't invest in F1.

Edited by Morbus, 22 March 2013 - 19:14.

[TigersWood]

I think races are far more interesting nowadays that in 2007 and back. I remember, being a Fernando Alonso fan, a certain number of races where for instance he found himself stuck behind a slower car and couldn't overtake him because he had more fuel than the other car, and because there was nothing to facilitate the overtakings. I find this very unfair and made very difficult to judge the true pace of the different drivers.

And I specially blame Nick Heidfeld. In 2007 Alonso was always behind him

But the engines were much more powerful and everybody loves that.

[KnucklesAgain]

I think races are far more interesting nowadays that in 2007 and back. I remember, being a Fernando Alonso fan, a certain number of races where for instance he found himself stuck behind a slower car and couldn't overtake him because he had more fuel than the other car, and because there was nothing to facilitate the overtakings. I find this very unfair and made very difficult to judge the true pace of the different drivers.

And I specially blame Nick Heidfeld. In 2007 Alonso was always behind him

But the engines were much more powerful and everybody loves that.

Huh? The engines were frozen at the state of Suzuka 2006, and were used for 2007 and 2008. In 2009 the max rpm were reduced from 19,000 to 18,000. With all the "reliability" modifications since, I doubt there is much difference to 2007.

[Rubens Hakkamacher]

"Curiously", it would appear just about all of the drivers, team bosses and F1 personalia agree with me.

Lewis: "it's boring".
Vettel: "you're not racing but managing tires"
Diresta: "it's really about dealing with the tires"
Brawn:"we have to see how the tires hold up"


on and on....

..not to mention the harbinger of 2014, "you must slow down and conserve fuel".



Sorry, you're nuts if you don't want to see the drivers RACING at 10/10ths as MUCH AS POSSIBLE. BS, this isn't racing.

I'M SICK OF HEARING THE WORD "TIRES" LITERALLY EVERY 10 SECONDS DURING THE "RACE"!!!!!

WTF????

/ pace "now" versus "then": aero is much more developed, lap times come about by gains in corners. Watch this - watch the MotoGp out drag the Redbull into the first corner. If that looks "the same" to you, get your eyes checked. Also your ears, if the SOUND of the F1 car doesn't do it for you - note it drowns out everything, and is noticeable from across the track. Sigh.

[ArnageWRC]

It's all about 'The Show' - if you want to watch Motor Racing, go watch another series without gimmicks, rubbish tyres, etc

[One]

It's all about 'The Show' - if you want to watch Motor Racing, go watch another series without gimmicks, rubbish tyres, etc

What is wrong is that the FOM wants to move Brazillian GP to Rio, while Carlos Pace is the place for such a great racing actions.

[One]

"Curiously", it would appear just about all of the drivers, team bosses and F1 personalia agree with me.

Lewis: "it's boring".
Vettel: "you're not racing but managing tires"
Diresta: "it's really about dealing with the tires"
Brawn:"we have to see how the tires hold up"


on and on....

..not to mention the harbinger of 2014, "you must slow down and conserve fuel".



Sorry, you're nuts if you don't want to see the drivers RACING at 10/10ths as MUCH AS POSSIBLE. BS, this isn't racing.

I'M SICK OF HEARING THE WORD "TIRES" LITERALLY EVERY 10 SECONDS DURING THE "RACE"!!!!!

WTF????

/ pace "now" versus "then": aero is much more developed, lap times come about by gains in corners. Watch this - watch the MotoGp out drag the Redbull into the first corner. If that looks "the same" to you, get your eyes checked. Also your ears, if the SOUND of the F1 car doesn't do it for you - note it drowns out everything, and is noticeable from across the track. Sigh.

NOt really, this is all part of the game.

[Jimisgod]

I'M SICK OF HEARING THE WORD "TIRES" LITERALLY EVERY 10 SECONDS DURING THE "RACE"!!!!!

It was so much better when you heard fuel levels or fuel strategy every 5 seconds, was it?

[wepmob2000]

They should ban radios and go back to pit-boards, thus doing away with the engineers micro-managing every aspect of the drivers race...... then we'd find out who's really good. Experience would also count for something once more in F1

Edited by wepmob2000, 25 March 2013 - 19:39.