2085 replies to this topic

[DILLIGAF]

As A long time Webber fan I believe this thread serves no real purpose now,...other than to encourage people to lower their standards.

I've just read so much inflammatory stuff, of which I have to confess to having supplied some.

Truly like a car accident, you want to look away but don't.... please mods close

mymemoryfails

Agree. It's become redundant. Nothing more from me.

[OO7]

doesn't matter if his english is good or not when the car is so loud that he couldnt even understand what was said if it was german... xD... if you been in a club you know how hard it is to understand something under loud noise

Then why didn't he just say that in Malaysia and now when being interviewed in english?

[ardbeg]

I would actually suggest that's more the case with Vettel... he apologises for his actions 3 weeks ago, and suddenly changes his mind this weekend and tells the world that he'd do it again, and he's not sorry to Webber as he thought he deserved the win, and now he didn't ignore the order he just didn't understand it/hear it.

Seb can't make his mind up can he, whether to stand by his convictions or let the team tell him what to say... the same team he wilfully disobeyed during the race!

Actually, only the opposite would indicate the lack of backbone - if he had said after the race that he was not sorry and that he would do it again and then three weeks later he would apoliogize and swear it was the last time. That would indicate he spoke from heart first tome, then he allowed people to change his official stance although it would not change his person or his true beliefs.

In this situation, he went with was probably suggested, or maybe even ordered, by the team until he could think it through. Then he spoke his mind.

Best would have been if he had kept quiet until he had cleared his thoughts, but maybe that was not his choice. In any case, denying a truth is, IMO, more spineless than admitting a lie.

[Sin]

Then why didn't he just say that in Malaysia and now when being interviewed in english?

cause he wasn't asked?! That is something what I noticed with the british journalists in F1... whenever there was something that sounded weird, they did not ask an additional question, they just took it as it came.... no wonder we get clearer answers in german...

... anyway I'm sick of discussing, I'm sick of people keeping bashing on Vettel, probably as sick as you are of people critisizing Webber... so I will shut up now and hope this thread gets closed soon and does not provoke me to answer again

[bourbon]

In any case, denying a truth is, IMO, more spineless than admitting a lie.

Well considering you can't admit a lie without first denying the truth, I don't really understand how it could be more spineless.

That would be like saying robbing a bank is more spineless than returning the money to the bank. Well yeah, okay, but you had to rob it in the first place in order to be less spineless by returning it, so... um.... yeah....okay.

[Sin]

btw I'm growing to understand why you british are bashing on Vettel so much your media reports so biased about all this, its not a wonder...

[Kelateboy]

As A long time Webber fan I believe this thread serves no real purpose now,...other than to encourage people to lower their standards.

I've just read so much inflammatory stuff, of which I have to confess to having supplied some.

Truly like a car accident, you want to look away but don't.... please mods close

mymemoryfails

1 vote for locking the thread! It has passed its sell-by date. Let's move on - there is an interesting race tomorrow in Shanghai.

[OO7]

cause he wasn't asked?! That is something what I noticed with the british journalists in F1... whenever there was something that sounded weird, they did not ask an additional question, they just took it as it came.... no wonder we get clearer answers in german...

... anyway I'm sick of discussing, I'm sick of people keeping bashing on Vettel, probably as sick as you are of people critisizing Webber... so I will shut up now and hope this thread gets closed soon and does not provoke me to answer again

What has Webber got to do with it. You believe that my comments make me some sort of Webber fanatic. When this first blew up, I basically said I was in two minds about what had happened. One, that I admired Seb's fighting spirit and unwillingness to accept second best, two that he disobeyed a direct order because it didn't suit him. After I heard his comments I just called things the way I saw them, that I thought he lied.

[Sin]

dude I won't respond anymore... I have been making like 500 posts on Malaysia 2013.... I said everything I have to say several times.... I'm sick of it

[Jolkins]

Oh, my... These Seb fanboys. I've never been a fan of both drivers, but this is getting ridiculous. All this blind *****.

Sin, I'm just wondering, if you're so sick of discussing and getting these harsh replies, why are you still posting these biased comments of your own?

Edited by Jolkins, 13 April 2013 - 10:25.

[Sin]

Oh, my... These Seb fanboys. I've never been a fan of both drivers, but this is getting ridiculous. All this blind *****.

Sin, I'm just wondering, if you're so sick of discussing and getting these harsh replies, why are you still posting these biased comments of your own?

cause of people like you who keep provoking me... you don't like Seb fine.... but you dont need to rub it under the nose of the people who do like him every time, I haven't seen you posting anything about this topic, we had good discussions in here, but the people who really bash Sebastian really annoy me.... thats why I started to do the same with Mark.... because it just makes me angry...

Sebastian is a human being, he is not a monster, he makes mistakes like you and me... even tho I think what he said about Webber not deserving to be gifted a win (cause Webber never gifted Seb anything or supported him) was true... he is 25 years old...
FFS it has become a single huge bashfest in here, any discussion done and going in circles and your post doesn't add anything to it but more bad blood

people have different opinions and views, just because I think Seb did not do a mistake and there is a lot of reason to defend Seb doesn't mean you can tell me I'm stupid, thats my opinion you may have your own

Edited by Sin, 13 April 2013 - 10:32.

[thechin]

cause of people like you who keep provoking me... you don't like Seb fine.... but you dont need to rub it under the nose of the people who do like him every time, I haven't seen you posting anything about this topic, we had good discussions in here, but the people who really bash Sebastian really annoy me.... thats why I started to do the same with Mark.... because it just makes me angry...

Sebastian is a human being, he is not a monster, he makes mistakes like you and me... even tho I think what he said about Webber not deserving to be gifted a win (cause Webber never gifted Seb anything or supported him) was true... he is 25 years old...
FFS it has become a single huge bashfest in here, any discussion done and going in circles and your post doesn't add anything to it but more bad blood

people have different opinions and views, just because I think Seb did not do a mistake and there is a lot of reason to defend Seb doesn't mean you can tell me I'm stupid, thats my opinion you may have your own

Wrong!

[PurpleHam]

Massive error by Redbull to let Vettel be in-charge of putting fuel in Webbers car...

[Jon83]

btw I'm growing to understand why you british are bashing on Vettel so much your media reports so biased about all this, its not a wonder...

Complete nonsense.

Vettel was full of apologies after Malaysia, only to completely go back on it now. The claims of not understanding the team order are almost impossible to believe.

I used to like Vettel and never understood the stick he got on here. I've done my own 180 on the situation and pretty much hope this spoilt little brat has nothing but misery this season.

[pRy]

Come on, give it up. You people are looking increasingly ridiculous with your arguments. Just accept what he did. He has shown the world who he is.

He's a born winner. A driver who will do everything required to win. A great white shark amongst seals.

The only thing he perhaps miscalculated were his responses immediately after the race but with CH seemingly hanging him out to dry and the reaction of MW to what happened.. it's perhaps understandable that he retreated somewhat in his position. But he's had chance to think since then and he's decided to cut through all the BS and say it how it is. And it needed saying. The "relationship" between Seb and Mark has been non existant for some time now. They don't help each other. They don't like each other. Webber didn't help Vettel at Brazil. So why should Vettel help Webber in Malaysia?

Things have simply come to their natural conclusion. At least now both drivers know where they stand. Neither will help each other. That's fine. I'm sure it suits Vettel, because he will be confident he'll have the edge over Webber over the entire season. Although it would be amusing if Vettel did need Webber's help in the final race. But we saw at Brazil that he wouldn't give it anyway. So no big risk there really.

Less passive aggressiveness, more racing please.

[caso]

He's a born winner. A driver who will do everything required to win. A great white shark amongst seals.

That is debatable ;)

[ardbeg]

That would be like saying robbing a bank is more spineless than returning the money to the bank. Well yeah, okay, but you had to rob it in the first place in order to be less spineless by returning it, so... um.... yeah....okay.

Vettel returned nothing and regret nothing. Robbing a bank and then regret it and return the money is completely different thing. It would be more similar if you rob a bank, come home and your wife is furious and demands you to return the money. You do that, then you decide you do not need to listen to her and you rob it again. But that would not be a good example either since Vettel did not actually steal anything, in his eyes. He took what belonged to him. It made people upset because they did not think it did belong to him and the carousel was st in motion.

Anyway, what we see here is a lot of posters that think something that they themselves has done numerous times is unacceptable when someone else does it. We have all done it, said something while in defence mode, tried to excuse ourselves, tried to put the blame elsewhere. When things calms down we realize we could, and should, have behaved differently.

Nobody is perfect

Edited by ardbeg, 13 April 2013 - 13:26.

[JaredS]

It's true Webber does not deserve Sebs support, like he said he hasn't earned that.. because he constantly worked against Seb...

It's ironic then that it was Mark racing Alonso in the last race of the season that helped Seb clinch the title in 2010, and again in 2012 it was Mark who got past Alonso in the opening lap. Next time Mark should just ensure he does his very best to actively block Seb even if it means contact, and ensure that he lets Seb's closest competitors to the championship easily through.

At least then you will truly be accurate when you say he worked against Seb.

[JaredS]

A great white shark amongst seals.

It's funny you should mention seals. A couple of years ago, whilst I was surfing the autosport website during lunch break at work, one of our secretaries walked passed my desk and happened to see a big photo that had just loaded of Seb as he had won a race. The secretary who knew nothing about F1 asked me who it was to which I replied "That's Sebastian Vettel, he just won a Formula 1 race" She replied, "Oh he looks just like a seal pup". So I asked "Eh? Why, is it because of his big eyes and boyish looks?" To which she replied with a laugh "Noooo. It's just that I've seen his face on some other news sites and didn't know who he was or what he races. But every time I see his face, I want to club him to death!"

[ThomFi]

It's funny you should mention seals. A couple of years ago, whilst I was surfing the autosport website during lunch break at work, one of our secretaries walked passed my desk and happened to see a big photo that had just loaded of Seb as he had won a race. The secretary who knew nothing about F1 asked me who it was to which I replied "That's Sebastian Vettel, he just won a Formula 1 race" She replied, "Oh he looks just like a seal pup". So I asked "Eh? Why, is it because of his big eyes and boyish looks?" To which she replied with a laugh "Noooo. It's just that I've seen his face on some other news sites and didn't know who he was or what he races. But every time I see his face, I want to club him to death!"

If only I hadn't heard this lame joke before

As I was scanning through this thread, my daughter and her friend walked past my laptop and upon seeing the above photo of Vettel her friend commented "Oh, that's Seal Pup".

I turned around and asked "Seal pup? Because he's got big eyes, a nice smile and an innocent face?"

She said "No. Because every time you look at that face you want to club him to death!"

I must say I was quite taken aback.

Edited by ThomFi, 13 April 2013 - 14:23.

[SpaMaster]

^

[Sin]

in german it would be "Mark Webber hat ein Gesicht wie ein Feuermelder immer zum einschlagen bereit...", but that is a little bit brutal.... I don't dislike him THAT much... still dislike him alot tho

[Kelateboy]

dude I won't respond anymore... I have been making like 500 posts on Malaysia 2013.... I said everything I have to say several times.... I'm sick of it

If Alarcon was here, he would double your posts in no time....

[MikeV1987]

This thread has gone in circles for 52 pages, one side vs the other. Time to let this thread die.

Edited by MikeV1987, 13 April 2013 - 14:43.

[JaredS]

If only I hadn't heard this lame joke before

Classic!

[sniper80]

So Red Bull deliberately underfueled Webber? What do you think? Too much coincendence...

[nomi]

So Red Bull deliberately underfueled Webber? What do you think? Too much coincendence...

Message to Webber from Marko saying do not rock the boat.

Also to give breathing space because they know things are raw and do not want anything nasty AKA Turkey 2010.

[DKMoto]

Well atleast it wasnt a KERS issue for Webber.

Vettel had exactly same problem last year when he was actually fighting for a championship and still managed a podium.

But let me guess, this was all a big conspiracy by Vettel. He and Helmut Marko broke into the RBR Garage after midnight Mission Impossible style from the roof and made it so Webber's car will be underfueled only for Q2, not Q1 not P3, but Q2.

I wonder why the Vettel haters dont say anything about his crappy luck with Fuel?

It seems like Vettel is the devil according to those on here who support a driver who makes his teammates crash into walls and breaks their seals for the fun of it.

I hope Seb wins in China tomorrow so all the kleenex tissue wipers go buy a big bag tomorrow and cry furiously & type how much Vettel sucks and how "unlucky" their #1 Best Goat Never Make Mistake and #1 Human in World drivers are.

Edited by DKMoto, 13 April 2013 - 15:06.

[MikeV1987]

I think Vettel has a shot at the top 5, maybe even a podium depending on what happens in front of him. These tires are really holding RBR back which is making the championship that much more exciting.

Makes me wonder what things would be like if we had the bridgestones from 2010 this season.

[Lotusseven]

cause of people like you who keep provoking me... you don't like Seb fine.... but you dont need to rub it under the nose of the people who do like him every time, I haven't seen you posting anything about this topic, we had good discussions in here, but the people who really bash Sebastian really annoy me.... thats why I started to do the same with Mark.... because it just makes me angry...

Sebastian is a human being, he is not a monster, he makes mistakes like you and me... even tho I think what he said about Webber not deserving to be gifted a win (cause Webber never gifted Seb anything or supported him) was true... he is 25 years old...
FFS it has become a single huge bashfest in here, any discussion done and going in circles and your post doesn't add anything to it but more bad blood

people have different opinions and views, just because I think Seb did not do a mistake and there is a lot of reason to defend Seb doesn't mean you can tell me I'm stupid, thats my opinion you may have your own

Calm down girl. There is no need to be overprotective to your favorite driver, he will never thank you for that. Words don’t have power to hurt you or provoke you, unless that person (Vettel) means a LOT to you. I´m a very big fan of Alonso, but I avoid to defend him too much because he will survive without my help and protection, sometimes he´s a arrogant jerk like all the other drivers. Well, in the end you do what you want...

[Sin]

my favorite driver is for all times Heinz Harald Frentzen.... after that my favorite drivers are Hülkenberg & Gutierrez for this year since I'm cheering for Sauber most of all, then comes Vettel, Sutil & Di Resta...
And I state my opinion and will continue to state it, since I don't like people being treated unfair.

FFS just let this thread die

Edited by Sin, 13 April 2013 - 16:19.

[Raelene]

It might die if you stop responding

[Lotusseven]

my favorite driver is for all times Heinz Harald Frentzen.... after that my favorite drivers are Hülkenberg & Gutierrez for this year since I'm cheering for Sauber most of all, then comes Vettel, Sutil & Di Resta...
And I state my opinion and will continue to state it, since I don't like people being treated unfair.

FFS just let this thread die

[Kelateboy]

I think Vettel has a shot at the top 5, maybe even a podium depending on what happens in front of him. These tires are really holding RBR back which is making the championship that much more exciting.

Makes me wonder what things would be like if we had the bridgestones from 2010 this season.

Vettel definitely has a chance to be in the top 5. They keys to this (which is quite obvious) are to clear Button and not get mugged at the start by other midfield cars. Then start running his own pace and hope that the all the front runners would get into the traffic once they pit for primes for the 2nd stint.

Last year, Vettel was running 2nd with a few laps remaining but he got into tyres trouble from dueling with Kimi, and was subsequently overtaken by Lewis, Button and Webber to finish 5th. He started in 11th last year. So this year, it is a 2 grid-place improvement for the World Champion.

[JaredS]

my favorite driver is for all times Heinz Harald Frentzen.... after that my favorite drivers are Hülkenberg & Gutierrez for this year since I'm cheering for Sauber most of all, then comes Vettel, Sutil & Di Resta...
And I state my opinion and will continue to state it, since I don't like people being treated unfair.

FFS just let this thread die

The great thing about Webber is that what you see is what you get. He just doesn't BS like Seb. I fully agree that as a driver Mark is not on the same level as Seb but it's great that as the oldest driver on the grid, he can still push hard a triple WDC and one of the younger guys on the grid. Mark's done hard yards in crap cars, beating all team mates (ok some of them were crap such as Yoong, but he also beat Rosberg albeit a rookie and Coulthard who wasn't a bad peddler). Seb opened in Torro Rosso and drove really well and then found himself in the top car Red Bull. I think if we had a younger Mark paired up with Seb now, Seb would have his hands well and truly full. He may still come out on top but he would find it much more difficult and the title race would be close.

[MightyMoose]

Not sure why some of you went off-topic and began discussing details of the Chinese Grand Prix.....

Not sure why some of you seem intent on directing the majority of their posts at each other....

Given that everyone has had plenty of time to respond with their views & several have made very clear which side of the fence they're sitting on, I think it's inevitable this thread wasn't going to progress too much further.

In order to protect those of you who are breaching forum rules from yourselves, I'll consider this thread done and it's now CLOSED.