84 replies to this topic

[Skinnyguy]

An interesting piece of Autosport´s article, hope mods don´t get mad as it could be seen as an infringement of new "limited views"politic, but it´s just a little piece of a big article:


"Red Bull has a clear one and two, they always have. And that is why they have always had the problems they have had," Hamilton told British newspaper reporters.

"We don't have a one and two at Mercedes. I have always said, from the moment I was speaking to the team, that I wanted equality [with Nico Rosberg]."

Aren´t Lewis´ words nonsense? I mean, first of all, most of RB problems in the past have come precisely because of NOT being able to enforce a clear number one and two politic, just the opposite of what he syas. Think about Turkey ´10, Silverstone ´10, Silverstone ´11, and the last races of 2012. All these hard situations would have never happened with a clear number 1 and 2 politic actually working in the team.

And in a more specific note about this weekend, Red Bull TRIED to make Webber win the race, and Mercedes TRIED Lewis to come 3rd, both of them under pressure from quicker teammates in the final stages of the race. Surely you can´t come up with different conclussions from the same facts if they apply to you or others.

Is this another cheap psychological shot to RB and Vettel from Lewis? Has Lewis made any valid point here in your view?

[pRy]

If it's a myth that Redbull favours Vettel, why does Webber keep saying they do?

[EthanM]

Marko said Redbull is fair, they treat their drivers equally unlike Mercedes, Hamilton does a bit of tit-for-tat.

Storm in a teacup

[MikeV1987]

Theres only a #1 and #2 when one of the drivers is out of WDC contention, so technically he's right.

[One]

at merc they have too. brawn knows full well which one to put behind the other. if the order is reversed the order will not be heard,

[seahawk]

Lewis simply is the best. He does not need a lapdog as a partner, like other so called super star drivers.

[ToXiCiTy]

at merc they have too. brawn knows full well which one to put behind the other. if the order is reversed the order will not be heard,

Merc is in a bad situation, because if the order is reversed in future races and they **** Nico over the press will have field day with that. It was easy when we didnt hear the radio comms in a past.

[Sakae]

We see power of media in action. Black is white, and white is blue, if Hamilton says so, and media let him get away with it. He was the one who benefited from freaking team orders, yet he puts squarely blame on Vettel, without shred of evidence in his little hand, making in process DM a liar in very tangible way, since owner actually made time to make statement on the matter; but like all with Hamilton, nothing can surprise us anymore.

[Lelouch]

His car issues would suggest that he doesn't receive equal and I would say RB want him to be no 2 driver and nothing more. But having 2 pricks drive for them doesn't really help them get what they want. Ofc, one of the pricks is a 3-time WDC and if I had to focus on helping one guy win I would choose Vettel. I'd say off-track Webber is number 2 and on-track they are not even teammates.

[sanW10]

lol, Hamilton hitting back at Helmut

this is going to be a fun 2 week break.

Alosno is definitely going join Hamilton in this.

Edited by sanW10, 26 March 2013 - 16:54.

[stanga]

We see power of media in action. Black is white, and white is blue, if Hamilton says so, and media let him get away with it. He was the one who benefited from freaking team orders, yet he puts squarely blame on Vettel, without shred of evidence in his little hand, making in process DM a liar in very tangible way, since owner actually made time to make statement on the matter; but like all with Hamilton, nothing can surprise us anymore.

Poor DM. Dry your eyes mate! There, there!

You are right, of course. The media is always letting Hamilton 'get away with it'. They never write nonsense, puff pieces or take quotes out of context.

It's good that dear old Seb has been shown to be not quite the wunderkind, eh?

[ToXiCiTy]

lol, Hamilton hitting back at Helmut

this is going to be a fun 2 week break.

Alosno is definitely going join Hamilton in this.

I dont think so. It would make Alonso look like a fool. He really cant comment on teamorders.

[sharo]

What was that people are saying about a pot and a kettle?

[sanW10]

I dont think so. It would make Alonso look like a fool. He really cant comment on teamorders.

ohh, so thats why we haven't heard from him yet

[Skinnyguy]

Alosno is definitely going join Hamilton in this.

It´s actually Hamilton joining. Alonso started the attack on RB:

"It´s incredible because (RB) are always the most legal time, the team that always do everything right and never does evil stuff, but today we´ve seen the truth. In Ferrari this stuff does not happen, we´re the most united team, they say they´re united too but then you say it´s not the case."

"Es increíble porque siempre es el equipo más legal, el equipo que todo lo hace bien y nunca hace cosas malas, pero hoy se ha visto un poco la verdad. En Ferrari eso no pasa, somos el equipo más unido, ellos dicen que también lo están, pero después se ve que no es así."

http://motor.as.com/...296_641227.html

At least Alonso has a point, Ferrari is different to RB and they indeed are able of better teamwork, but Lewis´ facts and interpretations are nonsense.

[Juggles]

What was that people are saying about a pot and a kettle?

Definitely not that either are black, whatever Ali G may say

[Watkins74]

If Red Bull doesn't have equality why did Lewis want to drive for them?

[MikeV1987]

Lewis simply is the best. He does not need a lapdog as a partner, like other so called super star drivers.

You must feel really big going from thread to thread taking pot shots at other drivers while praising your own.

Edited by MikeV1987, 26 March 2013 - 17:15.

[stanga]

At least Alonso has a point, Ferrari is different to RB and they indeed are able of better teamwork, but Lewis´ facts and interpretations are nonsense.

No more nonsense than poor Seb's inane lies about not understanding the instruction.

[Group B]

Hamilton can claim what he likes, but what we all witnessed was the exact opposite; Vettel was ordered to stay behind Webber and Rosberg was ordered to stay behind Lewis. This is clearly LH trying to get a few sly brownie points at the expense of a competitor, but the truth was clear for all to see on Sunday. After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

[Sakae]

Poor DM. Dry your eyes mate! There, there!

You are right, of course. The media is always letting Hamilton 'get away with it'. They never write nonsense, puff pieces or take quotes out of context.

It's good that dear old Seb has been shown to be not quite the wunderkind, eh?

Just to be clear about this – I am not defending DM at all. In fact, I am not very pleased with his involvement in F1, and he also made me angry several times in the past, but point is, it is DM who is holding Webber around shoulders, it is the same DM who owns the team, and who is telling whole world that there is equality in his teams, yet here comes Hamilton, and without shred of evidence smudges RB (specifically Vettel as benefactor). To add insult to the injury, he does it on eve as beneficiary of his own P1 orders, existence of which he promptly denied contrary to facts.

[Skinnyguy]

No more nonsense than poor Seb's inane lies about not understanding the instruction.

Indeed. 100% agree.

At least he managed to get a grip once he cooled down and made a better interpretation of it. But that "it wasn´t on purpose" thing was totally laughable.

[Group B]

Lewis simply is the best. He does not need a lapdog as a partner, like other so called super star drivers.

Hmm, well he certainly doesn't want Rosberg if Malaysia was anything to go by.

[maverick69]

Hamilton can claim what he likes, but what we all witnessed was the exact opposite; Vettel was ordered to stay behind Webber and Rosberg was ordered to stay behind Lewis. This is clearly LH trying to get a few sly brownie points at the expense of a competitor, but the truth was clear for all to see on Sunday. After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

Sly brownie points?

It's a response to Marko proclaiming that Merc have a clear no.1 policy as an attempt to divert some of the mess from Sunday.......

Edited by maverick69, 26 March 2013 - 17:26.

[Juggles]

Hamilton can claim what he likes, but what we all witnessed was the exact opposite; Vettel was ordered to stay behind Webber and Rosberg was ordered to stay behind Lewis. This is clearly LH trying to get a few sly brownie points at the expense of a competitor, but the truth was clear for all to see on Sunday. After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

Because he was ordered not to by Brawn, despite asking for permission to do so.

[William Hunt]

After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

I also thought about this, he could have let Rosberg through if he had wanted to. Although I do believe Lewis that Mercedes doesn't have a first & second driver (at least not yet).

[Lelouch]

Just to be clear about this – I am not defending DM at all. In fact, I am not very pleased with his involvement in F1, and he also made me angry several times in the past, but point is, it is DM who is holding Webber around shoulders, it is the same DM who owns the team, and who is telling whole world that there is equality in his teams, yet here comes Hamilton, and without shred of evidence smudges RB (specifically Vettel as benefactor). To add insult to the injury, he does it on eve as beneficiary of his own P1 orders, existence of which he promptly denied contrary to facts.

But he did it in response to Marko's claims that Mercedes have a clear number 1 and there is much more evidence about RB having a number 1 driver rather than Mercedes.

Edit: Sorry, maverick69 had already mentioned it =/

Edited by Lelouch, 26 March 2013 - 17:27.

[Skinnyguy]

Sly brownie points?

It's a response to Marko proclaiming that Merc have a clear no.1 policy as an attempt to divert some if the mess from Sunday.......

Well yeah but Marko claim is a "look somewhere else" one, but it has a good ground in facts. Lewis´ claim is total nonsense, and he tries to back it up with the facts of a race pointing in the total opposite direction of what he says.

[Skinnyguy]

But he did it in response to Marko's claims that Mercedes have a clear number 1 and there is much more evidence about RB having a number 1 driver rather than Mercedes.

No. There´s not. Going by what has actually happened until now, it´s exactly the other way around.

[HopkinsonF1]

Hamilton can claim what he likes, but what we all witnessed was the exact opposite; Vettel was ordered to stay behind Webber and Rosberg was ordered to stay behind Lewis. This is clearly LH trying to get a few sly brownie points at the expense of a competitor, but the truth was clear for all to see on Sunday. After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

Lewis radioed Ross to say he wanted to let Nico past; Ross told him to follow orders and stay in front. Afraid I can't find the quote right now, but somebody else might be able to.

[Lelouch]

No. There´s not. Going by what has actually happened until now, it´s exactly the other way around.

So you would say that in 3 years all has been fair and square in RB and Webber was given the same chances? I'm not even saying he was worthy of having equal chances but I don't think he got them anyway.

Edit: typo

Edited by Lelouch, 26 March 2013 - 17:31.

[LuckyStrike1]

If it's a myth that Redbull favours Vettel, why does Webber keep saying they do?

Because he needs an excuse for getting beaten race after race, season after season.

"They are all against me and stop me from winning" sure sounds better than "I'm just not quite good enough am I?" ... although what it actually sounds like is "They are all against me and stop me from winning but here I am keep signing these one year contracts so I'm either stupid or lying."

[SmokeScreen]

but but but twas Marko wot started it .

He shouldn't have commented on Merc last Sunday -Why shouldn't Hamilton defend his team & pile the pressure back on his? I await Marko's next comments on this matter





In other news looks like Bernie is trying to kill two birds with one stone too-
deflect attention from his favourite team's woes

sustain his attempt to oust Brawn

[ToXiCiTy]

Because he was ordered not to by Brawn, despite asking for permission to do so.

So what? Like Ross has the power to punish their 60 million investment.

[Group B]

Because he was ordered not to by Brawn, despite asking for permission to do so.

Which takes us back to Lewis being number 1. If there were really no preference then why should Brawn care? There's no risk involved, and it would be a wonderful advert for the openess and fair play of Mercedes. It's difficult not to suspect that Lewis knew the answer before he asked: after all, why ask in the first place?

[swerved]

Hamilton can claim what he likes, but what we all witnessed was the exact opposite; Vettel was ordered to stay behind Webber and Rosberg was ordered to stay behind Lewis. This is clearly LH trying to get a few sly brownie points at the expense of a competitor, but the truth was clear for all to see on Sunday. After all, if Lewis really felt as bad as he claimed about it why didn't he just invite Nico past?

The usual hypocrisy from Lewis.

[undersquare]

Well yeah but Marko claim is a "look somewhere else" one, but it has a good ground in facts. Lewis´ claim is total nonsense, and he tries to back it up with the facts of a race pointing in the total opposite direction of what he says.

No the point is not the team order, which is quite normal among equal drivers, it's that Vettel can ignore it and get away with it.

As we saw. All we had was Horner talking about 'the drivers' not 'Sebastian'.

[sanW10]

http://willthef1jour...iling-assassin/
a good read, will buxton's opinion on team orders

[Crossmax]

Lewis simply is the best. He does not need a lapdog as a partner, like other so called super star drivers.

As was proven in Malaysia just a few days ago...

[undersquare]

Which takes us back to Lewis being number 1. If there were really no preference then why should Brawn care? There's no risk involved, and it would be a wonderful advert for the openess and fair play of Mercedes. It's difficult not to suspect that Lewis knew the answer before he asked: after all, why ask in the first place?

Brawn watched two passes and re-passes, burning up fuel. So he had to end the racing, and the usual pre-existing deal is that whoever is leading after the last stops keeps the lead while they cruise safely to the finish.

Hamilton had to ask because Rosberg was trying not to pass, so he'd have had to force it and effect a team order. That's not his prerogative, quite obviously.

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

Lewis simply is the best. He does not need a lapdog as a partner, like other so called super star drivers.

Then why did Jenson Button beat him over their 3 years together?

[P123]

Then why did Jenson Button beat him over their 3 years together?

He didn't.

[Asterion]

Then why did Jenson Button beat him over their 3 years together?

Do you watch F1, or do you just read the sports section on Monday?

[lifeohlife]

LH clearly said he wanted equal status in the team and RB did not. Why did he want to join RB?

He also said RB was just a drinks company. Then a few weeks later he wanted to discuss his future with Horner.

I won't believe a word from him after Australia 2009..

Edited by lifeohlife, 26 March 2013 - 17:51.

[P123]

Red Bull have the fastest car- any driver would want to have that chassis. Is it too obvious?

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

Do you watch F1, or do you just read the sports section on Monday?

F1???? What's that?

[undersquare]

LH clearly said he wanted equal status in the team and RB did not. Why did he want to join RB?

He also said RB was just a drinks company. Then a few weeks later he wanted to discuss his future with Horner.

I won't believe a word from him after Australia 2009..

Spare us. LH would not be No2 would he?

He did not say "just" a drinks company. Don't tell porkies . He meant not a long-standing racing team like Mac or Ferrari.

The others have all told lies more recently than 2009, Vettel only on Sunday. It's quite dishonest to pretend there's only been one lie told in F1 and it's Hamilton's.

[ToXiCiTy]

Where did he state that Hamilton is the only one that lies?

[tommi34]

If it's a myth that Redbull favours Vettel, why does Webber keep saying they do?

Because he's losing.

[f1supreme]

If lewis is the number 1 because nico was told not to overtake him, then webber must be the number 1 at RB because they told vettel not to overtake webber.

Marko is a hypocrite.