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Spanish Grand Prix Speculation/Build Up


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#1 SamH123

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 15:56

What with another 3 week break (why are the races not arranged a bit more consistently?) I enjoy speculating on what we might see in Barcelona to make the f1 drought feel a bit shorter.

Something I read that surprised me a bit was in Brundle's blog here: http://www1.skysport...-a-desert-storm
was this:

"There was a tense-looking meeting between some teams and Pirelli on Sunday morning and I suspect that the compounds will head towards more cautious territory through the year, and that the hard compound tyre in Barcelona will be back to the 2012 spec."

Is there really a chance of 2012 tyres or is Brundle not really talking sense? I've read that the tyres are really quite different and have been part of Mclaren/Sauber/Williams problems, surely they can't just change things like that mid-season?

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#2 Grundle

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 16:29

Ba

#3 Jovanotti

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 16:43

"There was a tense-looking meeting between some teams and Pirelli on Sunday morning and I suspect that the compounds will head towards more cautious territory through the year, and that the hard compound tyre in Barcelona will be back to the 2012 spec."

On the other hand:

Speaking to AUTOSPORT ahead of the meeting, Pirelli motorsport director Paul Hembery said that any outfit hoping for a return to the more conservative compound choices of late 2012 would be disappointed.

"There will likely only be very small tweaks, which will mainly involve changes to the operating ranges of some of the compounds," he said.

Imho there's zero chance for a 2012-like hard compound in Barcelona. RB is not Ferrari ;)

Edited by Jovanotti, 24 April 2013 - 16:45.


#4 SamH123

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 17:16

Oh I forgot that Hembery said that, weak comment from Brundle..

What specific teams have bragged about a big upgrade? Obviously they will all have some upgrades but I think Williams and Mclaren are probably the most likely to move forward...



#5 Cavani

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 17:22

too early for a build-up and it will make the break more longer i think

#6 BackOnTop

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 17:52

"There was a tense-looking meeting between some teams and Pirelli on Sunday morning and I suspect that the compounds will head towards more cautious territory through the year, and that the hard compound tyre in Barcelona will be back to the 2012 spec."

Is there really a chance of 2012 tyres or is Brundle not really talking sense? I've read that the tyres are really quite different and have been part of Mclaren/Sauber/Williams problems, surely they can't just change things like that mid-season?

If other teams 'continue' to do 1 extra pit-stop compared to Lotus.... then there will come an aggressive few races where both Kimi & Grosjean will make them pay for it!

20 seconds 'freely' gifted to Lotus for an extra pitstop every race is a lifetime in F1. RBR made an Extra Stop work in Bahrain, but Lotus might get up and start punishing everyone that don't stay with them on Pitstop count.

It might start this weekend onwards. Should be interesting if Lotus breakthrough & start qualifying like China consistently.

#7 Diderlo

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 18:34

It is not 20 seconds. Kimi and Romain would have better lap times if they pitted 1 more time. The difference isn't many seconds. Tactical benefit is what makes it effective.

#8 Sakae

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 20:55

I wonder if after Barcelona pecking order will emerge, or remains variable with no hope for us to guess where anyone stands from one race to another.

#9 Shiroo

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 21:04

I wonder if after Barcelona pecking order will emerge, or remains variable with no hope for us to guess where anyone stands from one race to another.

well we at least know when Mercedes will start to fade away. from May onwards (quite early change). I expect 3 top teams to win all other races. McLaren won't win, Mercedes well I doubt (especially after they will focus on 2014).

I wonder if any DRD will appear in Spain

#10 Sakae

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 21:27

I am not much these days on who is who, and their job description at Brackley, but from last year rumor that was floating around about job redundancies, my guess is then, that there will be a core team dealing with improvements on W04 (approved on consultative basis with 2014 experts), and new design will be taken over by people who have noting much to contribute on W04. It might not be then utter disaster, when they have enough resources. That's how I would organize that; well, we will see, but it would be a mistake to write them off yet.

Edited by Sakae, 24 April 2013 - 21:28.


#11 scheivlak

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Posted 24 April 2013 - 22:22

I wonder if after Barcelona pecking order will emerge

Monaco is too specific a GP for that.
Look at last year when Merc florished and Lotus was in big trouble in the principality and, come Montreal, Merc was in big trouble and Lotus were pretty competitive once again. Canada BTW can also produce rather peculiar and tyre-dependent results.

Maybe some pecking order will emerge only from the British GP on.

Edited by scheivlak, 24 April 2013 - 22:23.


#12 Kingshark

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 00:00

Sigh, with back to back racing weekends from China to Bahrain, 3 weeks until Spain feels like an eternity. :(

#13 BigCHrome

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 01:16

Sigh, with back to back racing weekends from China to Bahrain, 3 weeks until Spain feels like an eternity. :(

I wish there was a 2 week gap between China and Bahrain and a 2 week gap between Bahrain and Spain.

#14 Atreiu

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 01:33

Alonso
Vettel
Raikkonen

#15 Markn93

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 08:15

Something I read that surprised me a bit was in Brundle's blog here: http://www1.skysport...-a-desert-storm
was this:

"There was a tense-looking meeting between some teams and Pirelli on Sunday morning and I suspect that the compounds will head towards more cautious territory through the year, and that the hard compound tyre in Barcelona will be back to the 2012 spec."

Is there really a chance of 2012 tyres or is Brundle not really talking sense? I've read that the tyres are really quite different and have been part of Mclaren/Sauber/Williams problems, surely they can't just change things like that mid-season?

http://www.f1fanatic...d-tyre-durable/ - he was indeed correct.

#16 Shiroo

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 09:28

Actually it was perfect tyre. Good speed and quite durable. Dunno why it will be vhanged

#17 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 09:30

Why are we still talking about when the pecking order will be decided? I'm pretty sure we've got a good indication by now. What's next? The pecking order decided around Spa? :p

#18 lixlax

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 10:10

Why are we still talking about when the pecking order will be decided? I'm pretty sure we've got a good indication by now. What's next? The pecking order decided around Spa? :p

I understand your point, but I think in Spain we will see biggest upgrade packages of the year for most of the teams. So the pecking order might see some changes, but of course different tracks and weather conditions change the order at every GP.

#19 Gintonious

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 10:27

I'm glad he was wrong about that prediction now!

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#20 Grundle

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 11:20

well we at least know when Mercedes will start to fade away. from May onwards (quite early change). I expect 3 top teams to win all other races. McLaren won't win, Mercedes well I doubt (especially after they will focus on 2014).

I wonder if any DRD will appear in Spain

:clap:
Whenever you make a prediction about Mercedes, its wrong. Looking forward to a great year now
The only team I expect to improve relative to others this year is McLaren.
Besides, Mercedes are the only team to admit when they shift most resources to 2014, I expect other teams are similar, its a massive operation.

#21 V3TT3L

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 11:53

Tire allocation change, pro RedBull.
http://www.autosport...rce=mostpopular

'F1 teams will get the first chance to try out the new harder compound tyre at the forthcoming Spanish Grand Prix, where it will be used with the medium compound tyre.'

MEDIUM + 2012 spec HARD

#22 Opaque

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 13:31

I hope they use last year's hard compound in all races. That way nobody gains an unfair advantage by pitting fewer times.

Anyway, my guess for the race:

1. Vettel
2. Grosjean
3. Alonso

#23 Torsion

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 13:37

I hope they use last year's hard compound in all races. That way nobody gains an unfair advantage by pitting fewer times.


How is it unfair?



#24 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 13:41

Tire allocation change, pro RedBull.
http://www.autosport...rce=mostpopular

'F1 teams will get the first chance to try out the new harder compound tyre at the forthcoming Spanish Grand Prix, where it will be used with the medium compound tyre.'

MEDIUM + 2012 spec HARD


It's been made perfectly clear it's not the 2012 spec hard tyre. It's merely closer to the 2012 spec hard, but it is NOT the 2012 spec hard.

#25 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 13:42

I hope they use last year's hard compound in all races. That way nobody gains an unfair advantage by pitting fewer times.


In a word......huh?

#26 Shiroo

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 15:42

I hope they use last year's hard compound in all races. That way nobody gains an unfair advantage by pitting fewer times.

Anyway, my guess for the race:

1. Vettel
2. Grosjean
3. Alonso

how's better car at tyre management is unfair advantage?
Then I state that having too much downforce is unfair advantage.
having world champion as a driver is unfair advantage.
season opener is unfair advantage for a winner


Sweet god.

#27 charly0418

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 16:47

I think McLaren will finally get ahead of the Force India. Also I expect Sauber to improve a lot

#28 McLarenNo1

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 20:47

This race might be one of the best chances for Mercedes to win a race this year.

#29 SamH123

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 21:50

This race might be one of the best chances for Mercedes to win a race this year.


Monaco probably their best shot - but do you reckon Spain will be good for them because of what we saw in pre-season?


#30 Disgrace

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 22:22

I wonder if after Barcelona pecking order will emerge, or remains variable with no hope for us to guess where anyone stands from one race to another.


From one race to another race is optimistic. The pecking order changes between sessions during the weekend.

#31 Kelateboy

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 05:27

It's been made perfectly clear it's not the 2012 spec hard tyre. It's merely closer to the 2012 spec hard, but it is NOT the 2012 spec hard.

I believe it's the same specifications as the experimental hard tyres tested in Brazil last year.

#32 BackOnTop

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 06:10

It is not 20 seconds. Kimi and Romain would have better lap times if they pitted 1 more time. The difference isn't many seconds. Tactical benefit is what makes it effective.

Raikkonen has been doing 'better/similar laptimes' on old tyres than guys with extra pit-stops & new tyres!!

Hungary 2012.. from lap 36 to 45 is a prime example of why Ferrari, RBR & other teams are keeping a close eye on his race ever since. They think it's kinda improbable for 'everyone' to do Laptimes the same as Raikkonen on old tyres, hence the worry before every race this season.

Maybe this time it'll all click again like Australia.

#33 Dzeidzei

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 18:56

Raikkonen has been doing 'better/similar laptimes' on old tyres than guys with extra pit-stops & new tyres!!

Hungary 2012.. from lap 36 to 45 is a prime example of why Ferrari, RBR & other teams are keeping a close eye on his race ever since. They think it's kinda improbable for 'everyone' to do Laptimes the same as Raikkonen on old tyres, hence the worry before every race this season.

Maybe this time it'll all click again like Australia.


They will have to put extra 20 kg in Kimis Lotus. Otherwise he gets unfair advantage.

#34 SpartanChas

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 19:05

Monaco is Mercedes best chance to win this season, what with Lewis being the, *cough*, Monaco master and all. Spain could be too hot for them.

Edited by SpartanChas, 26 April 2013 - 19:05.


#35 Shiroo

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 22:21

Monaco is Mercedes best chance to win this season, what with Lewis being the, *cough*, Monaco master and all. Spain could be too hot for them.

If I would pick any Monaco master from current driver generation, with all due respect, it would be Kubica, he each season was insane here, I still can recall his performance where je qualified to q3 on meds in renault, totally isane.

Hamilton is good there similar to Alonso or Webber ( yes, Webber, his performance there in my opinion is really good)

#36 Seano

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 23:38

Well nice Mr Stobbart and his chums will be setting off from Warrington in the next few days with the Mercedes European Hospitality unit. Apparently there were issues the AC on the upper deck after someone had riveted a new floor surface in causing coolant leakage unpleasantness!

I must admit to entertaining a certain childish notion of beating Lewis to the bog - but then again Michael will have already been there, so maybe not.

Seano

#37 Clatter

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 23:41

If I would pick any Monaco master from current driver generation, with all due respect, it would be Kubica, he each season was insane here, I still can recall his performance where je qualified to q3 on meds in renault, totally isane.

Hamilton is good there similar to Alonso or Webber ( yes, Webber, his performance there in my opinion is really good)


I rather think the fact that LH is a current driver and RK isn't really makes any talk of how good he was rather moot, considering we are talking about upcoming race and not those of the past.

#38 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 00:10

They will have to put extra 20 kg in Kimis Lotus. Otherwise he gets unfair advantage.


Kimi would just adjust and then put in even faster laptimes. Then he would ask for more weight.  ;)

Edited by halifaxf1fan, 27 April 2013 - 02:53.


#39 Diderlo

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 00:29

Raikkonen has been doing 'better/similar laptimes' on old tyres than guys with extra pit-stops & new tyres!!

Hungary 2012.. from lap 36 to 45 is a prime example of why Ferrari, RBR & other teams are keeping a close eye on his race ever since. They think it's kinda improbable for 'everyone' to do Laptimes the same as Raikkonen on old tyres, hence the worry before every race this season.

Maybe this time it'll all click again like Australia.


But surely it is evident that Kimi himself could go even faster with new tyres. It was my point, not how fast Kimi is compared to other guys. Pitting fewer times gives you tactical advantage, not so much of speed advantage due to tyre wear.

Edited by Diderlo, 27 April 2013 - 00:30.


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#40 TheThirdTenor1

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 08:59

Spain really took a beating against Germany in these last 8 days. Hopefully Alonso can restore some pride! :|

#41 Gintonious

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 09:29

3 weeks...who the hell thought of this??????

#42 TheThirdTenor1

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 09:57

3 weeks...who the hell thought of this??????


Yes i would prefer it if we had 2 week breaks between each race.

#43 dave34m

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 10:13

3 weeks...who the hell thought of this??????

I know, we have had this 3 week break twice already. Its damn annoying and theres more to come before the mid year 4 week break.

#44 amppatel

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 10:20

Yes i would prefer it if we had 2 week breaks between each race.



I know, we have had this 3 week break twice already. Its damn annoying and theres more to come before the mid year 4 week break.


Exactly, it feels like F1 hasn't really started.

#45 encircled

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 12:45

http://www.f1technical.net/news/18355

The cockpit signalling system for F1 drivers will be fixed for the Spanish GP in one week time, race steward Derek Warwick said. The FIA has failed to get it working since it changed suppliers, but an update is set to resolve the problems.



#46 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 13:11

I know, we have had this 3 week break twice already. Its damn annoying and theres more to come before the mid year 4 week break.

Yes, and then near the end we have like three or four back to back races. Calendar has become very unbalanced in recent years.

#47 Oho

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 13:47

How is it unfair?


Wrong driver benefits.

#48 Myrvold

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 13:48

While, it is "boring" to wait 3 weeks for us. It is a lot better for the guys working at the racetracks. To travel two weeks, then having more time "home". Then travel again. Instead of travel, having 3-4 days home, and then travel again. It's probably also a bit cheaper.

#49 Sakae

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 17:46

how's better car at tyre management is unfair advantage?
Then I state that having too much downforce is unfair advantage.
having world champion as a driver is unfair advantage.
season opener is unfair advantage for a winner


Sweet god.

I it really about tire management? Perhaps this statement is becoming cliché removed from reality.

#50 MP422

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Posted 02 May 2013 - 18:01

I rather think the fact that LH is a current driver and RK isn't really makes any talk of how good he was rather moot, considering we are talking about upcoming race and not those of the past.


Yea inaddition i would rate Mark Webber as a highly successful driver at Monaco, as opposed to someone whom has never won or stuck his chassis on pole. lol.