123 replies to this topic

[Myrvold]

Hamilton – I had never thought so, but the analogy to J. Villeneuve is a good one

Never?

Both debuting in a top team, against a teammate that has been on top the last few years. Both being very fast, fighting for the title
Second season, last years driver one left the team. A talent (but still an unknown) joined the team. Both won the championship.
Third season. Team stays the same. Rules change massively. Both teams fail to make a car anywhere close to the top. While Hamilton got two wins, where JV got none. The 09 season was more changing than the 98 season, which had three drivers only, having chance for wins (with Belgium as the special one). Oh, btw, both in 98 and 09, the Winner in Belgium, took the only win for his team that year, both cases it was the WDC in JV & LH's debut season, both seasons JV & LH beat the WDC from their debut season with one point (JV beat Hill 21 to 20, LH beat Kimi 49 to 48). Both teams ended 3rd as well.

There the similarities stops. As JV left for the Brackley based team in his 4th season. While LH waited until his 7th.

However, the three first season, are as similar as it can be I think.

[garoidb]

Thank God internet forums weren't around back in the mid-90's. Imagine how much bashing and baiting Hill would get.

Don't know if you are trying to be ironic, but there were internet forums, including ones dedicated to F1, in the mid 90s.

[Kingshark]

Don't know if you are trying to be ironic, but there were internet forums, including ones dedicated to F1, in the mid 90s.

Actually, I did not know that. The oldest forum thread I've ever found was from 1999.

How was Hill perceived by forumers back in the mid-1990's? Just curious, because he gets slated a lot nowadays.

Edited by Kingshark, 21 May 2013 - 14:35.

[Collombin]

How was Hill perceived by forumers back in the mid-1990's? Just curious, because he gets slated a lot nowadays.

I definitely underrated him at the time, due to his lack of an outstanding record in lower formulae, getting the top car almost from the beginning of his F1 career and then still not capturing the title until he had a rookie team mate on board. Incidents like Germany, Britain, Italy and Japan in 1995 didn't help either (and maybe others too that I missed - that era was SO boring there was a high likelihood of being asleep for a fair chunk of the races).

For that reason, I found Hungary 1997 to be truly astonishing, and after his Spa win the following year began to realise that he was rather better than I had maybe given him credit for. Not remotely in the Schumi or Hakkinen league of course, but certainly better than most of the rest. It was a shame he faded again in 1999 and it all sort of petered out disappointingly, but at his peak it can't be denied that he got the job done. And remained a gentleman and great ambassador for the sport throughout.

Edited by E.B., 21 May 2013 - 14:54.

[garoidb]

Actually, I did not know that. The oldest forum thread I've ever found was from 1999.

How was Hill perceived by forumers back in the mid-1990's? Just curious, because he gets slated a lot nowadays.

He got slated a lot back then too (especially when he crashed into Schumacher e.g. Silverstone 1995) .

Edit: By the way, I was not referring to Atlas being around in 1995. I was thinking of rec.autos.sport.f1

Edited by garoidb, 21 May 2013 - 16:47.

[Collombin]

when he crashed into Schumacher e.g. Silverstone 1995) .

Any sympathy I had for Schumacher over the incident quickly went out the window when he said in a post race interview that this was the second time Hill had done this to him (yes, he was referring to Adelaide the previous year )

[garoidb]

Any sympathy I had for Schumacher over the incident quickly went out the window when he said in a post race interview that this was the second time Hill had done this to him (yes, he was referring to Adelaide the previous year )

Yes, I remember that

[Risil]

Any sympathy I had for Schumacher over the incident quickly went out the window when he said in a post race interview that this was the second time Hill had done this to him (yes, he was referring to Adelaide the previous year )

Somehow, that strikes me as exactly the kind of thing Vettel would say...

[Kingshark]

He did blame Webber for Turkey 2010, so don't be surprised.

[mattferg]

Vettel - Damon Hill

Lewis Hamilton - Juan Pablo Montoya

[gillesthegenius]

Lewis Hamilton - Juan Pablo Montoya

Hamilton - Maldonado ;)

[Jimisgod]

Hamilton - Maldonado ;)

Vettel - Ide x Rosset

[motorhead]

J.Villeneuve-D.Hill

Both had a priviledge of driving a dominant car....that Williams with active suspension was far more ahead to the rest of the back than RBR has ever been

[Eff One 2002]

For me Vettel is more like a mixture of Frentzen and Schumi, the likable quality of HHF and the racing success of Schumacher

Vettel likable? When did this happen?

[SophieB]

Posts deleted. Please do not insult other posters and if you see that happening, report the posts.

Now please continue to talk about which driver reminds you of which other driver.

[Briz]

J.Villeneuve-D.Hill

Both had a priviledge of driving a dominant car....that Williams with active suspension was far more ahead to the rest of the back than RBR has ever been

Both statements are correct, but have to point out that active suspension was banned after 1993, before Hill and Villeneuve won their titles

[Nomore]

Vettel - Damon Hill

[gillesthegenius]

Vettel - Ide x Rosset

Hmmm. That's interesting. I thought fast, furious and crash prone are things that bring Lewis and Pastor to common ground. But figuring out the 'wisdom' behind your suggestion leaves me befuddled. So Could you please care to enlighten me on it.

[gillesthegenius]

Vettel likable? When did this happen?

Probably when he built up a fan base that actually finds him 'likeable'.

[rasul]

I probably missed a few posts, but so far, the Top4 drivers were compared (at least once) to:

Vettel: Clark, Fangio, Senna, Schumacher, Hakkinen, Piquet, Damon Hill, Ascari;
Alonso: Prost, Schumacher, Lauda, Piquet, Senna
Hamilton: David Beckham , J Villeneuve, Mansell, Senna, Hakkinen,Andretti, Rindt,Peterson, Montoya
Kimi: Hunt, Peterson, Stewart, Prost, Piquet, Rindt, Scheckter.

So we can conclude that all top drivers remind us of very different drivers(and not drivers only), but generally, most people think that:
Vettel is a mix of Schumacher(11 votes), Senna(4) and Piquet(3). The Schumi part is dominating, though.
Alonso is a mix of Prost(6), Schumacher(5), and Lauda(4)
Hamilton is a mix of J Villeneuve(4), Mansell(3), and Senna(4)
Kimi is a difficult one--his career is quite unique and hard to define--but he's slightly more often compared to Hunt(3), Peterson(2) and Prost(2).

So, Vettel and Alonso 'share' some Schumacher traits, and Vettel and Hamilton share some Senna traits. Kimi is Kimi.

[sopa]

Good reading, some great comparisons in this threads I wouldn't have thought of.

I like a lot:
Button - G.Hill. Another one I would propose, not mentioned here, is Emerson Fittipaldi. Arguably a smooth driver too, also their pole-to-win ratio is similar. Both stronger in race pace than quali.
I found Vettel - Stewart comparison interesting by one guy. Stewart also won 3 titles in a team built around him.
Raikkonen has been compared so several single-time champions. Rindt and Jones I like a lot. Jones had a bad comeback in a crappy team though, that's the difference.
Peterson could be either Hamilton or Raikkonen, minus the championship of course.

Maldonado - Brambilla. Awesome match.
Grosjean can't say for sure. Depends on the career. Patrese is brought in here, but if Grosjean wins championship one day, he could rather be Scheckter. What about Depailler? Now I don't remember much about DP's career except he was considered good in the wet, but he got a good car pretty early in his career and always remained a second-tier driver with podiums and a couple of wins.

Bottas start is like Hakkinen's, who had a crappy Lotus in 1991 in which you can't score points without attrition.

Kovalainen - Johansson. Another awesome comparison in this thread.
Heidfeld - Brundle. Self-explanatory. Another one would be Warwick.
What about di Resta - Blundell? At times got some decent results, but driver is not rated highly.
Sutil - Mass or H-J Stuck? Germans under the radar, though Mass somehow got a race win.
Trulli - Arnoux. Gave a run for the money of a future multiple world champion (Alonso, Prost), but fell out with the team and was sacked. Next season was promising (Arnoux in title contention in 83, Toyota was good in 05), but after that career fell off-track. Was famous for his one-lap speed.
Kobayashi - Alesi. I dunno why this came to my head. Attractive flamboyant driving style. But Koba is like mini-Alesi. Career was much shorter and Koba didn't quite leave the mark Alesi did. Still neither lived up to promise.

Perez could be another Alesi, perhaps even a better fit than Kobayashi. Three podiums in Sauber last year. How many did Alesi get in 1990 in Tyrrell, I think two? Subsequently hired by a top team, but Ferrari was rubbish in 1991 as is McLaren in 2013.

I don't know, I don't see that much Alesi in Hulkenberg. He is more like Rosberg, Hakkinen, Raikkonen or Heidfeld depending on how career pans out. Silently does his business and without such a flamboyant driving style.

Edited by sopa, 22 May 2013 - 12:28.

[Linus27]

Good reading, some great comparisons in this threads I wouldn't have thought of.

I like a lot:
Button - G.Hill. Another one I would propose, not mentioned here, is Emerson Fittipaldi. Arguably a smooth driver too, also their pole-to-win ratio is similar. Both stronger in race pace than quali.
I found Vettel - Stewart comparison interesting by one guy. Stewart also won 3 titles in a team built around him.
Raikkonen has been compared so several single-time champions. Rindt and Jones I like a lot. Jones had a bad comeback in a crappy team though, that's the difference.
Peterson could be either Hamilton or Raikkonen, minus the championship of course.

Maldonado - Brambilla. Awesome match.
Grosjean can't say for sure. Depends on the career. Patrese is brought in here, but if Grosjean wins championship one day, he could rather be Scheckter. What about Depailler? Now I don't remember much about DP's career except he was considered good in the wet, but he got a good car pretty early in his career and always remained a second-tier driver with podiums and a couple of wins.

Bottas start is like Hakkinen's, who had a crappy Lotus in 1991 in which you can't score points without attrition.

Kovalainen - Johansson. Another awesome comparison in this thread.
Heidfeld - Brundle. Self-explanatory. Another one would be Warwick.
What about di Resta - Blundell? At times got some decent results, but driver is not rated highly.
Sutil - Mass or H-J Stuck? Germans under the radar, though Mass somehow got a race win.
Trulli - Arnoux. Gave a run for the money of a future multiple world champion (Alonso, Prost), but fell out with the team and was sacked. Next season was promising (Arnoux in title contention in 83, Toyota was good in 05), but after that career fell off-track. Was famous for his one-lap speed.
Kobayashi - Alesi. I dunno why this came to my head. Attractive flamboyant driving style. But Koba is like mini-Alesi. Career was much shorter and Koba didn't quite leave the mark Alesi did. Still neither lived up to promise.

Perez could be another Alesi, perhaps even a better fit than Kobayashi. Three podiums in Sauber last year. How many did Alesi get in 1990 in Tyrrell, I think two? Subsequently hired by a top team, but Ferrari was rubbish in 1991 as is McLaren in 2013.

I don't know, I don't see that much Alesi in Hulkenberg. He is more like Rosberg, Hakkinen, Raikkonen or Heidfeld depending on how career pans out. Silently does his business and without such a flamboyant driving style.

With Alesi being my all time favourite driver I can see the Kobayashi comparison 100% and I really liked Kobayashi as a driver. Perez I can see a little but a bit to early. He's not as reckless and flamboyant as Alesi but the results may end up the same.

[RSNS]

Never?

Both debuting in a top team, against a teammate that has been on top the last few years. Both being very fast, fighting for the title
Second season, last years driver one left the team. A talent (but still an unknown) joined the team. Both won the championship.
Third season. Team stays the same. Rules change massively. Both teams fail to make a car anywhere close to the top. While Hamilton got two wins, where JV got none. The 09 season was more changing than the 98 season, which had three drivers only, having chance for wins (with Belgium as the special one). Oh, btw, both in 98 and 09, the Winner in Belgium, took the only win for his team that year, both cases it was the WDC in JV & LH's debut season, both seasons JV & LH beat the WDC from their debut season with one point (JV beat Hill 21 to 20, LH beat Kimi 49 to 48). Both teams ended 3rd as well.

There the similarities stops. As JV left for the Brackley based team in his 4th season. While LH waited until his 7th.

However, the three first season, are as similar as it can be I think.

Yes, very right, but perhaps I thought Hamilton was a better driver than J. Villeneuve? Or perhaps as I usually compare driver styles (Hamilton being a smoothie an JV not so much so) the undeniable similarities you and Noikee point out had never occurred to me!

[Jimisgod]

With Alesi being my all time favourite driver I can see the Kobayashi comparison 100% and I really liked Kobayashi as a driver. Perez I can see a little but a bit to early. He's not as reckless and flamboyant as Alesi but the results may end up the same.

Perez is really young and he kind of matches Button in the races now. That is hard given how many years Button has been at McLaren. For all he is worth, Lewis was never too far ahead of Jenson over a season. So I think talk of Perez having a disappointing career is premature.

I think Perez is a unique driver thus far, slightly behind the big four - Vettel and Hamilton had a meteoric rise, and not far behind was Kimi. Alonso was a slower rise, but his 2nd season cemented his potential. However, Perez had a better start than Rosberg.

I think he is 50/50 as to whether he can break into the top echelon - or become a driver at Button and Webber level, good for a few chances at the WDC and a number of wins, but not always consistently there.