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IndyCar Iowa Cornholio 250


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Poll: Why not Sato? (43 member(s) have cast votes)

Why not Sato?

  1. Why not? (9 votes [20.93%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.93%

  2. Why not? (5 votes [11.63%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.63%

  3. Why not? (9 votes [20.93%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.93%

  4. Why not? (16 votes [37.21%])

    Percentage of vote: 37.21%

  5. Why not? (4 votes [9.30%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.30%

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#51 muramasa

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 12:14

Wow, your jimmies really are rustled. I personally have never made a Kamikaze/banzai remark though. I am a big Sato fan and he is the only person I pull for in IndyCar. I always post picks of the driver, and the comic sans is something I started just for fun when I did the OP for Sao Paulo.

I only speak for myself though. I am sure the rest of them are the intentional bigots you make them out to be.

i c, sorry about that.
I didnt have any specific persons to pick and point at in my mind, but just overall atmosphere/phenomenon. Mostly i dont feel offended, but sometimes i'm not sure if it's fun or mocking. Hard to describe but just cannot deny there certainly is the moment fine line is crossed at times, but at the same time same thing happens for any drivers.
Anyway I dont mean to stop having fun.


sounds a tad overreactionary

on Sato bit I admit to quite a degree.

but not banzai/kamikaze part.



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#52 SR388

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 12:16

I can understand about being upset about the kamikaze/banzai thing because that could be objectionable, which is why I refrain from using it.

But to insinuate that those of us who cheer him on by typing his name and posting pictures during these threads are mocking him is infuriating. As someone who has been following him since his Jordan days, someone telling me how to root on my driver is pure and utter bullpoop.


Edit. I didn't read murimasa post before I typed this.

Edited by SR388, 20 June 2013 - 12:27.


#53 SR388

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 12:49

Also, lets be kind to murimasa. I have seen him post before. He is a kind and honest man, I am sure he felt a bit unsure about where our hearts were at and he felt compelled to speak his mind. I have called out things here when they didn't sit well with me.

We need to hear from people like murimasa to let us know if we are saying stuff that could be offensive. I had an issue a few years ago where I called a player on the LA Clippers a "nancy" in a Facebook post. I never thought anything of it until I had a gay friend point out that the word I used was a homophobic slur, and could be offensive. I felt like a real heel that day. I was glad my friend spoke up though, I would have walked around offending folks without knowing why. That's the worst. If I am going to offend someone, I want to know how and why I am offending someone.

Edited by SR388, 20 June 2013 - 14:59.


#54 Red17

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 12:49

@muramasa
If you have any doubts about people genuinly cheering Sato go see the threads on the Indy 500 2012 and his victory this year. It's just that Sato is too human compared to some gray coorporate robots, so we have to hug these few humans left.

#55 Deluxx

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 13:05

Yeah, but why not Sato?

#56 PayasYouRace

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 13:34

Sato mocking is reaching disgusting level now.

Pathetic.

Also people seem to not understand banzai/kamikaze is pretty much racist remark. Banzai is expression of joy and praise, and kamikaze refers to "benevolent wind", an expression in ancient poems. If SoL is used to mean slave trade, elizabeth to mean exploitation、 matador to mean genocide, ferrari to mean fascism etc then it's inappropriate and surely people would feel unhappy. It's the same.


I believe it's been pointed out to you before that the meaning of those words in English have diverged from the original meanings. They're part of the English language now and they mean what they mean. On this board Takuma is very popular and those words are not being used in a negative way as regards to him or his racing.

#57 greenman

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 13:36

Stereotypes are fun until it concerns you or where you're from. It's weird we haven't had somebody from Iowa in this thread complaining about all the corn jokes.


Seriously though, I don't know many people on here that wouldn't be fans of Sato. And those that aren't seem quiet about it.
Also, "kamikaze" seem to be used instead of "ballsy" (both negative or positive ballsy). Not that it is what it actually means. But, you know, "idiot" also originally meant a person without interest in public affairs (or a "private person"). It is what it is.

Edited by greenman, 20 June 2013 - 13:39.


#58 Prost1997T

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 13:44

Seriously though, I don't know many people on here that wouldn't be fans of Sato. And those that aren't seem quiet about it.
Also, "kamikaze" seem to be used instead of "ballsy" (both negative or positive ballsy). Not that it is what it actually means. But, you know, "idiot" also originally meant a person without interest in public affairs (or a "private person"). It is what it is.


Thing is, years of dive-bombing moves and crashes in multiple racing series earned Sato that "kamikaze" reputation.

I mean come on, a driver that gets slagged off left and right for being unable to pass on track makes a cleaner pass than him here, and gets taken out for her trouble:



This year is a breakout season for him in Indycar, but I'm also concerned about the perception this creates of the series (which was also true to an extent during the CART era).

Edited by Prost1997T, 20 June 2013 - 13:44.


#59 muramasa

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 14:31

Also, lets be kind to murimasa. I have seen him post before. He is a kind and honest man, I am sure he felt a bit unsure about where our hearts were at an he felt compelled to speak his mind. I have called out things here when they didn't sit well with me.

We need to hear from people like murimasa to let us know if we are saying stuff that could be offensive. I had an issue a few years ago where I called a player on the LA Clippers a "nancy" in a Facebook post. I never thought anything of it until I had a gay friend point out that the word I used was a homophobic slur, and could be offensive. I felt like a real heel that day. I was glad my friend spoke up though, I would have walked around offending folks without knowing why. That's the worst. If I am going to offend someone, I want to know how and why I am offending someone.

Thanks for that.
I have to reiterate that I enjoy this Sato thing, and plz dont stop expressing support and enjoyment in the way you like.

Sure I sometimes come across remarks that's obviously meant to dis (not logically criticize) Sato, but I dont bother to remember who it was and dont really get irritated by that.
To look back myself and explain why I felt annoyed this time, it's because no one seems to get the point of me posting pics to explain and imply what kamikaze/banzai actually is and why it's inappropiate, and instead thread was turning into teasing about pics.
Then I quickly connected that with Sato, which was silly association/generalization and mistake on my part.

My point is solely about kamikaze/banzai, not about Sato and spoiling the fun, so apologize for that and correct myself.



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#60 muramasa

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 14:44

I believe it's been pointed out to you before that the meaning of those words in English have diverged from the original meanings. They're part of the English language now and they mean what they mean. On this board Takuma is very popular and those words are not being used in a negative way as regards to him or his racing.

That is exactly what I'm questioning and pointing out as wrong and inappropriate.
I know very well where originated and how transformed. Most Japanese do. Also I know the terms are too widespread and common, and no matter what I do makes absolutely no difference. But I just cannot help it and want to make efforts, however tiny and useless, to explain what they really are and why inappropriate.
Is it that hard to get? If, for example, Asian people used Elizabeth or Thames or whatever as terms to mean sth like brutal exploitation/invasion/ruling or whatever, would you say "oh, it's part of asian language, they mean what they mean"?


#61 HaydenFan

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 15:03

that's very poor excuse, sorry.
I know things well.

I know more people cheer Sato. But can you really deny he's being made clown here (not just here but many other board tho)? Those who just shout "SATO!" and put stupid pics or joke about it really cheer Sato? I doubt it.

and dont tell an obvious lie about banzai/kamikaze. Such thing as "racing senes" doesnt exist. Why did you put pic of crashing car to be refered by banzai/kamikaze in the first place if they're terms of affection then? They are NEVER used to describe "beautiful pass" or "excellent battle". No way. They ONLY means negatives, mostly describes idiotic, suicidal, brain-fade, failed conducts, in WHATEVER context. At best, in "racing context", they are used to describe rather forceful/risky way of overtaking (late braking, dive inside and squeeze pass), even then it's not positive. Dont even need to reconfirm once again or be told about such basic thing. I know it, you know it and everyone knows it.


I just feel this is a situation where differences in languages are causes difficulty. In racing terms when making a "banzai" or "kamikae" pass do usually mean negative connotations. "That driver made a kamikaze overtake attempt and took out the driver in front of him." Yes, it has just as negative connotations as what it is referred to 70 odd years ago.

Not to provide an excuse, and while I know English is your second language, you should realize this language sucks. We do not have very many subtle words to describe things. And again, while it doesn't intend to offend (just the completely odd coincidence that the driver the term is being used in this specific situation is Japanese), it is used to just describe something. Instead of saying, "That driver was a complete a$$hole who took out his three rivals going into the chicane," we will say, "That driver made a banzai pass that did not succeed."

In some cases though, the term, "banzai" is used to describe a crazy overtake that should not have worked. Think, Alex Zanardi at the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca on Bryan Herta. Just about every overtake by Montoya in F1. And because we are talking about Takuma Sato, Hinchcliffe's overtake of him at Sao Paulo this year. Shouldn't have happened after Sato's potentially questionable driving on the backstretch during the last few laps.

Is he being made fun of? Hell no. Coming from a country where over the top exuberance is commonplace, Sato should feel pretty happy about the support he gets from the rest of the world towards him.

Edited by HaydenFan, 20 June 2013 - 15:15.


#62 PayasYouRace

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 15:12

That is exactly what I'm questioning and pointing out as wrong and inappropriate.
I know very well where originated and how transformed. Most Japanese do. Also I know the terms are too widespread and common, and no matter what I do makes absolutely no difference. But I just cannot help it and want to make efforts, however tiny and useless, to explain what they really are and why inappropriate.
Is it that hard to get? If, for example, Asian people used Elizabeth or Thames or whatever as terms to mean sth like brutal exploitation/invasion/ruling or whatever, would you say "oh, it's part of asian language, they mean what they mean"?


I wouldn't dream of going to another language forum and telling them how to use their language, even if they have adapted some of our words. It happens. Plus what you're describing happens enough within the English language too. Ask anyone named Richard or William.

#63 Roscoe

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 15:39

Well this urinated on what are usually the more fun threads on the board.

Anyway, go..................Tony Kanaan? He's an IndyCar thing right?

Also, here is the official race celebratory drink:

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Edited by Roscoe, 20 June 2013 - 15:40.


#64 PayasYouRace

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 15:46

Anyway, go..................Tony Kanaan? He's an IndyCar thing right?


Apparently he won a race this year. Which one was that? :p

#65 Roscoe

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 15:47

The Rubens Barichello Bromance 250?

#66 Crazy Canuck

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 17:02

I just feel this is a situation where differences in languages are causes difficulty. In racing terms when making a "banzai" or "kamikae" pass do usually mean negative connotations. "That driver made a kamikaze overtake attempt and took out the driver in front of him." Yes, it has just as negative connotations as what it is referred to 70 odd years ago.

Not to provide an excuse, and while I know English is your second language, you should realize this language sucks. We do not have very many subtle words to describe things. And again, while it doesn't intend to offend (just the completely odd coincidence that the driver the term is being used in this specific situation is Japanese), it is used to just describe something. Instead of saying, "That driver was a complete a$$hole who took out his three rivals going into the chicane," we will say, "That driver made a banzai pass that did not succeed."

In some cases though, the term, "banzai" is used to describe a crazy overtake that should not have worked. Think, Alex Zanardi at the Corkscrew at Laguna Seca on Bryan Herta. Just about every overtake by Montoya in F1. And because we are talking about Takuma Sato, Hinchcliffe's overtake of him at Sao Paulo this year. Shouldn't have happened after Sato's potentially questionable driving on the backstretch during the last few laps.

Is he being made fun of? Hell no. Coming from a country where over the top exuberance is commonplace, Sato should feel pretty happy about the support he gets from the rest of the world towards him.


Great post :up:

CC


#67 HaydenFan

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 17:21

I strike for the case to be closed on the matter of language. I find no wrongdoing and just a mistaken case of accidental confusion.

Posted Image

Andrew, you failed at on thing in the OP. I still do not get the heat race platform. My understanding is we have 3 races. It is broken up based on practice times. Combined practice times or from final practice? I know it is not like the local short tracks or USAC (or whatever travel series that uses them) in that nobody is not going to DNQ for the main race. But who goes to what heat? Is it just the grid broken into 3 small races and then assembled back together for the main on Sunday?

Explain!

Edited by HaydenFan, 20 June 2013 - 17:22.


#68 Andrew Hope

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:04

For the record, my little bio for Sato was a reference to the fact that commentators in today's ludicrous politically-correct world that believes mentioning race = racism have to tip-toe around him, since he often does crazy pass attempts and other awesome things (and my f*ck do we all love him for it). I was making a joke that commentators have to think of things other than the obvious terms to describe him, since no doubt people would get pissy at a Japanese driver being referred to as a kamikaze. And just for the hell of it, I know an awful lot about WW2 and happen to respect and begrudgingly admire kamikaze pilots: the western world gets doe-eyed about self-sacrifice and hands out Medals of Honor and Victoria Crosses for nearly everyone who gave up their life in a sufficiently-obvious way, whilst for a large part of the Japanese air force, that was simply what you did. I happen to think, indoctrinated or not, that is incredibly ballsy. No one ever gets butthurt when you stereotype their country or their people in a positive way, so when you do it in a negative way (which no one here ever does) it's hard to get too upset about it.

I strike for the case to be closed on the matter of language. I find no wrongdoing and just a mistaken case of accidental confusion.

Posted Image

Andrew, you failed at on thing in the OP. I still do not get the heat race platform. My understanding is we have 3 races. It is broken up based on practice times. Combined practice times or from final practice? I know it is not like the local short tracks or USAC (or whatever travel series that uses them) in that nobody is not going to DNQ for the main race. But who goes to what heat? Is it just the grid broken into 3 small races and then assembled back together for the main on Sunday?

Explain!


First things first: dat spotter guide is out.

And I didn't put the quali format in the OP because I was reaching War & Peace dimensions already and there's no way I could explain it in less than five sentences. Here is the deal:

Positions in the three heat races will be determined by single-car, single-lap qualifying (4 p.m. ET) on the .875-mile, variably-banked oval. A blind draw will determine the qualifying order. Practice (11:45 a.m.-1 p.m. ET) and qualifying also are featured on indycar.com and INDYCAR 13 with Timing & Scoring and the IMS Radio Network call.

Here's the format, which adds the lure of bonus points – from nine points for the Verizon P1 Award winner and descending by one point each position to three points for seventh-eighth, two points for ninth and 10th and one point for 11th and 12th:

Race 1 -- Will consist of the even-numbered positions, starting with position 8 from single-car qualifying. The results of Race 1 shall determine the even-numbered positions in the starting field, starting with position 12. The top two finishers will transfer to Race 3 and start in positions 8 and 10.

Race 2 -- Will consist of the odd-numbered positions, starting with position 7 from single-car qualifying. The results of Race 2 shall determine the odd-numbered positions in the starting field, starting with position 11. The top two finishers will transfer to Race 3 and start in positions 7 and 9.

Race 3 -- Will consist of positions 1 through 6 from single-car qualifying plus the first- and second-place finishers from Races 1 and 2 to determine the pole winner and the first five rows of the starting grid.


In other words, there a couple vowels and some consonants.

Posted Image

It is easier than it looks.

  • All cars do a single lap, in order of random draw
  • Fastest 6 go directly to Heat #3
  • Cars 8/10/12 etc. from the single laps go to Heat #1
  • Cars 7/9/11 etc. from the single laps go to Heat #2
  • Top two cars from each heat race join the six that went directly to Heat #3
  • Heat #3 finishing order determines the top 10 grid spots for Sunday's race

Edited by Andrew Hope, 20 June 2013 - 18:12.


#69 PayasYouRace

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:22

So coming in the top two of the heats means you have to do an extra race. Is that OK in the sense of engine mileage and tyre allocations and all that sort of thing?

#70 Deluxx

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:22

Oh my god that diagram.

#71 muramasa

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:23

I just feel this is a situation where differences in languages are causes difficulty.

no it's not about language. it's more about unfortunate proliferation of misconception (altho i get rest of your point).
my point in short, plz stop using kamikaze/banzai at all, as it does not mean like that at all, in fact derogatory so the terms, or that part at least, should be eliminated from worldwide dictionary (not aspiring that actually as stated before, i know it makes no difference).(banzai can be used as substitute for "congrats" of course, but cannot think of proper case for kamikaze="benevolant/divine wind")


I wouldn't dream of going to another language forum and telling them how to use their language, even if they have adapted some of our words. It happens. Plus what you're describing happens enough within the English language too. Ask anyone named Richard or William.

You think I'm here just to tell you that?
I said i make no difference and explained my idea, hence It's not about what is general anymore but specifically about your personal attitude, and that is your answer? Dont know about richard or william or corn thing, but if perceived as derogatory, u just leave it? So why you bother to be here then. havent you corrected anyone before? even tho your opinion makes almost no difference to motorsport as a whole?
If you noticed or get corrected your misunderstandings (however common), just learn it. What is so hard about that?

Of course Japan isnt innocent at all. For example in Japan, one type of prostitution facilities used to be commonly called literaly "Turkey Bath" for whatever reasons and development for quite long time. In 80s government finally banned the naming, and it all started from an objection by one Turkish student studying in Japan at that time (no way to mean i'm trying to be one, just in case). Yet, the naming and notion widely remained until around turn of century.
we have lots of wrong usage of english such as "back mirror (=rearview mirror)", "side-brake (=hand brake)", "salary man (=office worker)" etc but those are totally harmless, and none inappropriate at all (at least cannot think of any offhand). Also I heard there used to be wide misunderstanding that Nokia was Japanese firm, but such is nothing more than funny story too. If kamikaze/banzai is same sort as that, i wouldnt dream of doing this.

I have personal experiences outside Japan that there's subconscious stereotypes that Japanese are sort of heartless and cruel, and I felt I'm judged that way, then wondered why and after observations realized that image of WWII, those samurai movies etc and notion coming from kamikaze/banzai is hugely affecting the perception of ordinary Japanese and the stereotype (another one is "jp is weird", but that's yet another story). And it's not limited to English only (Also english is becoming common language, which you seem to somewhat ignore. "Going to another language forum"? exclusive when convenient huh. such attitude will take u nowhere in this day of frequent translation and communication). I had discussed it in chatting with non-japanese guys and at times even told them off if they're friends or someone i judged to have no problem to do so. I'm not doing this for no reason.
Same applies to Japanese drivers overall, which is observable on this board. For example Nakajima jr was just average in everything (speed, consistency, and rate of accident) yet he was considered widely as crash-prone. Look at people's comments on last year's Lemans 24h thread when he collided with Deltawing, my point is perfectly proven there.

Last to note, I'm no way the only nor the first Japanese having such experience and thinking like that, needless to say.


Anyways sorry to derail the thread badly. I made my points enough, and gladly several people cared my opinion and understood my point, that's the main thing.



#72 greenman

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:53

When Sakamoto's Ue wo muite arukou became well known in the West, it was known under the name "Sukiyaki". That's more offensive to the Japanese if you ask me. But it's a similar logic I think.

As I said about stereotypes. Everybody does it (just look around this forum, if not, look elsewhere on the internet), but people will only get offended when it concerns them, their nationality. I've had a share of presumptions towards me based on where I live, but it was never really done in any harm. Just a bit of cluelessness and going by popular misconceptions. Nothing racist, nothing xenophobic.

Alright now let's set aside this stereotype talk and focus on the race in corn state.

#73 Andrew Hope

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 18:54

So coming in the top two of the heats means you have to do an extra race. Is that OK in the sense of engine mileage and tyre allocations and all that sort of thing?


I think so, the races are very short. The equivalent of at a normal race practice someone saying "I need another ten laps to get the front wing set just right". I don't think it's much of a problem.

Edited by Andrew Hope, 20 June 2013 - 18:54.


#74 jonpollak

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 19:02

I apploove this thlead...
Jp

#75 Jim Thurman

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 19:30

Actually the format isn't that different from some short track formats. Most short track open wheel formats are progressive (IOW, top 4 to the A-Main, next 4 to the B) and lined up based on qualifying. Usually four heats, so that's different, but an odd-even breakdown is common. Some short track formats have what is known as "Final Heat", taking the top finishers from the heat races. Then there is the "Trophy Dash". Usually, that's the four fastest qualifiers, but there also have been "Heat Winner Dash" races...if I have to explain that one, well... :lol: Sounds as if they've done a modified version combining these two types of events into a "Third Heat".

The whole thing would work a lot better if they had 32 cars :wave:

#76 greenman

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 19:51

It looks needlessly complicated but it actually makes sense. BTW, if they're really only doing one lap in that first part, it's gonna be over in half an hour.

#77 HaydenFan

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 20:23

It looks needlessly complicated but it actually makes sense. BTW, if they're really only doing one lap in that first part, it's gonna be over in half an hour.


The 1 lap qualifying for the heats will be quick. But nothing wrong with that. Qualifying can be a bit of a bore on ovals.

#78 Andrew Hope

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 20:52

It's a bit like super pole, only with a race afterwards. Which is good, we all know super pole qualifying is gangster.

#79 Lemnpiper

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 22:32

Actually the format isn't that different from some short track formats. Most short track open wheel formats are progressive (IOW, top 4 to the A-Main, next 4 to the B) and lined up based on qualifying. Usually four heats, so that's different, but an odd-even breakdown is common. Some short track formats have what is known as "Final Heat", taking the top finishers from the heat races. Then there is the "Trophy Dash". Usually, that's the four fastest qualifiers, but there also have been "Heat Winner Dash" races...if I have to explain that one, well... :lol: Sounds as if they've done a modified version combining these two types of events into a "Third Heat".

The whole thing would work a lot better if they had 32 cars :wave:



Actually if you watch a broadcast of any AMA dirt track grand national they basically use that format to set their main entry lineup. Once you see it done a time or two it's real easy to understand.

N ow with this 3rd heat idea at Iowa , you could get soemone determined to take the pole while other back off since starting anywhere else in the top 10 on an oval really doesnt have an effect on how you would run the overal main race.

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#80 Disgrace

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Posted 20 June 2013 - 22:34

These consecutive IndyCar weekends are going to have quite the withdrawal effect.

#81 Andrew Hope

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 00:48

Yeah, only a few back-to-backs left, though still 2 doubleheaders.

07 July - Pocono
13 July - Toronto
14 July - Toronto
-
04 August - Mid Ohio
25 August - Sonoma
-
01 September - Baltimore
-
05 October - Houston
06 October - Houston
19 October - Fontana

Edited by Andrew Hope, 21 June 2013 - 00:48.


#82 Deluxx

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 01:06

Woo can't wait for Poke-a-no's.

In before indycar site crashes for quali

#83 OvDrone

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 12:54

Posted Image


KILL IT WITH FIRE

#84 Deluxx

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 13:18

Rofl. I literally think that is the most overly complicated thing I've ever seen in racing

Edited by Deluxx, 21 June 2013 - 13:18.


#85 senna da silva

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 13:31

What's the distance on those Q races?

#86 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 13:52

Odd that there's a month gap at the end of the season.

#87 HaydenFan

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 14:13

What's the distance on those Q races?


50 laps of a 7/8 mile circuit. So 43.75 miles. No pit stops or any real major drop off the tires (unless they have the Texas rubber).

#88 senna da silva

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 14:28

50 laps of a 7/8 mile circuit. So 43.75 miles. No pit stops or any real major drop off the tires (unless they have the Texas rubber).


:up:

#89 Jim Thurman

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 15:31

Actually if you watch a broadcast of any AMA dirt track grand national they basically use that format to set their main entry lineup. Once you see it done a time or two it's real easy to understand.

N ow with this 3rd heat idea at Iowa , you could get soemone determined to take the pole while other back off since starting anywhere else in the top 10 on an oval really doesnt have an effect on how you would run the overal main race.

:up: This. You know Paul, it's been so long since I saw one on TV during the glory days of the true Grand National champion, that I forgot. I also plead to a 4-wheel mindset in replying. Thanks for the reminder.

Guys, it really isn't that hard. Like I've written other times, you guys need to get out of the house more often and go to your local short track :D ...though I can't promise the same level of racing as it was in the past (I post this not as an old guy waxing nostalgic or "today's racing sucks", but simply as a true observation and disclaimer. I don't want anyone here doing it and coming back with "Well, that sucked" :D).

#90 HaydenFan

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 16:01

Yeah, but at least the local tracks in Michigan I've been to recently, have inversions of grid rows and blind draw for the pole winner. The fast guys always seem to start about halfway down the grid, making for some good racing (recently seen former NASCAR Trucks champ Johnny Benson blast his way from about 14th in a 20 car field to top 5 in about 20 laps before spinning out and only managing to get up to 10th or 11th, even though he won fast time by a few tenths).

After seeing the diagram of death, it really isn't as confusing as it seems. Pretty simply system. Not a big fan of making the 3rd heat a second race to a couple of drivers though. More track time, but also being in a race setting, means a bigger chance at crashing. Although, I do not recall anyone crashing last year.

Edited by HaydenFan, 21 June 2013 - 16:05.


#91 Deluxx

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 16:21

Guys, it really isn't that hard. Like I've written other times, you guys need to get out of the house more often and go to your local short track :D ...though I can't promise the same level of racing as it was in the past (I post this not as an old guy waxing nostalgic or "today's racing sucks", but simply as a true observation and disclaimer. I don't want anyone here doing it and coming back with "Well, that sucked" :D).


Yeah but that diagram is crap at explaining it rofl

#92 OvDrone

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 16:33

Yeah, I got the gist of the qualifying process and I think it's rather cool. And although I understood that diagram it is still bats^&t.

#93 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 16:50

Yeah the diagram is less intuitive than a written explanation.

#94 Andrew Hope

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 19:40

For an unprecedented 400th race in a row, Dario Franchitti has lost the coin flip to Scott Dixon and will run the Ganassi third jersey this weekend.

Posted Image

#95 jonpollak

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 21:59

I heard Bia is bringing Bardahl into IndyCar !!!
Jp

#96 SR388

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:17

For an unprecedented 400th race in a row, Dario Franchitti has lost the coin flip to Scott Dixon and will run the Ganassi third jersey this weekend.

Posted Image


I hope Dario's motor blows in every session.

#97 Jim Thurman

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:40

Yeah, but at least the local tracks in Michigan I've been to recently, have inversions of grid rows and blind draw for the pole winner. The fast guys always seem to start about halfway down the grid, making for some good racing (recently seen former NASCAR Trucks champ Johnny Benson blast his way from about 14th in a 20 car field to top 5 in about 20 laps before spinning out and only managing to get up to 10th or 11th, even though he won fast time by a few tenths).

After seeing the diagram of death, it really isn't as confusing as it seems. Pretty simply system. Not a big fan of making the 3rd heat a second race to a couple of drivers though. More track time, but also being in a race setting, means a bigger chance at crashing. Although, I do not recall anyone crashing last year.

Yeah, there are plenty of formats. Full invert was common (from the 1940s on!). with fastest at the back of heats or even the feature. Inverting based on blind draw has been pretty common for around 25 years or so now, particularly on paved short tracks.

I used to attend a track that had a handicap system based on performance in the last 3 races. The better you did, the further back you started. One of the fascinating things about auto racing is the almost innumerable variations.

I still wonder though...how many others here aside from you, Lemnpiper and I have even attended short track races?

#98 Jim Thurman

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 22:41

Yeah but that diagram is crap at explaining it rofl

Blame the OP :lol:

#99 Andrew Hope

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 23:21

Sorry to say this, but I am by a wide margin one of the dumbest people watching car racing and I had no trouble following that graph. I'm glad I nicked that from IndyCar's site though, and that I aborted my plans for a "Who should I cheer for?" IndyCar flow chart/infographic (all roads led eventually to Sato). Perhaps for the next thread.

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#100 Andrew Hope

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Posted 21 June 2013 - 23:22

Odd that there's a month gap at the end of the season.


Wasn't there plans for a race in Italy this year? Maybe that explains 34 days of nothing between Baltimore and Houston.