But Heidfeld was never a contender, he just kept scoring a decent ammount of points consistently. Kubica snatched a win and kept getting in Ferrari's and McLaren's way as often as possible. It's different enough, IMO.
1 votes
Best of the nearly-men
Started by
Atreiu
, Jun 27 2013 20:50
70 replies to this topic
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#52
InfectedPumpkin
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Posted 28 June 2013 - 15:51
Kubica.
Hands down.
Hands down.
#53
HaydenFan
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Posted 28 June 2013 - 16:07
Massa in those first couple of years at Ferrari looked like he could replace Schumacher and continue the Ferrari dominance of the 2000's.
#54
Alfisti
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Posted 28 June 2013 - 16:24
Almost exactly the same can be said for Webber's time with Heidfeld. Truth is we don't know what Kubica did or did not have as he never sat in a genuine race winning car for a season.
But Heidfeld was never a contender, he just kept scoring a decent ammount of points consistently. Kubica snatched a win and kept getting in Ferrari's and McLaren's way as often as possible. It's different enough, IMO.
#56
Kingshark
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 00:15
If you want to go by history, then the correct answer would be Stirling Moss, followed by Carlos Reuteman. My fellow countryman Gilles Villeneuve also deserves an honorable mention.
#58
DarthWillie
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 06:39
Didier Pironi 1982, second 4 points behind rosberg dispite missing 6 races that year
#59
SpaMaster
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 07:01
Kubica is the best in that list.
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#60
Lord_Shaitan
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 07:42
From the list above - Kubica and it's no brainer for me.
After 16 of 18 races he was only 12 points behind the leader when Raikkonen in the same stage in 2007 was 17 points behind.sure Kubica made no mistakes but he also took advantage of the outsider position. He had no pressure on him to deliver....he finished 4th for heaven's sake he wasn't even close to winning it
#62
MortenF1
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 07:50
Between DC, Webber and Berger probably, for me.
#63
Spa One
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 07:56
Kubica for me.
Special mention to Heinz Harald Frentzen, who had a corker of a year during 1999
Special mention to Heinz Harald Frentzen, who had a corker of a year during 1999
Edited by Spa One, 29 June 2013 - 08:00.
#64
Junky
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 08:20
People tend to forget that after the win in Canada 08, BMW just stopped the development of that season's car to concentrate on their (horrendous) 2009 machine. And at the end of the year that cost the title to Kubica, which made a phenomenal year.
#65
InfectedPumpkin
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 08:36
Since 2008 Kubica was the best driver on the grid alongside Alonso and Hamilton. Hard to say which one of them was best, though. Ask Alonso or Hamilton.
In 2008 he could win title if not BMW bad managment. Then In 2009 he had worst car on the grid, no doubt about that. And 2010 - perfect season. Nobody could do better in that car for sure, simply perfection. I still can't believe how he drove his car on Monaco streets fighting head to head against superior Red Bull cars. Madness!
In 2008 he could win title if not BMW bad managment. Then In 2009 he had worst car on the grid, no doubt about that. And 2010 - perfect season. Nobody could do better in that car for sure, simply perfection. I still can't believe how he drove his car on Monaco streets fighting head to head against superior Red Bull cars. Madness!
#66
motorhead
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 08:41
For me it has to be Kubica. Where other drivers made lots of errors, he was fast and consistent throughout the season. He just didn't have the car to win the championship. All of those errors by the main championship contenders is the only reason he was anywhere close with the car he had.
One season? For me he had one great and one good season but he was also beaten by Heidfeld 2 out of 3 seasons at BMW. Kubica has almost legend like status for some people, but Massa is a guy who almost won the WDC
#67
joshb
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 08:55
One season? For me he had one great and one good season but he was also beaten by Heidfeld 2 out of 3 seasons at BMW. Kubica has almost legend like status for some people, but Massa is a guy who almost won the WDC
I sort of agree. He was marginally better than Nick Heidfeld but beat him well in the 1 year people took notice (2008) and hammered a woeful Petrov in his rookie year... very difficult to decide. It'll still be a big 'what if' because of his accident and the team having a competitive car from 2011 to now and Ferrari also going well but I can't be fully committed to say he was the man on a relatively small sample size... not saying he was bad mind....
#68
ArkZ
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 08:58
One season? For me he had one great and one good season but he was also beaten by Heidfeld 2 out of 3 seasons at BMW. Kubica has almost legend like status for some people, but Massa is a guy who almost won the WDC
He was beaten in his rookie season, if you go through his career he became better with every season and probably not yet reach his prime, not by accident Alonso said that he was the best driver in the grid.
Edited by ArkZ, 29 June 2013 - 08:59.
#69
garoidb
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 09:00
One season? For me he had one great and one good season but he was also beaten by Heidfeld 2 out of 3 seasons at BMW. Kubica has almost legend like status for some people, but Massa is a guy who almost won the WDC
As well as almost winning the WDC, Massa has had an impressive line up of team-mates over the years, including four world champions and, of course, the above mentioned Nick Heidfeld. He has actually done well, and would have deserved the WDC in 2008. If he had not come back after 2009, there would have been the allure of unfulfilled promise, not knowing how good he could have been, like there is for Kubica now. That is why it is difficult to call Kubica a "nearly man" in the same sense as Webber or Massa, because he did not get the opportunity to complete a full racing career with all the possibilities of disappointment that brings. I think he had huge potential, but there have been several who looked that way for a few seasons and then did not quite deliver over time.
Edited by garoidb, 29 June 2013 - 09:16.
#70
Nemo1965
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 09:10
1. Stirling Moss. Only lost his world title because he protested against the disqualication of his main rival, Hawthorne... who subsequently beat him by one point.
2. Ickx. Was on his way to the world title, when he had a, lets say, fortunate mechanical failure that gave the title posthumously to Jochen Rindt. Ickx always stated that he did not want to win the title.
3. Didier Pironi. Was on his way to the world title, when he chose at Hockenheim to drive very fast in the pouring rain, in a meaningless session. Broke both is legs, season ended. Still finished 2nd in the standings.
I don't want to offend other posters, but I don't think Coulthard, Kubica or Webber came nearly as nearly as Moss, Ickx or Pironi.
#71
garoidb
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Posted 29 June 2013 - 09:26
1. Stirling Moss. Only lost his world title because he protested against the disqualication of his main rival, Hawthorne... who subsequently beat him by one point.
2. Ickx. Was on his way to the world title, when he had a, lets say, fortunate mechanical failure that gave the title posthumously to Jochen Rindt. Ickx always stated that he did not want to win the title.
3. Didier Pironi. Was on his way to the world title, when he chose at Hockenheim to drive very fast in the pouring rain, in a meaningless session. Broke both is legs, season ended. Still finished 2nd in the standings.
I don't want to offend other posters, but I don't think Coulthard, Kubica or Webber came nearly as nearly as Moss, Ickx or Pironi.
Pironi is an interesting one. Ferrari only entered one driver for the Austrian and Swiss Grands Prix and Tambay did not start the Swiss one. Keke Rosberg came second and first in those races. They also had three races with only one driver after Villeneuve was killed. Surely there was someone available who could have done a reasonable job for them, even on a race by race basis?
