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Horrible 2014 sound [merged]


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#1951 Scotracer

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 10:40

Turbo engines in the eighties had somewhere around 700-750 hp max in race conditions. The current PU's have already more than that on full power.

 

In 1986-87 they had more than that in race trim. They were closer to 850BHP in race trim.



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#1952 ExFlagMan

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 10:46

But did it make the racing any better - coz I don't remember it being very close in most races. They might have had that power available but couldn't use it without either blowing up or running out of fuel.

#1953 saudoso

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 11:38

In 1986-87 they had more than that in race trim. They were closer to 850BHP in race trim.

88 around 700HP with a 155L limit, 116KG by today's measuring system.



#1954 saudoso

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 11:39

But did it make the racing any better - coz I don't remember it being very close in most races. They might have had that power available but couldn't use it without either blowing up or running out of fuel.

Had as much influence on  racing as today's formula does: very little.

 

The racing quality issue is on the aero side, not here.



#1955 bigfoz

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 11:58

Sound very like the early V6 single turbos from late '70s early '80s. Like it. I'd prefer to have seen more freedom though, the early turbo days with mixed V12, V8, V6 Turbo, 4-cyl turbos ertc were awesome. A better regulation would have been 1.6 single turbo, choose your #cylinders, some would have gone 4, some 6, variation would have made it better. 

 

But then every car  has sounded hideously the same for the last 20 years that there's been no variation in the engines anyway.



#1956 Scotracer

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 12:28

88 around 700HP with a 155L limit, 116KG by today's measuring system.

 

1988 had a boost limit as well as fuel limit - the Honda engine produced 675BHP (from an SAE paper I have somewhere) at 2.5bar. 



#1957 nosecone

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 12:31

Bernie Eccelstone is the only person in the world who calls the product he sells unacceptable.



#1958 Nitropower

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 12:40

And rightfully so. I bet he is freaking out when checking the TV audience figures. Formula One has long gone downhill no matter how hardcore a fan of F1 you are. I am one of those who stopped watching because it's lost the plot.

#1959 ExFlagMan

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:04

Unless it is a cunning plan to devalue F1 so CVC get panicky and sell it to him for peanuts!

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#1960 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:04

I found it interesting that according to the HUD the FIs (IIRC it was them) regularly revved to 13,000 during quali - higher than expected with the FFL


Edited by KnucklesAgain, 06 April 2014 - 13:04.


#1961 photon

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:14

I appreciate Bernie's honesty and only am sad that no one adequately predicted the outcome before it was too late.  I personally knew the new engines would sound like crap because the whole way that turbos work, basically, is by taking kinetic energy out of the exhaust.

 

But people should have known better just looking at how Indycar engines sound -- like a joke compared to F1 engines. Before, that was.  Now F1 engines sound the same as Indycar engines or actually worse.


Edited by photon, 06 April 2014 - 13:14.


#1962 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:21

I appreciate Bernie's honesty and only am sad that no one adequately predicted the outcome before it was too late.  I personally knew the new engines would sound like crap because the whole way that turbos work, basically, is by taking kinetic energy out of the exhaust.

 

But people should have known better just looking at how Indycar engines sound -- like a joke compared to F1 engines. Before, that was.  Now F1 engines sound the same as Indycar engines or actually worse.

 

So F1 in the 80's was a joke?  :drunk:

 

I bet you haven't heard the PU's live and have followed F1 for less than a decade.  :rolleyes:



#1963 ExFlagMan

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:23

I found it interesting that according to the HUD the FIs (IIRC it was them) regularly revved to 13,000 during quali - higher than expected with the FFL

Possibly they have a map that allows the system to rev up the FFL using the ICE, then maintain that fuel flow and bring in the ERS to spin up the revs further.

#1964 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 13:25

The whiners and Bernie win, lets go back to 6 litre pushrod naturally aspirated engines with tubular frame chassis, front engines and four speed h pattern gearboxes.

#retarded



#1965 uffen

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 14:13

The whiners and Bernie win, lets go back to 6 litre pushrod naturally aspirated engines with tubular frame chassis, front engines and four speed h pattern gearboxes.

#retarded

You know your argument is weak when you resort to this kind of thing.

Actually, you may have hit on one thing - front engines would be far more road car relevant...



#1966 Lazy

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 14:14

I see Bernie's cunning plan is to give them an extra 10kg of fuel. As if people are saying "sounds alright in Q but not so good in the race"  :rolleyes:

 

He's playing some game in the background, his whole approach to this makes no sense otherwise.



#1967 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 14:26

You know your argument is weak when you resort to this kind of thing.

Actually, you may have hit on one thing - front engines would be far more road car relevant...

 

Not weak, just frustrated at having to deal with selfish intellectual midgets.

I feel like I'm Nico Rosberg at a drivers meeting.


Edited by senna da silva, 06 April 2014 - 14:30.


#1968 Clatter

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 14:42

I see Bernie's cunning plan is to give them an extra 10kg of fuel. As if people are saying "sounds alright in Q but not so good in the race"  :rolleyes:

 

He's playing some game in the background, his whole approach to this makes no sense otherwise.

Is that something he has come out with? What would be the point when there is a FFL and as we saw in Malaysia they are not using the full 100kg anyway.



#1969 Lazy

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 14:49

Is that something he has come out with? What would be the point when there is a FFL and as we saw in Malaysia they are not using the full 100kg anyway.

 

Exactly.

http://www.planetf1....-Engine-Changes

 

"They can do something about the noise, and they need another 10 kilos of fuel or something," Ecclestone said Sunday ahead of the Bahrain Grand Prix. "Everybody will agree to that."

 

 

http://www.auto-moto...er-8292550.html

 

 

 Ecclestone even called for the raising of the fuel limits by ten kilograms knowing that the FIA would make completely ridiculous when she accepted this proposal. Then her beautiful fuel-saving idea would be the devil. And there would be nothing gained. The engines would be barely louder, broken only go more often, and Mercedes would the ten kilograms more to implement the same into more power as Ferrari and Renault. 

 


Edited by Lazy, 06 April 2014 - 14:51.


#1970 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 15:08

I have to say, this is the first race I hate the engine sound. Maybe it's the open spaces but when they accelerate it sounds like a bunch of screaming goats.

 


Edited by TheUltimateWorrier, 06 April 2014 - 15:08.


#1971 krod

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:07

I'm starting to love the sound,

 

Maybe it's time for the Flat Earth Society to head to the Train Spotting message boards. They'll get plenty of nostalgia and Good Old Days there...



#1972 Tourgott

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:15

Still hate the sound but at least we saw what would be possible without fuel restriction after the safety car today.



#1973 yasushi888

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:21

Maybe it's time for the Flat Earth Society to head to the Train Spotting message boards. They'll get plenty of nostalgia and Good Old Days there...

 

Or you could just go to the Nostalgia section on this forum? But why has anyone got to go anywhere? Discussing the sound of current F1 is here?



#1974 Clatter

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:34

I'm starting to love the sound,

 

Maybe it's time for the Flat Earth Society to head to the Train Spotting message boards. They'll get plenty of nostalgia and Good Old Days there...

Me too. I'm looking forward to hearing them in the flesh.



#1975 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:50

I'm starting to love the sound,

 

Maybe it's time for the Flat Earth Society to head to the Train Spotting message boards. They'll get plenty of nostalgia and Good Old Days there...

 

In fairness, I've loved and championed the sound of the new engines. It's just this race, whether it is the open layout of the track, the accelerating sounded horrible imo. But I won't be unsubscribing from my theories of a spherical Earth yet. I can't wait to hear them in Monaco on the streets  :love:



#1976 Clatter

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 17:53

In fairness, I've loved and championed the sound of the new engines. It's just this race, whether it is the open layout of the track, the accelerating sounded horrible imo. But I won't be unsubscribing from my theories of a spherical Earth yet. I can't wait to hear them in Monaco on the streets  :love:

Could be down to the placement of the microphones.



#1977 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 18:03

Could be down to the placement of the microphones.

 

Could very well be! Was just the opening laps and I was a bit underwhelmed by the accelerating noise.



#1978 BullHead

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 18:06

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/113317

 

So they're gonna try and do something....

It kinda sickens me that these lot are willing to get together to change something that is pretty fundamental and will cost money/time/effort over an issue that is quite frankly peripheral, yet refuse to budge and do the right thing about something really important like double points.

Asshats!



#1979 4MEN

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 18:23

More than the sound I hate the short shifting.



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#1980 uffen

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 18:28

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/113317

 

So they're gonna try and do something....

It kinda sickens me that these lot are willing to get together to change something that is pretty fundamental and will cost money/time/effort over an issue that is quite frankly peripheral, yet refuse to budge and do the right thing about something really important like double points.

Asshats!

Got to agree on the double points thing. When they asked Todt about getting rid of the double points he said they have bigger things to deal with... well so why change the points in the first place?



#1981 nonobaddog

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 19:45

I've loved and championed the sound of the new engines.

 

What is it about the new sound that you love?



#1982 Lazy

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 19:58

What is it about the new sound that you love?

Not everyone is a fan of volume above all things.



#1983 xmoonrakerx

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 19:59

I think if the fom put the microphones inside the engines, sound problem would be fixed :)

#1984 Mauseri

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 20:18

Easy solution to get more sound would be removing mufflers from the safety car.

 

I think the sounds are fine. It's nice to hear tyre and bottoming sounds and the crowd. Well maybe the Mercedes engines irritate a little with the tractor-like sound.


Edited by Mauseri, 06 April 2014 - 20:19.


#1985 Slartibartfast

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 23:21

I think if the fom put the microphones inside the engines, sound problem would be fixed :)

 Unlike the microphones, which would definitely need fixing after you did that to them.
 

Easy solution to get more sound would be removing mufflers from the safety car.
 
I think the sounds are fine. It's nice to hear tyre and bottoming sounds and the crowd. Well maybe the Mercedes engines irritate a little with the tractor-like sound.

So not the "disappearing off into the distance, leaving every one else behind" sound?

#1986 John Player

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 23:27

Is it just me or from the onboards the Red Bulls sound a bit like the Williams in 1993/1994



#1987 nonobaddog

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Posted 06 April 2014 - 23:54

Is it just me or from the onboards the Red Bulls sound a bit like the Williams in 1993/1994

 

It is just you.

 

Williams ran a Renault V10 then and it sounded like a V10.



#1988 nonobaddog

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:15

Is it just me or from the onboards the Red Bulls sound a bit like the Williams in 1993/1994

 

I'll retract my last comment and say the two don't sound at all alike to me.  How you perceive it is, of course, up to you.



#1989 Spinnekop

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:51

Yeah, but imagine going to a House party and they're playing the same music they did 10 years ago.

 

That would be great... if I really wanted to party some late 90's early 2000's proper hard house is exactly what would get me dancing  ;) 

 

My iPod is full of Talking Heads, Midnight oil and more laid back modern tunes for everyday commutes but F1 isn't everyday it's something I want to dance to.



#1990 Radion

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:27

I wanted to visit a track this year, but after watching this:

 

 

I refuse to pay money for it. If this is the sound level I'm going to be experiencing, I might as well just let my friends going in circles around me with a vacuum cleaner.

 

Seriously, I want to hear the cars roaring all over the track. I want not to be able to hear my own voice while them passing by. FIA DO SOMETHING FOR FUC*S SAKE!  :mad:


Edited by Radion, 07 April 2014 - 07:28.


#1991 BullHead

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:39

The racing is outweighing lack of 'noise' though. The crowd there are loving it.



#1992 Lazy

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:44

 

 

 

Wow, great video, that braking is astonishing.



#1993 BullHead

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:45

2 things:

 

- I highly suspect the engines will sound a bit different and 'noisier' next year, issue dealt with.

 

- I imagine lots of fans will go to tracks this year for the racing and curiosity about the sound anyway.

 

No problem IMO



#1994 muramasa

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:51

I wanted to visit a track this year, but after watching this:

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=SyMvD4WxOfk

 

I refuse to pay money for it. If this is the sound level I'm going to be experiencing, I might as well just let my friends going in circles around me with a vacuum cleaner.

 

Seriously, I want to hear the cars roaring all over the track. I want not to be able to hear my own voice while them passing by. FIA DO SOMETHING FOR FUC*S SAKE!  :mad:

 

I love it.

Diving down into the corner with the hiss sound of turbo and probably ers as well as squeal feels actually menace, in a different way than V8/10 did.

Note that that video is not replicating lower freq sound well, but even "quiet" Audi LMP1 car sounds awesome so that's not a main thing.


Edited by muramasa, 07 April 2014 - 07:52.


#1995 PayasYouRace

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:51

Is it just me or from the onboards the Red Bulls sound a bit like the Williams in 1993/1994

 

Not just you. The onboards sound so much like the mid-90s onboards that I was getting a major nostalgia rush watching the Bahrain coverage.

 

I think the trackside camera mics are doing a much better job of capturing what I heard at Jerez now.

 

 

I wanted to visit a track this year, but after watching this:

 

 

I refuse to pay money for it. If this is the sound level I'm going to be experiencing, I might as well just let my friends going in circles around me with a vacuum cleaner.

 

Seriously, I want to hear the cars roaring all over the track. I want not to be able to hear my own voice while them passing by. FIA DO SOMETHING FOR FUC*S SAKE!  :mad:

 

I don't think that video does it justice. The guy's camera doesn't appear to have a sensitive enough mic. Your ears will pick up the engine sound a lot better. Remember, I could hear the cars all the way round the track at Jerez.



#1996 Lazy

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:57

I wanted to visit a track this year, but after watching this:

 

 

I refuse to pay money for it. If this is the sound level I'm going to be experiencing, I might as well just let my friends going in circles around me with a vacuum cleaner.

 

Seriously, I want to hear the cars roaring all over the track. I want not to be able to hear my own voice while them passing by. FIA DO SOMETHING FOR FUC*S SAKE!  :mad:

Seriously, you watched that race and you still don't want to go see them?



#1997 tomjol

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 07:59

I wanted to visit a track this year, but after watching this:

 

 

I refuse to pay money for it. If this is the sound level I'm going to be experiencing, I might as well just let my friends going in circles around me with a vacuum cleaner.

 

Seriously, I want to hear the cars roaring all over the track. I want not to be able to hear my own voice while them passing by. FIA DO SOMETHING FOR FUC*S SAKE!  :mad:

 

Everybody knows that the most effective way to bring about change is to stand around looking angry and screaming obscenities  :rolleyes:



#1998 Lazy

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 08:16

I'd go just to see those Mercs racing.



#1999 Kobasmashi

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 08:17

Wow, great video, that braking is astonishing.



!!!! The broadcasting "experts" at FOM don't position their cameras properly to let us see the braking but some bloke in a crowd on his phone can....

On the Sky feed at least yesterday they seemed to have improved the mix from the earlier races, although this was the first race I've watched on a TV this year. I thought the sound really was fine, despite the TV mics missing out on the hissing and popping from the amateur testing footage.

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#2000 SenorSjon

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 08:44

FOM footage muted the previous cars as well. The onslaught about the sound would be even worse. ;)