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LdM Not Happy With Alonso's Comments


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#101 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:11

Lets not get ahead of ourselves. The ferrari has been a title contender 2 times in 2010 and 2012. Alonsos start of the season 2010 wasnt exactly jawdropping though the teams strategy was shitty in the last race. Last season the ferraris racepace was always up there though they didnt qualify as well (bar maybe 2 first races when they were lost). It would be a different thing if they were actually in the midfield aka the F60.


I give you 2010, it was a quite ok car. Had they built on that, it would be different. Instead they went backwards, and the 2010 car being the most competitive of the bunch, is "not so great" indeed.

You must be joking about 2012. The car was pure crap before Barcelona, and better than the RB maybe once or twice even during its best streak, which was short.

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#102 Markn93

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:11

Clear as mud

Er, I hope you realise that was sarcastic, perhaps I should have added a :p

#103 Gallivant

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:11

I think Alonso's frustration is understandable, but obviously LdM, the Tifosi and Italian media won't take kindly to these rumours and it signals a potential fracture in the Alonso-Ferrari relationship. Rather than spouting off however, LdM should maybe consider a tactical counter-attack - try to openly engage Vettel in talks luring him to Ferrari. If rumours are true that any Kimi-RBR deal might be for 10 years - a few years in F1 and subsequent promotion/connection with Kimi in other motorsporting endeavours (rally, motocross) - then in some ways it will be Kimi and not Vettel who is perceived to be the future of RBR. This could prove problematic for Vettel's status within the team as he has a shorter commitment to RBR and is widely expected to jump ship to Ferrari later in his career. Enticing him to Ferrari now might therefore be an easier proposition than we imagine. And of course, any such talks would serve to undermine RBR and Alonso at the same time.

The truth is LdM might have to consider the longer term here. If Alonso is increasingly discontented it might be worth Ferrari's while to let him go, and to buy in new talent all-round, (replacing Domenicali for sure, perhaps with Horner), in a bid to rebuild Ferrari from the ground up. With so many changes afoot in 2014, this might be the right time for a clean sweep strategy. LdM could bring Vettel on board as the centrepiece of a remodelled Ferrari team, offering him the chance to truly emulate his hero (Schumi). If Massa retires as well (as rumoured), this would then free up yet another seat for a budding junior who could happily play second fiddle.

#104 Jon83

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:12

As usual the hierarchy bang on about 'staying calm' blah blah blah





#105 Jon83

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:14

Perhaps Alonso blasting every time against the team and inferior car is getting on some Italians nerves? It is not all their fault and Alonso seems to be not on his top game. He did loose the 2012 championship by himself. He was getting passed by Massa left and right on more than one occasion in the second half of the season. He had a massive points advantage before Spa and he lost it all.

Alonso is also part of the team and a bit responsible for developing it due to his feedback. Looks like it isn't helping much... Perhaps he should stop blaming the car for everything gone wrong to him.


How did he lose the 2012 championship by himself?

What did the team do? Give him a car which was some 1.5 seconds off McLaren at the start of the season.

Alonso has carried Ferrari for years now.

#106 motorhead

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:21

http://formula1.ferr...i-doesnt-sit-me

LdM very angry


I would be too if I was paying 30mil a year for a guy who´s loyalty to his employer seems to be questionable...

#107 pRy

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:23

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/23495111

BBC article suggests Ferrari aren't happy with Alonso's qualifying performances, so perhaps something has been said prior to Hungary. Alonso, believing he is giving 110% has then taken this personally, initiated the Redbull talks at Hungary and come out with the "i'd like another car" comment. LDM has then done what LDM does and arranged for a horse head to be placed on Alonso's pillow tonight.

Knowing how the McLaren relationship collapsed once Fernando and Ron fell out.. I'm not sure this bodes well for him and Ferrari. Alonso is head strong. Luca is head strong. And there isn't the sweetener of a competitive car to help matters either.

Interesting times.

#108 Les

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:25

Clear message to Ferrari from Alonso in this tweet - https://twitter.com/...0041088/photo/1


What's that? A humble pie?

#109 ElJefe

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:27

At least he didn't compare his car to a truck, but LdM not sounding amused at all. Alonso to leave Ferrari Prost-style?

#110 Rikhart

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:27

Alonso proving toxic to yet another team? Maybe he will find himself in a lotus sooner than later, he might miss his ferrari then...

#111 SpaMaster

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:28

I think Alonso's frustration is understandable, but obviously LdM, the Tifosi and Italian media won't take kindly to these rumours and it signals a potential fracture in the Alonso-Ferrari relationship. Rather than spouting off however, LdM should maybe consider a tactical counter-attack - try to openly engage Vettel in talks luring him to Ferrari. If rumours are true that any Kimi-RBR deal might be for 10 years - a few years in F1 and subsequent promotion/connection with Kimi in other motorsporting endeavours (rally, motocross) - then in some ways it will be Kimi and not Vettel who is perceived to be the future of RBR. This could prove problematic for Vettel's status within the team as he has a shorter commitment to RBR and is widely expected to jump ship to Ferrari later in his career. Enticing him to Ferrari now might therefore be an easier proposition than we imagine. And of course, any such talks would serve to undermine RBR and Alonso at the same time.

The truth is LdM might have to consider the longer term here. If Alonso is increasingly discontented it might be worth Ferrari's while to let him go, and to buy in new talent all-round, (replacing Domenicali for sure, perhaps with Horner), in a bid to rebuild Ferrari from the ground up. With so many changes afoot in 2014, this might be the right time for a clean sweep strategy. LdM could bring Vettel on board as the centrepiece of a remodelled Ferrari team, offering him the chance to truly emulate his hero (Schumi). If Massa retires as well (as rumoured), this would then free up yet another seat for a budding junior who could happily play second fiddle.

Why would Vettel want to drive for Ferrari now? He still has lot of time. He can do it a few years later. Agree with Kimi's contract interpretation only to the extent that Kimi wanting to save his back at Red Bull instead of any potential undermining. I don't think it would elevate to the extent of Kimi being the future of Red Bull. I don't think Kimi is the sort of person that sells that kind of an image. He just minds his own business.

#112 SpaMaster

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:35

http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/23495111

BBC article suggests Ferrari aren't happy with Alonso's qualifying performances, so perhaps something has been said prior to Hungary. Alonso, believing he is giving 110% has then taken this personally, initiated the Redbull talks at Hungary and come out with the "i'd like another car" comment. LDM has then done what LDM does and arranged for a horse head to be placed on Alonso's pillow tonight.

Knowing how the McLaren relationship collapsed once Fernando and Ron fell out.. I'm not sure this bodes well for him and Ferrari. Alonso is head strong. Luca is head strong. And there isn't the sweetener of a competitive car to help matters either.

Interesting times.

Interesting to hear that Ferrari is not happy with Alonso's qualifying. I mentioned it earlier when Ferrari was still more competitive (during Monaco/Spain time), that Raikkonen was often outqualifying Ferrari/Alonso when he shouldn't. At that time Ferrari was still the better qualifying car and in the race it used to fluctuate. All through weekend you would see Ferrari being faster on single lap pace. But come crunch time, Raikkonen started to outqualify Alonso. Yes, I also think Alonso was slopping a bit in the middle part of the half-season in qualy. I think Fry made similar comments last year around the Indian GP - that the car potential is not being maximized in qualy. That was the time when Alonso was qualifying behind Massa, told to maintain gap to Alonso, etc. - Korea, India and a few other races in the later part of the season.

#113 chrisj

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:35

When it ends between Ferrari and Alonso, it will be ugly.

#114 artista

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:37

Clear message to Ferrari from Alonso in this tweet - https://twitter.com/...0041088/photo/1

Tortilla de patatas? I always get tarta con gaticos de merengue for my birthday and, frankly, the tarta is thousand times better. Not that I would mind a bit of that tortilla right now...

That said, I don't see how a tortilla can be a clear message.

#115 naiboz

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:39

so if Ferrari are unhappy with Alonso's qualy performances, what on earth is Massa still doing in red?



#116 Outsider

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:44

so if Ferrari are unhappy with Alonso's qualy performances, what on earth is Massa still doing in red?

i honestly have no idea...

#117 sopa

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:44

At least people don't have a boring summer vacation now. Something to discuss about. Enjoy. Maybe that was the purpose of these news. Request by Ecclestone to keep F1 in the news during the break.:p

Funny think though 6 years ago in Hungary right before the summer-break we also had an Alonso-McLaren meltdown.

#118 jstrains

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:51

Clear message to Ferrari from Alonso in this tweet - https://twitter.com/...0041088/photo/1


I had some hard time translating it: "Tortilla dinner. Fundamental to any birthday. Missing it when traveling..."

Maybe I am already too tired today but how does it response to LdM?

Edited by jstrains, 29 July 2013 - 19:52.


#119 Rikhart

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:52

so if Ferrari are unhappy with Alonso's qualy performances, what on earth is Massa still doing in red?


Outqualifying alonso several times in a row, for example ;)

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#120 Outsider

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:53

Outqualifying alonso several times in a row, for example ;)

some 10 times in 4 years.... really outstanding performance by Massa

#121 wj_gibson

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:54

Outqualifying alonso several times in a row, for example ;)


Yes, "several", "many" - these are basically weasal words that allow someone to make a case by insinuation rather than hard fact.

The correct number, I believe is 4.

#122 sopa

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:55

so if Ferrari are unhappy with Alonso's qualy performances, what on earth is Massa still doing in red?


Because Massa is a good nice guy and a nice team player. They Ferrari want a good family together.:D

Funny thing is that in all seriousness I have never felt Alonso is quite as good qualifier as Vettel or Hamilton. Yes, he has had a car that is not that incredible in quali, but somehow he has not convinced me. Yet he has been obliterating Massa, which has made me scratch my head.

TBH I have felt the same about Raikkonen. Despite him obliterating his team-mate and the car not being the best in qualifying, he is like Alonso. Not quite the very best on Saturday neither.

#123 V3TT3L

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 19:58

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#124 currupipi

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:00

so if Ferrari are unhappy with Alonso's qualy performances, what on earth is Massa still doing in red?


so true :lol:


#125 Markn93

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:00

I had some hard time translating it: "Tortilla dinner. Fundamental to any birthday. Missing it when traveling..."

Maybe I am already too tired today but how does it response to LdM?

Twas sarcasm, as everything he says will be twisted etc. Didn't come across I see.

#126 Vesuvius

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:07

So Alonso-Ferrari not so happy "marriage" as everyone claimed it would be? Then he wasn't the next Schumacher, perfect Ferrari driver like was said.

#127 rmpugh

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:08

LdM needs to calm the **** down. CH must be laughing his arse off, that his comments caused the desired effect. Everyone else saw them for what they were, CH and RB trying to cause problems, but LdM actually took it on board. The old fool needs to learn to understand that opponents say stuff to try and destabilize you.

Domenicali understood, but LdM is too simple to understand. The sooner he pisses off into Italian politics, joining such good company as Berlusconi, and away from Ferrari/F1, the better.

#128 RockyRaccoon68

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:09

Wow, that's certainly a public fallout between Alonso and LdM...and when you fallout with Luca you know what happens!! Interesting times and I think this is massively unfair on Alonso, he did not deserve that. He has carried that team for over three seasons now, without him they would have been point scorers and Q3 contenders at best with the odd podium and maybe a win or two in 2010. Ridiculous.

#129 bonjon1979a

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:09

This could get ugly, quite quickly. Alonso is a ruthless operator but he's a great driver who should be in a top car. To be honest though I wonder if this is more to do with next year rather than this year. Heard very little about ferraris engine and how can he have confidence in them developing a whole new car when current updates aren't correlating with the wind tunnel on this years. First sign of cracks in the fernando/Ldm love in at any rate. Fills the next few weeks anyway...

#130 apoka

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:10

"Alonso to Red Bull", "Alonso under investigation", "LdM not happy about happy with Alonso's comments" - interesting times at Ferrari. In a year or so, we will see whether this means more than just some entertainment in the summer break.

I have to agree with one of the posters above that Ferrari should seriously think about exchanging the second driver. If (big if) Alonso is indeed underperforming, then why keeping Massa? Massa is very likeable, but that should not guarantee him a seat at a top team. (Has anyone except Schumacher actually done more races for Ferrari?)


#131 RockyRaccoon68

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:13

Holy crap, is this the rubbish Kimi and his fans had to put up with after he fell out of favour with Luca?

#132 Vesuvius

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:14

Horner and Red Bull played very well...they got under the skin of Ferrari causing trouble inside the team.

First signs of not so perfect harmony was seen few days before, when it was said that Alonso wanted Pat Symonds to Ferrari but Ferrari didn't agree on that.

#133 ArkZ

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:15

I had some hard time translating it: "Tortilla dinner. Fundamental to any birthday. Missing it when traveling..."

Maybe I am already too tired today but how does it response to LdM?


People will read out this as they wish. I will never forget when after the season Alonso posted photo from the coast with the glowing lights and some peoples linked this with the Vettel yellow flag controversy and started to bash him for that :rotfl:

#134 Pinch

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:15

I'm not a fan of the man himself, but I admire Alonso's driving and I must say LDM is way out of order with these comments. On a large number of occasions in the last 4 years, Alonso has dragged an inferior Ferrari into positions no one thought possible, whilst at the same time his team mate was usually nowhere to be seen. Alonso has spared Ferrari's blushes many times whilst being extremely patient in the wait for a car to rival Red Bull. Alonso does not deserve a public dressing down by LDM.



Could not of said it any better, minus Alonso and Ferrari are the laughing stock of F1.

Teams look after themselves, so should drivers. You go to where the best opportunity to win championships happen to be. For the last 4 years that has been RBR, I don't see what the problem here is, if LdM wants 100% commitment from Alonso (which he has given, when you consider the dross Ferrari have produced for the last 4 years) then give him the goods. If anything, Domenicali and Co need to be looked at. The problem isn't Alonso.





#135 Vesuvius

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:16

Holy crap, is this the rubbish Kimi and his fans had to put up with after he fell out of favour with Luca?


For starters yes...it will get uglier believe me.

#136 bonjon1979a

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:16

Holy crap, is this the rubbish Kimi and his fans had to put up with after he fell out of favour with Luca?

Maybe, but it turned out to be true didn't it...

#137 MaxisOne

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:23

I believe they have actually worked at the same team in the past, at Beatrice/FORCE/Haas or whatever it was called. Somebody had a good eye for talent. Obviously, Brawn was not in charge though, so your point stands.


I think it would work ... I think there is enough trust and mutual respect there to leave Newey alone with all the technical aspects and Brawn handling everything else on the sporting side.

I would not see it being a problem in terms of working together... However the present problem is they are up in age and eventually want out. In addition to that they have made quite a bit of money. at some point .. they want some time to enjoy it in retirement.

As it regards to the present situation.. I understand Freds frustration .. but of all people he should know that doing stuff like this will not work. If he wants to effect change give LDM a call... let him know that this situation cannot continue (Crap cars) and ask him to change the management up upgrade the facilities or something. The moment you piss off LDM is the moment you have lost your influence..

#138 BestCarWins

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:26

So Alonso-Ferrari not so happy "marriage" as everyone claimed it would be? Then he wasn't the next Schumacher, perfect Ferrari driver like was said.


Thinking about it I seem to recall Schumacher and Luca not parting on happy terms either despite all the success Ferrari had at the time.

I admit I'm a biased Alonso fan but I do feel that Ferrari have let Alonso down a lot more over these past few years than the other way around. I mean without an Alonso/Kimi/Lewis/Vettel in 1 car what would they have achieved in these past few years? How discouraging is it to see rival cars get updates that work most of the time vs your own updates that rarely seem to work with no one in the team knowing why? (aside from blaming the windtunnel they can not fix).

I hope Ferrari and Alonso can win at least 1 title together but it is currently hard to see this will happen when other teams are frankly better at delivering better/more consistent cars so I fully understand why Alonso would be angry. That said he should have taken more points from the start of this season and while I understand his anger he should not say things about wanting another car.

As for LDM he needs to watch what he says as well - I mean if Alonso went who would they get to replace him? Lewis won't move again any time soon, I can't see Vettel leaving Red Bull while they continue to deliver and Kimi will not go back.

#139 sopa

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:43

As for LDM he needs to watch what he says as well - I mean if Alonso went who would they get to replace him? Lewis won't move again any time soon, I can't see Vettel leaving Red Bull while they continue to deliver and Kimi will not go back.


Where would Alonso go? Only retirement is an option. So we can't discuss Alonso leaving with any probablity regardless of how much he dislikes there. Red Bull won't take him alongside Vettel. Mercedes? I have some doubts as well. Lotus? Well, okay. But long-term it is a worse bet than Ferrari and Alonso should know it. And then we have McLaren, who would certainly be happy to have a top driver like Alonso. Well, maybe they can forget the past.:p And except Mclaren has proven to be worse than Ferrari recently too.

Alonso would leave only if things went really bad like in 2007 with McLaren that he just feels he NEEDS to go regardless of what. Or like Hamilton in 2012. And both took what was at the time (2007 Renault and 2012 Mercedes) a midfield team compared to a top team they had at that time. But I just can't see things going that bad yet that the athmosphere is intolerable.

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#140 string158

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:45

I could see him back at Lotus. He can't stay away from that team!

#141 garoidb

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:48

Where would Alonso go? Only retirement is an option. So we can't discuss Alonso leaving with any probablity regardless of how much he dislikes there. Red Bull won't take him alongside Vettel. Mercedes? I have some doubts as well. Lotus? Well, okay. But long-term it is a worse bet than Ferrari and Alonso should know it. And then we have McLaren, who would certainly be happy to have a top driver like Alonso. Well, maybe they can forget the past.:p And except Mclaren has proven to be worse than Ferrari recently too.

Alonso would leave only if things went really bad like in 2007 with McLaren that he just feels he NEEDS to go regardless of what. Or like Hamilton in 2012. And both took what was at the time (2007 Renault and 2012 Mercedes) a midfield team compared to a top team they had at that time. But I just can't see things going that bad yet that the athmosphere is intolerable.


It would be interesting to know McLaren's outlook on drivers right now. They do need to have one of the tier 1 drivers, and running Jenson and Sergio might be leaving just a little on the table. It depends how Sergio develops, of course. They have history with three of the top four drivers, and the fourth is not a runner either. I assumed they would go for youth and hope to bring along the next star, but if Alonso became available for a few years ....

#142 shonguiz

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:51

What i find telling is that LDM's outing wasn't recorded in an interview with a journo, it was reported in the official inhouse Media, and that's seriously quite something, i don't believe for a second that it's only because of the manager meeting with CH, when Kubica was with BMW, he was never shy of telling how much he loved italy while his manager was often seen in the Ferrari center and playing with journo about a possible switch to Ferrari, yet Mario Theissen or Peter Sauber never made a fuss about it.

Edited by shonguiz, 29 July 2013 - 21:05.


#143 Menace

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:51

So... Alonso to Lotus, Hulk to Ferrari, and Kimi to Red Bull? :p :lol:

#144 Henrik B

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:51

I could see him back at Lotus. He can't stay away from that team!


There has been rumours and comments that Enstone wasn't that happy with him in the last season - the gist of it was that he was basically waiting for the contract to end and made no effort at all. Have no idea if it was true, some of the on record comments were from Boullier who wasn't around at that time.


#145 Gintonious

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:52

What are the odds now he will win at Spa, and take a chunk of points out of the Vettel.

#146 garoidb

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:55

What i find telling is that LDM's outing wasn't recorded in an interview with a journo, it was reported in the official inhouse Media, and that's seriously quite something, i don't believe for a second that it's only because of the manager meeting with CH, when Kubica was with BMW, he was neevr shy of telling how much he loves italy ehile his manager was often seen in the Ferrari center and playing with journo about a possible switch to Ferrari, yet Mario Theissen or Peter Sauber never made a fuss about it.


If Ferrari have doubts about Alonso, the thing to do would be to retire Massa and get the best available driver to run beside FA (Kimi, Hulkenberg or whoever they can actually get). Then they would find out if they really needed him or not.

#147 bourbon

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:57

Alonso has to adhere to the Ferrari way in all things as a driver, but that is nothing new. If Michael and Kimi - and hey, after the truck comment, even Alain - can do it, surely he can.

#148 Sakae

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:58

I have been always wondering how long LdM will put up with Alonso and his cr**. Now I know. Not for ever.

#149 Watkins74

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:59

Holy crap, is this the rubbish Kimi and his fans had to put up with after he fell out of favour with Luca?

Hopefully the Alonso fans will have more dignity than the Kimi fans and their legacy of hatred and butthurt.

#150 artista

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Posted 29 July 2013 - 20:59

There has been rumours and comments that Enstone wasn't that happy with him in the last season - the gist of it was that he was basically waiting for the contract to end and made no effort at all. Have no idea if it was true, some of the on record comments were from Boullier who wasn't around at that time.

If I remember it correctly, Boullier did say that in an interview with a Belgian newspaper during the Belgian GP weekend. What I can't remember is the name ifo the newspaper and if it was in 2010 or 2011 (I think it was 2010)