Jump to content


Photo
* * * * - 8 votes

In defence of Esteban Gutierrez


  • Please log in to reply
131 replies to this topic

#101 Kyo

Kyo
  • Member

  • 853 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2013 - 11:05

If you look to results alone, every rookie driver looked pretty bad against a more experienced team mate since the testing ban. IMO this is no coincidence, and has much more to say about the testing ban than the drivers. Most of them had considerable better results in the second year, and will probably be the same for Gutierrez in case he stays.



Advertisement

#102 Tron

Tron
  • Member

  • 614 posts
  • Joined: September 13

Posted 13 October 2013 - 11:09

His first points are not only important for his career, but also for the state of the rookies this year.


Edited by Tron, 13 October 2013 - 11:09.


#103 sopa

sopa
  • Member

  • 3,226 posts
  • Joined: April 07

Posted 13 October 2013 - 11:20

Gutierrez has improved recently and I'd be pretty hard for Sauber to decide against keeping him for 2014 especially if he brings money.



#104 DS27

DS27
  • Member

  • 1,092 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2013 - 15:15

I think it's now quite clear that he deserved his chance in F1 and I think he has shown enough speed to warrant a second season.



#105 coppilcus

coppilcus
  • Member

  • 361 posts
  • Joined: November 12

Posted 13 October 2013 - 16:51

He's being with Sauber for four years... Way before any money stayed at Sauber when Perez leaved, they saw something in Esteban beforehand and he is showing it at last!

#106 olliek88

olliek88
  • Member

  • 4,049 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 13 October 2013 - 17:03

A good few performances from Steve lately but i think it has much do to with the Sauber improving has it does with himself, today was probably his best drive but he was still 20+ seconds behind his teammate. Its an improvement though and as other rightly say, he (along with all rookies) need to be given more time but i'm still not convinced. Would happily eat my words though.



#107 Seanspeed

Seanspeed
  • Member

  • 14,527 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 13 October 2013 - 17:14

Nah, still isn't doing enough, in my opinion.  The car has improved and he's doing better, but he's still been disappointing overall, showing bad racecraft and generally getting whooped by his teammate.  I'd rather see somebody else in that seat.  I've been unconvinced by him since GP2 and that hasn't changed with a couple races.



#108 coppilcus

coppilcus
  • Member

  • 361 posts
  • Joined: November 12

Posted 13 October 2013 - 17:52

Come on... Recently, the only one that shined in his debut season was Hamilton, not even Alonso.

#109 BullHead

BullHead
  • Member

  • 6,807 posts
  • Joined: May 08

Posted 13 October 2013 - 17:55

GUT for once showed himself. Good effort.

#110 olliek88

olliek88
  • Member

  • 4,049 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 13 October 2013 - 18:54

Come on... Recently, the only one that shined in his debut season was Hamilton, not even Alonso.

 

Off topic but i'd say, all things considered, BOTTAS has shone this year, its just the car hasn't put his performances into the limelight, he, overall, has been the better of the two Williams drivers and has a rookie i'd say that very impressive, Pastor might be reckless but he's quick and more experienced. Canada was only a glimpse but it was a fantastic performance, his season kind of reminds me of Hulk's debut year.



#111 Seanspeed

Seanspeed
  • Member

  • 14,527 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 13 October 2013 - 19:23

Come on... Recently, the only one that shined in his debut season was Hamilton, not even Alonso.

Just not true.

I'm not asking him to fight for the world championship, either. He's just disappointing more often than not. Even on his day of shining, he was still thoroughly outperformed by his teammate.

#112 coppilcus

coppilcus
  • Member

  • 361 posts
  • Joined: November 12

Posted 13 October 2013 - 20:22

Just not true.
I'm not asking him to fight for the world championship, either. He's just disappointing more often than not. Even on his day of shining, he was still thoroughly outperformed by his teammate.


First time at Suzuka... One of the most challenging circuits of the calendar as was proven on Friday And Saturday.

#113 Risil

Risil
  • Member

  • 14,105 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 13 October 2013 - 20:25

I'm not asking him to fight for the world championship, either. He's just disappointing more often than not. Even on his day of shining, he was still thoroughly outperformed by his teammate.

 

I can't be the only one worried about the weakness of a Gutierrez-Sirotkin Sauber team next year.



#114 Seanspeed

Seanspeed
  • Member

  • 14,527 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 13 October 2013 - 21:15

First time at Suzuka... One of the most challenging circuits of the calendar as was proven on Friday And Saturday.

Yes, he had a respectable weekend.  He had those in GP2 as well.  But he didn't do it often enough, just as it seems to have taken him 15 race weekends before doing anything noteworthy in F1.  And that noteworthiness still didn't include beating his teammate.  

 

I'm just not going to suddenly change my opinion of him because of one decent race.  If he starts consistently scoring top 10 finishes and can perhaps match or beat Hulkenberg on occasion, I'll happily begin to change it. 

 

I can't be the only one worried about the weakness of a Gutierrez-Sirotkin Sauber team next year.

Seriously.  I like Sauber and this just sounds disasterous.


Edited by Seanspeed, 13 October 2013 - 21:17.


#115 DS27

DS27
  • Member

  • 1,092 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2013 - 21:21

How well you rate him really depends on what you think of Hulkenberg.

I have thought for some time that he is very, very good, and seeing as most people now seem to agree with this, you have to take this into account. If Esteban was partnered with Chilton, we might all be saying he was the next Alonso.

Edited by DS27, 13 October 2013 - 21:22.


#116 Seanspeed

Seanspeed
  • Member

  • 14,527 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 13 October 2013 - 21:26

How well you rate him really depends on what you think of Hulkenberg.

I have thought for some time that he is very, very good, and seeing as most people now seem to agree with this, you have to take this into account. If Esteban was partnered with Chilton, we might all be saying he was the next Alonso.

Gutierrez only barely beat Chilton last year in GP2. 



#117 sopa

sopa
  • Member

  • 3,226 posts
  • Joined: April 07

Posted 13 October 2013 - 21:33

Yea Gutierrez is hardly a future champ. But at least it is good to see he is not out of his depth in F1.

 

Anderis likes to compare finish times and he was again his usual "Di Resta gap" behind.



#118 Kyo

Kyo
  • Member

  • 853 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2013 - 21:39

Off topic but i'd say, all things considered, BOTTAS has shone this year, its just the car hasn't put his performances into the limelight, he, overall, has been the better of the two Williams drivers and has a rookie i'd say that very impressive, Pastor might be reckless but he's quick and more experienced. Canada was only a glimpse but it was a fantastic performance, his season kind of reminds me of Hulk's debut year.

Comparing to Maldonado, Bottas is doing a great season considering he is a rookie. That said, I can't see how Bottas has been the better of the two Williams since Maldonado finished ahead more often than not and achieved one 10th place and three 11th while Bottas only achieved one 11th. And Bottas is by far the most prepared rookie to enter the sport since the testing bans since he spent an entire year doing rookie tests and FP1 sessions.



#119 scheivlak

scheivlak
  • Member

  • 11,742 posts
  • Joined: August 01

Posted 13 October 2013 - 22:02

Come on... Recently, the only one that shined in his debut season was Hamilton, not even Alonso.

I take it you didn't follow 2001 very closely.



Advertisement

#120 Mendel

Mendel
  • Member

  • 148 posts
  • Joined: September 10

Posted 13 November 2013 - 20:57

Off topic but i'd say, all things considered, BOTTAS has shone this year, its just the car hasn't put his performances into the limelight, he, overall, has been the better of the two Williams drivers and has a rookie i'd say that very impressive, Pastor might be reckless but he's quick and more experienced. Canada was only a glimpse but it was a fantastic performance, his season kind of reminds me of Hulk's debut year.

 

It´s very hard for Bottas to shine in that dog of a car. Maldonado also has more point than him. But I guess someone noticed since Valtteri will drive for them next year and Pastor will not.



#121 sheogorath

sheogorath
  • Member

  • 300 posts
  • Joined: December 11

Posted 13 November 2013 - 21:30

It was Pastor who decided to leave, not the other way around.



#122 DS27

DS27
  • Member

  • 1,092 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 14 November 2013 - 08:29

Gutierrez only barely beat Chilton last year in GP2. 

 

 

And we could say that Bianchi is barely beating Chilton, but apaprently he's the second coming.



#123 Disgrace

Disgrace
  • RC Forum Host

  • 10,167 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:02

How do we feel about him one year later given his latest example of disastrous racing ability? I think it's clear that he has learnt nothing and has out-stayed his welcome in F1.



#124 DutchQuicksilver

DutchQuicksilver
  • Member

  • 1,985 posts
  • Joined: June 11

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:04

Why is this clown still in F1? He's even worse than Maldonado. There's better drivers out there who have money to bring. Someone like Nasr for example could help Sauber out next year.



#125 bub

bub
  • Member

  • 2,480 posts
  • Joined: July 11

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:05

I haven't noticed him much this season because Sauber are nowhere but that was a very poor move today. I don't know what he was thinking. I don't think he's a particularly bad racer in general though.



#126 Jejking

Jejking
  • Member

  • 2,433 posts
  • Joined: June 11

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:11

I was thinking back to Kovalainen vs Vergne (instigator) at Europe 2012. That was stupid as well and we know how that ended... for Vergne. I rate Gutierrez lower by the way.



#127 MaxisOne

MaxisOne
  • Member

  • 1,221 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:19

Its time... 

 

He cannot possibly retain his seat next year.. Sauber you cant be that desparate.



#128 Jimisgod

Jimisgod
  • Member

  • 2,808 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 07 September 2014 - 15:41

The Sauber is a beautiful car this year. Pity it is shockingly slow and the drivers are useless. Probably Sauber's worst season ever.

They're kidding if they think Gutierrez can lead them out of the malaise.

#129 Viceroy

Viceroy
  • Member

  • 336 posts
  • Joined: January 01

Posted 07 September 2014 - 18:49

The Gutierrez defenders have become silent, they are not hailing their "better than Di Resta" hero anymore


Edited by Viceroy, 09 September 2014 - 23:28.


#130 Wheels23

Wheels23
  • Member

  • 416 posts
  • Joined: November 09

Posted 08 September 2014 - 03:42

I want to see how he goes with a non crappy car. He has had some good races like Monaco which he threw away but like I remember Massa spinning out and causing mistakes at the start of his career. He is not bad compared to worse I've seen. 



#131 Jimisgod

Jimisgod
  • Member

  • 2,808 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 08 September 2014 - 05:39

He's a Badoer or Gene level talent. Kind of shows moments of competence but is mostly below average.

Maybe Gachot or Diniz level, but he's still not even a midfield runner in a car that was midfield last year.

He's the kind of guy who might have made a good test driver when they mattered.

#132 wj_gibson

wj_gibson
  • Member

  • 2,249 posts
  • Joined: January 05

Posted 08 September 2014 - 06:23

Personally I think Badoer and Gene better talents. Badoer was a F3000 champion after all. Gutierrez is more like Patrick Friesacher or Zsolt Baumgartner really.