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Red Bull dominance - harm for the sport?


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Poll: Red Bull dominance - harm for the sport? (382 member(s) have cast votes)

Does RB's four-year long dominance harm F1?

  1. Yes, it does. (205 votes [53.66%])

    Percentage of vote: 53.66%

  2. No, it doesn't. (177 votes [46.34%])

    Percentage of vote: 46.34%

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#451 Winter98

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 23:18

I live in Canada too - and it's not the calendar. Not for me, anyway. I've been watching F1 for 30 years now, and let me tell you - the coverage available here now is streets ahead of what it was in 1984 or 85 when you were lucky to pick up a half hour highlight package on Wide World of Sport. Even after that, in the mid to late 80s when they started to carry full races, they often aired them at "their convenience" - which generally meant midnight or after. 

 

I agree that I don't like the summer break... too long. But the coverage we have now is amazing. it's the competition at the front that isn't. 

Whereabouts in Canada do you guys reside?  I'm on the wetcoast (sic).

 

It's great getting full race broadcasts (I remember the dark days), but the times do suck.  5am here.  :(



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#452 Bruce

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 23:35

Whereabouts in Canada do you guys reside?  I'm on the wetcoast (sic).

 

It's great getting full race broadcasts (I remember the dark days), but the times do suck.  5am here.  :(

 

 

Oh dear - if you're in BC than it IS a little tougher for you - I'm in Toronto - the 3 hour difference actually probably makes quite a difference. 

 

Still - I've gotten in the habit of not watching them live (for various reasons)  - I usually see them an hour or two after they finish. I just have to be very careful to ignore tweets, this site, and other media outlets prior to my viewing....



#453 weareracing

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 23:36

I'm just puzzled and curious how Sebastian could gap the field by 2-3 seconds a lap after the safety car period on a used set of tyres.

I know he's an exceptional talent in a dominant car but to destroy the opposition like that   :up: 

Personally I feel privileged to watch him race, not many drivers in the history of F1 have achieved so much.

I guess if Fangio or Clark were racing today they would be booed too   :down:  



#454 Cyanide

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Posted 22 September 2013 - 23:38

I'm not convinced by Vettel's pace today. 

 

In Monza, we saw that Kimi and Lotus had similar speed to Vettel. Too bad there were 23 cars between them. And in Singapore, Kimi was setting fast laps, and a fastest one actually after pitting for super softs. Again, grid place hindered any challenge whatsoever, along with traffic. 

 

I believe in the last 2 races Lotus have been matching the Red Bulls in long run pace, or they have been the only ones relatively close to them. But their single lap performance is not enough for them to challenge Vettel. Even if they qualify 5th or 6th, by the time they can climb up to 2nd, Vettel will be well ahead and impossible to catch. 


Edited by Cyanide, 22 September 2013 - 23:39.


#455 repete

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 00:33

I'm just puzzled and curious how Sebastian could gap the field by 2-3 seconds a lap after the safety car period on a used set of tyres.

I know he's an exceptional talent in a dominant car but to destroy the opposition like that   :up:

Personally I feel privileged to watch him race, not many drivers in the history of F1 have achieved so much.

I guess if Fangio or Clark were racing today they would be booed too   :down:  

its not puzzling at all. RBR/Vet were going to pit once more, they were decided on that approach. So they went full tilt until the tires gave up in hope of getting a big enough lead to pull off the pit and still fight with the SC pitters.

 

What Mercedes and Rosberg did 100% aided RBR/Vettel's plan. They had used Medium tires on also, but were conserving tires after the SC, I guess in hope to try and make the distance. Which backed up the entire field, ultimately this allowed RBR/Vet to pull a monstrous 30+second gap to Alonso and allow him to come out with the lead. Merc/Ros tires were not falling off when they decided to pit him, I am suspecting they figured they would not make it to the end so pitted early to allow more time to make up the lost positions.



#456 Tron

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 05:16

 So you say, even a Monkey would be faster in a Red Bull than Mark Webber??

 

After a certain point of a championship, every team concertrates it's efforts on the stronger driver, factual, and even a monkey would know if Vettel wasn't at Redbull, Webber would have been WDC a couple of times already.



#457 aray

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 06:05

RB will be dominant again in 2014 and Vettel will clinch his 5th straight title.... :wave:



#458 ClubmanGT

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 06:10

After a certain point of a championship, every team concertrates it's efforts on the stronger driver, factual, and even a monkey would know if Vettel wasn't at Redbull, Webber would have been WDC a couple of times already.

 

Or the one that comes from the country with the biggest market for their product. You only have to cast your mind back to when the team said they'd back both drivers evenly (while Webber was ahead of Vettel in the WDC) and when Vettel got ahead, Webber was expected to fall into line. 



#459 F1ultimate

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 07:10

Red Bull's performance this weekend was crushing. A couple of races ago Merc emerged as a potential title challenger and was catching up with the Bull, but now the gap looks bigger than ever. Sure everyone can start looking forward to 2014 but the way Red Bull has improved the past races while working on the 2014 will surely give other teams sleepless nights and concerns for the coming year.



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#460 f1motogp

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 13:29


 

Cry me a river! Sour grapes is all that this thread is about.
Domination in sports is inevitable, it has been there and will remain forever, It's up to others to do a better job and finally they will.
RB/ Vettel dominance will come to an end someday and then after a while some other driver/team will start dominating f1 but until then RB/Vettel wont care at all that some people aren't enjoying it or that they rate other drivers/teams higher than them.
If your favorite driver was dominating it you not only wouldn't have had any problem with it but also would have enjoyed it more and more.



#461 EthanM

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 13:47

Or the one that comes from the country with the biggest market for their product. You only have to cast your mind back to when the team said they'd back both drivers evenly (while Webber was ahead of Vettel in the WDC) and when Vettel got ahead, Webber was expected to fall into line. 

 

redbull's biggest market is the states not germany, and the UK is actually bigger than Germany so let's see ... English speaking, UK based Aussie should on paper be the better marketing tool. Fail conspiracy theory?

 

chart.jpg


Edited by EthanM, 23 September 2013 - 13:47.


#462 Bruce

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 14:36

If your favorite driver was dominating it you not only wouldn't have had any problem with it but also would have enjoyed it more and more.

 

Wrong. I enjoy competition. A close and spirited win by any driver - especially your favourite - is far more exciting than an easy and predictable win form the front. 

 

If the above is how YOU feel - that's fine - but it doesn't follow that everyone shares your opinions or predilections. 



#463 Bruce

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 14:36

RB will be dominant again in 2014 and Vettel will clinch his 5th straight title.... :wave:

 

 

Sadly, I think you're right... I'll still watch every race though. 



#464 discover23

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 14:51

Part of the reason why I did not push really hard to go to the race this year at Singapore was because of RedBull's domination-- I am sure that there are other fans like me out there who are on the same boat.  I attended Montreal & Hungary this year and the overall experience was great and I do not regret going, however after the race I left somewhat empty, specially Hungary..This feeling is what makes me think twice now if I should go to Austin or not. The thrill of watching an F1 race live is awesome but you start getting mixed emotions when you realize that your favorite driver/team has no real chance at winning the race.   Attending these races is not cheap and at some point you start to wonder if you are really getting the most from your buck - and I really really hope this changes next year. 

 

By the way, I am in no way justifying the booing, I never do it.. but I can understand how some personalities can turn their disappointment into a disrespectful action. Some people are just stupid like that, they snap easily and it has nothing to do with racing or f1 but with their character.



#465 tifosi

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 15:48

I don't know about harmful, but I notice here on Atlas F1, the NASCAR threads tend to generate far more actiivty and interest than teh F1 threads.

 

Maybe boring isn't the right word, but certaintly 100% predictable outcome is becoming sort of pointless as fas as following the sport anymore.  Less you think this is simply fanboyism, my favorite period of the sport was between 86 and 92, hardly a period of Ferrari wins.



#466 totgate

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 15:59

Red Bull is doing a fantastic job both on the track and earlier this year when they where lobbying for more durable tyres. Thanks a lot all you people who was moaning over "Crap Pirellis" just because some teams didnt use the tires as instructed by Pirelli. Its all you tire moaners that gifted the championship to Red Bull.....



#467 jimbox01

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 09:41

Short of having an accident and missing the rest of the season, they might as well declare Vettel/RB champions now.

Mercedes (Wolff) have given up, they think SV can win all the remaining races.

Ferrari (Alonso) say they're pinning their hopes on next year.

Lotus etc. have absolutely no hope.

 

We all know the final outcome, it's just a question of the details now, but then I'm not that bothered about who comes third and fourth in the WDC, or who's second in the WCC - doesn't help either when you can't watch all the races live.  At least in 2000 to 2004 I could watch all the races live, I didn't have to pay to see Schumacher/Ferrari win everything.



#468 Tract1on

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 10:15

The last three races were so boring and predictable. Agreed about the tires, why was everyone asking for more durable tires, its made it even easier for them....

Totally sick of Vettel and his one finger salute, its become soooooo boring it is *just* like the Schumacher domination 2000-2004 era all over again, its hard not to see them continue on and on like this.

Actually i am going to cancel my Sky contract, i only got it for the F1 (HD package) and im not enjoying F1 enough to pay for it.....

Sure i'll miss the live coverage but i prefer the BBC coverage anyway.

I hope to god that 2014 isn't more of the same....


Edited by Tract1on, 24 September 2013 - 10:20.


#469 Longtimefan

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 10:16

I've been an F1 fan since 1970 but yes, I feel it is bad for the sport.

If a hardcore F1 nut like myself is turning the TV over 20 laps into a race, perhaps lots of casual fans are turning off after lap 1.

I don't dislike RBR or Vettel, but I am very tired of the Newey rocketships. Also I find it hard to rate Seb and I would love to see him in a non Newey car just so we can better judge his talent.

Back to the topic, yes its bad when it gets like it is currently, when the race is over after lap 1, there is a problem.

#470 apoka

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 10:33

Red Bull is doing a fantastic job both on the track and earlier this year when they where lobbying for more durable tyres. Thanks a lot all you people who was moaning over "Crap Pirellis" just because some teams didnt use the tires as instructed by Pirelli. Its all you tire moaners that gifted the championship to Red Bull.....

 

Although it has to be said they were already leading WDC/WCC when they moaned. Given their record in Asian races, I think this didn't change the outcome too much. Actually, we don't even know how much the tyres helped them.



#471 Nonesuch

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 12:33

Red Bull is doing a fantastic job both on the track and earlier this year when they where lobbying for more durable tyres. Thanks a lot all you people who was moaning over "Crap Pirellis" just because some teams didnt use the tires as instructed by Pirelli. Its all you tire moaners that gifted the championship to Red Bull.....

 

Cosmas over on F1Fanatic.co.uk made this table, showing that the difference in results between the two tyres is rather exaggerated.

 

f85iCv5.jpg



#472 Asterion

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 13:01

Been watching F1 for 15 years now, and my wife was surprised to see me not watch the whole grand prix last weekend. So predictable, it's downright sad. Another year of total domination next year and I may quit watching for good. 



#473 mtojay

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 13:09

Been watching F1 for 15 years now, and my wife was surprised to see me not watch the whole grand prix last weekend. So predictable, it's downright sad. Another year of total domination next year and I may quit watching for good. 

 

 

feel free to leave. nobody forces you to watch formula 1. it may get predictable by now. but if you watch f1 for 15 years, i wonder what you did when schumacher won with ferrari. if you really was following that time, you would knew that it has been more boring at times. the action in the races these days are more intense ;-) last years championship was decided in the last race with the guy who won it in the end spinning in the first lap, following by a furious comback in that race.

 

there are basically two options:

a) you enjoyed it and was a schumacher/ferrari fan and didnt mind the domination.

b) you didnt even watch, else you would knew

 

so, to be honest, both options are kind of dumb. pretending to be a long f1 fan might even be more idiotic than option one. but if its option one, it seems as if you are one of the "few" bitter ferrari fans who cant deal with being dominated like they did years ago. actually quite funny to see. :clap:  :clap:  :clap:


Edited by mtojay, 24 September 2013 - 13:10.


#474 Asterion

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 18:10

Man, don't be so upset at the thought of me leaving. It's only F1, mtojay... Hope you keep enjoying it though. :)

Have a good day sir.

#475 pacwest

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 19:12

Whereabouts in Canada do you guys reside?  I'm on the wetcoast (sic).

 

It's great getting full race broadcasts (I remember the dark days), but the times do suck.  5am here.  :(

 

 

I'm in BC too. On the Island. I download my races. I cancelled cable. F1 was the only thing holding me to cable vision. But recently, I have lost interest, after following since I was in my teens ('80s).

 

Watching Singapore, right after the safety car I looked at the clock (noonish) and thought, "Vettel wins, screw this". I stopped my Apple TV playing it, went to formula1.com and looked at the results.

 

"Not a true race lover." "Racing is in the pack." All these excuses can't really do much for me when we have so many world champions vying for wins and I'm getting bored.  Maybe the turbos will change things for a bit.



#476 Infinityl

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 22:48

Sorry but it is BS for me. I was happy when Ferrari was dominant. These days it's red Bull, we a have to accept it, Ferrari and others have just to do a better job, and it's very low to diminish Vettel title like that.

 

If it was Alonso in the Red Bull, you will say he is great etc...

 

Of course not. Thanks to God Alonso is in Ferrari and we have seen some fight for the championship in 2010 and 2012, with Alonso in a dominant car you have a permanent 2011.



#477 Raven8

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 22:56

Season is over, excitement is gone. I can't be bottered to watch the races live. Maybe qualy. but 'll I decide after the result on Sunday, if I rewatch the race



#478 Tron

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 05:06

Or the one that comes from the country with the biggest market for their product. You only have to cast your mind back to when the team said they'd back both drivers evenly (while Webber was ahead of Vettel in the WDC) and when Vettel got ahead, Webber was expected to fall into line. 

 

picard-facepalm.jpg

 

Of course not. Thanks to God Alonso is in Ferrari and we have seen some fight for the championship in 2010 and 2012, with Alonso in a dominant car you have a permanent 2011.

 

And so, you've just contradicted your comment as you completely diminished Vettel's title with that. :rolleyes:



#479 apoka

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 05:24

Season is over, excitement is gone. I can't be bottered to watch the races live. 

 

I think that's the main reason why many posts in here are so bitter about RB/Vettel lately. The WDC battle is almost over with 6 races to go and people just vent their frustration.



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#480 bourbon

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 05:35

So you people only like to watch F1 if there is a fight for the lead?   Watching Great wheel to wheel by Kimi, Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel, Button, Perez, Maldonado, Grosjean, et al., behind whoever is in the lead isn't interesting?  That is a shame - I love it.


Edited by bourbon, 25 September 2013 - 05:36.


#481 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 07:00

Red Bull is doing a fantastic job both on the track and earlier this year when they where lobbying for more durable tyres. Thanks a lot all you people who was moaning over "Crap Pirellis" just because some teams didnt use the tires as instructed by Pirelli. Its all you tire moaners that gifted the championship to Red Bull.....

 

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that Pirelli don't make their decisions, based off of autosport forum comments. :D



#482 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 07:02

Been watching F1 for 15 years now, and my wife was surprised to see me not watch the whole grand prix last weekend. So predictable, it's downright sad. Another year of total domination next year and I may quit watching for good. 

 

The last 10 laps were awesome, shame you missed it.  Fortunately, it's the race I care about, not about who wins.  There are 20 other cars out there.


Edited by HoldenRT, 25 September 2013 - 07:03.


#483 Cult

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 07:15

I was a huge Schumacher fan but seasons like 2002 and 2004 hurt the sport. Seasons like 2011 and 2013 also do.

 

It's time for a change in regulations. Red Bull are getting too ruthless for their own good, I can't believe they blocked Sauber's proposal to substitute a day of testing for a day of windtunnel testing. The FIA need to equalise the playing field else this advantage will continue for years, especially if the Renault engine isn't (much) worse.



#484 Cyanide

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 07:33

So you people only like to watch F1 if there is a fight for the lead?   Watching Great wheel to wheel by Kimi, Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel, Button, Perez, Maldonado, Grosjean, et al., behind whoever is in the lead isn't interesting?  That is a shame - I love it.

 

You have to understand that whatever's happening between 2nd and 8th makes no difference if we know halfway through the season who will seal the championship. Because in the long run, people watch a season-long F1 to see who gets the title. And it gets boring when at the 9th race out of 19, you already know who'll be crowned. 



#485 Tron

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 08:41

You have to understand that whatever's happening between 2nd and 8th makes no difference if we know halfway through the season who will seal the championship. Because in the long run, people watch a season-long F1 to see who gets the title. And it gets boring when at the 9th race out of 19, you already know who'll be crowned. 

 

Yip, it's like Senna said, second place is the first loser, and it's like a watching a film while already knowing the ending. It's a bit... Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz



#486 tifosiMac

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:04

The more committed enthusiast will watch F1 whatever happens. However I know people who are more casual fans and take a glancing interest who have stopped watching completely due to the predictability of the championship. I know many here would say it is no loss to lose people who aren't as knowledgable as us, but its not as simple as that. The more people watching the more attention the sport gets and if it gets boring for some and they turn off, it slips from the forefront of peoples minds. F1 doing its all to move on to pay TV isn't helping the popularity either. there are a vaiety of things harming the sport at the moment not just Red Bulls dominance.



#487 Nemo1965

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:05

I think the thread-title is all wrong and represents the flawed concept of a lot of posters here. It should read 'Is the Vettel/Red Bull-dominance bad for the sport?' It has been said a thousand times but I will say it again: the dominance is by Vettel and Red Bull. If the car itself was really dominant, Webber would have racked up the second places in races and soforth, much like Barichello did in the Ferrari-dominance years, or like Riccardo Patrese did in 1992 next to Mansell (when indeed any driver could have won in the Williams). If Vettel or a driver of his class had not driven the Red Bull, the team would have won at most two or three grand prix this year. But Vettel is just those few tiny bits quicker than Webber (two tenths, three sometimes) at critical moments, which puts the Red Bull in places in which he save his tyres, so at certain moments he is much, much quicker during races.

 

So, is the dominance of Vettel in the Red Bull bad for the sport? Well, the question is: is Vettel the best driver of this moment? I think he is. Would I like more tension myself? Yes. But sport is about the hope that the best 'may' win. And the best wins, in my view. If the current race-fans can't see and accept that, all the worse for the current-racefans.



#488 Tron

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:22

The more committed enthusiast will watch F1 whatever happens. However I know people who are more casual fans and take a glancing interest who have stopped watching completely due to the predictability of the championship. I know many here would say it is no loss to lose people who aren't as knowledgable as us, but its not as simple as that. The more people watching the more attention the sport gets and if it gets boring for some and they turn off, it slips from the forefront of peoples minds. F1 doing its all to move on to pay TV isn't helping the popularity either. there are a vaiety of things harming the sport at the moment not just Red Bulls dominance.

 

That's not cool to generalize people based on your dedication towards the sport. I've been watching F1 since 81, I collect the memorabilia, the DVD reviews, waste my time on such forums, go to live races whenever possible, and just because I choose to not watch every lap of races where the same winner that I do not support is obvious, doesn't mean I'm not a committed enthusiast, rather I got other things to do with my time.

 

And to blame the sport's decline (?) on people that don't patriotically support every lap , is a weak excuse to get fans to watch something they don't enjoy which is their opposing team continously winning.

 

I'll say it again, I support the red cars. When they're out, I linger for some action towards other favoured drivers, and if they're not in the position to win, I'm not going to waste my time in watching a car that's painted in electric vomit lead every lap.

 



#489 tifosiMac

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:32

That's not cool to generalize people based on your dedication towards the sport. I've been watching F1 since 81, I collect the memorabilia, the DVD reviews, waste my time on such forums, go to live races whenever possible, and just because I choose to not watch every lap of races where the same winner that I do not support is obvious, doesn't mean I'm not a committed enthusiast, rather I got other things to do with my time.

 

And to blame the sport's decline (?) on people that don't patriotically support every lap , is a weak excuse to get fans to watch something they don't enjoy which is their opposing team continously winning.

 

I'll say it again, I support the red cars. When they're out, I linger for some action towards other favoured drivers, and if they're not in the position to win, I'm not going to waste my time in watching a car that's painted in electric vomit lead every lap.

 

Sorry tron but I think you have completely misunderstood the points I was making. I was not suggesting those who don't watch every lap are not committed enthusiasts. I am a committed enthusiast and don't watch every lap of the races because I can't. When I said the enthusiast would watch whatever happens, I meant they will watch as much as is available. The coverage has been sold to pay TV and that is totally out of my price range. That doesn't mean I am not following the sport or in anyway a lesser fan than anybody else. I was saying the TV companies have made access more difficult for fans on that basis. My points about the casual fans was purely on their lesser knowledge due to interest level and with the same person winning the championship, it is more of a turn off. I know people who I used to be able to discuss the sport with and who watched every race, but have stopped watching as often because of Vettel. This isn't the same excuse for everybody but the point I was making was all these factors have harmed the sport.

 

I urge you to re-read what I wrote and apply the context that was intended. I wasn't having a dig at enthusiasts like yourself because you don't watch every lap. I am in the same boat as you! :)


Edited by tifosiMac, 25 September 2013 - 09:34.


#490 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 10:18

You have to understand that whatever's happening between 2nd and 8th makes no difference if we know halfway through the season who will seal the championship. Because in the long run, people watch a season-long F1 to see who gets the title. And it gets boring when at the 9th race out of 19, you already know who'll be crowned. 

 

Does that mean that if the championship is decided with 3 races to go, that the final 3 races are meaningless?

 

Not to me, to me each F1 weekend, has been like an event in itself.  That's why they get a trophy.  It could have no bearing in the championship but be the best race of the season.  A close championship is just like icing on the cake to me, sometimes it can add to the tension and be great.. but most times it means little to me.  It's the same with most sports.. whether it's basketball or football or something else.  Who wins the whole thing, and how enjoyable the season was, seem like two different things.  But everyone's different I guess.  I can only think of one season since I've started watching where the driver I wanted won the championship, Alonso in 2006.  And yet, I've still enjoyed most other seasons seperate from who wins or not.



#491 Der Pate

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 10:33

Maybe those 3 races could be the best of the year, as there would be no tactics regarding points and championship...



#492 Tron

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 12:20

Sorry tron but I think you have completely misunderstood the points I was making. I was not suggesting those who don't watch every lap are not committed enthusiasts. I am a committed enthusiast and don't watch every lap of the races because I can't. When I said the enthusiast would watch whatever happens, I meant they will watch as much as is available. The coverage has been sold to pay TV and that is totally out of my price range. That doesn't mean I am not following the sport or in anyway a lesser fan than anybody else. I was saying the TV companies have made access more difficult for fans on that basis. My points about the casual fans was purely on their lesser knowledge due to interest level and with the same person winning the championship, it is more of a turn off. I know people who I used to be able to discuss the sport with and who watched every race, but have stopped watching as often because of Vettel. This isn't the same excuse for everybody but the point I was making was all these factors have harmed the sport.

 

I urge you to re-read what I wrote and apply the context that was intended. I wasn't having a dig at enthusiasts like yourself because you don't watch every lap. I am in the same boat as you! :)

 

Fair enough, and thanks for the reply. Also apologies for reading it with a countering tone in my head, a major weakness of the internet as we can't hear the person's voice. ;)

 

And yes, I agree now with your point. And to be honest, these days I record certain races before watching them, then if the result positive, I watch it fully, or fast foward to the moments of excitement.

 

Give me back the days between McLaren vs Williams vs Ferrari where it was anyone's race till the checkered flag... or just give me all of Schumacher's years. :p

 

I also think another harm to the sport is that the cars are bullet proof like in the video game. There's no more the agony of a supported car slowing down, or the joy of a opposing car going up in smoke.

 

And for me, the biggest harm to the sport is DRS that killed off defensive driver. No more those truly great races where a race finished with cars sworming behind each other.



#493 Arry2k

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 12:35

If a hardcore F1 nut like myself is turning the TV over 20 laps into a race, perhaps lots of casual fans are turning off after lap 1.
 

I dare say they wouldn't even turn the TV on in the first place.



#494 Asterion

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 12:38

The last 10 laps were awesome, shame you missed it.  Fortunately, it's the race I care about, not about who wins.  There are 20 other cars out there.

Didn't miss it. TV was off for the mid-race though.

 

First time I heard there are 20 cars out there. Thanks!


Edited by Asterion, 25 September 2013 - 12:39.


#495 f1motogp

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 12:54

Wrong. I enjoy competition. A close and spirited win by any driver - especially your favourite - is far more exciting than an easy and predictable win form the front. 

 

If the above is how YOU feel - that's fine - but it doesn't follow that everyone shares your opinions or predilections. 

 

You mean if your favorite drivers/teams won all the races you would become sad!?
Of course i prefer the more exciting and hard fought wins but i don't dislike the easier wins.

The question here is if redbull's domination is harmful to the sport which i don't think so, otherwise only Ferrari/Schumacher fans would have remained following f1 between 2000 and 2005.



#496 ThomFi

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 12:57

Fair enough, and thanks for the reply. Also apologies for reading it with a countering tone in my head, a major weakness of the internet as we can't hear the person's voice.  ;)

 

And yes, I agree now with your point. And to be honest, these days I record certain races before watching them, then if the result positive, I watch it fully, or fast foward to the moments of excitement.

 

Give me back the days between McLaren vs Williams vs Ferrari where it was anyone's race till the checkered flag... or just give me all of Schumacher's years. :p

 

I also think another harm to the sport is that the cars are bullet proof like in the video game. There's no more the agony of a supported car slowing down, or the joy of a opposing car going up in smoke.

 

And for me, the biggest harm to the sport is DRS that killed off defensive driver. No more those truly great races where a race finished with cars sworming behind each other.

 

That's easy, just stop supporting Ferrari and join the Red Bull camp. Retirements because of gearboxes, KERS, alternators, loose wheel nuts, etc, there is everything.


Edited by ThomFi, 25 September 2013 - 13:02.


#497 Coral

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 13:13

So, is the dominance of Vettel in the Red Bull bad for the sport? Well, the question is: is Vettel the best driver of this moment? I think he is. Would I like more tension myself? Yes. But sport is about the hope that the best 'may' win. And the best wins, in my view. If the current race-fans can't see and accept that, all the worse for the current-racefans.

 

But that's the thing...we don't really know whether Vettel is the best driver of this moment. Personally I don't think he is...I think Alonso is. Red Bull could have put Alonso (or Kimi) in that car alongside Vettel and we would know for sure...but they didn't...instead they gave Vettel a whipping-boy like Ricciardo as his new team-mate. Does anyone really think that Ricciardo will be able to challenge Vettel next season? Because I certainly don't. Vettel is perceived by many to have it too easy, and it is becoming a turn-off.



#498 Winter98

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 13:21

But that's the thing...we don't really know whether Vettel is the best driver of this moment. Personally I don't think he is...I think Alonso is. Red Bull could have put Alonso (or Kimi) in that car alongside Vettel and we would know for sure...but they didn't...instead they gave Vettel a whipping-boy like Ricciardo as his new team-mate. Does anyone really think that Ricciardo will be able to challenge Vettel next season? Because I certainly don't. Vettel is perceived by many to have it too easy, and it is becoming a turn-off.

It's hard to blame Vettel for that, he can only play the cards he is dealt.

 

Red Bull appear to be quite happy with his performances, which is why they went for a driver who is going to be, imo, a solid #2 for the next season or two.



#499 jimbox01

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 16:02

The more I think about it, the more I realise that not having all the races live does make a very big difference.

 

Can't rationalise it, but edited highlights just don't do for me, so I end up knowing the results before it's shown on the BBC, which means unless something dramatic has happened, it's hardly worth watching.

 

Only watching live BBC races meant the season didn't start until China, then 2x 4 week gaps between races, a 3 week gap, then an 8 week break, 2 weeks to Monza, then 5 weeks until Suzuka (3 weeks still to go), then we have a short 2 weeks to India, and 4 weeks until the last race of the season.

 

Yes I could get Sky (but we don't have planning permission for a dish), or I could fork out to watch online (we've only just got usable broadband), but I'm not a die hard SV/RB fan, and resent the idea of being blackmailed (by Sky) into buying a service I don't really want and won't use - except for F1.

 

It doesn't mean I've completely lost interest in F1, just following it in a different way, but I image if enough people stop watching it will eventually have an impact.  Then again, provides new circuits keep signing up, and the TV companies keep paying the fees, why should anyone in F1 care about losing a few million off the audience figures.  The only people it's going to matter to are the smaller teams struggling to attract sponsors, but then no one cares about them either.

 

 

Lack of live F1 I'll learn to live with, but completely losing Moto GP is a huge blow - I'm seriously considering taking out a subscription to their online service.  Just got 16-20mb broadband through a community/rural scheme, and if I switch to BT for 'free' BT Sport the speed drops to a level where it's impossible to view live online TV.



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#500 Rubens Hakkamacher

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 17:51

Vettel pulls out a second gap after one corner side by side with Nico?

Then the safety car Magic Gap?

 

But qualifying is still relatively "close"?

 

That's not Adrian Newey aero magic, that's horse power-getting to the track-magic. 

 

He pulled away from Hamilton at Spa on the Kimmel Straight like he had DRS open. 

 

It's either magic, or...

"Shennanigans!"