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'I don't want to be that far ahead.' - Hamilton


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#51 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:38

I seem to remember him talking to Red Bull before Mercedes. He would have chosen them over Mercedes I think.

You know what they were talking about?

When Hamilton made his decission last year, he had the fastest car on the grid, faster than RBR.He lead the race & pulled away from Vettel at Singapore 2012. He could have been WDC if not McLaren f++ed up



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#52 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:39

I know you have nothing to be sour about.  So what's your excuse?  :stoned:

 

The article is from the BBC which is headlined 

Lewis Hamilton: Sebastian Vettel does not deserve to be booed

others headlined it:

 

That is the context.  Lewis thinks the booing is happening largely because of Sebi's ongoing car advantage.  It's pretty obvious that he (and even Sebi who knows) would rather NOT be booed but win with a dazzling herioc struggle.  That's what's not rocket science.

 

I read the article at a different website. I have already mentioned the source. The headline there states.. 

 

" I don't want to be like Vettel ." 

 

I didn't want to create more drama with that headline and Hamilton doesn't actually say that, so I changed the caption and quoted him. He clearly says that he wouldn't want to dominate like Sebastian and that he's having it easy. It's not like I'm misquoting him. I don't know why you're trying to single me out. Please read the full article first.



#53 Burtros

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:39

Whats Vettel supposed to do, crash into a wall on purpose now and again so others can keep up? If Lewis was in this position, would he do that? Simple fact is they are all striving to be the best, no one is going to take their foot of the gas because they dont want to be 'too good'

 

Its also laughable to suggest Hamilton is some kind of warrior hero who relishes battles all the time. He relishes world titles and thats a bigger and more important fact - and what I think drives comments such as these.

 

While I dont think the comments are good or bad, I do think its a silly thing to say.



#54 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:43

He's got a really good car and he's maximising everything. I'll just compare him to the other three world champions and title contenders for the past three races in comparison to their team mates, so you really understand how difficult it is to put it all together.

 

Regardless, Vettel may have had the best car, but like the rest of the season, he's not left any stone unturned. He simply just maximises everything and never lets up.

This is all irrelevant.  The thread we're in is an old-fashioned mean-spirited Hammy bash thread, which you started on a flimsy pretext.



#55 andrewf1

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:44

If you look at most of Lewis' wins, the most important ones are all pretty much action packed or in challenging conditions and i really believe he enjoys that - starting from the battle with fernando in usa 2007, safety-car ridden canada 2007, fuji 2007, silverstone 2008, monaco 2008, germany 2008, belgium 2008, turkey 2010, spa 2010, canada 2010, china 2011, germany 2011, canada 2012, austin 2012 and hungary 2013 - they really all have that 'fight with others for the win' character. Of course, he's sometimes had it easy as well, but i believe that's a minority of cases.

 

Vettel has had hard earned wins too and even the ones which seem easy always require no mistakes, perfect concentration and the ability to maximize every opportunity which comes in his way.



#56 BenettonB192

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:44

I doubt he would mind dominating a championship. A small dig at Seb in there but Hamilton also sounds more humble and relaxed about his situation nowadays. Compare that to some of the things he said early in his career when he already considered himself the next Senna.

 

So Hamilton says what every Seb fan doesn't want to hear, that from Seb's on board, in hammy's opinion, Seb's not even on the limit - which means the car is such a monster that even when you don't max it out you're still 2 seconds faster than anyone... I believe hammy but I suppose we'll hear the "what about Webbo" comments and questions about why if the car is such a beast doesn't Webbo produce the same results, (as if we don't also know reason for that).

 

Everybody has his opinion. Lauda who i would consider at least as competent as Hamilton talking about these things said after the race that he has rarely seen anyone drive so well.



#57 Watkins74

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:44

Will any top driver think they are that far ahead because of the car and not themselves?



#58 bub

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:45

You know what they were talking about?

 

What do you think they were talking about?

 

When Hamilton made his decission last year, he had the fastest car on the grid, faster than RBR.He lead the race & pulled away from Vettel at Singapore 2012. He could have been WDC if not McLaren f++ed up

 

What are you trying to say? That Hamilton leaves teams when he thinks the car is too good? That he'll leave Mercedes if they build the best car? That Lewis actively avoids getting the best cars because he would prefer not to win?


Edited by bub, 23 September 2013 - 21:49.


#59 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:47

This is all irrelevant.  The thread we're in is an old-fashioned mean-spirited Hammy bash thread, which you started on a flimsy pretext.

 

If you have an issue, I suggest you report to the moderators. I did not start this topic to bash anyone. I just felt that Hamilton was a little jealous and I felt like sharing it with everyone and having some opinions and discussions. Your crying out my foul intentions doesn't make my intent foul. If you want to add to the discussion in a healthy way, let's discuss or I can't care more as to what you think of my intentions. 



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#60 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:47

Media picking a headline where there is little substance.

 

The facts are in another interview, Lewis says Vettel has done a great job this year and complimented the team. Both have said really nice things about each other this year, and they clearly get on these days.

 

There is no real story or "dig" here in my opinion.



#61 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:47

He's got a really good car and he's maximising everything. I'll just compare him to the other three world champions and title contenders for the past three races in comparison to their team mates, so you really understand how difficult it is to put it all together.

 

BELGIUM - Spa Francorchamps.

 

Qualifying - Race

 

Vettel P2 - P1 

Webber P3 - P5

 

Alonso P9 - P2

Massa P10 - P7

 

Hamilton P1 - P3

Rosberg P4 - P4

 

Raikkonen P8 - RET

Grosjean P7 - P8

 

ITALY - Monza

 

Qualifying/Race

 

Vettel P1 - P1

Webber P2 - P3

 

Alonso P5 - P2 (allowed to pass Massa)

Massa P4 - P4

 

Hamilton P12 - P9

Rosberg P6 - P6

 

Raikkonen P11 - P11

Grosjean P13 - P8

 

SINGAPORE 

 

Vettel P1 - P1

Webber P4 - P15 (Ret)

 

Alonso P7 - P2

Massa P6 - P6

 

Hamilton P5 - P5

Rosberg P2 - P4

 

Raikkonen P13 - P3

Grosjean P3 - (Ret)

 

From the above, the last three races : 

 

1) Vettel has out-qualified and out raced Webber on all occasions. (6-0)

2) Alonso has been out-qualified twice and out raced Massa on all occasions. (4-2)

3) Hamilton has been out-qualified twice and been out raced twice by Rosberg. (2-4)

4) Raikkonen has been out-qualified twice and been out raced twice by Grosjean.*

*Raikkonen did suffer with reliability/sickness/incidents, so his stats are blurred.

 

Regardless, Vettel may have had the best car, but like the rest of the season, he's not left any stone unturned. He simply just maximises everything and never lets up.

Webber is not a team mate this seson he is worse than Massa anyone would be better in the 2nd RBR even Chilton. Vettel had easy wins and easy qualys at all those races you listed. This 6-0 from Vettel over Webber is just another proof how easy he has it, he has no competiotion in his team,and a superior car while Hamilton has the strongest team mate of all them and not an superior car

*BTW Hamilton had a puncture at Monza wich held him back in the race

He never lets up like at Hungary qualy?



#62 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:51

Whats Vettel supposed to do, crash into a wall on purpose now and again so others can keep up? If Lewis was in this position, would he do that? Simple fact is they are all striving to be the best, no one is going to take their foot of the gas because they dont want to be 'too good'

 

Its also laughable to suggest Hamilton is some kind of warrior hero who relishes battles all the time. He relishes world titles and thats a bigger and more important fact - and what I think drives comments such as these.

 

While I dont think the comments are good or bad, I do think its a silly thing to say.

He would have stayed at Mclaren and not have moved to an supposed inferior team,  if he would relish  titles more than challenges or batttels.



#63 V3TT3L

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:54

'I don't want to be that far ahead... that's why I turned down beying WDC in my first year'

#64 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:54

Media picking a headline where there is little substance.

 

The facts are in another interview, Lewis says Vettel has done a great job this year and complimented the team. Both have said really nice things about each other this year, and they clearly get on these days.

 

There is no real story or "dig" here in my opinion.

 

Can you send me the link to the full artcle?

 

I also think Fernando and Sebastian are getting along. Notice, Sebastian's reaction in Singapore when Alonso receives his trophy and Alonso's acknowledgement to Vettel's reaction. I thought it was a cool moment. Up there with the Coulthard champagne shower.  :p



#65 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 21:56

I read the article at a different website. I have already mentioned the source. The headline there states.. 

 

" I don't want to be like Vettel ." 

 

I didn't want to create more drama with that headline and Hamilton doesn't actually say that, so I changed the caption and quoted him. He clearly says that he wouldn't want to dominate like Sebastian and that he's having it easy. It's not like I'm misquoting him. I don't know why you're trying to single me out. Please read the full article first.

I read the article.  I read Lewis saying ""But this is the way it is. It's definitely not a positive thing to hear he has been booed. He's on his way to his fourth world championship, and he needs all the credit he deserves."

 

You created this thread saying he's "bitter" but the evidence is firmly against you.  Why did you start the thread? What was your motive?

 

So you've been challenged, is all.  Singled out, sure.  Put on the spot, dude, and you're wriggling  :D . 



#66 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:08

What do you think they were talking about?

 

 

What are you trying to say? That Hamilton leaves teams when he thinks the car is too good? That he'll leave Mercedes if they build the best car? That Lewis actively avoids getting the best cars because he would prefer not to win?

He left the team to seek the challenge, to battel  to help the team to imporove and come on top

He could have stayed at McLaren who where thought to have a very good car 2013 where he won 4 races that year , and went to Mercedes who struggled to get points

If Hamilton really only wanted to win he would have stayed at McLaren as their chances for wins and championships had been much better than at Mercedes for 2013

How where the odds before the start of the 2013  to win  for Mercedes and how for McLaren. How many experts and former drivers called Hamilton decision stupid to leave a winning team like McLaren , for Mercedes?

If Hamilton would relish winning more than battling he would have stayed at McLaren, because their chances for the future looked much better end of 2012, than those at Mercedes.



#67 F1 Tor.

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:09

All athletes want to dominate. Whoever tells you differently is lying. Admitting publicly, now that's another matter altogether. :wave:



#68 TomNokoe

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:12

If you're gonna use the stupid team mate argument... as if Grosjean, Massa or Webber have the raw pace, consistency, motivation and team support of Rosberg at Mercedes. It's obvious you have an agenda against Lewis and it's laughable you couldn't actually come up with a credible argument as to why he is somewhat fallible at times, despite their being a few validish arguments.

#69 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:13

Can you send me the link to the full artcle?

 

 

Sure

 

Vettel complimenting Lewis -http://www1.skysport...him-this-season

 

Lewis complimenting Seb - http://www.autosport...t.php/id/109787



#70 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:14

Can you send me the link to the full artcle?

 

I also think Fernando and Sebastian are getting along. Notice, Sebastian's reaction in Singapore when Alonso receives his trophy and Alonso's acknowledgement to Vettel's reaction. I thought it was a cool moment. Up there with the Coulthard champagne shower.  :p

You did not even read it??



#71 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:18

All athletes want to dominate. Whoever tells you differently is lying. Admitting publicly, now that's another matter altogether. :wave:

Win yes, dominate- no. There is a difference, and it matters how you win.



#72 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:21

All athletes want to dominate. Whoever tells you differently is lying. Admitting publicly, now that's another matter altogether. :wave:

The part you're missing is that they want to be thought of as the best.  NOT to just happen to have the best car.  They are not track athletes.

 

Best DRIVER, okay?

 

I'm not saying Sebi isn't great, I'm saying Lewis is saying HE doesn't want to get booed and be thought of as just a good driver in the best car.  He would rather fight for it.  And maybe Sebi would too, but obviously he has to drive the car he's given to the max whatever.



#73 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:23

You did not even read it??

He is talking about the article I was talking about.



#74 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:25

Sure

 

Vettel complimenting Lewis -http://www1.skysport...him-this-season

 

Lewis complimenting Seb - http://www.autosport...t.php/id/109787

 

Wow. I'd read the second article before, but not the first. Very nice to hear that they're getting along. 



#75 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:27

Wow. I'd read the second article before, but not the first. Very nice to hear that they're getting along. 

Indeed, its kinda of tragic that they get on well, but their fans choose at times to bitch like 5 years old's at one another (not a dig at yourself btw)


Edited by sennafan24, 23 September 2013 - 22:27.


#76 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:27

The part you're missing is that they want to be thought of as the best.  NOT to just happen to have the best car.  They are not track athletes.

 

Best DRIVER, okay?

 

I'm not saying Sebi isn't great, I'm saying Lewis is saying HE doesn't want to get booed and be thought of as just a good driver in the best car.  He would rather fight for it.  And maybe Sebi would too, but obviously he has to drive the car he's given to the max whatever.

this is why Schumacher is not regarded as the best of all time by the many of F1 fans & experts

When you ask them the most will answer Senna, not even Prost who won more titles/races



#77 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:30

this is why Schumacher is not regarded as the best of all time by the many of F1 fans & experts

When you ask them the most will answer Senna, not even Prost who won more titles/races

And so they f****** well should   ;)



#78 quasi C

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:31

He's just trolling Seb.

Correct.



#79 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:31

I read the article.  I read Lewis saying ""But this is the way it is. It's definitely not a positive thing to hear he has been booed. He's on his way to his fourth world championship, and he needs all the credit he deserves."

 

You created this thread saying he's "bitter" but the evidence is firmly against you.  Why did you start the thread? What was your motive?

 

So you've been challenged, is all.  Singled out, sure.  Put on the spot, dude, and you're wriggling  :D . 

 

So, you only read the part you wanted to? 

 

"I look at Sebastian's laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers. When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so."

 

"It's every driver's dream to have a car to be able to fight, but me, I don't want to be that far ahead. I want to be able to fight with him, or whoever."

 

I don't believe he's being honest with a few of these statements. I just wanted a second opinion and a healthy discussion. I didn't put up a bash fest. It's not my style. In fact, if you would care to follow a few of my posts, I've defended Lewis on a few occasions in my limited time spent here. But then, I can't post to please everyone. Someone or the other tends to take you out of context. It's not the first time it's happened and it won't be the last time either. Not that I haven't done it. 

 

Just my last attempt to make you believe that bashing Lewis wasn't on my agenda with this thread. Just chill. 


Edited by Schuttelberg, 23 September 2013 - 22:32.


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#80 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:37

this is why Schumacher is not regarded as the best of all time by the many of F1 fans & experts

When you ask them the most will answer Senna, not even Prost who won more titles/races

 

So you expect everyone to regard one guy as the best? It doesn't matter. Schumacher will have his fans, as will Senna and as will Prost. 

 

To say some fans and experts don't regard someone as the best of all time is a pretty lame come back. I admire Senna a lot. I whole heartedly am a Schumacher fan, but after having watched a lot of Senna, read about him and what not, even I sometimes side with him when it comes to picking an all time best. But, if you're going to sell the "How you win" and the moral protocol to me and advertise "Senna" for it, I think you're talking about some other sport and some other Senna. He was as ruthless as any of the sports legends. It's what you need to have as a sportsman. 

 

The reason Senna is revered so much is because winning meant more to him than his life. He could over step a few rules to win, but also put his life on the line for a fellow driver. He just had that enigmatic magic about him. Please don't try sell the fact that he was some sort of 'saint' on the race track. He was cut from the same cloth that all successful racing drivers are.. "They want to win and win at all costs."


Edited by Schuttelberg, 23 September 2013 - 22:39.


#81 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:37

He is talking about the article I was talking about.

the article went up & down F1 media. Kind of "common knowledge" for a discussion about Vettel/Hamilton



#82 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:40

the article went up & down F1 media. Kind of "common knowledge" for a discussion about Vettel/Hamilton

Maybe give him the benefit of the doubt, I think I used to post with Schuttelberg on another forum and I can vouch for him, it is easy to take him the wrong way  but there is no harm to him. 


Edited by sennafan24, 23 September 2013 - 22:40.


#83 ThomFi

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:43

Hamlet don't want to be that far ahead. Well, he is not anyway. He is living his dream. Everyone should be happy.



#84 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:45

Maybe give him the benefit of the doubt, I think I used to post with Schuttelberg on another forum and I can vouch for him, it is easy to take him the wrong way  but there is no harm to him. 

 

Oh thank god! Now I know who you are mate.  :wave:

 

I kind of had a feeling, but so many 'senna fan' nicknames around. Good to see you.  :clap:



#85 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:47

the article went up & down F1 media. Kind of "common knowledge" for a discussion about Vettel/Hamilton

 

I didn't read the part where Vettel says he's started getting along with Hamilton. Even if I didn't it's not my job/responsibility. I felt like having a discussion and I don't understand the issue you guys are having with it??



#86 Seanspeed

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:49

This is the bitter part:

 

"It's not depressing. It's nothing new. I look at Sebastian's laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers. When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so."

 

I also don't blame him for being bitter, either.  But when he says right before that that Vettel needs all the credit he deserves, its a bit contradictory.  I don't expect many Lewis fans will see that, but its pretty clear to me.



#87 surbjits

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:49

Standing on the podium while lamenting the TO is enough. Maybe he should have fought with Nico. But like i said : words are easy. Actions are harder.

 

Ouch.
 



#88 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:50

So you expect everyone to regard one guy as the best? It doesn't matter. Schumacher will have his fans, as will Senna and as will Prost. 

 

To say some fans and experts don't regard someone as the best of all time is a pretty lame come back. I admire Senna a lot. I whole heartedly am a Schumacher fan, but after having watched a lot of Senna, read about him and what not, even I sometimes side with him when it comes to picking an all time best. But, if you're going to sell the "How you win" and the moral protocol to me and advertise "Senna" for it, I think you're talking about some other sport and some other Senna. He was as ruthless as any of the sports legends. It's what you need to have as a sportsman. 

Ask the team bosses ask the drivers, ask the ex drivers. Most of them will answer Senna

Because it matters how they drive & how they win. Dominating the sport doesn't make you the gratest & best driver in the world. My example was Schumacher

 

Hamiltons  is more like Senna than like Schumacher . Is it so hard to believe he prefers to fight for a win than to cruise for it?



#89 surbjits

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:52


 

Regardless, Vettel may have had the best car, but like the rest of the season, he's not left any stone unturned. He simply just maximises everything and never lets up.

 

And that's what's enraging folk :lol:



#90 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:52

So, you only read the part you wanted to? 

 

"I look at Sebastian's laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers. When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so."

 

"It's every driver's dream to have a car to be able to fight, but me, I don't want to be that far ahead. I want to be able to fight with him, or whoever."

 

I don't believe he's being honest with a few of these statements. I just wanted a second opinion and a healthy discussion. I didn't put up a bash fest. It's not my style. In fact, if you would care to follow a few of my posts, I've defended Lewis on a few occasions in my limited time spent here. But then, I can't post to please everyone. Someone or the other tends to take you out of context. It's not the first time it's happened and it won't be the last time either. Not that I haven't done it. 

 

Just my last attempt to make you believe that bashing Lewis wasn't on my agenda with this thread. Just chill. 

There's no bitterness in what he said. No dishonesty either.  He's not asking for such a huge advantage as the Red Bull; he'd be happy to be able to fight with him, as he said; isn't asking for such an advantage, and wouldn't want the booing that's been going with it looking so easy.  Too simple to misunderstand IMO.

 

So obviously I don't think your OP and posting are honest. I'm not exercised about it so don't tell me to chill.  Address my points or suck my opinion up, is how it works.  If you keep arguing I might too, so if it makes you feel victimised I suggest you just don't reply.



#91 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:56

This is the bitter part:

 

"It's not depressing. It's nothing new. I look at Sebastian's laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers. When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so."

 

I also don't blame him for being bitter, either.  But when he says right before that that Vettel needs all the credit he deserves, its a bit contradictory.  I don't expect many Lewis fans will see that, but its pretty clear to me.

There is nothing bitter in it, he is simply telling the truth, Vettel has a dominant car, he has not to push to the limit Therfore he has it much easier to win than for the other drivers

It's easier to win in a dominant car than in a not dominant



#92 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 22:59

Ask the team bosses ask the drivers, ask the ex drivers. Most of them will answer Senna

Because it matters how they drive & how they win. Dominating the sport doesn't make you the gratest & best driver in the world. My example was Schumacher

 

Hamiltons  is more like Senna than like Schumacher . Is it so hard to believe he prefers to fight for a win than to cruise for it?

 

So you're saying every team boss and ex-driver considers Senna the greatest? Hamilton is more like Senna than Schumacher? 

 

Dude, I know a lot of team bosses who consider Senna as the greatest and I know a lot of them who consider Schumacher as that. Get some team bosses from the Fangio era and there will be quite a few that nominate him. It's an endless debate because it involves human opinion which varies and cannot be quantified ever. What you are doing is responding in a vague manner. You're almost stating Senna as the best of all time as fact. It's not. It's your opinion. Belittling the achievements of Schumacher is highly easy. For once, just ask yourself how many 7 championships are? 



#93 spacekid

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:03

Ask the team bosses ask the drivers, ask the ex drivers. Most of them will answer Senna

Because it matters how they drive & how they win. Dominating the sport doesn't make you the gratest & best driver in the world. My example was Schumacher

 

Hamiltons  is more like Senna than like Schumacher . Is it so hard to believe he prefers to fight for a win than to cruise for it?

 

I'm sorry, I'm finding all this a bit nauseating.

 

Hamilton is more of a 'fighter' than Schumi? Really? Don't make me laugh.

 

Michael was exactly like Senna in that regard - he fought damn hard for titles, and way over stepped the mark in the process. If Schumacher wasn't fighting for a title all through 1997 what the hell was he doing, waiting for it to be handed to him? What was he doing in 1998, twiddling his thumbs until Ferrari got their shit together?

 

Hamilton wants the challenge of winning in not the best car? So now he's at Merc? Really? It isn't just that the working relationship with McLaren soured to the point he wanted to be anywhere else but there?


Edited by spacekid, 23 September 2013 - 23:04.


#94 Seanspeed

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:03

There is nothing bitter in it, he is simply telling the truth, Vettel has a dominant car, he has not to push to the limit Therfore he has it much easier to win than for the other drivers

It's easier to win in a dominant car than in a not dominant

Its possible to both tell the truth and be bitter at the same time.



#95 Schuttelberg

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:05

There's no bitterness in what he said. No dishonesty either.  He's not asking for such a huge advantage as the Red Bull; he'd be happy to be able to fight with him, as he said; isn't asking for such an advantage, and wouldn't want the booing that's been going with it looking so easy.  Too simple to misunderstand IMO.

 

So obviously I don't think your OP and posting are honest. I'm not exercised about it so don't tell me to chill.  Address my points or suck my opinion up, is how it works.  If you keep arguing I might too, so if it makes you feel victimised I suggest you just don't reply.

 

Why the bloody hell should I suck your opinion up? It's my opinion that there's some bitterness to Hamilton's statements and you're no one to come here and shove your opinion down people's throats. You don't like it? Don't post. It's my topic, as much my forum as it is yours. I've tried more than once to explain how I interpreted it and I can't help it if you can't get it. 



#96 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:06


This is the bitter part:

 

"It's not depressing. It's nothing new. I look at Sebastian's laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers. When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so."

 

I also don't blame him for being bitter, either.  But when he says right before that that Vettel needs all the credit he deserves, its a bit contradictory.  I don't expect many Lewis fans will see that, but its pretty clear to me.

This is it in context:

 

"Asked if he was depressed by Vettel's consistent dominance of F1 with Red Bull, Hamilton said: "It's not depressing. It's nothing new.

"I look at his laps on the on-board camera and it doesn't appear as though he is on the limit like some other drivers.

"When you have that much in hand it makes it that much easier to do so. At the end of the day he does the job he needs to do.

"They've also made a step somewhere on the car this weekend, but I still feel like we can fight at some point through the weekends for the rest of the season."

That is not "bitter".  

"Bitter" is a value-laden word as you and the OP know of course, and of course if he were bitter you for sure would blame him :drunk: .  But there is none of that nastiness in what Lewis said.  



#97 sennafan24

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:11

I'm sorry, I'm finding all this a bit nauseating.

 

Schumacher never fought for titles? Really? Michael was exactly like Senna in that regard - he fought damn hard for titles, and way over stepped the mark in the process. If Schumacher wasn't fighting for a title all through 1997 what the hell was he doing, waiting for it to be handed to him? What was he doing in 1998, twiddling his thumbs until Ferrari got their shit together?

 

Hamilton wants the challenge of winning in not the best car? So now he's at Merc? Really? It isn't just that the working relationship with McLaren soured to the point he wanted to be anywhere else but there?

I agree that Schumi was a real scrapper, as the examples you gave are accurate.

 

But Schumi does have a reputation (rightfully or wrongly) for ensuring he would have all the advantages so he would not have to fight on equal terms with teammates and other driver. 

 

Eddie Irvine does dismiss these accusations as rubbish, so it is not all one way and you would think Irvine being as outspoken as he is would have a lot to say on the matter. Most fan, critic and driver polls do cite Senna as the best, something I greatly agree with. The largest polls among fans I saw F1 Fanatic had Senna voted number 1, with Schumi second. And Senna again won the largest drivers poll, with Schumi second. A large survey I saw that asked who was better out of Senna/Schumi had Senna with 63 percent and Schumi at 27, the rest thought they were equal (google it if you want to see it)

 

That said, it is entirely subjective. there is no real definitive answer. I value relative performances and my own personal observations, over the stats that Schumi produced, but I do not dismiss Schumi's WDC's entirely. I could write more but this has drifted greatly off topic.


Edited by sennafan24, 23 September 2013 - 23:11.


#98 undersquare

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:13

Why the bloody hell should I suck your opinion up? It's my opinion that there's some bitterness to Hamilton's statements and you're no one to come here and shove your opinion down people's throats. You don't like it? Don't post. It's my topic, as much my forum as it is yours. I've tried more than once to explain how I interpreted it and I can't help it if you can't get it. 

Lol, chill dude.  You haven't explained anything.  Your opinion is struggling against the evidence.



#99 Neolew

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:15

Media twisting Hamilton's words into another bashing episode again...

 

Better drivers than vettel such as hamilton,raikkonen and Alonso can try to put in qualifying laps to catch vettel but thats pointless because racing against adrian newey GP is impossible when the car is 2 seconds faster than the field..also EVERY single one of sebs wins are from a Adrian newey designed car including the Toro Rosso STR3 , Raikkonen,Hamilton and alonso are proven race winners in inferior cars

 

Mark webber this season reminds me of Michael Schumachers teammates at benetton who always got the inferior car and reliability issues(illegal fuel filter valves to reduce pitstop times, launch control and traction control software . )   I am not calling vettel a cheat but its clear that the soon to be departing Mark webbers huge performance gap isn't just down to raw driver skill...


Edited by Neolew, 23 September 2013 - 23:17.


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#100 Raven8

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Posted 23 September 2013 - 23:16

I'm sorry, I'm finding all this a bit nauseating.

 

Hamilton is more of a 'fighter' than Schumi? Really? Don't make me laugh.

 

Michael was exactly like Senna in that regard - he fought damn hard for titles, and way over stepped the mark in the process. If Schumacher wasn't fighting for a title all through 1997 what the hell was he doing, waiting for it to be handed to him? What was he doing in 1998, twiddling his thumbs until Ferrari got their shit together?

 

Hamilton wants the challenge of winning in not the best car? So now he's at Merc? Really? It isn't just that the working relationship with McLaren soured to the point he wanted to be anywhere else but there?

Sorry, how will you know about Hamiltons relationship with McLaren?

all the pundits said Hamilton seeked the challenge at Mercedes,and  he could have stayed at McLaren

It was about how you win and if dominating the sport is the real aim of any athlethe? And if a dominating drive is really seen as the greates driver, if this is what ANy F1 driver wants.