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RBR vs Ferrari where is the differences?


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#1 ZuTiMa

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 14:19

Hi, I'm new to the Tech Forum so please excuse if Im asking something that has been discussed.

 

I would like to know more as to why and what is the differences between these to cars?

Why is there such a big performance gap between the 2?

 

Does it have to do with the engines that have been frozen for the last few years?

Does it have to do with some form of EBD?

Does it have to do with engine mappings?

Where is the big difference with aero?

Is there perhaps some form of launch / traction control?

 

I'm no boffin but would like to get better idea why there is such a big gap?

 

Thanks

 



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#2 dynatune

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 15:34

I presume anyone that could answer your question would be directly hired by Ferrari !! .... Although to a newbie the gap may seem enormous, in objective terms by definition in F1 the gap is within 7% (the famous 107% rule for not qualifying). Considering that Ferrari and RBR are not miles apart if on every of your item there is a 1% difference between them (talking about effect on laptime) you would arrive at 104% (leaving out launch control), which would class Ferrari halfway on the grid. So most likely the difference is less and putting my logic to the extreme there might be only 0,5% difference in every area between the cars ..... not such a big gap after all ..

F1 is all about attention to detail to give you the winning edge, there are no easy big hitters, welcome to F1 :clap:

 

Cheers,

dynatune, www.dynatune-xl.com



#3 munks

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 17:13

I wouldn't be surprised if the answer is "mostly aero". I can't locate the source right now, but at some point in 2011 or 2012, I read that the bottom F1 team (probably Marussia) had something like 40% less downforce than the top team (think it was McLaren) at one of the races. Of course one would have to take into account the trim level, could be Marussia felt they would be better off with less drag.



#4 MatsNorway

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 18:11

There is a combined reason for their success. But the biggie is perhaps named Newey. And Newey and co i suspect has a bigger focus on aero than any of the other teams. Thats why we see the narrowest, skinniest and most innovative designs year after year.

 

When KERS was new. And Mclaren++ was running a big chunk of batteries. Red Bull opted to run a smaller package to get superior aero. Lotus (now caterham) did also good in the the beginning without KERS. But did not really improve once they got it.

 

Another thing they do well is evolution. They don`t make a brand new car every year. They find what works and keeps it. Mclaren makes a brand new car every year, thats hard to do.



#5 Kelpiecross

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:09

If it wasn't for Alonso Ferrari would not do very well at all. I think that he is probably a better all-round driver than that German bloke.

#6 Wuzak

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 11:30

Lotus (now caterham) did also good in the the beginning without KERS. But did not really improve once they got it.

 

Team Lotus (now Caterham), Virgin (now Marussia) and HRT (now defunct) all ran the Cosworth when they entered F1, which didn't have a KERS availble for use with it. Not that the teams could afford that anyway.

 

Marussia still run Cosworths and still don't have KERS. So the fact that they are consistently beating Murussia would suggest that Caterham is getting some benefit from KERS (which they got when they signed up with Renault).



#7 ZuTiMa

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 13:53

One of the reasons I asked the questions I did in the OP was that somewhere with all my reading F1 related stuff on the net I read that some fans at track side during race weekends noticed a distinct different tone to the car when in a corner and exiting it... someone said it sounded like it could be running on 4 or 6 cylinders ( dont know if 6 is posssible?)



#8 munks

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 14:58

If it wasn't for Alonso Ferrari would not do very well at all. I think that he is probably a better all-round driver than that German bloke.

All (or nearly all) team bosses agree with you. And I think this is a good point, that the driver makes a noticeable difference - one engineer suggested Alonso is worth a second over some of the pay drivers at the other end of the grid.

 

Newey's career has proven he knows what the hell he's doing. Same thing for Alonso, actually, when you compare him against his teammates.



#9 MatsNorway

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 15:30

Marussia still run Cosworths and still don't have KERS. So the fact that they are consistently beating Murussia would suggest that Caterham is getting some benefit from KERS (which they got when they signed up with Renault).

Sounds like a false positive. They where sniffing at points without KERS and they have still not scored a point..

 

And Alonso will for me be one of the biggest ever. Top 10 no problem


Edited by MatsNorway, 26 September 2013 - 15:48.


#10 Wuzak

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 00:38

Did Ferrari lose out when they raised the nose, RBR style, in 2011?

 

http://img692.images...31/f150side.jpg

 

McLaren have seemed to have lost out in the transition too.

 

Lower noses next year, though.