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2013 Korean Grand Prix race day


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#851 active

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 15:33

:lol:

 

This year will be the fifth consecutive year the team bosses will rate Vettel as having been better than Hamilton, so your claim is somewhat debatable, to say the least.

 

 

Team bosses are not the gospel word and either way its no surprise they would believe this considering how flattered Vettel has been at redbull by his machinery, sort of like Massa was rated as one of the best on the grid when he spent a number of seasons in rocketships, yet as we saw how things turn around.



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#852 active

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 15:34

 

weren't Webber supposed to be one of big guys, at least some people were marking him like that back then when he was young (oh god, Mark was young :o)

 

 

Yep one of the big guys with best finishing position of 5th before 2009.



#853 fred54

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:26

(Tried to find this info in this thread, but only skim read.)

 

When the jeep/course car came out on the track the safety car was behind the entire field? What exactly happened after that? I ask because I only had BBC highlights and they cut most of it out. I presume because the safety car sign was out the cars single filed themselves around the track and the safety car just waited on track and picked them up?



#854 Winter98

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:41

Team bosses are not the gospel word and either way its no surprise they would believe this considering how flattered Vettel has been at redbull by his machinery, sort of like Massa was rated as one of the best on the grid when he spent a number of seasons in rocketships, yet as we saw how things turn around.

To be fair, Massa suffered a horrific accident.  It would be understandable if it affected his driving.



#855 Alfisti

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:51

Team bosses are not the gospel word and either way its no surprise they would believe this considering how flattered Vettel has been at redbull by his machinery, sort of like Massa was rated as one of the best on the grid when he spent a number of seasons in rocketships, yet as we saw how things turn around.

Massa never looked anything like Vettel does, not even close.



#856 Lukenwolf

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:04

When were they team mates with Hamilton? Never right? What a ridiculous statement. Hamilton see's himself and Alonso as the two best drivers on the grid, as do many people, maybe even the majority, so his comments make perfect sense. He has proven to be clearly better than all those drivers you listed, other than Alonso.

 

Its obvious that Alonso and Hamilton feel the same way Senna did in the early 90s, and also Schumacher in the  90s, when they were frustrated at being dominated by Newey machines. History just repeating.

 

Then maybe they should do what Schumacher did. Ignore the fact that your car is shyte and win anyways. All the while build your team into a force that can beat the raw stuffing out of newey for 5 years on the trot. Ferrari beat the Newey machines so comprehensively it took him a full 10 years until be built a winning machine again. But you don't do that by whining how it is beneath yourself to race for 5th. I think Lewis has a rather strange sense of entitlement. If memory serves me right, he started from 2nd on the grid. If he wound up 5th, whose failure is that?


Edited by Lukenwolf, 08 October 2013 - 02:05.


#857 syolase

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:12

Then maybe they should do what Schumacher did. Ignore the fact that your car is shyte and win anyways. All the while build your team into a force that can beat the raw stuffing out of newey for 5 years on the trot. Ferrari beat the Newey machines so comprehensively it took him a full 10 years until be built a winning machine again. But you don't do that by whining how it is beneath yourself to race for 5th. I think Lewis has a rather strange sense of entitlement. If memory serves me right, he started from 2nd on the grid. If he wound up 5th, whose failure is that?

Merc's milage and engine mapping (they have to start like +20kg to everyone else, thanks to the engine mapping freeze, before they got mclaren style exhaust)



#858 Lukenwolf

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:20

Can you please explain to me what the engine mapping freeze has to do with weight?



#859 V3TT3L

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:03

Can you please explain to me what the engine mapping freeze has to do with weight?

Maybe that an engine more thirsty has to strat the race with more gas, therefore more weight.

 

If Merc could change the engine mapping, things could be solved.


Edited by V3TT3L, 08 October 2013 - 03:10.


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#860 Lukenwolf

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:05

Merc could change the engine mapping at the start of the season. Engine development has been frozen for quite some time now. I doubt they only recently found out about it.



#861 syolase

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:17

Can you please explain to me what the engine mapping freeze has to do with weight?

Coanda style exhaust needs more fuel to work, but its the same for everyone. The problem at merc is that they used a non coanda exhaust before the engine map freeze, so its not optimized for that kind of use, so they have to burn even more fuel to get it to work. A lot more actually. The +20kg maybe an exaggeration, because thats the difference between coanda and non coanda (see first comment on the page: http://www.f1technic...1978&start=3945) but they still have to burn more fuel, so they have to carry more fuel, and that is a huge hindrance at the starts. So its no surprise that they go backwards every first lap.



#862 HeadFirst

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:24

Then maybe they should do what Schumacher did. Ignore the fact that your car is shyte and win anyways. All the while build your team into a force that can beat the raw stuffing out of newey for 5 years on the trot. Ferrari beat the Newey machines so comprehensively it took him a full 10 years until be built a winning machine again. But you don't do that by whining how it is beneath yourself to race for 5th. I think Lewis has a rather strange sense of entitlement. If memory serves me right, he started from 2nd on the grid. If he wound up 5th, whose failure is that?

Michael did that all by himself???? :rotfl:



#863 Lukenwolf

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:34

Michael did that all by himself???? :rotfl:

 

In a way he did. I doubt Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne could have been lured to Ferrari without Schumacher already being there. Then there was Schumachers obsession with testing. He was a certified car mechanic himself, so he had a tad more engineering knowledge than the average driver, which helped a lot with car development. When he came to Ferrari, they were the laughing stock of the paddock. He was instrumental in getting the team straightened as he was always known for his obsession with details.



#864 HeadFirst

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:54

In a way he did. I doubt Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne could have been lured to Ferrari without Schumacher already being there. Then there was Schumachers obsession with testing. He was a certified car mechanic himself, so he had a tad more engineering knowledge than the average driver, which helped a lot with car development. When he came to Ferrari, they were the laughing stock of the paddock. He was instrumental in getting the team straightened as he was always known for his obsession with details.

Schumie may have been the bait, but you must admit that Brawn, Byrne and others were instrumental in the success. And of course Michael's obsession with testing, doesn't really apply to today's F1, does it?



#865 Lukenwolf

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:58

Schumie may have been the bait, but you must admit that Brawn, Byrne and others were instrumental in the success. And of course Michael's obsession with testing, doesn't really apply to today's F1, does it?

 

Of course there were instrumental, but the whole package must fit. Look at Merc, they bought off half of Lotus. Their staff should be slapping Newey from left to right, but I've not yet seen any of the 'magic' we saw at Ferrari. The Braw-Byrne-Schumacher combo was referred to as a dream team for a reason back in the day.



#866 Rinehart

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 09:24

Massa never looked anything like Vettel does, not even close.

But he was never rated as the best driver 4 years running or even once or talked about alongside the greats so the original point is false and therefore your point moot.