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Jake Humphrey - Drivers need to start doing a decent job


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#1 FastnLoud

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:37

"Lewis says Vettel domination dulls the show..don't blame Seb! The answer is for 21 other drivers to start doing a decent job & challenge him"

 

I think with the exception of a couple of drivers they are all flat out and doing a decent job these days, going against one of the quickest guys with the quickest car isn't an easy thing to do.

 

Quite suprised by these comments from Jake.



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#2 Lukenwolf

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:38

Is there a link?



#3 FastnLoud

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:47

Is there a link?

https://twitter.com/mrjakehumphrey



#4 V3TT3L

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:49

Lewis says Vettel domination dulls the show..don't blame Seb! The answer is for 21 other drivers to start doing a decent job & challenge him


Edited by V3TT3L, 07 October 2013 - 19:54.


#5 MikeV1987

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:52

Well it's true, do you expect RBR to purposely lose races for the sake of entertainment?


Edited by MikeV1987, 07 October 2013 - 19:53.


#6 fabr68

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:53

No. The 2012 kevlar tire rigged this year's "show"

#7 ApexMouse

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:53

Football hack is football hack.



#8 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:53

He is talking about this article

http://uk.eurosport....346293--f1.html

 http://forums.autosp...ation-hamilton/

That thread couldn't stay on topic so this thread is on a very short leash. 

 

Read the whole article. Lewis isn't blaming or criticising Vettel. 

 

Keep to the topic. 



#9 maverick69

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:54

Lol.

 

Would have been funny if he said that in 1992 and 1993.......



#10 trogggy

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:55

Silly comment..  Therefore probably good for 20 pages of bickering.



#11 Disgrace

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:56

"Twitter user has opinion" have threads of their own now?



#12 FastnLoud

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 19:58

Maybe he meant the teams not the drivers, although i'm not sure we have 21 teams in F1 :p

 

Anyway it was a silly comment but do people really think that drivers are not doing a decent job now?



#13 Lights

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:02

Nice to see he's still following the sport. From a distance.



#14 spacekid

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:03

I always suspected Jake didn't get the sport.

 

I'll say the same thing I said in the other thread - the point of F1 isn't that its a competition between drivers. The point of F1 is its a competition between teams of car builders.

 

Di Grassi can do the best job in the world and he isn't going to beat Seb in his current car, so this is a very silly statement from Jake.

 

If you put a great driver in a crap car he won't win. If you put a mediocre driver in the best car he might win. If you put the best driver in the best car, he will dominate. It has been ever thus in F1 - I honestly can't think of a time when this hasn't been the case.

 

To beat the Red Bull/Seb package it is up to the other teams to come up with a better package, and then have a driver lineup capable of exploiting the potential of that machinery.

 

I honestly believe that F1 would be better off if some fans actually understood what they are watching, and reading comments such as Jake's I honestly think a lot of people don't, and thats why they get frustrated. And broadcasters like him aren't helping by pushing the idea that its a sport more about drivers than teams fielding racing cars.


Edited by spacekid, 07 October 2013 - 20:07.


#15 undersquare

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:03

I think the other drivers as a group underestimate Sebi's contribution to his success, but still I and some millions of others are getting more and more desperate to see him in some other car and some other driver in that one.



#16 spacekid

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:07

I and some millions of others are getting more and more desperate to see him in some other car and some other driver in that one.

 

Why?



#17 Shiroo

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:09

Well RBR wanted new tyres, they got them. Let's blame everyone now, that they changed the stuff in the middle of the season. FI is nowhere, though they were strong, Ferrari isn't a contender, and RBR is dominant.

Awesome stuff. Now let's cry a river together and blame everyone for it.



#18 jjcale

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:23

What as astoundingly uninformed comment ... thank God he is not involved with F1 anymore .... only pity is that he was so good as a generic broadcaster that Sky has brought in an equally annoying clone ....who appears to understand even less of what is going around him 



#19 undersquare

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:28

Why?

Wot?  Are you really not curious how Sebi would go in a Ferrari or a Merc?  Or how Lewis or Nando would go in the Red Bull?

 

It seems to me the success is a partnership of a car and its driver perfectly matched - at least unless FIA interferes with blowing the diffuser.

 

It's a brilliant partnership that's too good for the rest of them.  Break it up, please, let's learn more about Vettel and about Red Bull and one of the others in it.



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#20 RealRacing

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:39

I'll say the same thing I said in the other thread - IMO the point of F1 isn't that its a competition between drivers. The point of F1 is its a competition between teams of car builders.

 

Fixed that for you. Some of us couldn't care less what team wins or the final result of the season in the WCC.

 

But can we say that, in 1988 and 1989, F1 was irrelevant because one team was dominating and almost lapping the whole field on every race? I'd say no because the competition between two of the best drivers in history was fantastic. In 1990 Prost moved to Ferrari and the competition was fantastic again. Would the same have happened if it had been a different driver than Prost? Probably not. It's more exciting to watch MS drive a Jordan than Irvine a Ferrari, Vettel a Toro Rosso than Webber a Red Bull, Kimi a Sauber than Massa a Ferrari.  It's the racing that should matter, not the car or the team. Put SV, LH, KR anf FA in equal cars and the racing will be a 1000 times better. It's the drivers man, they make the ultimate difference.



#21 spacekid

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:40

Wot?  Are you really not curious how Sebi would go in a Ferrari or a Merc?  Or how Lewis or Nando would go in the Red Bull?

 

It seems to me the success is a partnership of a car and its driver perfectly matched - at least unless FIA interferes with blowing the diffuser.

 

It's a brilliant partnership that's too good for the rest of them.  Break it up, please, let's learn more about Vettel and about Red Bull and one of the others in it.

 

Its normal for drivers to move around teams as circumstances require/dictate. But I personally have no requirement for them to do so. I honestly don't think F1 is a sport about drivers, nor do I think its the job of the teams to do things 'just' to entertain me. Seb and Red Bull can stay together for as long as it makes best sporting/competitive sense for them for all I care.

 

Take Seb out of the Red Bull and put in someone equal/better, you'll have the same domination, just with a different driver. Seb would not get as good results. I don't see the point. Take Seb out of the car and replace him with someone worse, then you've taken a high level of sporting ability that the package was demonstrating, and made it worse. I don't see the point in that either.

 

Rather than breaking up the Seb/Red Bull package for my viewing pleasure, I would much prefer to see another team(s) rise up to the challenge that is presented to them. If they can go about their business in a way that I find more charasmatic than the Seb/Red Bull package, then so much the better. But really for me F1 is primarily about achieving the highest levels of auto-racing, not needlessly shuffling things around to make it more 'interesting'.



#22 sennafan24

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:43

Discussions like this is why I wish in many ways that F1 was a Spec series.

 

I know profit and business will never allow that, and those with strong team preferences would prefer not to see it, but I would bloody love seeing all the drivers fight whilst using the same machinery. 

 

Mind you I think forums would die off if we did not have Seb to debate about at the moment!



#23 spacekid

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 20:45

Fixed that for you. Some of us couldn't care less what team wins or the final result of the season in the WCC.

 

But can we say that, in 1988 and 1989, F1 was irrelevant because one team was dominating and almost lapping the whole field on every race? I'd say no because the competition between two of the best drivers in history was fantastic. In 1990 Prost moved to Ferrari and the competition was fantastic again. Would the same have happened if it had been a different driver than Prost? Probably not. It's more exciting to watch MS drive a Jordan than Irvine a Ferrari, Vettel a Toro Rosso than Webber a Red Bull, Kimi a Sauber than Massa a Ferrari.  It's the racing that should matter, not the car or the team. Put SV, LH, KR anf FA in equal cars and the racing will be a 1000 times better. It's the drivers man, they make the ultimate difference.

 

Please don't do the 'fixed' thing to my posts. I honestly don't think I'm stating an opinion when I say that F1 is historically a competition between teams, not drivers. Thats how F1 started, that is how F1 has always been run, that is how F1 is set up to run for the forseeable future. I'm pretty sure that is fact.

 

Yes, the competition between Prost and Senna at McLaren was a great sporting rivalry, but McLaren didn't spend all that money building the car and paying the drivers to race their cars to produce that entertainment - it was just a consequence, not the aim.

 

Teams spend money to build cars to compete to win. They want to hire the best drivers to put in their cars, but they are not doing it for the benefit of the drivers. Sometimes that produces something very exciting to watch, sometimes it doesn't.


Edited by spacekid, 07 October 2013 - 20:48.


#24 skc

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:11

I wish an interviewer just once would have the balls to ask Lewis what he would do if he were in Vettels shoes/car. Would he be ok with being a bore?



#25 Longtimefan

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:14

Tbh I'm no fan of Jakey-boy, he's more of a footie fan than F1 fan and imo that makes his opinion null and void.



#26 undersquare

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:15

Its normal for drivers to move around teams as circumstances require/dictate. But I personally have no requirement for them to do so. I honestly don't think F1 is a sport about drivers, nor do I think its the job of the teams to do things 'just' to entertain me. Seb and Red Bull can stay together for as long as it makes best sporting/competitive sense for them for all I care.

 

Take Seb out of the Red Bull and put in someone equal/better, you'll have the same domination, just with a different driver. Seb would not get as good results. I don't see the point. Take Seb out of the car and replace him with someone worse, then you've taken a high level of sporting ability that the package was demonstrating, and made it worse. I don't see the point in that either.

 

Rather than breaking up the Seb/Red Bull package for my viewing pleasure, I would much prefer to see another team(s) rise up to the challenge that is presented to them. If they can go about their business in a way that I find more charasmatic than the Seb/Red Bull package, then so much the better. But really for me F1 is primarily about achieving the highest levels of auto-racing, not needlessly shuffling things around to make it more 'interesting'.

Well each to his own but IMO you're wishing for the moon.  You could wait forever for some other combination to match them.

 

For me I have an uncertainty about Sebi.  Is he that special?  Or just extremely good?  I would like to know and in that sense I do 'require' it lol.  Why do you phrase it like that?

 

And looking at Webber it's not a given than anyone else would go as well in that car as Vettel, week after week after week.  I'd like to know about that too.  For me, F1 is a study in excellence, and the Sebi+Red Bull question is well and truly answered and I'd like to move on to the next.



#27 ensign14

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:16

The Nobel Prize for Literature is being awarded this week.

 

Incidentally, Jake's book is now available for £3.99 in the remainder bookstores.

 

Think someone else needs to start doing a decent job.



#28 RealRacing

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:17

Please don't do the 'fixed' thing to my posts. I honestly don't think I'm stating an opinion when I say that F1 is historically a competition between teams, not drivers. Thats how F1 started, that is how F1 has always been run, that is how F1 is set up to run for the forseeable future. I'm pretty sure that is fact.


Yes, the competition between Prost and Senna at McLaren was a great sporting rivalry, but McLaren didn't spend all that money building the car and paying the drivers to race their cars to produce that entertainment - it was just a consequence, not the aim.
 
Teams spend money to build cars to compete to win. They want to hire the best drivers to put in their cars, but they are not doing it for the benefit of the drivers. Sometimes that produces something very exciting to watch, sometimes it doesn't.



Ok, there are two different things here: what is the point of F1 for fans and what is the point of F1 for teams/manufacturers.

Let's start with fans first. I don't think it can be said that for fans F1 is only a competition between teams without any further evidence. Until then, for illustration purposes, let's just say that if they had the Stig doing laps in all the calendar's circuits with one car of each team and give the championship to the team with the lowest aggregate time at the end of the year, F1 would be in trouble. And then, let's ask ourselves what would happen if the top five drivers in F1 decide they are going to compete in a spec series. How many of the F1 fans would switch to this series? I have a hunch that it'd be a lot of fans; I'd be one for sure(but I'm not saying it's a fact that the majority of fans would do the same until I have some factual evidence).

And now, what is the point of F1 for teams and/or manufacturers? IMO each team has many and different objectives. Teams representing or related to brands of consumer cars probably have engineering, technology, marketing, sales and other objectives, whereas others such as FI, Williams, Sauber and others don't have any clear commercial objective: they are in it to compete for the title of the best race car manufacturer with what it entails: money for placing in the WCC, prestige, personal satisfaction, etc.

But I think in the end no one can state for a fact that F1 is about the teams or about the drivers. It's probably a mixture of both.

Edited by RealRacing, 07 October 2013 - 21:18.


#29 EthanM

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:38

 

But can we say that, in 1988 and 1989

 

That was 25 years ago, and that ended with Prost having a clause in his Williams contract banning Senna. And when that clause run out Prost chose to retire. Since then Schumacher has won his titles alongside Barrichelo, Herbert and a litany of never was-es like Jos the boss and JJ Lehto, Hakkinen alongside Coulthard, Alonso alongside Fisichella and Hamilton alongside Kovaleinen. You may want unicorns riding purple raibows, teams want titles. And historically the best way to win titles isn't by putting two roosters in the same henhouse for your entertainment.



#30 ensign14

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:45

At least with those Coulthard and Fisi had decent reputations, which were pretty much ruined by their team-mates' brilliance. And a couple of constructors' titles were won because one team's number 2 was better than the others'.

#31 JHSingo

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:49

Does this really warrant a thread? :yawnface:



#32 rhukkas

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:52

That one comment encapsulates F1.

 

feed the masses that F1 is about the 21 drivers purely

 

feed the fwq that the reality is it's probably around 10,000+ people working insane hours for not much money (bar the obvious exceptions) trying to beat each other.



#33 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:54

You'd almost assume Humphrey hasn't watched any F1. Probably too busy taking selfies in the paddock.



#34 EthanM

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 21:58

At least with those Coulthard and Fisi had decent reputations, which were pretty much ruined by their team-mates' brilliance. And a couple of constructors' titles were won because one team's number 2 was better than the others'.

 

As did Webber. I mean you people act like Vettel raced Paul Belmondo and Jean-Denis Deletraz to his titles.



#35 P123

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 22:05

 Break it up, please, let's learn more about Vettel and about Red Bull and one of the others in it.

 

Terrible idea.  I'd rather see a team rise to the challenge and beat Red Bull (which includes Vettel).  We've got another 10 years to 'learn about Vettel', if we haven't learned enough already (as in he is one of the very best).  Humphrey is of course barking up the 'it's all about the driver' tree, but then again that's how the F1 media tend to see things too, even the likes of Brundle and co. on Sky.



#36 Raven8

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 22:49

What as astoundingly uninformed comment ... thank God he is not involved with F1 anymore .... only pity is that he was so good as a generic broadcaster that Sky has brought in an equally annoying clone ....who appears to understand even less of what is going around him 

True, Humphrey was always a clown , he fits better at football, it's easier to understand!



#37 Lukenwolf

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 22:51

Well each to his own but IMO you're wishing for the moon.  You could wait forever for some other combination to match them.

 

For me I have an uncertainty about Sebi.  Is he that special?  Or just extremely good?  I would like to know and in that sense I do 'require' it lol.  Why do you phrase it like that?

 

And looking at Webber it's not a given than anyone else would go as well in that car as Vettel, week after week after week.  I'd like to know about that too.  For me, F1 is a study in excellence, and the Sebi+Red Bull question is well and truly answered and I'd like to move on to the next.

 

Frankly, I do not believe you. I suspect you don't really want to 'learn' about Vettel. You merely want him to stop winning. Would you be ok with him going to Ferrari and then Hulk getting the seat or RB promotes Marvin Kirchhöfer to F1? I don't think so. But that's just my opinion, because I've seen those statements on just about every F1 board I've ever been to and in the end it always transpired that the poster, eager to learn what Vettel can do in another car had a VERY specific idea, who should get the vancant RB seat.

 

Back to opening post: I agree that we shouldn't react to every tweet there is, especially since it is obvious that the author of said tweet did not exactly display a level of inside knowledge about how F1 works.



#38 Moosed

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 22:57

you would think after however many years on the job he would realise that its not as simple as the drivers just doing a better job, there are these little things called cars which are quite important....


Edited by Moosed, 07 October 2013 - 22:58.


#39 Raven8

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:01

you would think after however many years on the job he would realise that its not as simple as the drivers just doing a better job, there are these little things called cars which are quite important....

as if the other 21 drivers just cruise around & take it easy.



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#40 FizzyJerk

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:04

Read the whole article. Lewis isn't blaming or criticising Vettel.


Maybe someone should tell Jake that..

#41 RealRacing

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:08

That was 25 years ago, and that ended with Prost having a clause in his Williams contract banning Senna. And when that clause run out Prost chose to retire. Since then Schumacher has won his titles alongside Barrichelo, Herbert and a litany of never was-es like Jos the boss and JJ Lehto, Hakkinen alongside Coulthard, Alonso alongside Fisichella and Hamilton alongside Kovaleinen. You may want unicorns riding purple raibows, teams want titles. And historically the best way to win titles isn't by putting two roosters in the same henhouse for your entertainment.


Hmm, I think you may have used "historically" to try to give more force to your argument without caring much about actual fact. I believe the Kimi and Alonso at Ferrari threads and maybe others about teaming two top drivers if I remember correctly, have enough examples that it's not a "historic" practice in F1 to not put two top drivers together. And, anyway, even if it was the case that teams have tried not to team up top drivers, it's not an argument that it should not be done. Basically, the argument "it's always been like that, so it should continue to be like that" is a fallacy.

As argued in my quoted post, we don't know, and certainly you haven't provided enough evidence, that most fans don't want "unicorns riding purple rainbows" and so we can't assume it's only for my entertainment as it may well be for the majority of F1 fans' entertainment. In the meantime though, I'm more worried about your use of the rainbow and unicorn terminology than anything else...

#42 Winter98

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:12

....

 

For me I have an uncertainty about Sebi.  Is he that special?  Or just extremely good? ...

He (has almost) won 4xWDCs on the trot.  And this year leaving no doubt as to who is the best driver on the grid.

 

Yes, he is that special.


Edited by Winter98, 07 October 2013 - 23:14.


#43 discover23

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:20

This doubt for some casual fans would all end if the drivers raced for a spec series championship, racing on 10-12 saturdays as a support series to the f1 races.

Edited by discover23, 07 October 2013 - 23:22.


#44 Tron

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:24

That was 25 years ago, and that ended with Prost having a clause in his Williams contract banning Senna. And when that clause run out Prost chose to retire. Since then Schumacher has won his titles alongside Barrichelo, Herbert and a litany of never was-es like Jos the boss and JJ Lehto, Hakkinen alongside Coulthard, Alonso alongside Fisichella and Hamilton alongside Kovaleinen. You may want unicorns riding purple raibows, teams want titles. And historically the best way to win titles isn't by putting two roosters in the same henhouse for your entertainment.

 

Two roosters isn't meaning two world champions, it's meaning two drivers of almost equal strength both allowed to race for the title.

And it's worked wonders ever since.

 

Alan Jones and Reuteman for Williams.

Prost and Lauda, two WDC and two WCC.

Piquet and Mansel, two WCC and one WDC.

Senna and Prost, two and two.

Hill and Villeneuve (later paired with a then promising Frentzen), both WDC.

And it can be well argued that Vettel and Webber were both two very young roosters, and we all those results 3+(1?).

 

All of them, like the many others that are not coming to mind, have one vital factor in common, a good car.

 

When the car is good, it can be two roosters or two monkeys but races and titles will be won.

 

Two good drivers in the same team fighting on and off the track, will never bring down the car's performance.



#45 Asterion

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:27

He (has almost) won 4xWDCs on the trot.  And this year leaving no doubt as to who is the best driver on the grid.

 

Yes, he is that special.

There's plenty of doubt outside the Vettel fan club...



#46 Winter98

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:29

There's plenty of doubt outside the Vettel fan club...

The BBC's F1 team rated Vettel 8th all time, tops amongst current drivers.  And that was in Sept '12 when he only had 2 WDCs.

 

Apprently there is also plenty of belief outside the Vettel fan club.  :wave:


Edited by Winter98, 07 October 2013 - 23:29.


#47 Winter98

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:39

Jake interpreted Lewis to mean that Seb was boring F1 fans to death.  He disagrees with that - many do, like myself.  From that standpoint, the teams need to get on it and catch up - and that includes the drivers.  So I agree with Jake.

 

However, Lewis may have simply meant that a mix of different drivers winning over the season (i.e., 2010 or 2012) is interesting, but dominance is boring for some fans - not that RBR and Seb are culpable for anything.  Which is true - as long as he meant SOME fans because that would not include me.  I agree some years are a bit more entertaining, there is more icing on the cake - but for me, there is always cake and I enjoy every single season.

 

Still, if Lewis was not condemning Red Bull and merely speaking for some fans, acknowledging their boredom, one must ask why?  He himself said a bit ago that he was never bored and loved the sport.  So perhaps it would behoove him to explain to those bored fans why he loves it and how they might better enjoy the sport during dominating years.  For example, enjoying yesterdays race, dominated by Seb, by watching the race, which showed Seb for about 2-3 minutes of the entire 2 hours and spent the rest of the time showing the exciting racing.  Some might shallowly declare that it is only exciting if the race for 1st is on, but since that is so very rare, I would call them on any such claim.

Well said bourbon.

 

My favourite part of the race was watching Massa, Maldonado, and a couple of others dicing for 10th.  Technically they may not be the best on the grid, but damn they did a great job of fighting for spots and not taking each other out.  Those guys are extremely talented drivers showing their wares.  They certainly did a decent job.


Edited by Winter98, 07 October 2013 - 23:42.


#48 bourbon

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:39

Jake interpreted Lewis to mean that Seb was boring F1 fans to death.  He disagrees with that - many do, like myself.  From that standpoint, the teams need to get on it and catch up - and that includes the drivers.  So I agree with Jake.

 

However, Lewis may have simply meant that a mix of different drivers winning over the season (i.e., 2010 or 2012) is interesting, but dominance is boring for some fans - not that RBR and Seb are culpable for anything.  Which is true - as long as he meant SOME fans because that would not include me.  I agree some years are a bit more entertaining, there is more icing on the cake - but for me, there is always cake and I enjoy every single season.

 

Still, if Lewis was not condemning Red Bull and merely speaking for some fans, acknowledging their boredom, one must ask why?  He himself said a bit ago that he was never bored and loved the sport.  So perhaps it would behoove him to explain to those bored fans why he loves it and how they might better enjoy the sport during dominating years - rather than simply stating that some fans are probably bored because his family was. 

 

For example, in yesterdays race, dominated by Seb, the race director showed Seb for about 2-3 minutes of the entire 2 hours and spent the rest of the time showing the exciting racing behind.  Some might shallowly declare that it is only exciting if the race for 1st is on, but since that is so very rare, I would call them on any such claim.  Did Hamilton believe that all of the shots with him battling Alonso, Hulkenberg and Rosberg were boring?  Watching Kimi surge to 2nd from 9th was boring?  Watching Alonso try to get ahead was boring?  Watching that 5 way battle for points was boring?  What about Rosberg trying to take Hamilton and sparks flying, putting his effort to naught?  Or Sutil overdoing it and causing a Red Bull blaze?  All of that Boring?  I think not. 

 

Hamilton could have explained the excitement of watching the race which rarely shows any protagonists of dominance since these days, much more is going on behind the leaders and that is shown. 

 

To be fair to Jake, Hamilton's comments do call into question his motive.  I mean, he knows how exciting yesterday's race is, he was a part of it.  He also knows that the race director never shows the leader going around the track while ignoring the excitement behind.  So one might expect Hamilton to speak up on behalf of the sport and the exciting racing rather than commiserate with the fans who seem to feel that unless their race predictions are continuously proven wrong, they cannot enjoy the sport.



#49 Silvercheese

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:41

F1 drivers should be based on promotion and relegation to new teams rather than popularity and money.

 

As the standings are and if the drivers were not to retire:

 

Red Bull: Vettel stays/ Webber demoted                    Vettel/Alonso

Ferrari: Alonso promoted / Massa demoted               Lewis/Webber

Mercedes: Lewis promoted / Rosberg demoted         Massa/ Kimi

Lotus: Kimi promoted / Grosjean demoted                 Rosberg/Button

McLaren: Button promoted / Perez demoted              Grosjean/Di Resta

Force India: Di Resta promoted / Sutil demoted         Perez/Hulk

Sauber: Hulk promoted / Esteban demoted                Sutil/Ricciardo

Toro Rosso: Ricciardo promoted/ Vergne demoted   Esteban/Maldonado

 

---------------------------------------------

 

Bottom 3 teams can hire and fire whoever they want bar the top driver of the six who would be promoted, Maldonado being top in Williams.



#50 Raven8

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 23:48

Jake interpreted Lewis to mean that Seb was boring F1 fans to death.  He disagrees with that - many do, like myself.  From that standpoint, the teams need to get on it and catch up - and that includes the drivers.  So I agree with Jake.

 

However, Lewis may have simply meant that a mix of different drivers winning over the season (i.e., 2010 or 2012) is interesting, but dominance is boring for some fans - not that RBR and Seb are culpable for anything.  Which is true - as long as he meant SOME fans because that would not include me.  I agree some years are a bit more entertaining, there is more icing on the cake - but for me, there is always cake and I enjoy every single season.

 

Still, if Lewis was not condemning Red Bull and merely speaking for some fans, acknowledging their boredom, one must ask why?  He himself said a bit ago that he was never bored and loved the sport.  So perhaps it would behoove him to explain to those bored fans why he loves it and how they might better enjoy the sport during dominating years - rather than simply stating that some fans are probably bored because his family was. 

 

For example, in yesterdays race, dominated by Seb, the race director showed Seb for about 2-3 minutes of the entire 2 hours and spent the rest of the time showing the exciting racing behind.  Some might shallowly declare that it is only exciting if the race for 1st is on, but since that is so very rare, I would call them on any such claim.  Did Hamilton believe that all of the shots with him battling Alonso, Hulkenberg and Rosberg were boring?  Watching Kimi surge to 2nd from 9th was boring?  Watching Alonso try to get ahead was boring?  Watching that 5 way battle for points was boring?  What about Rosberg trying to take Hamilton and sparks flying, putting his effort to naught?  Or Sutil overdoing it and causing a Red Bull blaze?  All of that Boring?  I think not. 

 

Hamilton could have explained the excitement of watching the race which rarely shows any protagonists of dominance since these days, much more is going on behind the leaders and that is shown. 

 

To be fair to Jake, Hamilton's comments do call into question his motive.  I mean, he knows how exciting yesterday's race is, he was a part of it.  He also knows that the race director never shows the leader going around the track while ignoring the excitement behind.  So one might expect Hamilton to speak up on behalf of the sport and the exciting racing rather than commiserate with the fans who seem to feel that unless their race predictions are continuously proven wrong, they cannot enjoy the sport.

Jake suggest all other 21 drivers do a bad job not challenging Vettel enough. Tell this the drivers of the smaller teams, that they do a really miserable job.

He completely dismisses the fact the car plays a major role in F1, just like Vettel has the same car as Bianchi or Hülkenberg, only they are too bad to  win the wDC

He uses Lewis name to get attention, and than paddles back in his next tweet:

 

@hampsonalex: Read the whole interview and he doesnt blame Vettel.” >>I know he doesn't. That line was aimed at the booers and criticisers

 

I