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The 2013 Airtel Indian Grand Prix Race Thread


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#351 mnmracer

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:41

Can't wait for the tell all book next year !!

Curious how much 'tell all' it will be.

Webber's been really good about forgetting Vettel's troubles (Vettel who still has more mechanical retirements than Webber).



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#352 anti

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:41

Race:  :: Pit :: Best lap :: Lap Chart :: History graph
 



#353 OvDrone

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:43

 

 

 

How simply not being a pessimist can be the difference between self-ruining and enjoying a sport.

 

 

Well, that was the best part of the race, the dude is one of the greats, hands down. Buuuuuut, the rest was smog-filled misery. I love my distraught pessimism mate. :p



#354 redreni

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:50

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

#355 noelspark

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 11:58

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

On occasions like this undoubtedly YES, pity were not allowed to see more of it...



#356 bourbon

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:00

whooooooooooooooooooooooohooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!  Sebastian Rocks!!!!! :clap: :clap:

 

Congrats to Seb and congrats to Red Bull on a kickin' kool season!!! 

 

CHAMPIONS!!!  FOUR TIMES OVER!  :D

 

***STOKED****!!



#357 P123

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:14

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

 

I think he and the car are so far ahead that nobody really cares. 

 

It was a better 'show' than anything the likes of DRS bring to the party.



#358 dau

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:16

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

Really? I mean...really?



#359 redreni

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:29

I think he and the car are so far ahead that nobody really cares. 
 
It was a better 'show' than anything the likes of DRS bring to the party.


Mmm. It‘s too showy for my tastes. Too cheesy. Everybody‘s known since Spa what the outcome of the championships was going to be. The race results still matter, though, and the thing is the window of opportunity to cheat by being underweight was pretty huge, because it‘s not as if Red Bull didn‘t know in advance that if Vettel finished in the points, he was going to win the title and therefore be exempted from the parc ferme regulations, and that if he didn‘t finish in the points he wouldn‘t be scrutineered. I‘m not saying they took advantage of the opportunity to cheat: they didn‘t need to, but it was a pretty easy, virtually risk free opportunity to run significantly underweight.

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#360 Kelateboy

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 12:47

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

 

Do you need permission from the Race Director to park your car off the track and not in parc ferme at the end of the race? I thought that you could do it for specific reasons like running out of fuel without having to consult the Race Director provided that the car is parked at a safe location.

 
@F1PitRadio2
To PdiR, "P8, P9, for us, well done..."
PdiR, "I should stop?"
Re:"Yes, please, Paul, turn the engine off, stop and turn the engine off"

 

Anything specifics in the regulations that deal with these sorts of incidents?



#361 Anderis

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 13:22

Chilton again in front of Bianchi.

 

AFAIR, it's 3rd time in the last 5 weekends Chilton wins his head-to-head team-mate battle and the other 2 races were pretty close as well. Was Chilton underrated and overinsulted or Bianchi overhyped at the beginning of the year? Or a bit of both?



#362 P123

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 13:29

Chilton again in front of Bianchi.

 

AFAIR, it's 3rd time in the last 5 weekends Chilton wins his head-to-head team-mate battle and the other 2 races were pretty close as well. Was Chilton underrated and overinsulted or Bianchi overhyped at the beginning of the year? Or a bit of both?

 

A bit of both.



#363 Bloggsworth

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 13:50

I thought that Chilton drove well today after the first lap assault by VdG (the ability of racing drivers to look at the bleedin' obvious and see something entirely different never ceases to amaze me), whatever wasn't working in practice and qualifying he managed to overcome in the race itself.

#364 garagetinkerer

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 15:02

Sorry, my nurse has just wiped the drool from my keyboard, I had to wait for her to dab my chin before I could reply.

 

It's not a matter of Webber being on Vettels's level or not, It's a matter of it making no objective sense whatsoever to pit him when he's maintaining a lead, to put him on inferior tyres when the car still has half a tank of fuel and half a race to go. A heavier car puts more energy into the tyres by dint of physics. A less rubbered/ clean track has less grip available, meaning more sliding, which causes higher tyre wear.

 

In other words, even to my imbecilic mind, you suffer the softs at the start for grid position and off the grid performance, or you run them at the end when the track conditions are most suited to them. Or you run them when you gain neither grid position nor final laps optimum conditions, and be sure to have devout faithful followers ready to quell any fandom dissent.

 

I would have had agreed with you... but didn't a Mercedes driver (Rosberg i think) suggest that they may be able to make the soft last longer than RBR (Now, didn't Mercedes' tyre life suck)? So given that, and how steep the cliffs are with these tyres, perhaps it was a better strategy to be on reliable/ consistent tyres than a set which you don't know may give up on you whenever they fancied.



#365 garagetinkerer

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 15:05

I didn't notice Vettel getting the marshals permission to walk onto the track after the race ? Wonder if he will get same penalty as MW.

In Webbo's case it was on slowing down lap, and with Vettel i think it was after the slowing down lap... the difference is traffic. In one case, there was a fair bit of traffic... and in this case, none. However, stranger things have happened.

 

edit: what do i know :p

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/110943

 

RBR fined 25k euros and Vettel reprimanded...

 

Seriously though, i'm glad it wasn't Herbert who was the steward. I still haven't forgotten that sham of a penalty handed to Massa in 2011.


Edited by garagetinkerer, 27 October 2013 - 15:11.


#366 Jon83

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 16:57

Chilton again in front of Bianchi.

 

AFAIR, it's 3rd time in the last 5 weekends Chilton wins his head-to-head team-mate battle and the other 2 races were pretty close as well. Was Chilton underrated and overinsulted or Bianchi overhyped at the beginning of the year? Or a bit of both?

 

Bianchi has destroyed Chilton this year. Let's not get carried away with a couple of races here. 



#367 George Costanza

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 17:00

Congratulations Vettel!  :clap:

 

Together with Prost now. The scary thing is Seb won his fourth title at an age where Prost didn't even win a race. 

 

True, but Alain certainly made it up for it.

 

F1 is truly a crazy sport....



#368 SpaMaster

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 17:17

I‘m sure Vettel probably had permission to stop on the start line and not in prc ferme, but how are the scrutineers suposed to know the weight of the car includong the driver if he‘s having contact with marshalls and spectators over by the grandstands, tossing his gloves over the fence, having contact with his guys over the pitwall - there were so many opportunities for outside interference before he and the car would have made it into parc ferme to be weighed, and too many rules violations to count. Are the TV pictures really more importnt than making sure that basic procedures are in place that are needed to ensure the competition is straight?

Yes, the tv pictures, by that you mean, raw celebration, instant emotions, glee, crowd response, spontaneous dawning on of a championship are all more important than some silly rules. That was one of the high points at the circuit today. I was there. Believe me, it was electric. They were all absolutely ecstatic seeing the championship win unfold before them. Whatever boos Vettel may have heard in some European tracks, they got more than compensated by the cheers he got from all around the Buddh circuit today. The picnic stands were all jam packed today and all of them (irrespective of whether they were Raikkonen fans, Ferrari fans, Hamilton fans, Force India fans) cheered in one united fashion for Vettel today. Vettel got great reception from the fans today!



#369 Miggeex

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 17:42

Glad Vettel won it here where he got the cheering that he deserves. (No matter how annoying it might be to see this guy win it all, but he and the team really deserves it.)



#370 Alfisti

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 17:49

Ok am I the only one that cannot work it why mark pitted at all? I mean it's all moot given the car died but he was only losing about two tenths per lap to seb in that first stint, just keep going surely??????? What's there to lose? He could have kept going then scraped on soft for the last few laps. Worse case he finishes second anyway.

#371 repete

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 18:03

they probably wanted to get the Soft stint out of the way in case of a late race caution.



#372 apoka

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 18:12

Ok am I the only one that cannot work it why mark pitted at all? I mean it's all moot given the car died but he was only losing about two tenths per lap to seb in that first stint, just keep going surely??????? What's there to lose? He could have kept going then scraped on soft for the last few laps. Worse case he finishes second anyway.

 

But that would mean 30 more laps on the medium tyres? Almost full race distance including qualy on one set. I think even with the gap he had that could backfire. (Edit: Alternatively, he could do a longer stint on softs, but RB seemed to have significant issues on that tyre. Even his short soft tyre stint didn't look good.)

 

His strategy was well balanced: 28 laps on medium, 4 laps on soft, 28 laps (without car failure) on mediums. I guess that is what made most sense mathematically.


Edited by apoka, 27 October 2013 - 18:14.


#373 Jon83

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 19:37

Not many expected Vettel to sail through the field the way he did. He benefited a little from Alonso and Button having a few problems but a lot I listened to before the race seemed to think he'd be stuck in traffic for a lot longer than he ever was. 

 

I don't think RBR did anything with Webber that they shouldn't have. 



#374 hmm

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 20:10

Interesting that the fresh soft tire was not really much faster than the harder one, on lap 30 Webber had just pitted for softs and Vettel was on lap 27 of with his mediums:

 

Webber: 1.29.500

Vettel: 1.30.282

 

That's only 0.782 difference of a new soft and a medium at the end of the stint, no wonder they didn't use the softs for long. On lap 31 Mark was already doing 1.30.0 and then he pitted back for mediums.



#375 Alfisti

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Posted 27 October 2013 - 22:57

That's my point, webber should have done a grosjean as his times were fine. Worse case he finishes second.

#376 repete

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 00:11

grosjean started on new softs...and did a "long" stint on them. then ran medium till the end. Webber would have done opposite...or a Sutil.

 

with Webbers normal strategy, at worst he would have been 2nd anyway. and by pitting when they did onto the softs, it was ideal incase of safety car deployment in second half of race.



#377 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 01:52

whooooooooooooooooooooooohooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! Sebastian Rocks!!!!! :clap: :clap:

Congrats to Seb and congrats to Red Bull on a kickin' kool season!!!

CHAMPIONS!!! FOUR TIMES OVER! :D

***STOKED****!!

Excellent race by Vettel today, coming from the very back of the grid to win the race and the championship!

He joins the greats with his four WDC's. In plain terms of todays best racers he equals Hamilton + Alonso + Raikkonen!

Not too bad for a twenty-six year old.

.

thanks Ethan

Edited by halifaxf1fan, 28 October 2013 - 02:03.


#378 EthanM

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 02:00

Not too bad for a twenty-four year old.

.

 

Vettel is 26



#379 garagetinkerer

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 02:09

Glad Vettel won it here where he got the cheering that he deserves. (No matter how annoying it might be to see this guy win it all, but he and the team really deserves it.)

 

As an Indian, i breathed a sigh of relief... before i was overcome by joy! I mean this is the second properly great driver who i had an opportunity to watch (Schumacher being the other) make history...



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#380 Velocifer

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 05:04

Was a fun race with yet another outstanding drive by Vettel, but props to a very patient and fast Grosjean and also Massa who finally delivered nicely for the team when it mattered.

 

Buddh is a real gem of a track and ought to be a mainstay on the F1 calendar in my opinion. Cars look really cool going around it and it allows for some good moves without being too easy to pass either.



#381 Crossmax

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 08:57

Mmm. It‘s too showy for my tastes. Too cheesy. Everybody‘s known since Spa what the outcome of the championships was going to be. The race results still matter, though, and the thing is the window of opportunity to cheat by being underweight was pretty huge, because it‘s not as if Red Bull didn‘t know in advance that if Vettel finished in the points, he was going to win the title and therefore be exempted from the parc ferme regulations, and that if he didn‘t finish in the points he wouldn‘t be scrutineered. I‘m not saying they took advantage of the opportunity to cheat: they didn‘t need to, but it was a pretty easy, virtually risk free opportunity to run significantly underweight.

What a stupid post.