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Williams FW36


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#801 joora

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 18:56

Luck and competence clearly aren't on Williams side this year. The only comforting fact is that Bottas managed to get some points. 

 

Massa once again a great start, unlucky to get hit by Alonso. Inexcusable pitstop, they looked like clowns.

 

Bottas a decent start, unlucky to get hit by Rosberg. Team should've pitted him earlier after the second stint to try to get in front of Hulk. I got the feeling that we had a bit more pace than FI today, but not enough to overtake on track.

 

All in all, Williams is wasting points in their traditional way. Hope for a better and luckier euro part of the season.



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#802 Mart280

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 19:26

Plenty of races left and I'm sure soon a weekend will go our way but I said elsewhere that I think Frank must have run over a black cat back at the factory or something, if it wasnt for bad luck this team would have no luck at all, still I liked the way Rob Smedley said about it's his responsibility for the tyre mix up and they will sort it out by being totally honest with each other, lots of new people and systems in place at team Willy and it wont all knit together overnight, i'm really pleased with the job Claire, Pat and Rob (although he's only been there 5 minutes I like the cut of his jib) are doing and after 2011 and 2013 we're having a great season, I just want to see us compete week in week out in the top ten and improve and I think we're doing that.


Edited by Mart280, 20 April 2014 - 19:27.


#803 Nustang70

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 22:52

Seems like a left-right rear tire mix up. Would have thought with Pat here, he would have sorted it out. He's known for getting pit stops smoothed out. 

Head of vehicle performance Rob Smedley said the issue had arisen as a result of procedural weaknesses at Williams. 

“You clearly saw that we tried to fit the left on the right and vice versa; that was pretty clear,” Smedley said. “What led to it in very broad, general terms, was not having good enough procedures and not having good enough processes to catch things like that, to ensure things like that don't happen. 

“That's why we just have to go away, be pragmatic, be very honest and open with each other inside the team; I think that's important. Something that I'm keen to do at Williams is to be absolutely transparent with everybody and go away and say 'this was good, this wasn't good and this needs to be fixed'. We'll decide on Monday and Tuesday exactly what needs to be fixed, where the priorities are and just get on with it.”

Come now, I don't think any of us here can claim we've never spend 50 or so seconds trying to cram the left shoe on the right foot.   :p



#804 Lord Snooty

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Posted 20 April 2014 - 22:54

Come now, I don't think any of us here can claim we've never spend 50 or so seconds trying to cram the left shoe on the right foot.   :p

Indeed, or tried to get both legs down one trouser leg while getting dressed in a hurry....



#805 Barri

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Posted 21 April 2014 - 02:18

Do they have Ross Brawn's phone number?



#806 Okyo

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 10:06

Does seem that we got a chance to get 2nd row. Updates working as it seems  :clap:



#807 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 10:25

Massa has a good shot at a podium finish. Should be a fun battle with Alonso.



#808 Hans V

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 10:28

Ross Brawn as team principal would have been great - and a nice 360 for Brawn who started out at Williams. And a great challenge for Brawn.

#809 joora

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 13:27

Great job from Bottas today, wonder what mistake did massa make to end 9th.



#810 Vesuvius

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 14:02

great job by Bottas, missed the fp1 because of williams paydiver thinky...was lost with setups until quali and beated Massa :up:



#811 Francesc

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 16:26

Excellent result from qualifying, and feels even better after reading some of the comments on this board saying that Williams were losing ground already.



#812 Mart280

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 16:35

I think Massa said he messed his lap up in the last sector, good to see no lame excuses from him. Seeing the upgrades work is heart warming as well, Rob Smedley also seems to be making a difference, I'm optimistic of a good double result tomorrow hoping for one of Felipe's super starts.



#813 kaisellgren

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 16:47

I hope the dirty side Bottas starts on doesn't cause much of a trouble in the start. I'd be nice to see a Williams on the podium, and Bottas seems to be the one who's more likely to get there.



#814 Mart280

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 17:30

I would be happy to see both cars finish solidly inside the top ten, 5th and 6th and if things go our way with a bit of luck maybe a podium, one thing that hasn't really played out that was predicted is a high rate of attrition with the new power units, they are so reliable it has taken something away from the spectacle compared to say the 80's and 90's, FW36 is looking like a good solid car with plenty more to come from it, Symonds, Smedley and the guys back at the factory are doing a great job, no slacking guys lets keep this up right the way through.



#815 Jambo

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 17:33

Good to see the car moving forward performance wise, Merc are in another world but Williams seemed to have moved ahead of Force India, at least for barcelona.



#816 PayasYouRace

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 19:25

Nice to see they're keeping up the pace. Hoping for a good result tomorrow.



#817 darkkis

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 21:29

great job by Bottas, missed the fp1 because of williams paydiver thinky...was lost with setups until quali and beated Massa :up:

Team Brazil tried to hinder his performance, but it failed. :p



#818 Lord Snooty

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Posted 10 May 2014 - 21:50

Good day today. Fingers crossed for tomorrow and a day of snafu free strategies and pit stops.



#819 Boing 2

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 14:31

Williams now ahead of McLaren in the Constructors championship and looking like they might be able to hunt down Force India for P4! :eek:



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#820 PayasYouRace

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 15:39

The Williams was probably the 3rd quickest car today and easily the 2nd quickest Mercedes car (best of the customers).

Hope this form continues.

 

Great job from Bottas.  :up:



#821 Exb

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 15:48

The Williams was probably the 3rd quickest car today and easily the 2nd quickest Mercedes car (best of the customers).
Hope this form continues.
 
Great job from Bottas.  :up:


Agree, Williams seemed 3rd quickest today, good to see their updates are keeping them in it and they are not falling behind. Can't help thinking if they had tried a 3 stop with Bottas he may have held onto 4th but still a great result and very well driven by Bottas.

#822 kaisellgren

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 16:31

This was a promising race.

 

We have to remember that this track works as a some kind of benchmark for the rest of the season due to the layout of the circuit. It means Williams indeed has a decent car. Now let's just hope they can keep bringing new updates that actually matter.

 

Oh, and a great drive from Bottas!



#823 Lord Snooty

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 16:48

Good race; Massa was unlucky but Bottas was on top form.    :up:



#824 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 18:56

Bottas has been without any bad luck so far. Hopefully luck will fall into Massa soon as well. Monaco is a track where he usually excels too. Let's hope his luck changes there.



#825 Markn93

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 19:01

Quick question, why didn't Williams just mirror Danny Ric throughout the race? Didn't look like he could pass on track.



#826 SpeedRacer`

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 19:41

Quick question, why didn't Williams just mirror Danny Ric throughout the race? Didn't look like he could pass on track.

 

I think if Bottas had stopped as early as that, he would've ended up doing a 3 stopper. Ricciardo did a really long second stint.

 

I'm not sure why they brought Massa in so early for his second stop.



#827 polesetter1

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Posted 11 May 2014 - 22:21

I think that Massa had some problems with overtaking. That's the same issue he had after refuelling ban in Ferrari. He was in the mix with Vettel and Alonso, on similar strategy, but he lost much time behind K-Mag, and let Vettel overtake. If Massa overtook Magnussen earlier, he would be comfortably Top-8 and Vettel wouldn't be able to catch Bottas.



#828 EarnardBeccelstone

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 00:18

I believe Williams is now the third fastest car of the field, behind Mercedes (obviously) and Red Bull, at least over one lap. Qualifying pace is excellent, thanks to the Mercedes powerplant and an apparently low-drag (or maybe low downforce) car design.

 

Race pace is probably not as good as it should be. I’d put them level pegging, perhaps a little ahead, of Ferrari in this regard. The car seems a little harder on its tyres than most of the other runners battling for the minor placings.

 

Relative race pace seems to drop off towards the end of a stint, and Bottas seems to be pitting earlier than most cars around him in the opening stint of the dry races. Perhaps it’s a lack of rear-end downforce and not quite getting the rear tyre pressures right. The Williams seems to be less stable at the rear end that the Red Bull and Ferrari as the reace progresses.

 

It’s also shame that the team has suffered so much misfortune during the races this season. But, they’ve also manufactured some of their own poor performance.

 

Pit stops have been consistently a few tenths slower that other, top of the field, teams. Pit stop errors have been too frequent as well.

 

All in all, a better season that last year. My hope now is that Massa and Bottas consistently finish in the top 3-6 positions, possibly earning Williams fourth, or third if very lucky, in the constructors championship.



#829 SPBHM

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 01:11

I think that Massa had some problems with overtaking. That's the same issue he had after refuelling ban in Ferrari. He was in the mix with Vettel and Alonso, on similar strategy, but he lost much time behind K-Mag, and let Vettel overtake. If Massa overtook Magnussen earlier, he would be comfortably Top-8 and Vettel wouldn't be able to catch Bottas.

 

it looked to me like his pace was not very good, and the tires were always gone, so no hope of passing, very strange because of how good he was looking until Q3... also it looked like he was unlucky with Grosjean, like with the Ferraris Grosjean had little power on the straight and with Massa he had power back? or was just Massa extremely slow on the last corner? anyway, very poor race by Massa and very good race by Bottas, still, it looks like they can be the 4th place team this year,

 

I wonder how well this car will work on tracks like Spa and Monza... low drag but short gears!?



#830 paulogman

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 01:16

considering how awful last season was, it is great to see we are in a position to complain about not beating a redbull home... :clap:



#831 kaisellgren

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 13:09

Bottas has been without any bad luck so far. Hopefully luck will fall into Massa soon as well. Monaco is a track where he usually excels too. Let's hope his luck changes there.

 

I agree Massa has had bad luck before, but this weekend he was quick and had everything in his hands, but ruined it all by himself. Unlike Bottas in Melbourne, Massa did not make up for his own mistakes. In some races he has had bad luck, but this weekend was not one of those.



#832 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 15:22

I think if Bottas had stopped as early as that, he would've ended up doing a 3 stopper. Ricciardo did a really long second stint.

 

I'm not sure why they brought Massa in so early for his second stop.

Because his tyres were gone.



#833 Dunc

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 16:42

If this race is indicitive of where the teams are at Williams should be expecting 4th in the WCC and pushing for 3rd. Ferrari has a stronger driver pairing but Williams have the better car, so it will be a hard one to predict.

I concur that it is nice to be legitimately complaining about not beating Red Bull :)

Edited by Dunc, 12 May 2014 - 20:58.


#834 Mart280

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Posted 12 May 2014 - 18:25

Important thing is they seem to be improving the car, I'm sure soon we will see them have a weekend with both cars in the top six and a nice points haul.



#835 Nustang70

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Posted 13 May 2014 - 04:55

Quick question, why didn't Williams just mirror Danny Ric throughout the race? Didn't look like he could pass on track.

Can't really mirror when you're the car ahead.



#836 Anderis

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Posted 13 May 2014 - 11:29

Bottas has been without any bad luck so far.

I think a collision with Rosberg in China, which was not his fault IMO, hampered him a bit in that race so it's not like he has been without any bad luck.

 

Also his strategy in Malaysia was not really good, and he lost perhaps a position or two due to SC in Bahrain (though, Massa lost exactly the same there).



#837 Imateria

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Posted 13 May 2014 - 13:11

One thing I'm worried about, Bottas seemed to have poor pace on the hard tyre in the final stint. In that second stint he only lost about 5s at most to Ricciardo (plus the 10 that went AWOL with the longer first stint) but he dropped a long way behind with the hards. A sign that they're still lacking in downforce?



#838 EarnardBeccelstone

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 02:09

Massa blames tyre degredation from being stuck in traffic for poor-ish showing at Spain:

 

http://www.espn.co.u...ory/158475.html

 

He says he thinks the issues have been solved (I think that's optimistic, but what do I know, really). Also that Williams has been having some troubles with rear wing downforce (as they appear to have had all season).

 

I'm preparing for some pain at Monaco. I know that the circuit is strongly mechanical grip dependent, but its also a very high downforce track, which could leave Williams in the cold on the weekend. 

 

Fingers crossed for a good P1, 2, 3 and qualifying, otherwise Sunday is going ot be hard to watch.


Edited by EarnardBeccelstone, 16 May 2014 - 02:10.


#839 Molo19

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 06:19

I'm preparing for some pain at Monaco. I know that the circuit is strongly mechanical grip dependent, but its also a very high downforce track, which could leave Williams in the cold on the weekend. 

Monaco, more than anything, is an absurdly quali intensive race. You can have incredible levels of tyre deg or just overall poor pace and still keep the competition behind or vice versa. If Bottas and Massa can do well on Saturday, their golden, I'm sure.



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#840 PayasYouRace

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 06:59

Massa blames tyre degredation from being stuck in traffic for poor-ish showing at Spain:

 

http://www.espn.co.u...ory/158475.html

 

He says he thinks the issues have been solved (I think that's optimistic, but what do I know, really). Also that Williams has been having some troubles with rear wing downforce (as they appear to have had all season).

 

I'm preparing for some pain at Monaco. I know that the circuit is strongly mechanical grip dependent, but its also a very high downforce track, which could leave Williams in the cold on the weekend. 

 

Fingers crossed for a good P1, 2, 3 and qualifying, otherwise Sunday is going ot be hard to watch.

 

It depends on the nature of their downforce loss. If they can crank on some more wing and the problem is excessive drag, then they can't do that at most circuits but at Monaco it won't be a big problem. If the problem is just not being able to get the downforce in the first place, it would be more of a problem.


Edited by PayasYouRace, 16 May 2014 - 07:00.


#841 paulogman

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 09:26

maybe the short gears they have selected to start the season will pay dividends here abd then they can go to a longer set of ratios after monaco?



#842 northell

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Posted 17 May 2014 - 08:16

maybe the short gears they have selected to start the season will pay dividends here abd then they can go to a longer set of ratios after monaco?

Yeah i was thinking about that as well, but the lack of downforce at the rear might bring problems for Williams. I hope they can suprise at monaco.



#843 Anderis

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 12:41

Finally it is:

 

https://wmrshop.com/us/team-wear.html



#844 Hans V

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 18:38

Finally it is:

https://wmrshop.com/us/team-wear.html

Pity they couldn't make something a bit more subtle and classy. Way to busy for my taste. I might buy a T-shirt to support the team, but will only be used for work-outs as it can't be worn in public. ;)

Edited by Hans V, 20 May 2014 - 18:38.


#845 Exb

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 19:13

Photos from Monaco http://www.auto-moto...otoshow_item=27

Williams-Formel-1-GP-Monaco-20-Mai-2014-

 

Williams-Formel-1-GP-Monaco-20-Mai-2014-



#846 ballow

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Posted 20 May 2014 - 22:03

If this race is indicitive of where the teams are at Williams should be expecting 4th in the WCC and pushing for 3rd. Ferrari has a stronger driver pairing but Williams have the better car, so it will be a hard one to predict.

I concur that it is nice to be legitimately complaining about not beating Red Bull :)

 

 

Williams dont have the better car. Ferrari is a good car  in relation to other cars and certainly better than Williams. 

 

I cant see Williams beating Ferrari as they dont have the better car nor money and staff to challenge Ferrari for the rest of the season 


Edited by ballow, 20 May 2014 - 22:11.


#847 Anderis

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 09:51

Williams dont have the better car. Ferrari is a good car  in relation to other cars and certainly better than Williams.

In Spain Williams certainly did seem to have a slight edge over Ferrari and Barcelona is usually a good indicator of the overall quality of the package.

 

Let's see how will the season evolve. It's a stereotype Williams can't match big teams in terms of development due to having less money, but in the last couple of years, each time they brought a decent car for the beginning of the season, they were around equally competitive at the end of it.



#848 ballow

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 10:25

In Spain Williams certainly did seem to have a slight edge over Ferrari and Barcelona is usually a good indicator of the overall quality of the package.

 

Let's see how will the season evolve. It's a stereotype Williams can't match big teams in terms of development due to having less money, but in the last couple of years, each time they brought a decent car for the beginning of the season, they were around equally competitive at the end of it.

 

And its a sterotype for people just to asusme just because a team is 'slightly' does better in Barcelona means its the better car. Remind me where was Massa in the race? Ferrari has been the better car period. I support Williams put lets call it as it is. No way they beat Ferrari over the season and no way they have been the better car. Their target should be to be McLaren.  



#849 Anderis

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 12:09

Remind me where was Massa in the race?

Since when the worse performance of the two drivers is an indicator of where the car stands compared to the opposition? Then maybe we should conclude Mercedes is not the fastest car in quali trim, because Rosberg was beaten by one of the Red Bulls in 3 out of 5 quali sessions so far? Or that Red Bull never had the best car over a season because Webber never finished within top2 in championship?

 

Williams had better car than Ferrari in Barcelona. That's a fact unless you believe Bottas outperformed Alonso and Raikkonen by quite a margin on a driving skill alone. Considering where they both were in China. that means they did better with traditional "first European race of the season" upgrade than Ferrari, who was supposed to develop the car better. Williams also had quicker car than Ferrari in Bahrain and Australia, so that was not a one off fluke thanks to circumstances they beat Ferrari.

 

It's just unreasonable to insist Ferrari has a better car than Williams ATM the way you does it. Whether they have a chance of challenging Ferrari over a season is an open question. My money would be on Ferrari as well, but what happened in the last 5 races and in the last 5 or 6 years suggests Williams is not completely without a chance.


Edited by Anderis, 21 May 2014 - 12:14.


#850 ballow

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Posted 21 May 2014 - 16:05

Since when the worse performance of the two drivers is an indicator of where the car stands compared to the opposition? Then maybe we should conclude Mercedes is not the fastest car in quali trim, because Rosberg was beaten by one of the Red Bulls in 3 out of 5 quali sessions so far? Or that Red Bull never had the best car over a season because Webber never finished within top2 in championship?

 

Williams had better car than Ferrari in Barcelona. That's a fact unless you believe Bottas outperformed Alonso and Raikkonen by quite a margin on a driving skill alone. Considering where they both were in China. that means they did better with traditional "first European race of the season" upgrade than Ferrari, who was supposed to develop the car better. Williams also had quicker car than Ferrari in Bahrain and Australia, so that was not a one off fluke thanks to circumstances they beat Ferrari.

 

It's just unreasonable to insist Ferrari has a better car than Williams ATM the way you does it. Whether they have a chance of challenging Ferrari over a season is an open question. My money would be on Ferrari as well, but what happened in the last 5 races and in the last 5 or 6 years suggests Williams is not completely without a chance.

 

You call Bottas finishing ahead of Alonso by 8 seconds quite a margin?  :confused:  Alonso was held up by Kimi in the race, pretty sure if he was ahead of Kimi he would have either beaten Bottas or been  a lot closer to him.. The point is Bottas beat both Ferrari's in qualification because he was better than both drivers in qualification.  Just like DR and SV were better than Nico in the two  times they beat Nico .

 

Williams are fighting McLaren and not Ferrari but its a nice fantasy to think they are quicker than Ferrari.