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Mark Webber on the favourites for 2014 and who's the best driver he'd raced against


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#1 st99

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 09:38

 Mark Webber gives his opinion on who's favourite for 2014 and who's the best driver he's raced against:

 

I think they (Red Bull) are going to be very strong.

It's an engine category next year more than probably a car/aerodynamic category, which is probably not a bad thing for some people.

But there will also still be decent driver input, especially from a brainpower perspective in terms of pacing and managing and all the technology the cars are going to have next year, which will help Sebastian. That's right up his alley. Perfect for him.

 

"So to try to answer your question, on Sundays Fernando over two hours is a handful. There is no question about that. Over one lap I think he's not with Seb. But on Sundays between those two it's very, very tight.

"Lewis [Hamilton of Mercedes] is handy but probably not quite as much of a machine as those two are. They are literally 'plug them in and off they go'. They are very, very handy."

 

There's also some interesting quotes about Schumacher and the famous "car park" in Monaco in 2006.

 

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/25344023

 

 



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#2 Fontainebleau

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 09:44

Thank you, great read! :)



#3 rasul

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 09:55

Interesting insight, thank you. Mark got nothing to lose at this point, so his comments are likely his real thoughts on the matter.  



#4 ensign14

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 09:58

If they are "literally plug them in", then they are either cyborgs or an illegal part of the car. 



#5 Shiroo

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 10:00

I always thought that on Hamilton on the pace is great, but he doesn't share have steel mind like Vettel or Alonso



#6 EvanRainer

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 10:01

I'd say that's a very accurate description by Webber. 

 

Though I am not entirely clear on the exact meaning of the term "handy" :lol:



#7 Nonesuch

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 10:33

I'm always surprised by how similar the driver's descriptions are to those of 'reporters' who are watching things from the sidelines. It's usually the same, rather meaningless, words and comparisons. Maybe being a driver isn't all that complicated, and the difference between a 1x and a 2x, and a 4x WDC is accurately described by the difference between being 'handy', 'very handy', and 'very, very handy'. :stoned: :p

 

As for 2014, so Webber thinks Red Bull, primarily known for their mastery of this regulation's aerodynamics, is going to be very strong - but also that it's going to be more of an 'engine category' - and that the drivers will still have 'decent ... input'. So, a bit like every other year, then? That's great! :up:  :p 


Edited by Nonesuch, 13 December 2013 - 10:39.


#8 GlenP

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 11:13

Seems he is saying what pretty much everyone would agree to. Fernando is still the boss on Sundays, but Seb runs him very close… plus he is amazing on Saturday… plus he is technically extremely "handy".



#9 sennafan24

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 13:34

I always thought that on Hamilton on the pace is great, but he doesn't share have steel mind like Vettel or Alonso

Probably.

 

Up until lately I would have put Lewis on par with those two and maybe a tad better, as I felt 2011 was a blip, but 2013 he was inconsistent as well. Seb was not exactly great guns at the start of 2012, but it did not effect his season as a whole (plus he was a growing driver at that stage, he only entered his stride in 2013 in my view), Alonso has had a high level of consistency for years now.

 

Webber really did not like what Schumi did at Monaco 2006, and seems to have stuck in his head. I do forget about it myself to be honest.



#10 as65p

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 14:15

Webber really did not like what Schumi did at Monaco 2006, and seems to have stuck in his head. I do forget about it myself to be honest.

 

If you look a bit closer, Webber was totally in awe of Schumacher when he entered F1, had did say so many times. IIRC, after Monaco he had a private chat with MS the next race, possibly to clear things up. I think Webber was probably more disappointed in his former hero than anything else.



#11 sennafan24

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 14:20

If you look a bit closer, Webber was totally in awe of Schumacher when he entered F1, had did say so many times. IIRC, after Monaco he had a private chat with MS the next race, possibly to clear things up. I think Webber was probably more disappointed in his former hero than anything else.

I was going to mention that myself, if you look here at the start of the video, you can tell. First thing Webber mentions.

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=lvbBMFUsfnI

 

Again though, it will be because of Webber first hand being a victim of the Monaco 2006 incident, Schumi and a lot of other top drivers did worse than that. 



#12 Rinehart

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 14:38

I'd say that's a very accurate description by Webber. 

 

Though I am not entirely clear on the exact meaning of the term "handy" :lol:

 

"Handy" means pretty good. In context he's using it in a humorous & modest way to say that are Brilliant. A bit like if you were to say Usain Bolt is pretty handy at the100m. 



#13 P123

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 14:59

Seems a fair assessment based on current form.



#14 Antonov

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 15:36

I always thought that on Hamilton on the pace is great, but he doesn't share have steel mind like Vettel or Alonso

 

Hamilton's best season is still 2007, by far. And that is slightly concerning. 


Edited by Antonov, 13 December 2013 - 15:37.


#15 sennafan24

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 15:39

Hamilton's best season is still 2007, by far. And that is slightly concerning. 

I disagree, 2012 was better, and 2010 was on the same level.

 

2010 he only finished behind Button when both finished twice, both in mixed conditions, and in 2012 he was amazingly consistent. Only in Australia was he off-pace on merit, when nothing went wrong he performed to a very high level, sometimes to such a level he was the king of the field.


Edited by sennafan24, 13 December 2013 - 15:40.


#16 P123

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 15:47

Hamilton's best season is still 2007, by far. And that is slightly concerning. 

 

Good grief, not even close.  One of his most consistant periods results wise (and McLaren's...), but then again 4th was about as bad as he was going to be at that time given the strength of both Ferrari and McLaren over the rest of the field.  It's become a bit of a throw-away line accepted in forum world but he had stronger runs in 2010 and 2012; both of those seasons surpassing '07, although '07 remains better than '08, '11 and '13. 



#17 apoka

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 16:25

It's interesting that Webber gives Vettel quite some credit here by saying that he is faster over a lap and it's very tight between them in the race. When rating the credibility of such statements, I always think first about the motivation behind what a driver says. He is a friend of Alonso and certainly wouldn't slap him. However, he was also team mate of Vettel and making him look worse, wouldn't do him any favor as well. In total, there is probably no clear motivation why he would make one driver look better and being Webber, there is actually a chance he actually just told what he thinks - a rare thing in F1.  ;)

 

 



#18 f1supreme

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 16:30

Thats about right atm. But i can see lewis getting the better of vettel and alonso next season, as i expect him to bounce back, just like after his 2011 season. Hopefully he'll have a 2012 type season without all the bad luck, which cost him at least 100 points.
Im looking forward to seeing how well vettel and alonso do against their teammates too.
Hopefully they won't get number 1 status over their teammates, coz number 1 status makes it a lot easier to beat your team-mate.

#19 d246

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 17:53

When you watch Hamilton round the swimming pool in 1997 quali, you get an appreciation as to why he is so frustrated with the 8 tenths tyre management way of recent F1.

Tend to agree with Webber's comments.

It will be interesting to see how he measures up to McNish and co next year.

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#20 stillOrange

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 18:05

Seems he is saying what pretty much everyone would agree to. Fernando is still the boss on Sundays, but Seb runs him very close… plus he is amazing on Saturday… plus he is technically extremely "handy".


Disclaimer: I'm being extremely picky here and I'm clutching straws, English isn't my first language.

He didn't actually say that Fernando is THE boss on Sunday. He didn't say anything to suggest one or the other is better over the full race distance. He only said that it's very very tight between them while he clearly stated that Seb is better on Saturday.

In conclusion, after analysis of every single word from this quote by a guy who doesn't speak English as his first language, we can categorically state that Mark Webber thinks that Seb is better driver than Alonso overall.
;) (please note the winky smiley)

#21 Module

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 20:57

In conclusion, after analysis of every single word from this quote by a guy who doesn't speak English as his first language, we can categorically state that Mark Webber thinks that Seb is better driver than Alonso overall.
;) (please note the winky smiley)

 

And in addition he said:

 

 

But there will also still be decent driver input, especially from a brainpower perspective in terms of pacing and managing and all the technology the cars are going to have next year, which will help Sebastian. That's right up his alley. Perfect for him.

 

As I read it he says SV is better in two important areas and they match eachother on Sundays, so yeas, in a way he says that SV is the best.

 

Webber seems to realy have had a change of heart about SV. Maybe like what Coulthard wrote about Hakkinen some time ago, that it takes time to accept that the other one is faster.



#22 metz

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 21:26

 

 

As I read it he says SV is better in two important areas and they match eachother on Sundays, so yeas, in a way he says that SV is the best.

 

What else would you say about a guy that beats you every year? 



#23 Module

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 21:54

What else would you say about a guy that beats you every year? 

 

Maybe that you are the less prefered driver, that the team is on the others side, not bad for a number two, bring up bad luck, imply your team is sabotaging you and so on?



#24 metz

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 22:18

You need to give Mark more credit.

You NEVER burn bridges.



#25 George Costanza

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 22:38

I disagree, 2012 was better, and 2010 was on the same level.

 

2010 he only finished behind Button when both finished twice, both in mixed conditions, and in 2012 he was amazingly consistent. Only in Australia was he off-pace on merit, when nothing went wrong he performed to a very high level, sometimes to such a level he was the king of the field.

 

 

Agreed there. But 2012 gets overlooked at by Fernando Alonso's season.



#26 sennafan24

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Posted 13 December 2013 - 23:44

Agreed there. But 2012 gets overlooked at by Fernando Alonso's season.

Its hard to directly compare, but for me Alonso and Lewis were pretty equal in 2012, both being the cream of the field.

 

Its hard to compare this year as well, but to give him his due, I think Seb has been the top driver in 2013. I dislike Webber as I think he is a bit of a whiner with a victim complex, but I think he makes a decent point, Seb may be a bit quicker in one lap pace, but Alonso might have the edge in race trim.

 

I am always interested in drivers opinions of other drivers, for example it was Schumi who predicted Alonso would aspire to greatness, back in the early 00's when JPM has all the hype (from a spotty, longer haired 16 year old version of me as well!) 



#27 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 00:36

But you also have to weigh the politics of a driver's comment, in this case Schumacher's. Montoya was a 'problem' for him in the early 00s so promoting Alonso's cause could also be mindgames.



#28 st99

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 00:43

Its hard to directly compare, but for me Alonso and Lewis were pretty equal in 2012, both being the cream of the field.

 

Its hard to compare this year as well, but to give him his due, I think Seb has been the top driver in 2013. I dislike Webber as I think he is a bit of a whiner with a victim complex, but I think he makes a decent point, Seb may be a bit quicker in one lap pace, but Alonso might have the edge in race trim.

 

I am always interested in drivers opinions of other drivers, for example it was Schumi who predicted Alonso would aspire to greatness, back in the early 00's when JPM has all the hype (from a spotty, longer haired 16 year old version of me as well!) 

 

Schumacher was also one of the first to name Vettel as the next superstar in 2007-2008 so he has a good eye for this predictions.



#29 sennafan24

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 01:02

But you also have to weigh the politics of a driver's comment, in this case Schumacher's. Montoya was a 'problem' for him in the early 00s so promoting Alonso's cause could also be mindgames.

I did think about that, but Schumi's argument was really well structured, you can read it in detail in James Allens's book about Schumi, as said above Schumi does have seem to have a good eye.

 

I love JPM, and no doubt Schumi did take delight in making those comments as JPM was a pain in his arse at times, but a lot of Schumi's points were true in the end. Schumi for all that is said, has never outright endorsed crap, he says the best 4 drivers on the grid now are Alonso, Seb, Lewis and Kimi, which are seen by most fans, the paddock and critcis as the 4 best, and he rates Senna as the best ever, who also wins most polls out there from various sources (when Senna does not win those polls, Schumi himself does by the way)

 

Sometimes it is stating the obvious, but give his due the Alonso comment in 2001-2003 time was bit of a gamble, and it turned out to be true. Schumi has never said anything like that which is outlandish, and for that I respect his opinion, whether its influenced or not.



#30 mardmarium

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 01:48

I think Webber is saying what he thinks. He is praising Vettel and frankly, why not? Vettel has been fast, consistent, disciplined, worthy WDC winner and obviously has beaten Webber every year. What Webber says in this interview makes sense? I think so
 
On the other hand he isn´t saying that Vettel is better than Alonso, basically that Vettel is better on Saturdays and Alonso neutralizes that advantage on Sundays. If Vettel qualifies ahead of Alonso and is at least on the Spaniard level over the full race distance, Vettel wins, wouldn´t be "very, very tight between those two". 
 
Talking about Hamilton, 2013 hasn´t been his best season but I agree with those who praise his 2012 season, had an outstanding season in 2012.
 
 I have no doubt F1 drivers know more about F1 than I do and I have no basis on facts in order to think they are lying or having hidden interests behind their words (even if they have hidden interests, they know more about F1 than I do and surely wouldn´t say something irrational)


#31 HP

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:03

Hamilton's best season is still 2007, by far. And that is slightly concerning. 

Hamilton's strength, his natural ability is his greatest weakness. Sometimes these types of personalities rely too much on it alone, Plus McLaren prepared him very well for his entry, which made his subsequent progression look less impressive than that from other drivers. Webber is obviously in a better position to recognize these things, as he had to race against him and others.



#32 HP

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 02:07

On the other hand he isn´t saying that Vettel is better than Alonso, basically that Vettel is better on Saturdays and Alonso neutralizes that advantage on Sundays. If Vettel qualifies ahead of Alonso and is at least on the Spaniard level over the full race distance, Vettel wins, wouldn´t be "very, very tight between those two". 
 

 

I would think that the balance would shift more and more towards Vettel, as I can't see Alonso getter better than he is right now. Vettel however has more room to still evolve.



#33 lbennie

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 03:25

The way i read it:

 

Alonso gets a 8 or 9 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Vettel gets a 10 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Hamilton can match both on his day, but he isnt as consistent as those two,



#34 f1RacingForever

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 03:56

Until i see Vettel consistently perform as well as Fernando did in 2012 in a car that was very clearly well off the pace, Fernando is still the king of Sundays in my book.


Edited by f1RacingForever, 14 December 2013 - 03:56.


#35 Gorma

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 08:01

Until i see Vettel consistently perform as well as Fernando did in 2012 in a car that was very clearly well off the pace, Fernando is still the king of Sundays in my book.

Fernando's sundays seem better because his saturdays aren't always that good in comparison.



#36 boldhakka

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 08:49

Should have asked Webber who he thinks is better in the rain. Some insight to be had there.

#37 mardmarium

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 10:41

The way i read it:

 

Alonso gets a 8 or 9 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Vettel gets a 10 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Hamilton can match both on his day, but he isnt as consistent as those two,

 

if that´s the case Vettel is pure perfection, while others aren´t, Vettel wins. It wouldn´t be tight between him and whoever.
 
"Over one lap I think he's not with Seb. But on Sundays between those two it's very, very tight"
 
In any case this is Webber opinion, does he own the absolute truth? I don´t even know if Alonso will beat Raikkonen next year or if Vettel would beat Hamilton if they were teammates (I think Hamilton was better than Vettel in 2012).
 

I would think that the balance would shift more and more towards Vettel, as I can't see Alonso getter better than he is right now. Vettel however has more room to still evolve.

 

Vettel at his peak better than Alonso at his peak? That's a possibility but I really don´t know. Maybe we should start from: Who is better, Alonso at 26 years old or Vettel at 26 years old?


#38 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 10:50

I always thought that on Hamilton on the pace is great, but he doesn't share have steel mind like Vettel or Alonso

As good as Alonso and Vettel are, Hamilton is more exciting to watch on track for me. Though due to the FIA's ridiculous penalties he's calmed down too much.



#39 FastnLoud

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 11:04

The same Lewis that beat Fernando in his first year. I guess he is going on the current era though of the Pirelli tyre because if we went back to sprint racing with tyres you could push on Lewis would be up there all day long.



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#40 rasul

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 11:37

The same Lewis that beat Fernando in his first year. I guess he is going on the current era though of the Pirelli tyre because if we went back to sprint racing with tyres you could push on Lewis would be up there all day long.

I like Lewis better than the other two, but I have to say a great top driver should be able to adapt and excel on any tyres. In that regard, I'm disappointed in Lewis, even though I still consider him potentially the fastest driver. But it's not enough. Vettel and Alonso seem to be more adaptable than him. They looked good both on Bridgestones and Pirellis. "Would be"s and "If"s don't matter. 



#41 sennafan24

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 11:56

The way i read it:

 

Alonso gets a 8 or 9 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Vettel gets a 10 for saturdays & a 10 for sundays

 

Hamilton can match both on his day, but he isnt as consistent as those two,

I take it you are a Vettel fan

 

The sad thing about Lewis is that until 2011 and the latter stages of 2013, he was very consistent, and just as consistent as the other two.  

 

People are forgetting thanks to his brilliance in 2013, that Seb was actually very patchy in the early stages of 2012, it was not as bad as Lewis's efforts in 2011, but his form did dip as he struggled to adapt to the car (similar to how Lewis did in 2013)

 

I rate Seb very highly and has recently been the outright best on the grid in my view, but 10/10 for both race pace/ and qualifying? No driver is perfect. There were times in 2013 were Seb showed he was outright strong in both areas, Germany his race pace was amazing given his DRS problems and the pace of the Lotus behind, but I saw nothing that separated him from Alonso in race pace given the car difference.

 

In short, its all very hard to quantify given the car difference, I would say Lewis is the best qualifier on the grid, but I cannot determine it 100%, you can judge consistency a bit better as you have a teammate comparison, but other variables are very hard to quantify. Alonso's qualifying is one I would find difficult to access one way or another. There is a chance that Seb's qualifying will be seen as over-hyped if his young teammate does well against him next year.

 

I had a debate on another thread about being able to quantify Senna vs Schumi based on 1993, I believe there were significant comparisons to form some conclusions, but others brought up some really good points that it is indeed still hard to quantify, I stand by points but you get my drift on things.


Edited by sennafan24, 14 December 2013 - 12:15.


#42 apoka

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 17:57

I rate Seb very highly and has recently been the outright best on the grid in my view, but 10/10 for both race pace/ and qualifying? No driver is perfect. There were times in 2013 were Seb showed he was outright strong in both areas, Germany his race pace was amazing given his DRS problems and the pace of the Lotus behind, but I saw nothing that separated him from Alonso in race pace given the car difference.

 

When it comes to race pace, they both seem to be really good. Of course, we cannot really know how close to perfection they get, since we don't have that much to compare them against. But the way I read the quote, Webber is thinking that they are very close in terms of race pace and Seb is faster in qualy. That is also what I would expect myself if those two were paired: Seb qualifying higher on average and then doing similar lap times on Sunday. Anyway, as you say we are mostly guessing here and actually I expect Alonsos stock to rise in 2014.



#43 sabjit

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 19:45

I thought Lewis Hamilton was well known for being the best at handling oversteer.



#44 Cult

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 19:52

My opinion is that Hamilton is the best qualifier, Alonso the best race driver. Vettel is marginally behind Hamilton in Q and Alonso in R (but better than Alonso in Q and Hamilton in R).

 

It's all subjective and I can't prove that but there's been plenty of circumstantial evidence to back this point of view up.



#45 Zava

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 19:54

When it comes to race pace, they both seem to be really good. Of course, we cannot really know how close to perfection they get, since we don't have that much to compare them against. But the way I read the quote, Webber is thinking that they are very close in terms of race pace and Seb is faster in qualy. That is also what I would expect myself if those two were paired: Seb qualifying higher on average and then doing similar lap times on Sunday. Anyway, as you say we are mostly guessing here and actually I expect Alonsos stock to rise in 2014.

that is my understanding too.

 

what mardmarium says would sound like this: "Over one lap I think he's not with Seb. But on Sundays over a race weekend between those two it's very, very tight."



#46 sennafan24

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 20:13

On the qualifying debate.

 

I think we will find a lot more next year, I am going to wait to see how Seb and Alonso perform against fresh meat before I make express a firm opinion. I agree that it appears to be Seb who has the edge there, but he faces a very stern test in qualifying against Ricciardo next year.

 

Alonso vs Kimi should be interesting also.

 

We will find out a lot about both next year, both had the same teammate remember for over 4 years, in the case of Seb 5 years. 



#47 SebnandoKimilton

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 20:23

On the qualifying debate.

 

I think we will find a lot more next year, I am going to wait to see how Seb and Alonso perform against fresh meat before I make express a firm opinion. I agree that it appears to be Seb who has the edge there, but he faces a very stern test in qualifying against Ricciardo next year.

 

Alonso vs Kimi should be interesting also.

 

We will find out a lot about both next year, both had the same teammate remember for over 4 years, in the case of Seb 5 years. 

Agree with this, Ricciardo looks to have one hell of a Q3 lap in him. Wouldnt be surprised at all if he gives Vettel a rough time in qualifying.

 

Raikkonen I feel has declined like Alonso in qualifying, im not sure how much I will be able to read into that qualifying battle, I expect it to be close but I dont think either will be getting those insanely fast laps out of the car like Vettel and Hamilton do. 


Edited by SebnandoKimilton, 14 December 2013 - 20:24.


#48 mardmarium

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 21:05

that is my understanding too.

 

what mardmarium Webber says would sound like this: "Over one lap I think he's not with Seb. But on Sundays over a race weekend between those two it's very, very tight."

 

He also says "on Sundays Fernando over two hours is a handful. There is no question about that". 
 
In Alonso case he is perfectly able to be a clinical driver Sunday after Sunday (Spa this year is a clear example of what I am talking about, like a surgeon all the race, I was quite impressed) I don´t have enough information about Vettel (he usually starts from pole, his own merit but I don´t have enough information), I don´t know if he is as relentless as Alonso is in that sense. If they were teammates, driving a not dominant car, starting from P4 (Vettel) and P6 (Alonso), Who would be more relentless? I need to know more about Vettel in that sense. 


#49 Kingshark

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 21:20

Fernando's sundays seem better because his saturdays aren't always that good in comparison.

 

Alonso's Saturday's were generally quite a lot better than Vettel's Saturday's in 2012, FA was out qualified by his teammate only twice, SV got out qualified 9 times.

 

2013 has been disappointing for Alonso one-lap pace wise, I agree.



#50 bourbon

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 22:07

I take it you are a Vettel fan

 

The sad thing about Lewis is that until 2011 and the latter stages of 2013, he was very consistent, and just as consistent as the other two.  

 

People are forgetting thanks to his brilliance in 2013, that Seb was actually very patchy in the early stages of 2012, it was not as bad as Lewis's efforts in 2011, but his form did dip as he struggled to adapt to the car (similar to how Lewis did in 2013)

 

I think Mark is taking that into consideration.  It is expected that one's form would dip if the performance of the car is lacking or if the driver has trouble adjusting to a new configuration.  This happened to Alonso in the same period and to Lewis at Merc in 2009.  So I don't think Mark would find it an acceptable excuse for purposes of his rating these drivers.

 

I rate Seb very highly and has recently been the outright best on the grid in my view, but 10/10 for both race pace/ and qualifying? No driver is perfect. There were times in 2013 were Seb showed he was outright strong in both areas, Germany his race pace was amazing given his DRS problems and the pace of the Lotus behind, but I saw nothing that separated him from Alonso in race pace given the car difference.

 

Right - the 10/10 is never accurate in sports, or any discipline.  It would be more accurate to say that Mark likely had in mind:  Vettel 9/10, (Hamilton I imagine he'd have right up here) and Alonso 7.5/10 (qually) and Vettel 8.5/10, Alonso 8.5/10 and Hamilton 7.5.0/10 (race).  something along those lines. 

 

But the percentages are not important.  I think his point was that Vettel has the edge on Alonso on Saturday (and if he'd thought about Hamilton when saying that, he'd of lumped him in with Seb) and that Alonso/Vettel are very equal on race day and edge Hamilton.  

 

I agree with his opinion on the qualification assuming he includes Hamilton as I did, but he is missing the boat on his race analysis, imo.  First, Vettel/Alonso/Hamilton/Kimi are all very equal on race day.  Mark has always had a thorn in his side regarding Kimi, so not surprised he left him out altogether.  However, I think he overstates it regarding the others.  He may see Vettel and Alonso as plug and go, but that cheapens the effort of both and boils down to gaseous words used to meet some behind the scenes agenda, imo.   It is always car + driver, and doing the best with what you have is the standard, nothing more, nothing less, imo.

 

In short, its all very hard to quantify given the car difference, I would say Lewis is the best qualifier on the grid, but I cannot determine it 100%, you can judge consistency a bit better as you have a teammate comparison, but other variables are very hard to quantify. Alonso's qualifying is one I would find difficult to access one way or another. There is a chance that Seb's qualifying will be seen as over-hyped if his young teammate does well against him next year.

 

I think it is too close to call between Seb and Lewis.  I expect others will join them in that regard, if not Daniel, then some of the others coming up. 


Edited by bourbon, 14 December 2013 - 22:17.