365 replies to this topic

[Tuboscocca]

Apparently both.      

DCN

Doug,

 

that wasn't meant as a reproach...

 

The research of car-histories never (seldom) ends, it's more an ongoing process.

 

Very best regards Michael

[Alan Cox]

Is the shot from within the monocoque (photo 3), looking upwards towards the gear selector, from inside a Lotus? Probably not, but I am interested to learn the correct identity

[Roger Clark]

Is the Birdcage 63.010, ex-Cunningham and here fitted with a 2.4 litre Maserati speedboat engine?

[doc knutsen]

Any thoughts more closely identifying the 'Birdcage' chassis, or the Cobra Daytona Coupe, or in particular the shot of that tubular arrangement within some kind of sheet-metal sheathing, above?

 

DCN

 

Regarding the tubular arrangement with sheet-metal sheating, it seems to me we are inside of the front part of a monocoque side pod, looking towards the front of the tub. The gear lever housing is up above, but it is hard to judge the relative size. Is it the front of a single-seater tub, or a sports car ditto? The outer wall curve suggests a fairly early single-seater, but the end wall does not appear to be bolted to a steel fabricated bulkhead...

The aircraft solid rivets (purplish) suggests a British-made tub from the Sixties, but I am confused about the smear of red paint. The light green paint run looks like it could be BRP....the BRP-BRM?

 

Kudos for providing some grey matter nourishment at this time...makes a good change from splitting my time between building a 1:32 P 51D model, and welding in roll cage mountings on the 3.8 Mk 2  FIA racing car-to-be.

[Doug Nye]

Yes, Maserati Tipo 63 from the Rosso Bianco Collection and a right-side pontoon-interior view of the ex-Donington ex-Parnell Lotus 33 which had replaced the 1965 Belgian GP-wrecked 'R4'.  Now what about these, perhaps?

 

 

1

 

2

 

3

 

4

 

5

 

6

 

7

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Doug Nye, 28 December 2013 - 11:06.

[Jean L]

3

 

1936  Montlhéry, Grand Prix de l'ACF  Bugatti type 57 G  Robert Benoist / Philippe de Rothschild

[Jean L]

5

 

Grand Prix de Pau 1954  

#14 Ferrari 625F1 6  Maurice Trintignant

[Jean L]

6

 

Lister Jaguar

[Jean L]

7

 

Reims, Grand Prix de l'ACF  

 

#22  Ferrari 312F1 Parkes & #20  Bandini

[Steve L]

4

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

 

Number 4 - Harker Special, a super little special which still exists.

 

It is about time that we had a thread for all the wonderful specials from the 1920-30's (Appleton Special, BHW etc.)   ...

 

 

 

Edited by Steve L, 28 December 2013 - 11:58.

[Tim Murray]

2: Lewis Hamilton (W25), Gert Straub (W125), Ralf Schumacher (W154) and Hans Herrmann (W196); Stuttgart 2009.

[Roger Clark]

Is number 1 Leon Elskamp at the 1913 Grand prix de France (Le Mans) in a modified 1908 Grand Prix Mercedes?

[Tim Murray]

It is about time that we had a thread for all the wonderful specials from the 1920-30's (Appleton Special, BHW etc.)   ...

 

Some are discussed in these earlier threads:

 

Specials from the Bolster book

 

Query; three British specials

[Doug Nye]

Plainly we all have too much time on our hands...

DCN

[Paul Parker]

Picture 6 is the Ecurie Ecosse Lister BHL 109, the famous 'Monzanapolis' car pictured at Monza in 1958 which is nowadays back in its original form and raced by Rod Jolley although handicapped by having to use the 18 inch rear wire wheels as per its Monza spec with the early Dunlop R type rubber to fit the rims.

[Hse289]

The Cobra Daytona is CSX2300 owned by Daniella Ellerbrock.

[Doug Nye]

OK - I've swept up the leaves, sorted the mail, had a cuppa...here are a few more...

 

 

8

 

9

 

10

 

11

 

12

 

37

 

14

 

15

 

16

 

17

 

18

 

19

 

20

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

[Paul Parker]

Number 9 is the Panhard et Lavassor X88 which Lucien Pailler crashed at White House on lap 5 of the 1954 Le Mans, luckily he survived. His co-driver was Jacques Dewez, perhaps better remembered as 'Franc' who later raced Aston Martins here with Jean Kerguen.

[D-Type]

#18 is Basil Davenport's GN Spider, but I don't recognise the venue.

[proviz]

Hey, nice angle of Porsche 917-003 in Le Mans Test Day 1969 in nr. 15. But nr. 9 has really got me puzzled...

[ChrisJson]

Number 20 is the winner of the 2 litre class of LeMans 1975.

Moynet LM 75 driven by Marianne Hoepfner/Michelle Mounton/

Christine Dacremont.

[nicanary]

No.8 is the 1957 Touring Car Race at the International Trophy meeting. Jag #64 is Archie Scott-Brown in the Murkett Bros entry, and you can also spot Ted Harrison's Zephyr and the 2 A105s of Alan Adler and Jack Sears. Harold Grace in the Riley, naturally.

Edited by nicanary, 28 December 2013 - 15:52.

[proviz]

Nr. 11 - 1963 Targa Florio, Lancia Flaminia Zagato of Artunoff/Pryor and Lancia Aurelia of de Tommasi/de Leo.

Nr. 16 - Mike Spence in the Parnellil-BRM.

[Roger Clark]

Number 14 is one of the 1913 Grand Prix Sunbeams being raced in America by C Babcock, of whom I know nothing.

[nicanary]

Is No.16 Mike Spence in the Parnell-BRM?

 

(Whoops - proviz beat me to it!)

Edited by nicanary, 28 December 2013 - 15:56.

[nicanary]

No.10 is the 1955 Goodwood 9-hours. The spinning car #27 is the Tojeiro-Bristol of Rogers/Crabb, car #33 is the HRG of Calvert/Green, and I reckon the following car is the Frazer-Nash of Stoop/Wilson.

 

(I've just noticed a "hidden" car behind the HRG. Is that Chunky's Lotus??)

Edited by nicanary, 28 December 2013 - 16:04.

[Louism]

Blimey Mister DCN sends his pics with a machine gun !

 

I can answer uppermost about Le Mans

- ChrisJson has just wrote about the 1975 Moynet driven by the three girls...this car has been restored recently.
- Number 9 is the Panhard X88 in bad position during 1954 edition of the 24 Hours at Maison Blanche...driver safe.

- Number 15 shows the first public apparition of the new 917 during the Le Mans preliminary tests, 1969 March 29th, car #46 is chassis 003 driven by Hans Herrmann and Rolf Stommelen.

 

I like picture 10 at Goodwood !

 

Warm regards

Louis Monnier

Edited by Louism, 28 December 2013 - 17:12.

[kayemod]

Blimey Mister DCN sends his pics with a machine gun !

 

 

It's beginning to look as if someone has given Uncle Doug a quota to fulfill before the Year's end.

[Steve L]

 

OK - I've swept up the leaves, sorted the mail, had a cuppa...here are a few more...

12

 

37

 

18

 

19

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

 

 

37 - Bignan or Peugeot?

 

19 - Early Maserati 8C - Sommer?

 

18 - Basil Davenport in GN Spider at Lewes Speed Trials?

 

12 - No idea but I like it!  On second thoughts, one of the smaller MG's with a streamlined body?

 

Thanks for posting these pics Doug, it is much appreciated.

 

Thanks also to the poster pointing me towards the older "special" threads - shame the photos on these are no longer available!

Edited by Steve L, 28 December 2013 - 16:37.

[Doug Nye]

I can assure you that if anyone had been daft enough to tell me to fulfil "a quota" they would have been provided with b----- all (thinks - not confident this will translate but oh well, never mind - it has been Christmas, after all).

DCN

[Michael Ferner]

Number 14 is one of the 1913 Grand Prix Sunbeams being raced in America by C Babcock, of whom I know nothing.

 

Thanks, Roger - I had the Sunbeam identified, but (of all people!) didn't think of its US career . My cue now, it's the 1914 Corona Road Race with George Babcock at the wheel, riding mechanic unknown, allegedly running on the same tyres that the car wore at Indianapolis six months earlier (presumably driven by Harry Grant in that race, and positively identified as the one Johnny Marquis flipped spectacularly in the Grand Prize in February). The two men appear to be enjoying themselves, as well they should with Babcock taking an early lead and holding it commandingly for well over an hour, until hitting a small, white dog around half-distance, and losing close to an hour with repairs, then retiring in the closing stages when the steering broke (no doubt a consequence of the canine rendez-vous). Its sister car, manned by driver Harry Grant (who had entered both racers for owner William Ziegler junior) and mechanic Harold Smith, perished in a spectacular fire after climbing up to 7th from the rear of the field shortly before the dog incident, its extra fuel tanks mounted below the frame ripped open when a rear wheel came off, and igniting from the sparks created by the naked hub riding on the rough Corona boulevard :eek:. This time, Grant escaped with a few minor burns, but ten months and a day later he would not be so lucky...

[RStock]

That fellow in pic #16, the one holding the T wrench sure looks like Martin Brundle. I know it isn't, but there certainly is a strong resemblance, in my opinion.

[Roger Clark]

Number 37 is the Georges Irat team at the 1927 Spa 24 hours. Number 7 (Burie-Rossi) won the 2-litre class and the team won the Coupe du Roi.

[Roger Clark]

12  Hugh Hamilton K3 MG 1934 Coppa Acerbo, Pescara

 

19  Goffredo Zehender Maserati 8C 3000 Grand Prix de la Marne Reims 1934

 

The no. 18 GN photo is not Basil Davenport, it is George Symonds , in the ex-Davenport BHD Special, at Lewes Speed Trials in  either 1935, 1936 or 1937.

 

 

Research by Adam Ferrington

 

[Doug Nye]

No takers on No 17 then...?

DCN

[Roger Clark]

Is it Lucien Bianchi retiring Fred Tuck's ex-works Cooper in the 1960 British Grand Prix?

[Doug Nye]

Apart from No 17 being, I suspect, a photograph taken during practice rather than on race day, you are, Roger - as so often - correct.

DCN

[Vitesse2]

 

12

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

 

And here, seen in the pits, presumably after his victory ...

 

[RTH]

There is something about those  big , sharp, clear, pre war black & white pictures that are just exquisite

[275 GTB-4]

There is something about those  big , sharp, clear, pre war black & white pictures that are just exquisite

Yes! I particularly like the Alvis ones

[Doug Nye]

And then - as the holiday approaches its end - there are...

 

21

 

22

 

23

 

24

 

25

 

All Photos Strictly Copyright or Via: The GP Library

 

DCN

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Doug Nye, 30 December 2013 - 12:06.

[Tim Murray]

21: Kelly Petillo?

[arttidesco]

25. John Cobb in the Napier Railton during the 1934 BRDC 500 miles no idea on the #28

[Vitesse2]

25. John Cobb in the Napier Railton during the 1934 BRDC 500 miles no idea on the #28

A year out, Ralph. It's 1935. The other car is one of the Rileys, I think - possibly Dobbs/Richardson.

 

http://www.britishpa...e-at-brooklands

[nicanary]

A year out, Ralph. It's 1935. The other car is one of the Rileys, I think - possibly Dobbs/Richardson.

 

http://www.britishpa...e-at-brooklands

According to "that site" car No.28 is an Alvis Speed 20 of Dunham/Oats.

[Vitesse2]

According to "that site" car No.28 is an Alvis Speed 20 of Dunham/Oats.

Indeed. For some reason it slipped my mind that WSRP has the 500 results

[Michael Ferner]

21: Kelly Petillo?

 

No, Tim, it's Babe Stapp, but Petillo was the next regular driver of that same car (the Harvey Ward/Miller). It's late 1932, and the fence in the background looks like Ascot Speedway in Los Angeles. Stapp took three seconds and two fourths in the six daytime races at Ascot that closed the 1932 Pacific Coast season - he missed one race due to the flu, and Bob Carey subbed for him, but retired. The Babe also needed relief by Les Spangler for one of his runner-up finishes, having only just returned to racing after a nasty shunt in spring.

[Michael Ferner]

22 is Cliff Durant at the start of his first (?) auto race, the Los Angeles-to-Phoenix "Cactus Derby" in late 1914. The car is a near-stock Chevrolet, and the riding mechanic one R. Lawrence - at the finish, Durant was accompanied by a rather more famous mechanician: Louis Chevrolet had retired the team car out in the desert, to be picked up by Durant on his way to an impressive 4th place.

[Michael Ferner]

23 is Billy Pearce riding a factory Fal (or: Falcar, Fal-Car) at the support race for the 1910 Grand Prize in Savannah (GA). A broken axle meant retirement.

[Michael Ferner]

24 is Ralph de Palma in E. J. Schroeder's 37-90 Mercedes, same venue but one year later, and competing for the Vanderbilt Cup. Led the first four of seventeen laps, and finished second.