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Racing Maserati Mistral?


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#1 francoisb123

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 17:56

Hi, all,

I'm processing to restore a Mistral in a sort of "racing form": I'd like it to be lighter, considering the fantastic engine was  on the stock car suffering from weight;

but : strange it never raced at all , no?

Someone to know some events with a Mistral, perhaps in US (lot of them were sent there!) ?

Thanks!   :wave:



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#2 arttidesco

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 18:49

With no factory support and an engine that was coming to the end of its production life I am guessing the power to weight ratio did not add up for privateers to have a go. But considering the effort Ford was putting into the Cobra and Ferrari into the 250 GTO maybe that was a "no brainer". I guess production numbers were too low to compete against the Corvette and later Mustang that was to follow.



#3 francoisb123

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 18:53

With no factory support and an engine that was coming to the end of its production life I am guessing the power to weight ratio did not add up for privateers to have a go. But considering the effort Ford was putting into the Cobra and Ferrari into the 250 GTO maybe that was a "no brainer". I guess production numbers were too low to compete against the Corvette and later Mustang that was to follow.

 

Thanks for that...and for the top teams, and great events, you re'true, of course...but no one to want to drive a Maserati in period, more than a sad US stock car? :confused:



#4 arttidesco

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 19:55

Thanks for that...and for the top teams, and great events, you re'true, of course...but no one to want to drive a Maserati in period, more than a sad US stock car? :confused:

 

No accounting for taste I saw a film with Brit Ekland driving one the other day :smoking:



#5 GMACKIE

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 20:59

Absolutely gorgeous :love: ...and the Mistral is is also quite nice.



#6 Andrew Fellowes

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Posted 27 January 2014 - 22:48

in 1965/6 I had a ride in one at Snetterton, its a long time ago now but I recall it being tail happy, not really a circuit car, but I wasn't driving! We experimented with me lying in the back to see if that helped, no it didn't!


Edited by Andrew Fellowes, 27 January 2014 - 22:51.


#7 francoisb123

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 11:32

in 1965/6 I had a ride in one at Snetterton, its a long time ago now but I recall it being tail happy, not really a circuit car, but I wasn't driving! We experimented with me lying in the back to see if that helped, no it didn't!

 

:lol:  What? some weight distribution problems?



#8 Paul Parker

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 17:34

I drove the various versions of the 6 cylinder Maseratis in period as well as the Ghibli and all were essentially relatively heavy touring cars, turning one into a serious GT racer would have been nigh on impossible without radical changes mechanically and chassis wise.

 

The Maserati's 6 cylinder motor in its 3485 cc guise was similar to the Jaguar XK motor with a bore and stroke of 86 x 100 mm (Jaguar 3442 cc 84 x106 mm) but not so rugged and in period I doubt it could have been persuaded to produce the necessary reliable 260-300 bhp required to match the Aston DB4GT, Jaguar E type and much lighter, better balanced Ferrari 250GT SWB when GT racing became serious.



#9 francoisb123

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 20:00

Yes, about weight and "old fashion" rear axle, it's clear, but some "long stroke" engines, then,  were not so bad for racing, no?

And with 235 BHP in stock cars, was it so difficult to reach 260 in race trim?

But, really, thanks, whatever; in fact, I was more waiting a "gentlemen driver" than a period "top team"!



#10 D-Type

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 20:13

A "gentleman driver" would go for a car that would be quick "straight out of the box" as he wouldn't have the resources or time to develop a competition car.  The Mistral was conceived and designed as a road car whereas some of the opposition would have included possible competition on the list of design objectives.



#11 GMACKIE

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 20:41

Racing aside, I would rather have a Maserati Mistral [ideally a Spider] than an E Type Jaguar.....that's just my preference.



#12 Paul Parker

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Posted 28 January 2014 - 20:44

Yes, about weight and "old fashion" rear axle, it's clear, but some "long stroke" engines, then,  were not so bad for racing, no?

And with 235 BHP in stock cars, was it so difficult to reach 260 in race trim?

But, really, thanks, whatever; in fact, I was more waiting a "gentlemen driver" than a period "top team"!

 

Very unlikely that it actually produced 235 bhp in road trim, but I could be wrong, but weight was/is also an issue.

 

For instance the Jaguar E type was quoted as 265 bhp in showroom trim but the late Ron Beaty told me that 210-215 bhp was the most you could expect and that the most powerful 3.8 litre Jaguar production line motors were fitted to the early 3.8 Mk2 saloons even though they only had two carburettors rather than the three of the E type and of course the XK150S. As an example the Equipe Endeavour E type ECD 400 which won its first ever race driven by Graham Hill at Oulton Park in 1961 had an engine which gave 243 bhp although when it was later raced at Spa by Mike Parkes its motor had American Iskendrian cams for which 276 bhp was claimed.

 

Astons also had a problem with quoted power output figures which were rather less than they claimed.

 

The same thing applies to top speeds, the fastest I could ever get out of a production E type was an indicated 142 mph from a 1965 4.2 FHC, whilst a slightly warmed up 3.8 roadster with the earlier lower geared top (3.31:1) managed an indicated 140 mph whilst the Maserati Ghibli I maxed out very early one morning would not go beyond a speedo 154 mph (the factory claimed 170 something if i recall correctly) at which speed it was almost flying and I could not see the road in front of the car.

 

The E type had similar aerodynamic problems and were scary beyond 125 mph in road trim.



#13 JoBo

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 00:08

Hi, all,

I'm processing to restore a Mistral in a sort of "racing form": I'd like it to be lighter, considering the fantastic engine was  on the stock car suffering from weight;

but : strange it never raced at all , no?

Someone to know some events with a Mistral, perhaps in US (lot of them were sent there!) ?

Thanks!   :wave:

 

No Maserati Mistral had every been entered in a race!

Only one Mistral coupe made a kind of long distance "Rallye" in 1965 to proof its reliability.

 

JoBo


Edited by JoBo, 29 January 2014 - 00:09.


#14 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 06:47

So not this one then...(Mistral body, Maserati engine)...

 

http://www.racingspo...-12-06m-100.jpg

 

Vince H.



#15 JoBo

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 07:50

So not this one then...(Mistral body, Maserati engine)...

 

http://www.racingspo...-12-06m-100.jpg

 

Vince H.

 

I read Ferrari there....

 

JoBo



#16 francoisb123

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 17:29

Very unlikely that it actually produced 235 bhp in road trim, but I could be wrong, but weight was/is also an issue.

 

For instance the Jaguar E type was quoted as 265 bhp in showroom trim but the late Ron Beaty told me that 210-215 bhp was the most you could expect and that the most powerful 3.8 litre Jaguar production line motors were fitted to the early 3.8 Mk2 saloons even though they only had two carburettors rather than the three of the E type and of course the XK150S. As an example the Equipe Endeavour E type ECD 400 which won its first ever race driven by Graham Hill at Oulton Park in 1961 had an engine which gave 243 bhp although when it was later raced at Spa by Mike Parkes its motor had American Iskendrian cams for which 276 bhp was claimed.

 

Astons also had a problem with quoted power output figures which were rather less than they claimed.

 

The same thing applies to top speeds, the fastest I could ever get out of a production E type was an indicated 142 mph from a 1965 4.2 FHC, whilst a slightly warmed up 3.8 roadster with the earlier lower geared top (3.31:1) managed an indicated 140 mph whilst the Maserati Ghibli I maxed out very early one morning would not go beyond a speedo 154 mph (the factory claimed 170 something if i recall correctly) at which speed it was almost flying and I could not see the road in front of the car.

 

The E type had similar aerodynamic problems and were scary beyond 125 mph in road trim.

Thanks: interesting  period cars analysis...



#17 francoisb123

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Posted 29 January 2014 - 17:32

No Maserati Mistral had every been entered in a race!

Only one Mistral coupe made a kind of long distance "Rallye" in 1965 to proof its reliability.

 

JoBo

Hello,

So, it's a "rallye", but not a race : only one car to go "there to there"? Some more information, it's, whatever, interesting!



#18 JoBo

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 00:17

Hello,

So, it's a "rallye", but not a race : only one car to go "there to there"? Some more information, it's, whatever, interesting!

 

It was the French driver Jacques Maglia who drove in 1967 a Mistral from Modena to Tokyo.

Maserati used this as a PR-tool to proof the reliability of the car.

It was a long-distance run and not a "rallye" - but "rallye" sounded better........! 


Edited by JoBo, 30 January 2014 - 00:17.


#19 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 06:13

I read Ferrari there....

 

JoBo

 

The Maserati engine is in the fine print.  More here:

 

http://www.tamsoldra...t/McCC0010.html

 

Vince H.



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#20 JoBo

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 08:03

The Maserati engine is in the fine print.  More here:

 

http://www.tamsoldra...t/McCC0010.html

 

Vince H.

 

This car was a Ferrari, based on a adder-frame while the Mistral had a monocoque chassis. From the production site it was the 1st modern Maserati.

Also this hybrid had a V8 engine fitted and the Mistral always had a inline 6 (despite one prototype). 

 

So this car you refer to had nothing to do with a Maserati MIstral.

 

JoBo


Edited by JoBo, 30 January 2014 - 08:04.


#21 francoisb123

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 17:22

It was the French driver Jacques Maglia who drove in 1967 a Mistral from Modena to Tokyo.

Maserati used this as a PR-tool to proof the reliability of the car.

It was a long-distance run and not a "rallye" - but "rallye" sounded better........! 

 

Yes! Jacques Maglia, FJ winner at Chimay, and some races with Alpine...

 

No picture of the Mistral during this run?



#22 JoBo

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Posted 30 January 2014 - 22:45

Yes! Jacques Maglia, FJ winner at Chimay, and some races with Alpine...

 

No picture of the Mistral during this run?

 

Yes, I have a very nice photo of this run. But I am unable to post photos here. :( I tried various times but its too complicated here :mad:  :down:.

 

JoBo


Edited by JoBo, 30 January 2014 - 22:46.


#23 francoisb123

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 11:17

Yes, I have a very nice photo of this run. But I am unable to post photos here. :( I tried various times but its too complicated here :mad:  :down:.

 

JoBo

Just sent you a private message, JoBo...thanks! :up:



#24 JoBo

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 14:08

Just sent you a private message, JoBo...thanks! :up:

 

Just replied via PM.

 

JoBo